Why Americans feel affinity to Israel? A Question to Americans.

I beg to differ with you.
First:

Jose Padilla is a citizen of the United States. He recently converted to Islam, changed his name to Abdullah Al Muhajir, and visited the Middle East, including Afghanistan and Pakistan. Upon returning on 8 May 2002, Jose Padilla was arrested at Chicago's O'Hare airport by federal agents. Agents detained him based upon evidence collected by the CIA and other intelligence organizations that allegedly shows that he had met with al Qaeda agents and had discussed building and detonating a radioactive "dirty" bomb in the U.S. The U.S. Department of Justice suspected that Padilla was involved with a terrorist organization and may have plotted a terrorist act. On 11 June 2002 he was declared an "enemy combatant" and was transferred from federal custody in New York to a Naval brig in South Carolina. He was denied access to his lawyer and his family. He is in isolation, in the words of Attorney General John Ashcroft "for the duration of the war" on terrorism. In short, Padilla's constitutional right of Habeas Corpus has been suspended.

STRIKE ONE

Citizens are not randomly checked and searched.

They absolutely are. What do you think the TSA searches at the airport (including random anal probes) are?

In addition, what would you call random police checkpoints to catch DWI's?
STRIKE TWO

Torture, while I don't agree with it, is only carried out on foreign illegal combatants.

Well, I beg to differ there also:

The Bush administration's May, 2002 lawless detention of U.S. citizen Jose Padilla -- on U.S. soil -- was, as I recounted in my book, the first incident which really prompted me to begin concluding that things were going terribly awry in our country. The administration declared Padilla an "enemy combatant," put him in a military prison, and refused to charge him with any crime or even allow him access to a lawyer or anyone else. He stayed in a black hole, kept by his own government, for the next three-a-half-years with no charges of any kind ever asserted against him and with the administration insisting on the right to detain him (and any other American citizen) indefinitely -- all based solely on the secret, unchallengeable say-so of the President that he was an "enemy combatant."

STRIKE THREE

The United States does not have concentration camp

Check out the ATS thread below. There are plenty of links that contradict your statement:

www.abovetopsecret.com...
STRIKE FOUR

By signing orders you mean signing statements, I think. They seem to work alright, except if the President deliberately refuses to follow an Act of Congress. I think that would be grounds for impeachment.

You may think that they are alright, but they are illegal. They violate separation of powers. The President does not have the RIGHT to write or REWRITE laws, and that is what signing orders(also known as signing statements) attempt to do. The ABA agrees with me on that.

STRIKE 5

Free speech demonstrations are very widespread in the United States. Hell, they hold marches to give citizenship to illegals while waving the flags of their native countries!

I hardly think that allowing ILLEGALS to have free speech has anything to do with the free speech of US CITIZENS.
What you don't seem to realize is that ILLEGALS in this country have more rights than LEGAL citizens. My children and grandchildren don't have free healthcare, free higher education, and other forms of welfare. But then again, they pay the taxes to allow these criminals to receive that aid. Just another way for the NWO to destroy the fabric of America and the Middle Class.
STRIKE SIX

I think that expanding the money supply is a bad economic policy but it's just that - a different way to run the economy. There are times when it actually helps.

If you think that printing money is a "Good THING", then you should have been in Germany in the 1930's. You would have worn out your wheelbarrow going to the market for a loaf of bread.

STRIKE SEVEN

And Islam isn't very demonized

I guess you haven't listened to some of the Christian conservatives who want to declare all-out war on Islam.
It's just some more of that good ole' American spirit, right?:
"Praise the Lord and Pass the Ammunition."
STRIKE EIGHT, and you're out.

Originally posted by ProfEmeritus
Jose Padilla was designated an illegal enemy combatant - something that is very dangerous. I agree with you there, but you conveniently left out the rest of the story. I'll use Wikipedia since it explains it better than I could.

However, on January 3, 2006, he was transferred to a Miami, Florida, jail to face criminal conspiracy charges. José Padilla was found guilty of all charges against him on August 16, 2007, by a federal jury, which found that he conspired to kill people in an overseas jihad and to fund and support overseas terrorism.

He was scheduled to be sentenced on December 5, 2007, but his sentencing was postponed to January, due to the death of a family member of the Judge was going to sentence him. On January 22, 2008, Padilla was sentenced by US District Court Judge Marcia Cooke to 17 years and four months (or 208 months) in prison.

Second Circuit Court of Appeals:

Declaring without clear Congressional approval (per 18 U.S.C. § 4001(a)), President Bush cannot detain an American citizen as an "illegal enemy combatant" the court ordered that Padilla be released from the military brig within 30 days[15]. However, the court had stayed the release order pending the government's appeal to the U.S. Supreme Court.

Concerning that it almost happened, yes. But we have to be careful lest we begin to cry wolf. I'm just annoyed that the Supreme Court refused to hear his case.

Originally posted by ProfEmeritus
They absolutely are. What do you think the TSA searches at the airport (including random anal probes) are?

I'm firmly against the TSA, especially the fact that they can break open any non-approved locks. As is the case with Padilla, this is something that's gone wrong, but not to the point of making the nation perverse and totalitarian.

Originally posted by ProfEmeritus
In addition, what would you call random police checkpoints to catch DWI's?

Questionably legal. In Michigan Dept. of State Police v. Sitz, the Supreme Court essentially ruled that the checkpoints were illegal but were allowed to stand because the justices felt that checkpoints were worth it. It's an idiotic example of judicial activism, but many states don't allow random checkpoints themselves.

Originally posted by ProfEmeritus
Well, I beg to differ there also:

The Bush administration's May, 2002 lawless detention of U.S. citizen Jose Padilla -- on U.S. soil -- was, as I recounted in my book, the first incident which really prompted me to begin concluding that things were going terribly awry in our country. The administration declared Padilla an "enemy combatant," put him in a military prison, and refused to charge him with any crime or even allow him access to a lawyer or anyone else. He stayed in a black hole, kept by his own government, for the next three-a-half-years with no charges of any kind ever asserted against him and with the administration insisting on the right to detain him (and any other American citizen) indefinitely -- all based solely on the secret, unchallengeable say-so of the President that he was an "enemy combatant."

I said torture, kid, not illegal detention. Next time you "beg to differ," can you actually address the point?

Originally posted by ProfEmeritus
Check out the ATS thread below. There are plenty of links that contradict your statement:

And you think their intended purpose is the detainment of U.S. citizens?

Originally posted by ProfEmeritus
You may think that they are alright, but they are illegal. They violate separation of powers. The President does not have the RIGHT to write or REWRITE laws, and that is what signing orders(also known as signing statements) attempt to do. The ABA agrees with me on that.

Which is why I say that their misuse is grounds for impeachment.

Originally posted by ProfEmeritus
I hardly think that allowing ILLEGALS to have free speech has anything to do with the free speech of US CITIZENS
What you don't seem to realize is that ILLEGALS in this country have more rights than LEGAL citizens.

You mean citizens can't march? They weren't in the specific one I talked about? There are no demonstrations?

Are you kidding me, I hear about a new protest practically every week.

Originally posted by ProfEmeritus
My children and grandchildren don't have free healthcare, free higher education, and other forms of welfare. But then again, they pay the taxes to allow these criminals to receive that aid.

Criminals get free higher education?

I agree with you on the fact that illegals are leeches to the rest of us, but that's another story.

Originally posted by ProfEmeritus
Just another way for the NWO to destroy the fabric of America and the Middle Class.

Which NWO?

Originally posted by ProfEmeritus
If you think that printing money is a "Good THING", then you should have been in Germany in the 1930's. You would have worn out your wheelbarrow going to the market for a loaf of bread.

What are you going to do, not print money? I think you mean purposely increasing the money supply, as I said, which would devalue the dollar. Something that is done right now through the Federal Reserve's regulation of interest rates. I don't believe in it, but it has its uses. Study some Chicago School economics (right now it seems you're speaking as an Austrian).

Originally posted by ProfEmeritus
I guess you haven't listened to some of the Christian conservatives who want to declare all-out war on Islam.
It's just some more of that good ole' American spirit, right?:
"Praise the Lord and Pass the Ammunition."

I thought you meant by the government. There are plenty of idiotic Christians, Jews, Muslims... There are really just damn plenty of idiots. Course you're going to have bigotry.

Originally posted by ProfEmeritus
STRIKE EIGHT, and you're out.

Holy #, can you quit it with that strike bull#?

reply to post by Johnmike

I thought you meant by the government. There are plenty of idiotic Christians, Jews, Muslims... There are really just damn plenty of idiots. Course you're going to have bigotry.

One of them that wants a "Crusade" happens to be the President of the United States.
It's interesting that in your original post, you stated all of those things that you claimed do not occur in the US. When I gave you examples to the contrary, all of a sudden you changed your tune.

