Verbal Abuse

Originally posted by AccessDenied

Do what makes you happy girl..and ONLY what makes you happy.
That is my motto.
It has brought me far, and so have my ATS/BTS family.
Trust me hon, the loser didn't deserve you.

AccessDenied, he may be what you called him, but a negative label doesn't help her situation, it was her choice in a partners.

People choices in life, even though sometimes painful are still there decisions that they will live with always. No sense in adding salt to the wounds, by more negative comments.

Originally posted by photobug

Controlling People: Controllers use verbal abuse to subtly undermine their victim's perceptions, to manipulate them into doing what they want, to foster dependency, to isolate them from truth, from outside contact and even from their own children. They may withhold information while lying to their victim.. Controllers create confusion, emotional pain and mental anguish, while periodically "rescuing" their victim by seeming to offer the balm of love that alleviates the victim's pain drawing the victim ever closer. Controllers gain and maintain power over people while often presenting a perfect persona to the world.

Hey photobug this quote is very true, but what really freaked me out was the fact that we could take the word people out and replace it with.......

Religions or

Politicians or

Governments

I most of us are rebelling these day because we are being controlled and manipulated from every angle and coming home for the same really sucks.

A home should be where you feel safe from the outside chaos.

Originally posted by Real Truth

Don't come up with a permanent solution to a temporary problem, especially if there are children involved.

It takes to to tango and adults can be selfish, point fingers at each other because they are so full of hate, anger and feel sorry for themselves that very little gets solved. Communication is very important on both sides.

Real Truth, perhaps you could clarify a bit what you mean here for me. perhaps Iam reading something out of it that wasn't intended.

A permanent solution to a temporary problem....
Do you think that we are all packing up and heading for the lawyers office after one argument? I went through 20 years of BS, and it was MY CHILDREN who finally told me to kick him out because they were scared and angry.

As for communication.. how do you do that with someone who always talks down to you as if you are a child? There is no level field. He was always right, I was always wrong..period. He never wanted to discuss anything about the marriage or lack of it, despite me trying over several years to "fix' whatever was wrong.He never remembered most of what he said or did because he was drunk or high or both. I was never selfish.. I GAVE and GAVE and GAVE, until there was nothing left of me to give. He just emptied my entire cup. Took a long time to fill it again..and it's still not at the top.
I speak of my own experience, but Iam not alone..
Thousands of women and men too, could speak the same words.

Many just don't understand unless you have lived it. The situation is not so black and white.

reply to post by Realtruth


I put labels where I chose to, and any man that physically harms a woman..is a LOSER!

Originally posted by Realtruth

Originally posted by photobug

Controlling People: Controllers use verbal abuse to subtly undermine their victim's perceptions, to manipulate them into doing what they want, to foster dependency, to isolate them from truth, from outside contact and even from their own children. They may withhold information while lying to their victim.. Controllers create confusion, emotional pain and mental anguish, while periodically "rescuing" their victim by seeming to offer the balm of love that alleviates the victim's pain drawing the victim ever closer. Controllers gain and maintain power over people while often presenting a perfect persona to the world.

Hey photobug this quote is very true, but what really freaked me out was the fact that we could take the word people out and replace it with.......

Religions or

Politicians or

Governments

I most of us are rebelling these day because we are being controlled and manipulated from every angle and coming home for the same really sucks.

A home should be where you feel safe from the outside chaos.

Very true indeed I was thinking the same thing myself. I think I may post a topic on that if it's alright with you.

Not to sound edgy but the conversation always seems to turn towards women as the abusee. But how about the woman as an abuser and how does a man gain custody of his children from an abusive woman that plays the definition of a controller to a "T". I as a man understand what each and everyone of you has described becasue I have been there and am currently drowning in it. It took a long time to ralize what was going on and now that I do I feel as if I dont leave my health and mental wellbeing will continue to suffer. However my daily struggle not to leave focuses on my children and not wanting them to have to suffer through one moment of what i have. At least while I am there I can counteract the effects of her to a point. Then again maybe shes right and I am the one who screwed it all up and I should just count my losses. I cant believe I just put that out on a public forum, but writing helps.

reply to post by photobug


That's a really tough situation. Maybe you could very discreetly check with a lawyer to see if suing for divorce on the grounds of mental cruelty (or whatever version of it exists where you are) would influence custody?

