Any ATS members on the Square????

Everyone has their right to their own opinion

-- VIRTUS JUNXIT MORS NON SEPARABIT --

I just have a question for the masons, as someone who might consider joining if it were worth the time and effort...

For lack of a simpler way to put it, "What's in it for me?"

Is all of masonry just memorizing very long texts and going through drama rituals, where all you get out of it is a moral or something philosophical? Or is there anything "hands-on" such as workings in the occult?

How has masonry changed your life in a way that nothing else could have? Has it given you any profound understanding about yourself, how the world works, or anything else? If you can share details that would be great, but it's understandable if you can't.

I live nowhere near Washington D.C so maybe that gives you an idea of how the lodges around here are regarding security. No its not a walkin public temple you can just walk into either.

Hi Yarcofin, well.. "What's in it for you?" Actually that's not quite easy to say, just because the lodges all over the world doesn't all work the same and doesn't even have the same rituals, though the base might be somewhat the same all over the world.

I myself was invited some years ago and didn't really had a clue what they were up to or who they were, I can only say that after I've joined I know more about the "truth" than before. Another quite good thing is that when I went to the states some 7 years ago I was invited to a lodge in Florida where they all took care of me, what I mean by that is that regarding a place where to live during my stay and to get food on the table I din't have to think about it. So we all "take care" of each other. Money isn't the issue, it's about respecting a fellow mate thats visiting your country.

But then, this is just a small part of whats going on in the masonic world. But hey, as I said, they aren't all the same. I can only speak for myself and the one's that "I know of". If you have any more specific questions I'll be glad to answer them as far as I'm allowed to.

Best regards
IllumUA

Originally posted by topsecretombomb
I live nowhere near Washington D.C so maybe that gives you an idea of how the lodges around here are regarding security. No its not a walkin public temple you can just walk into either.

OK then. Name just one of these "secret books" that cannot be found in a public library.

Come on, just one.

Originally posted by Masonic Light


OK then. Name just one of these "secret books" that cannot be found in a public library.

Come on, just one.

Listens to the sound of crickets chirping.





[edit on 25-7-2007 by Masonic Light]

Originally posted by Yarcofin
I just have a question for the masons, as someone who might consider joining if it were worth the time and effort...

For lack of a simpler way to put it, "What's in it for me?"

It depends on what you want to put into it. Might sound cliche, but it's true. If you are active and participate, the bonds of friendship you will make with the brethren is one thing. If you memorize all the ritual I would say that you would have a very real sense of accomplishment within yourself. If you read and study Masonic literature or other related material, you just might find that you look at the world a little differently. These are just a few examples.

Also, there's roast beef. Mmmmmm...

Is all of masonry just memorizing very long texts and going through drama rituals, where all you get out of it is a moral or something philosophical? Or is there anything "hands-on" such as workings in the occult?

No, that's not all of it. A big part, perhaps, but not all. "Hands-on ... workings in the occult?" I highly doubt that, given the context implied; though it probably wouldn't be hard to find someone willing to discuss those kinds of things with you. Really it depends on the lodge. Some are more esoterically inclined than others. It really is what you make of it.

How has masonry changed your life in a way that nothing else could have? Has it given you any profound understanding about yourself, how the world works, or anything else? If you can share details that would be great, but it's understandable if you can't.

Masonry is a "vehicle for enlightenment," if you will. There are other ways to achieve what Masonry can in an individual. There are *plenty* of "Masons" out there who have never set foot in a lodge, or even considered doing so. No, Masonry has no monopoly on changing lives. It has a unique way of doing it, however. But again, it all comes down to YOU. What are you willing to put into it for yourself? The answer to that question is the answer to YOUR question.

Me personally? It really hasn't changed me all that much. I'm a little more reverent, I think, and I seem to be quicker to help a stranger than I once was. I also have friends and Brothers all over the world, that I might never have met otherwise. The best part of it is difficult to describe. It's an internal, personal thing; an increased knowledge of self, perhaps.

I have learned a great deal since I started researching Masonry a few years ago, and it's not something I expect to end. I'll keep learning until I reach the end of my time...

[edit on 7/25/07 by The Axeman]

Hahahaha I would like to see proof you're a mason buddy. Anyways if you're a mason that knows secret information you wouldnt be on conspiracy theory forums you'd be staying away from these forums like the black plague. But some masons are drawn to these forums...the WANNABE MASONS

haha you're hilarious

Originally posted by skillzdatchillz
Hahahaha I would like to see proof you're a mason buddy. Anyways if you're a mason that knows secret information you wouldnt be on conspiracy theory forums you'd be staying away from these forums like the black plague. But some masons are drawn to these forums...the WANNABE MASONS

Wow, your insight into the matter is staggering.

