McCain for President. Do we even have a choice?

We have all heard McCain’s interest in war and the fact that he said we would be in Iraq for 100 years. McCain reminds me of Bush, and it just so happens that Bush's backing him for the elections. Remember how Bush got presidency? By cheating the voting system, using the loopholes through his father and brother and creating confusion in Florida to tilt the feed in his favor, Bush managed to claim the House. I have a bad feeling about McCain. He is like Bush, but far worse with an appetite for war. It is all an illusion to the American people. Republican against republican, democrat against democrat, they are both two sides of the same coin. Bush wants McCann for president, congress wants him, and the underlying corporate development of devouring resources wants him. So, do you think that we have a choice? I think not, as America is a corporation trying to govern the world and dominate every country trying to move at it's own pace. Sept 11. was the catalyst for deception of the American people. Fear immobilizes, knowledge empowers.

youtube.com...

[edit on 15-3-2008 by TheScientist]

Mod Edit - please see your U2U's

[edit on 17/0308/08 by neformore]

Here is your other choice..
picture say's a thousand word's
to sorry to pledge allegance to the flag.

reply to post by TheScientist


A corporate republican or a corporate democrat? A liberal republican or a conservative democrat? A neo-con republicrat? What's the difference? Answer: no difference between John McCain and Hillary Clinton.

That leaves us with one viable choice in 2008... Barack Obama. And for once millions of Americans can feel proud about making this choice and not feel as though they had to "settle".

There was a terrific article in Rolling Stone magazine (March 20, 2008) about Obama, and how successful he has been at gaining a huge grass roots effort...he worked smart early on, and has the proven leadership skills and organizational structure and behavioral savey to be a tremendous President. He also has some very good policy directions for the future and stands on a decent platform for the well being of the people, the economy, and supporting the troups by bringing them home.

I used to adore Hillary...she was once my hero, but I think lately has been proof enough for me that she is a corporate (at best) centerest (part of the DLC) and when one really steps back and analyzes her from a political standpoint very little has distinguished her from a Republican other than a bunch of rhetoric. Sometimes the road to hell is paved with good intentions, but so far what has she really brought us? Her healthcare initiative was great, and to pay the devil his due, one has to admit she was outspent by big insurance, pharma, and the medical establishment in the war for our minds, but when ultimately her plan failed, she ended up helping to deliver a conservative majority back in 94 as a result of her actions. Now we see the fangs out dripping with venem and she's not coiled up to strike to McCain, she is trying to sink them in Obama and in the process deviding the party... just some thoughts from a bias and progressive dem...

btw, shouldn't this be in Above Politics?

reply to post by beforetime


Oh come on! That wasn't the pledge...it was the National Anthem. It is not a requirement or a complete social custome to place the hand over the heart while the Star Spangled Banner is sung...all that is needed with the Anthem is a respectful posture and full atention; if a hat is worn, it is removed during the song...the pledge is where the hand goes over the heart.

What's disrespectful is this smear tactic and doing it over our National Anthem, that is what is un-American.

Thanks for your reply.

Originally posted by TheScientist
We have all heard McCain’s interest in war and the fact that he said we would be in Iraq for 100 years. McCain reminds me of Bush, and it just so happens that Bush's backing him for the elections.

Sorry if it's considered bad form to insert paragraph breaks when replying, but you hit a lot of points, and I find it easier to keep track of things with breaks.

Let me preface anything I say about McCain with a disclaimer. My favorite candidate so far is "None of the above". I don't support McCain, Clinton, or Obama.

Did McCain actually say that we'd be in Iraq for a hundred years? I've heard him say "decades", and "several years", but I haven't heard him say "100 years"...and if he did say it, was it his actual estimate, or was it a flight of hyperbole, along the lines of "I have a million things to do!" ?. I bring up the point simply because anybody who's studied history to any degree can predict that we'll be in Iraq for a long time. Look at Germany, Japan, and Korea for examples. Speaking the truth doesn't mean that Senator McCain likes war, or has an appetite for it...given his experience, I'd suspect the opposite to be the case...it simply means that he's looked at history.

As for being backed by Bush, that could easily be party loyalty on Bush's part, rather than any real friendship between McCain and Bush. If I wanted to be really cynical, I could even speculate that Bush's backing of McCain was an active attempt to sabotage McCain's bid for the White House, given President Bush's poll numbers.

Remember how Bush got presidency? By cheating the voting system, using the loopholes through his father and brother and creating confusion in Florida to tilt the feed in his favor, Bush managed to claim the House.