Originally posted by photobug

Very true indeed I was thinking the same thing myself. I think I may post a topic on that if it's alright with you.

Here on ATS no need to ask my permission, just take charge and empower yourself with a another thread.

Verbal and mental abuse are even worse than physical abuse, because the physical abuse the wounds most often heal by themselves. When mentally abused with words and being around someone that is angry, manipulative, and takes pleasure in seeing others suffer healing will take time, but you will be ok. The fact that you are realizing this and talking out is a great start.

Whatever way you decide to hang in or cut ties, I would recommend some type of group counseling to help you along the way. Another recommendation is self hypnosis tapes, they work really well if you use them often. Some of the best ones I have used are from a person call Barrie Konicov. I have been listening to him for over 20 years.

Link to Barrie's Site for Tapes

Keep talking and expressing yourself.



[edit on 30-4-2008 by Realtruth]

Thanks, I'll check out those tapes. I'm not really sure I could let my self be hypnotized but I'm game to give it a try.

Originally posted by photobug
Thanks, I'll check out those tapes. I'm not really sure I could let my self be hypnotized but I'm game to give it a try.

I think the word "Hypnosis" has gotten a bad name, someone or tape can not do anything to you that you do not allow. Our wills are very strong, but with the proper self intentions and wanting to change tapes like these act as an assistant.

They are very soothing and comforting to listen to, and they only make suggestions in the areas that you desire help. Let's say for instance you want to feel more confident about yourself. These audios first put you in a very tranquil state of mind, then begin to suggest that you are a confident person and that everyday your confidence grows stronger.

Goodluck to you.

Originally posted by photobugNow imagine all of his lifes energy and literally his lifeforce being sucked out of him until he becomes but a shell of his former self. Imagine now everything that you are and everything that you own has been taken from you and now has become your prison.

Yes, I've seen this on a very personal level. The man was a big 6ft 200lb steelworker and the wife was a little 5'3 110lb person and she literally dominated the life out of him.

It was so bad that the people at church would make jokes about it. Now most people are on their best behavior at church, but she would order him around to such a degree it was even evident then.

Even the guy's kids, two very nice boys would go to him and tell him to save himself and get a divorce, that they'd cope. This is not something you see out of kids, where the last thing they want is to have their parents break up.

Unfortunately the pressure and stuff played on him until somewhere around 15 years into the relationship his personality changed and he became moody and mean.

Later, when the kids were grown and married, they still witnessed this and finally banded together and said they were never coming back to visit until this badgering and controlling stopped. It had a profound effect and the wife finally realized what she was doing. I think the main thing was the realization that now someone had the power to break away and the image of the perfect family would ever be destroyed. In fact I think the wife never really changed or realized, but just 'faked' it to keep things together.

I think it all stemmed from the wife's upbringing and strife in her home where she was seen by her mother to be competing for the affections of her father. So the wife's goal in life was to have everything so perfect, perfect house, perfect husband and perfect kids, that she drove everyone nuts.

It had a deep affect on the kids' personalities too. One of them is just as controlling and driven to temper outbursts and the other is fairly passive, emulating the personality of the father.

It's too bad, because I think if the Dad had divorced and remarried a supportive and kind wife at the right time things would have just been idyllic.

Thanks for the clarification on the hynosis. I do indeed have some hypnosis MP3's and your right if they are used as positive reinforcement I believe they can definatley help. Right now I'm just having a hard time thinking straight, My health, my passion, and my business are all suffering becasue of this. The hard thing for me right now is that since I have finally realized what is going on, It makes it more difficult to cope with the situation and I know I am making it worse by not playing her games anymore.

Thank you for the story of the steel worker. I for one do not plan living the remainder of my life like this nor am I willing to let my kids go through it.

Today was a total blow out. I first got accused of talking to women, Which is the last thing I want right now, and then She met me at The dance Studio where I take my kids every week and proceeded to humiliate me in front of two Women that were also there for their kids. I just don't understand this public humiliation thing, Perhaps it's becasue she Knows I will not tolerate fighting in public and will not do anything to escalate the situation. I realize the whole time she is making herself look bad but I can't help but to feel like crawling under a rock especially since I just finished a business related conversation with both of them.

reply to post by photobug


That's not the worst part of it.