And what, exactly, would constitute proof to you? Not that I have to prove anything to you, I could care less if you believe I'm a Mason or not, seeing as my response was not directed at you.

You must be one of those who beLIEves that you have to have some sort of powerful connections or be fabulously wealthy to be a Mason. Well I hate to disappoint, but Masons are by and large just regular joes like me.

I'm curious; is it all Masons on this board that you think are "wannabes" (looks like you would know about "wannabes," given your use of the letter "z" in your username - takes one to know one, right?) or is it just me?

Oh, and what makes you think Masons would "avoid these forums like the black plague?"

I thought we were supposed to be denying ignorance here? Did you not get the memo?

[edit on 7/27/07 by The Axeman]

I'm a Brother and have been a member of this site for quite a while now, although I've not posted for some time.

It cracks me up to see all the Mason-Baiting still going on. Most people seem to think that Freemasonry has some dark motive for keeping secrets. The truth is we DON'T! The secrets that we once had, were the means to identify each other, but the Internet has revealed most of those.

The only real secret that Freemasonry has left, is the effect of going through your degrees and learning from them. No amount of study can compensate for that.

Since I joined, I admit, that now I am a much better person than before. I know now what consequences my actions can produce, I not only valve myself, but others too and wish no-one harm. I regulary help the poor or those less fortunate than myself. Above all, I try to pass on a little of what I've learnt about Brotherly Love to everybody, thus making this a better place.

Still what I've written above won't change most peoples ideas about Mason's, and it's not meant too. Everyone is allowed to express thier own thoughts ands ideas and if you think Freemasonry is about dominating the Earth then your allowed to think that. Afterall there is 'FREE' speech and 'FREE' thinking. So your 'FREE' to use your own mind to draw your own conclusions.

If people still want to believe the world domination theory, think about this......

During WW2 Nazi Germany, exterminated millions of Jews just because of thier Race. The Nazi's had plans to create a 'pure' Race, with blonde hair and blue eyes and with everyone obeying the Nazi rule. Nazi thinking was that the Jewish people were inferior and needed to be destroyed. Along with thier crimes against Jewish people, the Nazi's also hunted down and murdered Freemasons, for the simple reason that the Nazi's knew that the bond between Brothers wouldn't fit into thier plans for a new Reich of total population control. They also knew that the unique way that Freemasons learn from thier degree teachings would not fit in with thier ideals and would eventually destabilise thier plans. Freemasonry went underground in Europe and a new identification symbol was born. This symbol is still worn today by many Brethern who refuse to let the memory of thier fallen Brothers die away. Afterall those Masons who were murdered during those times, lost thier lives for they believed in one thing.......Being Free.

