Democracy DENIED, in Gaza.

Further disregard for human life portrayed by the United States of America.

No, this is not a thread about Iraq, Nor Bush, Nor the various crimes against humanity 2 specific leaders should be tried for…

This is for that quiet, un-spoken tragedy being forced upon a people, who are striving and searching for a way to build on their society and civility in a world of violence and hatred.

We seem only too quick to judge, and force restrictions, without even discussing or attempting to retain some sort of moral ethics amongst nations.
Palestine, more specifically Gaza.

"This is the choice of the people," Qureia, a member of the party's discredited old guard who did not run for re-election, told reporters here. "It should be respected."

If there is ever more an example of the United States Hypocritical stance, I would like to hear it. After our lies about Iraq were discovered when, no WMDs were discovered; we turned to the righteous and undeniable issue of democracy and civilian rights.

But it seems that civil rights & democracy are only ascertained by a nation should it have the blessings of the United States. It matters not if the people freely elect, nor if the people’s lives improve under this new leadership, if the United States doesn’t approve, the people will suffer.

Time Magazine – August 13 2007-08-08
‘’ A sort of Peace in Gaza ‘’

Details, how the Hamas overthrow of the Fatah party has brought a respite in violence. Has brought some normality to society that once was a dream amongst Gazinians.

It’s now illegal to fire guns for celebratory events.
Armed men roaming the streets are quickly surrounded, detained and de-armed. As seen below:




Drug Smuggling, Tribal clashes and kidnappings and I quote
‘’ have all but disappeared ’’

There’s been strides made in introducing and implementing shari’a law courts, to bring about some guidelines to which a violent street has now turned into a motorcade of happy newly weds.

Such lengths taken in Iraq would be hailed as an American success.
Such lengths taken in any nations, once considered on the verge of civil war would be considered extremely positive.

You’d think such positive aspects emerging would be met with open arms from western nations, you’d think maybe we would try to nurture, and provide economic assistance so this struggling, but succeeding nations could break free from the shackles that decades of death and destruction have caused.

But no, we in the West consider this democratic government that is striving for a better society for its people a threat, an evil regime.



WHY do we force them to hate us, by denying the basics of life?

The Gazan economy continues to deteriorate as a result of the limited opening of the Gazan crossings. The vast majority of import-dependent industries – notably the wood, construction and garment sectors – have temporarily closed down. Only 10% of Gaza's industries, those depending on previously-stored raw materials, remain partially functional.

Why do we deny them, their right to export goods?

The vast majority of import-dependent industries – including the wood, construction and garment industries – have closed down. 400 truckloads of furniture ready to be shipped to Israeli and other export markets valued at more than US $8 million remain stranded in Gaza.

Why do we deny them the ability to produce?

Agriculture
The high cost of cultivation due to increasing prices of raw materials has meant that crops such as strawberries, clustered tomatoes, cherry tomatoes and paprika which are normally planted at this time of the year are not being planted. With little prospect for exporting these crops, plantings will be substantially lower. Strawberry plantation is due to start by mid-August. There are some 40,000 baby strawberry plants ready be planted on a space of 2,000-2,500 dunums. Unless the closures are lifted, it is unlikely that these crops will be ready for export.

Now im not saying things are perfect, so before people attack me with examples of crime and abuses Im sure there are..
As there are in some of the BEST communities in the world.
This does not mean, Gaza doesn’t deserve the CHANCE to govern itself?
This does not mean, we the west.. Have a RIGHT to blockade them…
Why do we scream about the rights of a nation to have democracy and a free society, yet refuse to give it to a middle eastern nation that earnt it, and FOUGHT for it?

I do not take any praise for the photos or the examples, as this came from photos and lines from within TIME, I think this is an EXCELLENT article which has been eerily silent on the mainstream news.


Why is Israel so determined to wipe Hamas of the face of the earth?

Offensive pushes Hamas government near collapse
The Israeli offensive aimed at bringing home a captured soldier threatens to finish off Islamist militant group Hamas' attempt at elected government, already straining under international sanctions and a ...

Why, are we (The west & Israel) forcing the Palestinian people to SUFFER, because they chose a government we do not like?)

Why should HAMAS recognise Israel, when Israel, and the west refuses to recognise Hamas?

Israel DESERVED the right to its own land.
But by FORCING the inhabitants off this land, and forcing them to live in squaller, cut off from the world, they lost this right.
And for every day they deny Palestinians there GOD GIVEN Right of freely electing a leader, in the fashion we demand… will only further cause resentment.

You have got to ask?
For decades leaders have been asking HOW DO WE FIX the Palestine/Israel conflict?

Yet, it seems we refuse to accept who they are, what they want and why they want it?
If we just opened our ears, our hearts and our minds and reasoned with these people we might find they are no different to us.
We might find, they care for their children, their futures and their leaders.
Are they REALLY, any different from us?
So why do they deserve to live like animals?

Would you accept someone, who kicked you out of your home, beat and killed your people? Whom denied you the basic rights of life?
Whom constantly told the world, YOU were the problem, for wanting your OWN land?




These people still manage to crack a smile, when look what’s been inflicted on them in the background?
You enjoy living in a nice, clean manicured home, would you be able to smile if you lived here:



www.time.com...
www.washingtonpost.com...
www.topix.net...

Pretty damn disgusting that people can argue tooth and nail defending our righteous war for democracy in Iraq.
Yet, remain silent when our colours of democracy are shown in Palestine.

Either way, I will continue to post pictures of our 'bringing democracy to the middle east' endevours, that the shackled media refuses to.











