Why do people believe in the illuminati when there is no evidence that it exists?

You really should brush up on some history before you try to claim there is no evidence of something.

I have used the historical analytical method to analyse the claims of illuminati propagandists and I have drawn the conclusion that all illuminati propaganda is nothing but bullocks.

See:
academic.bowdoin.edu...


So that is my final conclusion about Illuminati.

Nothing but complete rubbish.

[edit on 28-6-2007 by Ickey]

And Illuminati are happy people think that way, so they can carry out any agenda they want, without anyone resisting much.

You came to conclusion they don't exist just because you couldn't find any proof with limited time and info. That way you just limited yourself, nothing else.

If you want to be sure you need more info and this is exactly what this forum is about - to deny ignorance and to try to get more information on subject, not to try to convince people something is not real when you don't even have time or info available to be sure about that.

[edit on 28-6-2007 by sb2012]

Chasing after fictional groups without evidence is hardly a good use of time either.

Divert attention away from real issues and real bad eggs.

That may be the real agenda of the illuminati propagandists.

Use fictional groups as a decoy, distract your focus away from the real issues and problems.

[edit on 28-6-2007 by Ickey]

Originally posted by twitchy

Originally posted by Masonic Light
If one is stuck in the egocentric, how can he be illuminated? Isn't that a contradiction?

Why don't You tell us the answer to that question, temple builder.

How do I know? That's why I asked!

Alright, I'm going to give this one more try...

Originally posted by Ickey
Chasing after fictional groups without evidence is hardly a good use of time either.

This website tells the history of the Bavarian Illuminati from their inception until their absolution. To deny that they ever existed is a fallacy, and one that I'm not going to entertain after this post.

Divert attention away from real issues and real bad eggs.

Care to elaborate on that please? I'm completely confused. What issues and "real bad eggs"?

That may be the real agenda of the illuminati propagandists.

Again, WHAT?

Use fictional groups as a decoy, distract your focus away from the real issues and problems.

Again, I'm going to point you to this website so that you can read up on it. I think an excerpt is in order for those that don't go to the link:

The Bavarian Illuminati was founded in 1776 by Adam Weishaupt, who was born a Jew, raised a Jesuit and ended his life as an anti-clerical reformer. The Bavarian Illuminati had as "its professed object … by the mutual assistance of its members, to attain the highest possible degree of morality and virtue, and to lay the foundation for the reformation of the world by the association of good men to oppose the progress of moral evil." At first the Bavarian Illuminati was very popular, enlisting some two thousand members. In the United States, Thomas Jefferson wrote a tribute to Weishaupt's ideals and reformist zeal.

Now that covers the formation of the order. Here's the part where they were "absolved":

Weishaupt died in Gotha in 1811, although almost two centuries later he is still reviled by conspiracy theorists and religious fundamentalists who inexplicably still see the invisible hand of the long defunct Illuminati at work behind the scenes of modern world events. The Illuminati has been variously been accused of everything from causing world wars to conspiring with space aliens in order to bring about a One World Government under their mysterious rule.

With the effective end of the Bavarian Illuminati in about 1790, many mystic and hermeneutic societies formed and reformed to fill the gap, often with very grand names and claims to supreme religious or other mystic knowledge. Some were offshoots of Freemasonry. Others borrowed heavily from Islamic, Cabalistic or ancient Egyptian "knowledge". Alchemy and contacting the spirit world also featured in some of them. Most were short-lived or were eventually absorbed back into more mainstream societies, like the Masons.

So, as you can see, this isn't quite as clearly cut as you think it is. I want you to read all of what I and others have put here as evidence for their existence, and then ask yourself if maybe, just maybe, you could have been wrong. If any doubt has been thrown your way, then I'll have done my job. The evidence is overwhelming, and quite honestly, too large to dismiss by mere opinion alone.

You're going to need something more solid than your word to sway our opinions here I'm afraid.

Also, I find it interesting that everyone claims that the Freemason Fraternity are all members of the Bavarian Illuminati, when in fact they were only related in the sense that some fringe groups of the Masonic Brotherhood were involved with such a group. Let me know what you think everyone.

Respectfully,
TheBorg

Very good post, i agree entirely. There is too much info and not all is disinfo, to be just ignored. Maybe he wants us to be like people from 1984, ignoring all which is not approved or proven.

No, he's a troll.

I know a truly disgusting adult human being. He will ask a question, then put his hands over his hears and shout nonsense while you answer. Then he demands to know why you didn't answer his question.

Still lives at home with his parents. Doesn't have a job. 51 years old.

That is what troll boy is doing here. Doesn't make a nickels worth of difference what you say to this fool. He will ignore the evidence and claim you have proven nothing.

The disgusting person mentioned above could not behave like he does if his parents didn't tolerate and encourage this behavior. They are enabling this behavior.

You enable this trolls behavior by replying to him. You are wasting your time and encouraging this behavior.