If you're looking for a 'white hat' in the Bush / Gore elections, you won't find one. Both candidates were pulling every legal and quasi-legal trick they could think of to dig up winning votes. Remember the Gore campaign's arguments about what constituted a 'correctly marked' ballot? Remember the dust-up about absentee vote counting? That's one reason that I hope this election (regardless of who wins) is decisive enough to avoid judicial involvement.

I have a bad feeling about McCain. He is like Bush, but far worse with an appetite for war. It is all an illusion to the American people. Republican against republican, democrat against democrat, they are both two sides of the same coin.

That, I'll give you. Both parties want to spend my tax dollars on things that (in my opinion) are none of the government's business. The only difference (other than party logos) is *what* they want to spend it on.

Bush wants McCann for president, congress wants him, and the underlying corporate development of devouring resources wants him.

You make three assertions here. One is that a Republican president wants a Republican to follow him in office. This is a surprise?

The second is that Congress wants McCain to be President. Really? I seem to have missed Speaker Pelosi's ringing endorsement of McCain. I'd imagine that most of Congress is (rather like most of the American people) undecided at the moment, with the Democrats split between Clinton and Obama, and the Republicans looking at McCain and going "Holy bleep, how did this happen?!". He's not well liked among the Republican party.

The third assertion, I can't make heads or tails of. "The underlying corporate development of devouring resources wants him" ? Exactly who or what is the UCDDR? If you're pointing the figurative finger at business in general, I don't think there's a particularly pro-business candidate on the slate this time around....they all support the Kyoto Accords, they all want to re-work NAFTA, and they all oppose expanded domestic oil drilling...businesses must be falling all over themselves to climb onto those band wagons.

So, do you think that we have a choice? I think not, as America is a corporation trying to govern the world and dominate every country trying to move at it's own pace. Sept 11. was the catalyst for deception of the American people. Fear immobilizes, knowledge empowers.

Ahh....now I get it. This isn't about Senator McCain, this is about your dislike of American policy. I'm not sure how you determine that America is a corporation. Who are the stockholders? Who are the board of directors? What does this corporation produce? Where does it market its products? There's a difference between being influenced by corporate interests (an unavoidable consequence of said interests having large amounts of cash) and being a corporation.

As for America trying to dominate the world, I'd like to borrow your rose-colored glasses so I can see this vast and shining American Empire. The closest we came to 'dominating the world' was in late 1945, when we actually *did* dominate the world. Our armies, navies, and air forces were on every continent except Antarctica, and were more powerful than any possible opposition, even before you take into account our monopoly on nuclear weapons. So, what did the brutal, oppressive Americans do with the world once they'd conquered it? They handed it back over to its original owners, went home, and called it a day.

So, what did the brutal, oppressive Americans do with the world once they'd conquered it? They handed it back over to its original owners, went home, and called it a day.

reply to post by Brother Stormhammer


One has to wonder why we since we whent home and called it a day, that we spend more on war and military might than the next dozen or so nations combined...nice to know all our troups are at home. I thought the vast majority was stationed abroad...my bad.

Actually, the majority of our troops did come home after World War II. Since then, we've managed to get involved in a lot of places, some of which were Really Bad Ideas (tm).

My point was that if America had the sort of imperial designs that some people seem to believe it has, why didn't we just declare the Empire after World War II, instead of standing down the Army, scrapping most of the Navy, and retiring most of the Army Air Corps? I'm not saying that America is blameless, spotless, and perfect, but we do seem to have (for the most part) avoided the vice of imperialism.

Originally posted by skyshow
That leaves us with one viable choice in 2008... Barack Obama.

He's a racist. He's a liar. He has an empty resume.

He's offers no 'change' and no 'hope'.
He's no different from any other politician.

The only thing that makes him stand out from Hillary and McCain is that Obama has an empty resume, whereas the other two have experience and the capability to be presidential. Obama doesn't even have that.

reply to post by FlyersFan


It would be much nicer and more intune with the desired standards of ATS to try and atleast back up some (preferably all) of your statements. You and everyone of course are entitled to opinion...we all have them, but I do think your post would hold more weight if you backed up your argument...but when you just say those things it's basically meaningless...you might as well have said you can't stand the candidate because he's a low down spineless bag of trash...well, ok, fine, so what?