reply to post by clevengercm


Among the predominant lodges you will find in the U.S. are the F. & A. M. (Free & Accepted Masons); A. F. & A.M. ( Ancient Free & Accepted Masons); and P.H. (Prince Hall) Masons. I am now finding out that A.F. & A.M. Lodges are more commonly found in the South/South Central. I had not ever heard of a "Four Letter Lodge" until moving to Florida. This is meant as a derogatory term, relating an A.F. & A.M. Lodge to a curse word. Meaning that all A.F & A.M. are dual members in the Klan, or are "Rednecks". By the Way, in the Real South, Redneck is not a bad word. Easterners say RedNeck and think of the guests on Jerry Springer with pointy hats and three teeth, or those living in trailer parks and having sex with their siblings. Redneck in southern terms is just a rural person that works hard in the sun (hence the red neck) and has good common sense and a set of traditional family values. Florida, although in the South can no longer be considered a Southern State by any means other than it's geographical location, (refer to the State flag...a Confederate flag in surrender status). The common language of the State is Spanish and Yankee. Southerners have fled and are still fleeing...most to the Carolina's (Don't know why. That's farther north!) LOL!
Florida is an F. & A.M. State. Texas and Louisana are A.F.& A.M. States. I never saw any of the A.F. & A.M. Lodges deny petitioners due to the color of skin... not to say that there may be some here and there just like any other area of society. We had many Hispanics in our lodges and I have even noticed a few Catholics (unusual because one of the Popes issued an edict threatening excommunication if a church member became a Mason...Thus the creation of the Knights of Columbus).
The Prince Hall Lodge was formed by a Black British(?) Subject in the Bahamas(?). I don't know when exactly, but it was when discrimination and segregation was the Law instead of the Rule. Therefore in the U.S. Black Americans have generally went with the Prince Hall Lodge...you go where you feel comfortable.
Masonry is not about confrontation, and doing something just to create problems or get under someones skin. One of the reasons for joining a Lodge is to become a better man...not to get in just to see if you can, or to stir up trouble. I know A.F. & A.M. Lodges pride themselves with keeping up the original practices of the first Lodges in the U.S. and possibly from England also (I do know that they are VERY particular in the way things are done, and said, and I have witnessed several lengthy 'discussions' on proper method). I've been told that the other forms of Masonry in the U.S. have changed rituals and even single words, which change the whole meaning of things, and thereby A.F. & A.M. lodges prefer to remain as they are. Masons are not a secret organization, they are an organization with secrets. This was done to make it exclusive, you can't remain that way if everyone knew everything about you. It is done, so one Mason can recognize another, without requiring any further validation, therefore you know the character of the other person without actually knowing the other person. If you do not qualify with one of their standards or values (race not being one of them) you are not allowed entrance. Likewise, if you violate one of these after admittance you will be 'shown the door'. I know A.F. & A. M. Lodges try to 'fly under the radar', many of the "new" lodges don't. Another reason they prefer to remain seperate. It's their right, if you don't like it find one where you are comfortable and leave the name calling out of it.

Originally posted by skillzdatchillz
But some masons are drawn to these forums...the WANNABE MASONS

Why would someone pretend to be a Mason (over a number of years!) on a conspiracy forum where they would no doubt be accused of working for reptilians, taking over the world, ritualistically sacrificing babies, and possibly even blowing up people's toilets?

I don't get where you're coming from, but I'm intrigued by your reasoning.

My question for existing masons on this thread. I have recently taken an interest in free masonry and I have even considered joining one of my local lodges should they allow me to take part.

I was reviewing the application for one such lodge online, an A.F. & A. M. chapter, and on the application it asks for two recommenders, one a mason from another lodge willing to vouch for you, and secondly the name of a member of this specific lodge who would attest for you (I would assume?)

What does one do if you are new to the order and do not know anyone, but are still interested in taking part? How would you recommend I go about approaching the members about joining? Any replies would be much appreciated.

Also, is A.F. & A. M. a part of the Scottish Right, historically speaking? Very curious to learn more.

Originally posted by BlackOps719


I was reviewing the application for one such lodge online, an A.F. & A. M. chapter, and on the application it asks for two recommenders, one a mason from another lodge willing to vouch for you, and secondly the name of a member of this specific lodge who would attest for you (I would assume?)

Most Grand Lodges require that candidates be sponsored by two members of the Lodge that he is applying for initiation in. If you don't know anyone in that Lodge, the Membership Committee will be happy to meet with you, and spend a little time getting to know you. When they are convinced that you are a "good guy", I'm sure they will not hesitate to sponsor your petition.

What does one do if you are new to the order and do not know anyone, but are still interested in taking part? How would you recommend I go about approaching the members about joining? Any replies would be much appreciated.

Simply contact the Lodge, or email the Grand Lodge, and let them know about your interest. The local Masons will be happy to meet with you, give you a tour of the Lodge, and answer your questions.

Also, is A.F. & A. M. a part of the Scottish Right, historically speaking? Very curious to learn more.

No. A.F.&A.M., F.&A.M., and A.F.M. are all Blue Lodge bodies of the York Rite. In the USA, practically all Masons receive the three degrees in these Blue Lodges. The only exception to this is District 18 in Louisiana, where the Blue Lodges are Scottish Rite bodies.

In the USA, the Scottish Rite admits those who already Third Degree Master Masons, and begin the Scottish Rite system at the 4°. The reason it's different in New Orleans is because those Lodges were chartered by the Grand Consistory of Louisiana before the Grand Lodge of Louisiana was formed. Eventually, the Grand Consistory merged with the Scottish Rite Supreme Council of the Southern Jurisdiction, and those Lodges were re-chartered by the Louisiana Grand Lodge, but the GL allowed them to continue working in the Scottish Rite version of the Blue Lodge ritual.