Oh yeah, I can just SEE the democracy oozing from Israel and the US.
We make them stand like cattle, to enter their OWN COUNTRY!

Are you argueing that we should just stand back and let them impose shari’a law, and let shari’a law spread?

Also, those picture of the wall... FANTASTIC, ill take 2000 miles of it to put on the south boarder of the US.

Your cpmplaing that they are being forced to stand in line like cattle... oh poor them... they deserve worse, they treat their women LOWER then cattle, look in those picture, you don't see one women, opps, wait there's one women, but shes a westerner, shes not wereing your beloved BIRKA

Im sorry i have no symphathy for the devil

My point precisley.
Arrogant, Ignorant people who lable people the DEVIL.
Tell me, were the French in 1940 the devil?
Are Iraqi's now the devil?
Were the chinese the devil?

An occupied nation fighting for their OWN land being labeled the devil?

No wonder the world hates us, look at how we portray ourselves.

wow, im double posting everything tonight for some reason, this is like the 3rd time tonight, and it has never happen before...

Deleate this post

[edit on 8/9/2007 by TKainZero]

Originally posted by Agit8dChop
My point precisley.

So you are in fact in favor of shari’a law, you seem to be knowledegble on the subject, and i can't belive that you don't know that atrocities of shari’a law, and if you find this type of lifestyle to be favorible to you, im sorry you realy don't have a place in the civilaized world, and the very least in the US.

Arrogant, Ignorant people who lable people the DEVIL.

The only one here to use that word is you.

Tell me, were the French in 1940 the devil?

No they were just damm stuipd, falling to the same invasion plan from Germany that it suffered 25 years before, just one of many acts of military blunders by the french.

Are Iraqi's now the devil?

No ther'ye in a flux state with a majority of chaotic states around it that funnel terror into the country.

Were the chinese the devil?

Were... now what did they do, its what they are GOING TO DO!

An occupied nation fighting for their OWN land being labeled the devil?

You are obsessed witht the devil. And if people were waring with one another in this region, calling each other inflamitory names, it should come as no suprise, as for as long as history has been recorded there has been chaos in that area, vast wars, from many diffrent people.

No wonder the world hates us, look at how we portray ourselves.

The media is patheic, and portrays a constaint warped view to the population, and presumably the world. Right now the US is controlled by a bucnh of curput corprate pigs, hell bend on making a profit form themselves and thier friends, rather then giving a mere second of thought to our nation. And dispite what has been said, this country has lasted, without a dictatorship, built on the founding documents that hold this great nation together.

[edit on 8/9/2007 by TKainZero]

Originally posted by TKainZero
Are you argueing that we should just stand back and let them impose shari’a law, and let shari’a law spread?

If that's what they want then what does it have to do with you? There doesn't seem to be much of a problem with your friends the Saudis having that style of government.

The right to self-government shouldn't include the phrase 'as long as the US and the West approves'.

Hamas is is an organization of murderous fundamentalist nutcases, and actually I agree we shouldn't be giving them a penny. It's entirely the Palestinian people's choice whom they elect, but frankly, they screwed themselves over royally when they voted for Hamas.

That said, Hamas's election victory shouldn't be taken as signifying that your average Palestinian is crying out for Sharia law. The election of Hamas was less an endorsement of Hamas than a protest vote against Fatah's corruption and ineffectiveness. From what I have read, the Gazan's in particular are a fairly cosmopolitan bunch (by the standards of the region anyway) and not particularly inclined to fundamentalism.

But unfortunately they were stuck with a choice between honest fanatics and ineffective crooks, and they picked the fanatics.

How do we fix it?

We don't.

By "we", of course, I mean the United States. Gaza and Israel are none of our business. Our biggest mistake was getting involved, supporting Israel, trying to play World Police. We can't possibly hope to rid the world of injustice, let alone force it upon it.

Originally posted by Chris McGee
There doesn't seem to be much of a problem with your friends the Saudis having that style of government.

The right to self-government shouldn't include the phrase 'as long as the US and the West approves'.

Yea i ahve a little bone to pick with the Saudi's too, but thats not right now.

The United States is special, they decided to take a stand on Slavery, this great country has taken a stand on Issues of Morality, and as it being the beacon on the Free World, the United States has an Obligation to bring civility to the world, and bring them into the Free and Modern world.

Originally posted by TKainZero

Originally posted by Chris McGee
There doesn't seem to be much of a problem with your friends the Saudis having that style of government.

The right to self-government shouldn't include the phrase 'as long as the US and the West approves'.

Yea i ahve a little bone to pick with the Saudi's too, but thats not right now.

The United States is special, they decided to take a stand on Slavery, this great country has taken a stand on Issues of Morality, and as it being the beacon on the Free World, the United States has an Obligation to bring civility to the world, and bring them into the Free and Modern world.

An obligation? I wouldn't say that. Even if it were so, it's certainly an obligation that hte United States has been neglecting since day one.

The United States is special, they decided to take a stand on Slavery,

You mean being the last country to make it illegal?

this great country has taken a stand on Issues of Morality, and as it being the beacon on the Free World, the United States has an Obligation to bring civility to the world, and bring them into the Free and Modern world.

We have no more right or obligation to bring our idea of civility to others than they do to us. We don't have anymore right to force Western conceptions of morality on the middle east than they have a right to force Sharia law (their ide of morality) on us.

Originally posted by TKainZero
[...] the United States has an Obligation to bring civility to the world, and bring them into the Free and Modern world.

Obligation? You mean like "The White Man's Burden"? We still have this kind of thinking in this century? :shk: