Women's Rights and the Objectification of Women in America

This thread occurred to me a few minutes ago in another thread. How do you guys feel about the equality of women in society? Are women truly equal? Or is that simply a myth?

I think it's pretty fair to say that there are still many in this society that view women as objects. My questions to you are, do you agree with this? Do women bring it upon themselves? Is the objectification of women fair or unfair?


Opinions welcome.

Jasn

Society has been run by males for thousands of years. Only recently have we have the somewhat enlightened mind to understand that regardless of race and gender we are all equal as human beings. There are smart and there are dumb women, just like men. There are smart and there are dumb African Americans, just like those of European descent. It is not a myth that women are equal to men, the myth is that men are somehow better than women. The only thing unequal is that because of hormones and body structure men have the potential to be physically stronger (but once again you'll find some fat and lazy people of both genders).

I'm a man btw.

reply to post by SimiusDei


I think that, unfortunately, male bashing has become a big hit lately. Things like "Everybody Loves Raymond" or any of the hundreds of commercials that show the MAN to be fat and stupid and needing his wife for...well everything including common sense. So I actually feel that we're heading down the opposite road. It is even becoming kind of a fad where men are now taking women's last names after marriage.

If we look at all human history, we'll see that man was generally superior due largely to his superior physical abilities. It has basically been a dog eat dog world, if you want something, you take it by force. This is why men have been perceived to be superior. They had the brute strength to fight for something or hunt more proficiently, and it has only been of recent that women have been growing to our equals (according to society).

I do think that if we end up blowing ourselves back into the stone age, men will once again be more dominant BECAUSE of their superior physical abilities.

[edit on 9-9-2007 by bigbert81]

If you want my honest opinion bout women in the US, here it is.

Though times have gotten better, it's still a man's world. Sure there are some women in top positions in companies, government, and so on... It's still male dominated.

Women are not treated at God status, as suggested in said thread. I wish they were. It would make my life a lot easier. It's harder for a woman to climb cooperate latter than men. I once worked in a male dominated company, where I was still treated like a secretary instead of the manager I was. When a higher position was available in the company, and I put my name in the ring, they went out of the company and hired a man. I'm not saying they didn't think he was the best candidate... only that I was passed up, in a male dominated company for another guy.

Women are only praised if beautiful. Take Britney Spears for example (back in the hight of her career). She was young, beautiful but not that talented. She was a pop diva, and I've heard just as talented voices on American Idol... that got turned away cause they weren't beautiful, and some who were better that had sever weight problems that got turned away.

When a woman gets in the media and isn't pretty in some way, she's a comedian.. to be laughed at... or someone who we are supposed to think is a witch with a B. No one looks at a woman's merits... only her beauty.

Ok, off my soap box.

reply to post by JessicaS


After millions of years through a very male dominated existence, how can people expect men or women to just shut off something that has literally become a part of their nature?

Yes, young and sexy will work better because SEX SELLS. The same thing goes for an attractive man. Also, if sex sells, why would a company who has millions of people at it's disposal want someone who's not attractive since it would most certainly cost them money?

Hmm, where to start.

I believe that the woman's rights movement was derailed by the mass marketplace.

Think of all the products/services a 'modern' woman buys in order to be a part of the workforce, especially if she is also a mother. Think of all the products marketed to her, and her income that use sexuality as a tool.

One example I often give is disposable diapers. They were invented to allow mothers more time to do what they want, be it housework or out in the workforce, instead of washing dirty diapers. Now disposable diapers are viewed as a necessity for almost all families in the United States, because Mom needs to be 'working' because she is equal.

I wonder how many families ever really look at the costs of childcare/disposable diapers versus the income of the parents... I bet the kids would grow up better adjusted if a parent stayed home/worked from home, and did cloth diapers.

Plus, the govt.s love it because more workers equal more gdp, equals more taxes...

The whole thing disgusts me because somewhere the hard work of mothers became demeaned and belittled, when the job of a stay at home mom is probably more difficult than anything besides heavy labor. Kids are wild!

Go call your mother!

DocMoreau

I might as well go ahead and throw my 2 pennies into the mix.

This is my opinion.


Women (as a generality) have no one to blame but women for the way they are viewed in today's society.

I say this because of such GARBAGE as the "girls gone wild" craze. This crap is promoted to absurd levels and this constant promotion is teaching young men how women "should" be viewed.

Naturally, the argument could be made that the men making and promoting these videos are to blame for this, however, this logic is flawed. IF those women weren't out there turning themselves into objects for some stupid beads that cost 99 cent per dozen, the men who started this crap would have never even had the idea.

Unfortunately, I feel the concept of a lady being a lady is quickly being lost.

These same women that do this horrid mess for the world to see for nothing more than what equates to a "doggy treat", are so quick to run around and say "Hey don't call me a slut." Sorry ladies, but that's EXACTLY WHAT YOU ARE.

The bad thing about this is, there are plenty of women who do NOT lower themselves to these standards, yet they get lumped in with this trash because it seems like the trashiest members of the female gender are more the rule now than the exception.

It's actually pretty darn sad.

At what point in time did the fairer sex turn themselves into street walking trash just for the sake of being street walking trash?

I honestly pity the women who have been cast into the lot with this garbage.

However, where I have my problem is that I think the women that are busy blaming their problems on men, should direct that attention to the women that are giving them a bad name instead.

Now, as far as male dominated society goes, I agree that this tends to be the rule. However, throughout history, there have been a fair number of women who had just as much, if not more, control than men had over society.

Personally, I would LOVE to see a society headed by the right woman. Why? Because I personally have witnessed in my short time on this planet that some women can be far more decisive and BRUTAL than any man ever could be. I would love to see the day a woman was in charge that was willing to "lay down the law."

There are several reasons for this.

1. No one would be able to use the "gender bias" argument against her.
2. Sometimes sheer brutality and ultimate decisiveness are needed to fix problems.




To describe another problem I see that women face, I will tell you a brief story of one of my experiences.

I have always tried to be the "gentleman" when it comes to women I date.

I dated this one girl in particular for close to 3 years. In the beginning I ALWAYS went out of my way to hold the door for her, open her car door for her, pay for dates and such as that. All my efforts resulted in were her getting mad with me for doing things for her that she could do for herself. Basically, she told me I was slapping her in the face by being a gentleman. So, I said "okay." And I ceased with the "insult". Skip ahead two and a half years or so and she and I begin having problems. She then decides to throw up that I never act like a gentleman anymore and she wants someone that will "take care of her". Needless to say, I promptly booted her because she was blaming our problems on things that SHE was the reason for.

My point being, some women seem to want their cake and eat it too. They expect things to be how they want them WHEN they want them that way.

I'm sorry, but life just isn't like that.

They seem to be on a perpetual search for "perfect" and, I'm sorry ladies, but perfect just ain't there.


Now, don't get me wrong, I know these things don't apply to ALL women. But, in my time, I have noticed that they are more the rule than the exception.


I think that for women to ever truly be happy, they need to find a common ground where they are comfortable and where they can stay.

Us men may be smart, but we aren't too bright when it comes to women simply because it seems that there is no figuring you guys out.


Perhaps you need to work on figuring yourselves out and what YOU want and then we can cater to THAT.

Until then, I feel the turmoil between the sexes will continue.



I shouldn't have to say this but I will.

I have the utmost respect for women who respect themselves. I would gladly serve under one in a job environment any day of the week as long as she held herself to the standards that were set for her. The same goes for any man.

There is no "better" sex, however, there are vast differences between the sexes. Some of these should be worked on, while others are needed in order for society to continue.


Ladies, I personally only feel that your place is "in the kitchen" if that is what you want for yourself. However, if you decide that that is indeed your place in life, please don't get mad at us men for learning to expect it out of you. Because those of you that DO choose that as your place, also put the expectation on us to live as if our place is working and taking care of the family financially.

Gender bias is truly a double edged sword. In some ways it is a good thing, in other ways it is a TERRIBLE thing.


However, basic human rights are owed to ALL regardless of gender or anything else.


Men that don't respect a woman that DESERVES respect are pathetic. However, the same can be said for any woman that doesn't reciprocate the treatment when earned.





Jasn

When I read this thread one thought just flashed it's way up out of the murky darkness that is my memory. First grade assignment in writing "what do you want to be when you grow up". I said President. I had to redo the paper (all of one paragraph) and got a lecture on how women could not ever be president. I asked why. (Because I asked a heck of a lot of "why" questions back then...I have learned better now...) And the answer was because you are not a man. Only men can be president. This was a female teacher. Miss Tubach who became Mrs. Bebe.

Did I remember that when I was passed over time and again for promotions in my male dominated field? Nah. I made jokes about them picking candidates who were "taller" than me. (I am 5"2' and don't even try the height intimidation card on me...all ya'll are all taller than me...doesn't bug me none) Did I have big big dreams that were discouraged in all those subtle subtle ways? Of course, all my friends did. When I took science classes I was "that nerd girl". All the cool chicks were in home ec.

I didn't make valedictorian (I salute the salutorians! Second best is good enough!) because shop class A's apparently count. It was a small rural school........ I am a realist. I am aware of the world around me. Aware of dangers and opportunities. I realize that I live just about the best place to be a woman. And it makes me sad. It should be better than this.

Women want to be People. Humans are sexually dimorphic but are still human. I think one of the greatest, most understated and mis-understood tragedy of the male dominated society is that Men want to be People too. What we are not allowed is criminal. When we make rules about what is "Men"
and what is "Women" we rob ourselves and our future of what is really possible.

Do I understand that it could be much much much worse for me somewhere else? Of course I do. I am lucky to be an American. So are you. That really isn't much of a consolation, and seems to be slipping away as we speak.

And Similus Dei probably needs to do some deep hard thinking about what he really wants and needs from his life on this planet. It is easy to confuse an encounter with one individual as justification for an extrapolation on many. If he really encounters these kind of polar opposites in daily life I would be looking at the lens that he is using to view these encounters with. Or maybe he is just unlucky. The television is not our friend.

I am not to be treated by what you think my clothes or manner say about me. I should be treated according to my actions. Chicks dig it. Trust me.

women are humans that help the world populate and have places in society that is fixed so balance of how society evolves