I enjoy ATS very much, but some posts are virtually meaningless and a huge waste of time and then everyonce in a while you happen accross some that even though I may not agree with, at least gets me to think about it some, and generally they have something backing up the stated opinion or belief. If Obama is racist as you said he was, I would like to see the facts that cause you to believe this to be the case. If he lied on things tell us what these things are. I don't think I have seen any evidence of any of the big three (McCain, Clinton, Obama) being racist, but perhaps you have some information that I have not been privy to, in wich case, I would really appreciate it if you posted it.

thanks
Sky--

Dear TheScientist
kind regards
Yes, the American people will have a choice between McCain and whoever the Dems select to run against him.
Although I disagree with John McCain on past illegal immigration choices, I feel he would be a good president.
Much better than Hillary or Obama.
yours thankfully
John

Originally posted by skyshow
more intune with the desired standards of ATS

I've been here 4 years. You've been here 6 months.
I'm sure I'm much more aware of 'ATS desired standards'
then you are.

some posts are virtually meaningless and a huge waste of time

Snob.

I would like to see the facts

Open you eyes. This site is full of the facts about Obama being a liar and a racist. Thread after thread - Obama's racist and anti-American pastor is his MENTOR and ADVISOR. He donated money to the church and attended for 23 years. Obama is a racist. He claimed he didn't know about Wright being what he is ... that is a flat out lie. Obama's pathetic Econmics is also exposed here for what it is .. FRIGHTENING and impossible.

Thing is .. according to ATS desired standards .. we are NOT supposed to continually repeat information on thread after thread after thread. It's all here at ATS. Just look at the thread titles ...

i always thought hiilary was our only choice becuase of bill clinton

like bush sr and then bush jr so now hillary after bill

McCain is the only choice for this man. I hope that the two (totally unqualified, by the way) Democrats running destroy each others chances to win by continuing to divide their party the way they have. I see nothing but trouble ahead for the Democrats. Works for me.

Can you all not see the deceit at work here? Divided we do not have a chance, racism is the key here (more than most know), it has always been for as long as we have been on Earth. Slavery and an elite ruler class, breaking the freewill of humanity.

Things are going to change real soon and for most they just can't seem to open there eyes or mind to it. However, the truth that has been concealed (relating to everything...politics, race, education, science, religion, history, evolution, creation, economics, aliens, other many other conspiracy theories) that is known to some who have prepared and thus will make it through unscathed (they think).

You must NOT take anything for granted, you personally need to spend the time to educate and enlighten yourselfs. Remember that there is always more to the situation than it seems, the simpliest answer is most likely false. Quit asking for proof with your close minded attitudes, go find it yourself, if you can muster up the will! Once you have enlightened yourself to the point that everything pretty much relates, you will see why things have happend in the past, why the current events are progressing as they do, and what the future has in store too! Then and only then will you be able to see who the correct choice is for our next president.

Not that at this point it really matters, as the PTB have been in control for at least 100 years and they are going to fulfill the prophecy, because they fear their maker because they know they have manipulated and enslaved humanities potential for their gain in the interests of power, knowledge, and money. What they do not realize is that they have been manipulated by Draconian evil race while straying from our creators, the Andomedian light (good) race. Why? So that a NWO/Draconians can prevail when the Earth is reborn. Just another race war, but of intergalatic scale.

In response to Dark_Ace....we are not a monarch here in America, when did the American people begin to think it was a good idea to give the power to family lines?

In response to FlyersFan, Obama may have an "empty resume" as you claim, but have you not come to see that experience in politics is NOT a good thing as it eventually leads to corruption, be it through self-inflicted choices OR ultimatiums from the true PTB? Obama will not cave in to the PTB, just as Kennedy did not, however he will most likely be silenced in the same way. Thus I proclaim I see the future and that Hillary will be the next president. She is not worried as she also knows the future. Many people know the future, it is those that do not that are in trouble.

[edit on 26-3-2008 by percievedreality]

Originally posted by percievedreality
In response to FlyersFan,

yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeees?

have you not come to see that experience in politics is NOT a good thing as it eventually leads to corruption,

Experience is necessary. You MUST have it to be POTUS. International experience is a must. Without it, America is screwed. To throw someone inexperienced in and say they can do a good job - well that doesn't work. In the old days of Lincoln it might have. But not now.

BTW - Obama is already corrupt. Remeber Rezco? Obamas friend Rezco is massively corrupt and Obama claims he 'didn't know', when in fact all of Chicago knew. And then there is his racist mentor of 23 years - Rev. Wright - and the lies of 'I didn't know about his views' ..

Thus I proclaim I see the future and that Hillary will be the next president.

You and the Bible Code agree. Obama will become the nominee. He will be assasinated. Hillary will then become the nominee AND POTUS. McCain will be the republican nominee but will have to step aside due to a heart problem. Mit Romney will step in but will loose to Hillary.

I don't follow the Bible Code .. but I thought you'd find that interesting.