Originally posted by BlackOps719
What does one do if you are new to the order and do not know anyone, but are still interested in taking part? How would you recommend I go about approaching the members about joining? Any replies would be much appreciated.

I didn't know anyone in the lodge that I joined; I had just recently moved to the area where the lodge is. I went to a "Fish Fry" that they were doing, which was open to the public, and introduced myself and met some of the members. I even got a "tour" of the lodge room, which was very cool. After that, it was not difficult to find a couple of people to sponsor me.

Excellent. Thanks for the advice gents, I will follow your instructions and let you know how it goes. Im looking forward to the fellowship and learning more about masonry, it seems like a good productive way to spend time. Again, your responses are much appreciated.

I believe I am on a path to enlightenment, I have had experiances that have grown my spirit, body and mind. The thing is one of the key experiances was walking away from fraternal organizations, and turning down an offer in an interview in a similiar enviroment.

I cringe a bit when I hear of people trying to enlighten themselfs, then they turn around and say the path or information to enlightment is secret. There is a simple reason, people would not consider the ideas of enlightenment to be good for all. Yes it is good for the few that secure it and protect each other at the cost of others, but it is not good for all.

If the Masonic Path is enlightenment, and they care for all, why not share that path without restriction. My opinion is they feel elite, like only they have the capability to understand, and therefore cradle this knowledge of their own self importance.

Masonic lodges should sponsor works of great Philosophy on TV, not the rediculous media we get. They should read their books in the town square to any that wish to listen. They should bring all of us up to their level, ahh but we are not worthy, their true mantra, they are the enlightened and will keep it that way at any cost.

Originally posted by Redge777
I believe I am on a path to enlightenment, I have had experiances that have grown my spirit, body and mind. The thing is one of the key experiances was walking away from fraternal organizations, and turning down an offer in an interview in a similiar enviroment.

Each person's path is different, what is right for you could be wrong for the next guy.

I cringe a bit when I hear of people trying to enlighten themselfs, then they turn around and say the path or information to enlightment is secret.

We in Freemasonry do not say that.

There is a simple reason, people would not consider the ideas of enlightenment to be good for all. Yes it is good for the few that secure it and protect each other at the cost of others, but it is not good for all.

No law or tenant in Masonry demands or hints that we should protect ourselves at the cost of others. On the contrary we are admonished to do to others that which we would have them do to us.

If the Masonic Path is enlightenment, and they care for all, why not share that path without restriction.

The teachings of Freemasonry are not secret. The means we use to recognize each other are not talked about by tradition but have been published by others since 1700s and are of course on the internet so it is tough to argue they are secret.

My opinion is they feel elite, like only they have the capability to understand, and therefore cradle this knowledge of their own self importance.

Do you know how we feel? Do I know what is going on in your head now?

Masonic lodges should sponsor works of great Philosophy on TV, not the rediculous media we get.

You are vastly over estimating the wealth of masonic lodges. My lodge is wealthier than most, we are able to contribute thousand each year to scholarships that we sponsor. If we had the millions to spare, your idea would be a good one.

They should read their books in the town square to any that wish to listen.

None would listen, trust me LOL. But if you doubt me, Morals And Dogma by Albert Pike can be read here. Read it all, I dare you. This book is the most mis-quoted book you will ever read. When I saw quotes from this book appearing in anti-mason sites I started looking up the quotes, searching each chapter and discovered I was being lied to. After studying ancient symbols I learned that these sites had very poor knowledge of the meaning and origin of them, they chalk it all up to Satan and ignore anything else. This is how I ended up becoming a Mason

They should bring all of us up to their level, ahh but we are not worthy, their true mantra, they are the enlightened and will keep it that way at any cost.

You do not need masonry to achieve a high level of moral conduct. After lodge we try to say enlightening things to each other but it takes about three beers before my brothers look enlightened to me.

Redge777, your a good person, you are just judging a path you have not walked.

Originally posted by Red pill
The teachings of Freemasonry are not secret.

Originally posted by clevengercm
I cant answer "all" questions...actually most of our rituals you can find on the internet. I will answer questions to the best of my ability without violating any of my obligations..

These are 2 contradictory statements, if your teachings are not secret then why is clevengercm unable to answer all questions, and what are these obligations that you cannot violate?

I am not old enough to join the freemasons yet, i would like to know what the freemasons do, what their innitiation ceremony is and whether i would have to keep secrets, also why should I join when I am old enough?

Redge777, what path of enlightenment are you on, i would like to know as it seems like a good one.