A Lake on Mars

I don't see why it's so hard to believe that our government could be lying about the color of Mars. They lie about everything else. And to say that every country couldn't possibly be lying about Mars is absurd. UFO's have been tracked on radar by other countries for years and they still haven't come out and said "There are indeed UFO's flying around in our atmosphere". Anyways, here's a picture from Europe's Mars Express. They haven't officially said that that's a lake on Mars but they did say the channel was once formed by flowing water. I don't know if they'll officially come out and say that it is indeed water. Maybe we'll see more pictures like these until they finally decide to say that Mars has an Earthlike atmosphere and contains liquid water. www.esa.int...

If any of you disagree that this is a picture of water on mars then what do you think it is?

This is a picture of where water used to flow. The blue is not water, it's deposits left by flowing water.

There could not be liquid water on the surface, it's too cold.


[Edited on 24-1-2004 by Zzub]

That's not bad going Jenkins, you managed to post this same post in 3 threads within 5 minutes.

Once is enough!

Wow... Funny how the deposits left behind mimmick the way water obscures light. And like I said, what makes you think the government isn't lying about Mars? Temperature and all.

>> what makes you think the government isn't lying about Mars? Temperature and all.

Why would they bother?

Zzub... i'm 15 and realize that the government keeps more things from us then they actually show us. It's not that hard to realize that they would keep this sort of thing from us. Why would they keep it from us? That's for you to decide. It's all of our own theories from here. I'm not saying they are keeping it from us... but I wouldn't be surprised if they did.

I dont know about the picture above, however it was speculated that the rover Spirit may have landed in mud. The reasoning can is that if the water is briny enough, then water could exist in a liquid form at the temperatures and pressures found at the landing site. In this article it goes on to explain that if there was an ocean there that evaporated, then the conditions for this salt water could exist.

www.theage.com.au...

[Edited on 1-24-2004 by William One Sac]

Yea, you could speculate as much as you want about why they would cover up the existence of an Earth like atmosphere on Mars. But tell me... What else could be making the light behave in that way besides water?

[Edited on 1-24-2004 by Jenkins]

This guy has been claiming for quite a long time that he has "proof" of a gigantic lake on Mars. It sounded so crazy at the time, I never really bothered to really research his work deeply. But what if?

cyberspaceorbit.com...



[Edited on 1-24-2004 by William One Sac]

maybe the beagle landed in a lake and drown?? If they did find something 'funny' on mars they wouldn't tell us. imagine the religous and political remifications. And if there were sentiant aliens on mars, the 'seceret societies' would want to figure out how to rule them before they let us know aliens were there

reply to post by Jenkins


Jenkins, how is there water in that picture? Agreed it looks like a channel, probably formed by running water on Mars millions of years ago when Mars was wetter and warmer than it was now. The picture clearly shows solid deposits in the channel not water.

Liquid water cannot exist on mars as the atmosphere pressure is to low, due to the thin Carbon Dioxide atmosphere. In fact, the surface of MArs is rather a good vacuum.

Originally posted by Jenkins
Wow... Funny how the deposits left behind mimmick the way water obscures light. And like I said, what makes you think the government isn't lying about Mars? Temperature and all.

If you don't belive a word NASA/ "The Government" says then, you can obtain the same results yourself. Go to a telescope with a spectometer, and some basic physics and you'll come out with the same result...

The caption of the image from ESA website:

This picture was taken by the High Resolution Stereo Camera (HRSC) onboard ESA's Mars Express orbiter, in colour and 3D, in orbit 18 on 15 January 2004 from a height of 273 km. The location is east of the Hellas basin at 41° South and 101° East. The area is 100 km across, with a resolution of 12 m per pixel, and shows a channel (Reull Vallis) once formed by flowing water. The landscape is seen in a vertical view, North is at the top.

Source:
ESA
www.esa.int...

3D CG Image:
www.esa.int...
Credits: ESA/DLR/FU Berlin (G. Neukum)

I see some ppl saying that it could not be water (H2O) in liquid state on Mars due the low pressure and temperatures.

