Don't force us to interact with our abusers

Group to magistrate: Don't force us to interact with our abusers

www.9news.com

However Blom said, "(It's) like a rapist and a rape victim forced to be in the same room together. It's no different."

"Educate judges, save lives!" the group shouted as it marched around the building.

(visit the link for the full news article)


Related News Links:
abcnews.go.com
www.lectlaw.com

[edit on 27-9-2007 by Eye_Of_Truth]

[edit on 27/9/2007 by Mirthful Me]

To start let me say that I am sympathetic to abused people. However most people know little about how messed up and dangerous the law really is. When people see anything to do with Domestic Violence the first thing they think about are what they have seen on the 5:00 news or O.J. Simpson. This is because most cases of Domestic Violence go un-noticed because they lack the grip of a big story line. Who wants to hear about the Dad who lost his children because he was acused of D.V.
Is this Magistrate wrong in doing this?
Do fathers not have any right to be fathers if they are acused of D.V?
Are all men Criminals, Sex offenders, and at very least Dangerous?
Will the Police state rise up and remove this judge for creating a controversy?
At very least is their no forgivness and redemption for people in this country who may want to turn their lives around and be fathers to their children?
Their are lots of facts that most people out there don't understand when it comes to D.V. If you have ever been unfortunate enough to have to go through D.V. you know that it can be devastating. Police can and do violate constitutional rights to make arests in D.V. cases becasue of the ease of a conviction. Just another tool for the police state. Until the truth and stereotypes about D.V. are exposed all men are soon to be doomed to be labled as dangerous second class citizens.
This story is gaining strength and is going to be a national story by the weekend. I am curious to hear if other people out there have had bad experiences with D.V. laws and know that the truth isn't what you hear on the news or see on the TV. That is just a fraction of what is really going on.

www.9news.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

[edit on 27/9/2007 by Mirthful Me]

Sorry first Thread and it wont take the title of the article

reply to post by Eye_Of_Truth


So are you saying that the men's rights to "forgiveness" supersedes a woman's security or at the least, sense of security? This should not be a universal mandate. It should be only mandated in an individual case, not in a blanket sense IMHO.
Some of these guys can be extremely dangerous and even murderous. You sound like you think the victims here are the men, not the women.

I come from a very mentally and emotionally abusive relationship. I had PTSD when I left. He was careful never to hit me, but that doesn't make any difference. The mental scars take far longer to heal than the physical ones.

If he HAD hit me, I wouldn't have to face him day after day. We got stuck with a daily child visitation schedule. For a long time he used the exchanges to intimidate me, and I often went home and had panic attacks afterward.

But the courts don't recognize emotional abuse as DV, and I've been treated as if I'm making up things just to get custody of the kids. I'm concerned about their safety with him. I've always been the caretaker, on call 24/7. he abandoned us for his girlfriend most of the time when I was pregnant with our son, and now he fights for custody.

Our divorce has been called high-conflict, but not only that, our judge says it's one of the worst of the worst. The statistics show that at least 70% of high conflict divorces are caused by domestic violence in the marriage, carrying over into fighting for the children. The mother wants to protect them, the abusive father knows this, and he fights for the children in an effort to hurt her.

I know it works; it's been 18 months and we're still fighting it out. The only reason an end is in sight for us is that the court finally ordered us to a custody evaluation. And even that, I'm not sure is going well for the children or for me.

Abusive men tend to file for custody much more often than non-abusers. The worst ones fight hard and long, and usually end up with partial or full custody over 70% of the time.

The statistics also show that a man who abuses his wife in any way is much more likely to abuse his children, including sexually. Because for them it's about control, not love. They just call it love because that's all they know.

so, yeah, I don't want to see my abuser daily anymore. And I have no choice. I could tell stories about the mean and twisted things he's said and done to our daughter to upset me all day long, but I don't want to clog up the thread.

Worst of all, the worst of these manipulative abusive types are also pathological liars, and very convincing. So they come across in the court, in mediation or an evaluation as emotionally stable and "wronged" and the emotionally damaged, frightened mother as "hysterical" and "vengeful."

Hooray for stereotypes.

The only places in the country where emotional and psychological abuse are NOT considered domestic violence is in the courts. I get services at a domestic violence center because they don't discriminate about which is worse, physical or emotional violence.

Violence is violence. And telling someone she wasn't abused is just blaming the victim, just like they did to rape victims prior to the mid 20th century.

No, What I am saying is that no one will listen to any of the other sides of this issue. Please don't asume that I am saying all D.V. abusers should be put into a room alone with the person they are acused of hurting. What I am saying is that we cant lable all D.V. cases as though they are all the same and exclude one parent from being a parent because of D.V. Most of the time it is a Man who is charged with D.V. Research and find out stats and you will see that actual cases like O.J. Simpson are but just a fraction of what is actually happening. Most D.V. cases are not anywhere near that serious. The other thing is that this is a powerfull tool for women to use to gain an advantage in a divorce. I have seen it first hand and it is very easy to do. Those are the people that you need to be upset with because they are the ones who cry wolf and hurt the people who you are argueing for. Laws are sexually bias towards women when it comes to this issue and that is a fact.