The verbal, mental and emotional abuse caused the Steelworker to take it out on his kids, one of whom endured beatings with a variety of objects including one with his pants down when he was in 9th grade over lying about being given a quarter.

Every room in their house had a hole in it in the shape of a doorknob, behind the door when he slammed the door against the wall due to the rage the wife caused in him.

The kitchen sink had a big divot of porcelain taken out of it due to the time the father threw a jar of mustard in the sink from across the room, barely missing the head of the child who had been beaten.

I'd get out of there fast - those kinds of relationships can be extremely damaging to everyone involved.

I'm working on it. Fortunatley I am a pretty down to earth meelow fella and do not loose my cool. I could easily see the situation escalating IF I would remotely act like her. Just trying to bid my time and get enough evidence as possible for a custody battle. One of the hard things is that its really hard for a man to get custody especially in a situation like this where the abuser puts on this perfect little disguise for the world. So I am doing what I can and trying to prepare the best I can without her getting wise. I just don't know how much longer I can hang on without just giving up and letting her have everything.

reply to post by photobug


Man, I feel for you. Really.

The other problem or reaction to this often one of two things.

You can identify with the abusive parent and take that pattern of abuse to the next generation so that the child also abuses their children.

On the other hand you can find the child identifies with the abused parent and develops a problem, such as introversion and timidity.

One reason the abuse passes to the next generation is that the identification with the abuser is a fear reaction which is masked by the abusive behavior. Rather than turn the fear onto themselves, the child has a 'stockholm syndrome' reaction and tries to be like the abuser, so that the abuser will see them as an ally and not a target.

It can also cause other related reactions, which are even worse.

So in reality, I fear for the children and their children even more than I do for the abused adult.

It may be that your wife was also abused by her parents in some way and she's acting out. In that respect it may be helpful if she's amenable to seek family counseling and maybe get to the bottom of it. It's possible that by realizing the 'why' of this verbal abuse and recognizing the damaging effects on everyone, the abuser can reform.

Hope this works out for you.



[edit on 1-5-2008 by Badge01]

'Photobug', I would suggest you gather enough evidence of your ability to support your children and how you are the [primary?] caretaker of them. The other party may try to prevent you from taking anything in the divorce. In the case of the next door neighbor, the wench kicked and screamed and was hauled away by the bailiff after the judge ordered monthly support by the mother for and on behalf of the father. But the children had to live in the same house with the mother and new hubby [yech] because of some technicality.

I can relate to abusive partners. Mine is so awful, stubborn, believes he's right about everything. He actually has a motto "I am always right". He is always moody and puts everyone else down, even people he's never met. He's so full of anger and hatred it's actually disgusting. The person he's usually irritated with is me...

I wouldn't put up with it if I had a security net to fall back on but as it is right now I'd have nowhere to go and I refuse to take our 18 month old and go live on the street. He makes it impossible for me to move out though, he doesn't let me work. Or maybe he just manipulates me into feeling guilty about wanting to work. He thinks that daycares are the worst place for a child to spend the day in, and especially the government funded ones. I can't afford to work if I had to hire a nanny, she'd take all of my wages. He makes me feel like it's selfish of me to want to work.

Everytime he takes his negative comments about me too far and I threaten to leave he retracts just enough to mollify me into staying.

I tried leaving before and lived with my mom for a few months but she was just as bad as him, she's been manipulative my whole life. Even living with him was prefferable.

Blah!

Originally posted by poisonmekare
I can relate to abusive partners. Mine is so awful, stubborn, believes he's right about everything. He actually has a motto "I am always right". He is always moody and puts everyone else down, even people he's never met. He's so full of anger and hatred it's actually disgusting. The person he's usually irritated with is me...

I wouldn't put up with it if I had a security net to fall back on but as it is right now I'd have nowhere to go and I refuse to take our 18 month old and go live on the street. He makes it impossible for me to move out though, he doesn't let me work. Or maybe he just manipulates me into feeling guilty about wanting to work. He thinks that daycares are the worst place for a child to spend the day in, and especially the government funded ones. I can't afford to work if I had to hire a nanny, she'd take all of my wages. He makes me feel like it's selfish of me to want to work.