But what if the liquid was some other kind, not really H2O ?

I mean, another kind of liquid that would not freeze at the temperatures on mars.

PS.
I also would like to add.
As someone already stated above, what if the termperatures/pressure and etc on Mars where not what the govt says ?
Nobody can guarantee that they are saying the truth.
Didnt they lie before ?
(look at the history and you know what i mean)

[edit on 27/11/07 by Krpano]

As I said before, you don't have to belive the government. Get a telescope and spectrometer, and you can reach the same conclusions yourself!

Quite why the government should want to hide facts about Mars doesn't seem at all clear to me. I mean, wouldn't NASA get a huge funding increase if they could show there was life on Mars? Hell I'm surprised they haven't tried it already!



[edit on 27-11-2007 by timelike]

Oh yeah...
Just like i could just go to any local store and buy me the equipment necessary to analyze Mar's surface.

Wouldnt the US govt be quite if they found life on Mars or anykind of minerals they could exploit....to avoid other countries to try to go there too ?
[sarcasm]
Or do you think they would go like:
Hey Germany, France, China...look, we found some new kind of energy booster or whatever.
Or: hey there is life on Mars, why doesnt everybody come here so we can all learn and evolve together just like we do on Earth ?
[/sarcasm]


Im not saying they are lying, im just considering another options.
What scares me most is not the fact they tell the truth or not but the ppl who believe anything govts say without even considering other possibilities.

Ppl like this should read a bit about the Milgram experiment.

That's no water. that picture is not taken with real natural light. it appears to be either taken in UV or some other filtered process. due to that, it could be simply shadow over the mountains. nothing more.

it could also be deposits left there from ice.

but not actual water flowing. it wouldn't look blue like that.

All color digital pictures are FALSE COLOR (there is no such thing as a true color camera).

Some pictures are "approximate true color" which means the camera takes several Black and white pictures of the same location through different filters. These filters give different light intensities, and based on those intensities, the color is basically "GUESSED". Usually the guess is very accurate, as we know through our own experiences with our home digital cameras.

Some pictures, such as the one in the OP are FALSE COLOR IMAGES, in which scientists assign a FALSE contrasting color to some intensities to help distinguish between various materials. They often use blue for Mars, because it contrasts so well with the mostly ochre-colored surface. So that blue material Isn't really blue -- it's a falsely assigned color. That blue material could be a darker yellow, orange or maybe light brown, but the scientists made it look blue so it would be easy to see.

If that photo showed a slightly darker yellow area inside that channel instead of blue, you would never think it was water.

If you looked at that 3D image posted by 'internos', you would see that the material that shows up as blue is sometimes on a slope, and is at different elevations.

I wish ESA published ALL of it's raw photographs, such as the way NASA does. NASA has released over 100,000 raw photos from the rovers, some of them many photos of the same scene taken through different filters. By looking at these raw B&W photos, one can get a better idea of what things really look like, rather than these potentially misleading false color images. Or ESA should release an approximate true color photo along with these false color ones.




[edit on 11/27/2007 by Soylent Green Is People]

Originally posted by Soylent Green Is People

If that photo showed a slightly darker yellow area inside that channel instead of blue, you would never think it was water.

If you looked at that 3D image posted by 'internos', you would see that the material that shows up as blue is sometimes on a slope, and is at different elevations.

Indeed that was the purpose of posting that 3d CG image :

MOC wide-angle image M02-00302
www.msss.com...
www.msss.com...
www.msss.com...
www.msss.com...

reply to post by Soylent Green Is People


A very good, reasonably short, explanation for a very complex question. It seems that pictures do speak louder than words, as people often see what is there before their eyes without reading why they are seeing something other than what is really there. (See why I liked your explanation better?:lol

Seriously, a really good explanation, and maybe we ought to frame it and put it on the wall to quote from time to time.(Yours, not mine.)

WOS, interesting links. I'll check that out here in a bit.

Great work as usual, internos.