Everything that you just said about men can be said about women as well. Where did you come up with the figures you quote? Who says that most abusive men try for custody? You sound bitter and maybe rightfully so, but you got into a relationship with a jerk and had kids with him, and now you are complaining, even though he never hit you.

Did he talk mean? Did he nag? Women do that too. You may be right about a lot of this but many men go thru hell because women use kids as a lever to get money and attention as well. How many ' boyfriends ' are responsible for most of the horros we hear about happening to kids? All the time. Blaming all men and generalizing won't do; the door swings both ways.

As far as not wanting to work custody out face to face , how can a kid see both parents if they cannot be at the same place at the same time? only in rare exceptions, where violence is immanent or likley, should there be any third parites there. Sounds like a personal problem and a matter of making better life choices. The judges cannot assign a bodyguard and a counselor to every couple who breaks up and has kids; some people need to get more mature and responsible before they get pregnant with some idiots kids and then have to live with their consequences.

If this guy never hurt you, and only yaks a lot, for sure divorce him but as far as needing a nanny to take your place when it comes to working out arrangements for your kid, give it up, society doesn't owe you anything, you made your bed, laid in it, and now don't like the firmness..too bad.

The article in question did not go into much detail aside from meeting in the same room during custody hearings. I know the domestic violence range can be very broad and cover many different things so no one case or procedure can be applied to all situations. If I remember right though, one of the basic rights of all accused is being able to face your accuser. So as I see it, if that is going to be changed, then the rights of the accused need to be changed from the ground level.

Custody hearings do not come under the auspices of criminal law so it's not an accused and accuser situation.

and to eyewitness:

Thanks for blaming the victim. Again. Much appreciated.

I get my statistics from books written by Lundy Bancroft and Jay Silverman. Silverman is a psychologist, and Bancroft works with battering men in a batterer's program. The work I quoted from was a review of all the literature by both men, with their expertise added to it.

You can go to Bancroft's website and read an extract from the book I was quoting here.

I've been through what he describes myself. What he says is right on the money.

If you haven't been in a DV situation then you know NOTHING about it. So I would appreciate you not lecture me on what I've been through during the past 11.5 years and the total muck up the court has made of the situation.

People who are abused should be protected from there attackers, However we can't asume that everyone who is in D.V. Situation is abusive or is any less of a parent. Some marrages don't work and I have seen several women making false claims agenst their husband's to get a restraining order put into place to keep him from their children. Not all women do this but some do, and more than people think.
All I am tring to do is ask people to be careful how they go about making and changing laws when it comes to this issue. Lots of good fathers are being taken from there children because of Bias laws. Police Don't care most of the time they just show up and arrest someone. (usually the man).

Originally posted by Eye_Of_Truth
However we can't asume that everyone who is in D.V. Situation is abusive or is any less of a parent.

This has to be one of the most moronic statements I've yet to see on ATS.
I usually refrain from using such strong language, but I'll risk the warning to say this:
D.V. IS abuse, you nimrod. And it's also abusive to the children. Don't you think that if a kid sees their mom being hit, that they're not going to be afraid that they will be hit as well?To say nothing of the fact that quite often, men who beat their wives will eventually beat the kids. And on top of that, most batterers grew up seeing their mothers being battered; it's a known fact that watching your mother be beat to a pulp makes a kid far more prone to grow up and do the same to their wives/girlfriends.

And then the victim gets blamed. I can't believe some of the responses on this thread. Where is the compasion and common sense? Yes, I do think that batterers SHOULD lose their children until they can demonstrate that they no longer will batter. Unfortunately, this is not the norm, most men continue battering. It is not uncommon for the men to kill the woman and/or the children. I have worked with batterers and abused women for 15 years and I do know what I'm talking about. These guys are extremely dangerous and unpredictable.
I think you need to listen to women who have been in this situation. Yes, there are women batterers, too, but mostly they are men. And before anyone accuses me of hating men, I will say this: I think that if a woman is battering her spouse and/or kids, she should not have access to the kids, either until she gets help and doesn't batter any more.
This isn't about men vs. women or who's to blame. It's about being humane to the abused spouse and the children, it's about common sense and compassion - 2 qualities that seem to be all but forgotten in today's society.

MajorMalfunction, thank you very much for sharing about a horrible chapter of your life. I'm sure you are still very vulnerable from all this and to put yourself out there to try to educate people is a brave and noble thing. Just ignore the morons who want to blame the victim and don't have enough humanity to care that you AND your children were irretrievably harmed. My heart goes out to you and I do understand and agree with the points you've made. I hope things get better for you soon. If you ever need to talk about this, please feel free to U2U me any time.

Thank you, Forestlady. I knew from the tone of the first two posts that I shouldn't read any more of this thread or my BP and PTSD would flare up. But when I saw a woman post, I came on to read it.

It's attitudes like those you rail against that keeps me in the court hell I'm in. Thank you so much for understanding!