As far as free college for aliens, where the heck have you been?
capoliticalnews.com...

Illegal Aliens are now cost honest Californians over $100 million a year in college costs. At the same time, National Guard members, who serve us in combat have to pay for the major portion of their college education. Not only is this not fair, it is immoral to charge those who protect us while giving a free education to those who violate our laws.

The better news is that we are spending at least $117 million per year to allow illegal aliens in state tuition (when they aren’t even here legally), while kids from Texas must pay out of State tuition, though they are citizens.

i could go on, but I think before you post something, you should research it better. You've made so many statements that are incorrect, or contradictory, that further discussion doesn't seem warranted.

Have a nice day.

If you'd stop trying to win an argument like a pompous ass you would have seen that I was giving you the chance to explain yourself and moving from an extreme to a more moderate position in light of what you'd presented.

Jesus Christ.

reply to post by DuneKnight


interesting, I have wondered the same, just on the fact that USA is predominantly Christian, eg., Constitution when Israel rejects Christ.

the only connection, briefly (as I have to go to work) is perhaps the Masonic ties? But then they are not fully disclosed are they?

But, it is a strange relationship!



oh edit to add: your title was addressed to Americans and that I am not, so sorry if I am outside the selection criteria!

[edit on 2-3-2008 by Thurisaz]

well Thurisaz, you can still tell me what Australians think of Israel.

What ticked me off was a segment in the news showing churches around the US all giving the same preach; that Israelis are their brothers and they must donate to help them with something. And the other thing was when hilary and obama in the last debate or so said that they reaffirmed their affliations woith jews/israel, especially hilary by saying rejected instead of denounced. remember that one?

reply to post by DuneKnight


IN a nut shell NO Israel, NO second coming, No new World Under God

It's simple really. Israel is surrounded by bloodthirsty dictatorships who follow a death cult and who have no qualms about slaughtering Jewish women and children. Like their cult leader Muhammed, Muslims are trained that genocide against Jews and christians is good. Remember it was Muhammed who slaughtered 500 Jews because they wouldn't convert to his death cult.

1500 years of Muslim aggression.
www.jihadwatch.org...

Muslims attacked Israel without provocation in 1948, 1967, 1973, and in 1987 the relentless campaign of palestinian terrorism against Israel began.

Americans like underdogs and they don't like heartless dictators. That's why we like Israel. Furthermore we know from the Bible that people would hate christians and Jews without reason. That is what we are seeing, a satanically inspired campaign of hatred against Israel, a country smack in the center of God's plans for the world.

reply to post by DuneKnight


Simple answer: America and Israel are two countries in which hypocritical religious nutjobs call all the shots & make all the money. Isrealies are God's chosen people (God seems to like punishing his chosen people a lot) and America's president talks to God (God seems to like punishing Americans as well by letting a 5th grader be president). Either way, it sucks being from Israel or America these days since the rest of the world thinks both countries are retarded. Both countries also like bombing the crap out of any country that does not see things their way, power mongers always stick together.

reply to post by DuneKnight


Who they are: its the same people with lies and hiding facts like JFK,
ETs, Tesla, A bombs and the rest. (Ex President Ford is thought to be
in one of those categories)

See, they say Americans feel affinity to Israel?
But we do not.

We know its a lie because thats exactly what their mind control tells us.
What a question.
If you don't think their way, they will make a law so you have to.
Don't question 911 cause you will be a terrorist.

Best we find out who they are and we won't need such questions.

Perhaps the main reason why some Americans support Israel is do to the spread of evangelicalism. It slowly radicalizes Christians into believing Armageddon is near, that all Muslims are killers, and that the Jewish people are god's chosen people.

Have you seen Jesus Camp?

www.youtube.com...

I would go on to speculate that the evangelical movement is being sponsored and supported by those with an agenda, e.g. the Israel lobby, Military Industrial Complex, NWO, and so on.

The validity of modern day Jews stating that Israel is their homeland is fallacious to a large extent:

www.iamthewitness.com...

You will find that approximately 90% of people in the world today who call themselves Jews are actually Khazars, or as they like to be known, Ashkenazi Jews. These people knowingly lie to the world with their claims that the land of Israel is theirs by birthright, when in actual fact their real homeland is over 800 miles away in Georgia.

This whole topic is silly however. The whole situation stems from the fact that people cannot live in harmony with one another because they practice a belief system that insists that they force it upon other people.