Everytime he takes his negative comments about me too far and I threaten to leave he retracts just enough to mollify me into staying.

I tried leaving before and lived with my mom for a few months but she was just as bad as him, she's been manipulative my whole life. Even living with him was prefferable.

Blah!

been there, done that..
Do what is right for you and your child. There are options available if you look for them. Things will probably not get better, so don't even tell yourself that. The road to happiness is not always paved with gold, but you have to be willing to take the first step.
Welcome to ATS/BTS by the way.
AD

I find it earily strange how similar all the stories are and how much of a hold the abuser has on the abusee. In my learning process I had a really hard time understanding it and I guess still am and it was especially ahrd becasue it was aslo a manliness thing. The hard part is differnetiating the good times from the bad and the ups and downs that go with them. For me the verbal abuses are so bad and so deamaning one day but then the next couple days are normal and it leads to a false sense of security. But what really helped me gain an understanding was when I started a journal. You really don't realize or see the patterns until you start documented them. For the poster above withthe 18th month, I understand your entrapment and wish you the best of luck, if you feel you can not leave right now you should at least begin making very secret preperations and start documented everyhting. It becomes very diificult to prove abuse in case where the abuser is putting on the fake perfect personificaton. My documentation helps me to stay above the abuse and empowers me not to let it beat me totally down. The negative side of realizing your being abused is that it becomes much easier to fall into a state of depression and you must be careful to avoid that.

Thanks for the replies!

I'm no stranger to depression, I've had it since I was eleven, when I was sexually abused by a family member. Thankfully it's something I'm able to manage so it doesn't get too bad anymore.

I definitely don't feel that now is the right time to leave. His nana (who raised him instead of his mom) just died of lung cancer so he's pretty low right now.

It was hard to leave before because when I lived with my mom she would always try and talk me into moving back with him, and give it another shot. I'm not surprised that she would stick up for him, since she was with several physically abusive men and still went back until things got really dangerous. Once when I was little and my older brother was probably seven or so, her boyfriend chased her with a hunting knife saying he was going to kill her. That's when she decided to leave, not like, when she saw him touching me inappropriately, or when he forced me to eat a fish's eye (I was only three).

My dad was so physically abusive that he beat her black and blue all over, she was all sorts of different colors, it hurt to take a shower and it hurt to sit down, she had to live in a shelter for a while, but she went back with him... he actually snuck away one day (and took the rent money leaving her with nothing but a bag of bread a jar of peanut butter and some diapers) and never came back. Good riddance I say!

I guess it's easy for me to excuse his comments because it's nothing compared to what some people do. Maybe even because it's nothing compared to the sexual and mental abuse I've gone through in the past, it seems like nothing. His comments are irritating but I don't actually believe what he says, so I guess I'm well off that way. I do have low self esteem but I always have. He hasn't added to that at all.

I defend myself and I tell him to shove it. I laugh when he tries to put me down because I don't take myself so seriously and it doesn't bother me. I just hate that HE actually believes those things and that says to me that he doesn't love me even though he says he does. That won't change if I leave. I don't want us to be separate and then he's brainwashing my daughter into thinking I'm some grand bitch and hating me. At least if I'm there while he's trying to say that stuff I can stick up for myself.

Really it's a stupid bind I've put myself into. I know in some ways it would be better to leave and yet in some ways it seems better to stay. I know that having an asshole for a father isn't that unusual and he isn't that terrible really. He treats our kidlet like a queen. If he ever treated her bad I'd be gone in an instant. She'd go straight into daycare, I'd even live with my mom for a couple months and I'd be on our own. But he treats her well and they have a great relationship and I'd feel terrible disrupting that.

I dunno, am I being stupid? Maybe it's a naughty thing to think, but if I had known any better I would have dumped him before I knew I was pregnant. He and I moved to a different province right before I found out I was pregnant and had to work for rent, food, bills and two tickets back home. I would have let him move on his own and said good riddance. I could have saved myself such a headache.

[edit on 4-5-2008 by poisonmekare]