You want to waste time, TV is made for that. Why on earth do you want to encourage this behavior?

I surely don't want to, so i won't answer his posts anymore. Besides, his "scientific" method is worthless without any info, so his argument holds no water.

People who are trolling or refusing to believe elites maybe organize and conspire always ask for a proof, without even checking existing proofs and material to start with. It seems they just want to reinforce their mindset on others or maybe spread lies for some reason.

Also, what would humanity achieve without researching something which is not proven? Pretty much nothing.

To me the best evidence, that can be verified, is the whole sordid Franklin Coverup, Jeff Gannon/James Guckert/Johnny Gosch affair, that conveniently has disappeared from public view.

www.thelawparty.org...

Nixon: "The Bohemian Grove, which I attend from time to time . . . It is the most faggy goddamned thing you could ever imagine"

[edit on 1-7-2007 by TheComte]

It's at the very least clear that a group calling itself the Illuminati existed in the late 1700's. There's very little evidence to support that it continued past this point. These are the facts.

However, on the internet, and in circles such as these, the Illuminati are not nessecarily the descendants of the Bavarian Illuminati. It's a name, for lack of one better, given to the purported "man behind the curtain"- the shadowy figures pulling the strings. The generic, end-all-be-all secret society controlling the world.

And there is plenty of evidence that societies comprised mostly of world leaders and operating under the highest levels of secrecy exist, even though their purpose is subject to debate.

[edit on 1-7-2007 by SamuraiDrifter]

Isn't one key point of a theory that it is just that: a theory? If there were proof that the theory were true, we wouldn't need to sit around debating validity. The Illuminati either exist or they don't, but it certainly does not make any sense whatsoever to say that a lack of evidence that they exist is, in itself, proof that they don't.

Suppose I create a book containing some mystical revelations, and I keep it in my basement, telling no-one where it is. The next day, I come to you and say that I have written a book with these incredible revelations, but that there is no proof that I have done so, or that the book even exists anymore. Would it be valid for you to say that the absence of evidence is in fact proof that the book doesn't exist?

Right now, I don't think we can categorically know for sure whether or not there is a group of people which falls in line with the idea of the Illuminati. That's why it's a theory, and not a fact.

That is what troll boy is doing here. Doesn't make a nickels worth of difference what you say to this fool. He will ignore the evidence and claim you have proven nothing.

Too early to tell.

Who is a fool here and who is not a fool is still too early to tell, xenu.

What is patently clear here Ickey, is you have made post after post in this thread and you have posted precious little as to why you believe what you believe...

On the other hand, many posters have provided numerous sources to suggest what you're saying isn't quite right

Soooooo.....Either start posting something of substance, and quit with the one and two line troll posts or get shutdown....

Your choice

Peace

Is there a confusion about terminology here? Do the Illumiinati still call themselves by that name or is it a generic term covering people who are not in the mainstream of Freemasonry but whose rituals are quasi Masonic?

I have more questions than answers at present, but are the OTO an Illuminati organisation?

www.oto.org...

www.answers.com...

It is more jewish disinformation bull# for wild eyed left wing conspiracists to discuss, who believe any crap you throw their way.

The fact that jews own the central banks in London, control the Federal Reserve, Microsoft, 96% of the news media, Hollywood and are the spy police (ADL) which have made it a crime to talk about how Arabs and Muslims might be detremintal to Europe, the same anti speech legislation they are attempting here and so when they build their North American Union anyone saying they don't want 100 million Mexicans here can be thrown in a northern Canadian gulag as a dissident hate criminal. As happened in the Soviet Union, which 300 out of 384 of them were the 1st commissars.

If there Illuminati is a corrupt organization it is only from jewish infiltration. There is no evidence of an Illuminati conspiracy, there is ample evidence of a jewish one. The Illuminati bull# is only to deflect from the jewish criminal conspiracy that has been going out for at over 2,000 with this neferous little tribe, and took full swing when the Rotschilds took over all the central banks in Europe. You have to ask yourself who would put up these bull# websites like this, saying it's NOT a jewish conspiracy.

The problem with them is that they do give truthful information, but it is only to lead you astray and cloud your understanding. But that truthful information still incriminates them. They are just too arrogant to realize it. Everything they do though is simply to cloud your thinking, as Ben Klassen said "Once the white man's thinking is straigened out, there is no stopping him."

Originally posted by TheBorg
Alright, I'm going to give this one more try...

Originally posted by Ickey
Chasing after fictional groups without evidence is hardly a good use of time either.

This website tells the history of the Bavarian Illuminati from their inception until their absolution. To deny that they ever existed is a fallacy, and one that I'm not going to entertain after this post.

Divert attention away from real issues and real bad eggs.

Care to elaborate on that please? I'm completely confused. What issues and "real bad eggs"?

That may be the real agenda of the illuminati propagandists.

Again, WHAT?

Use fictional groups as a decoy, distract your focus away from the real issues and problems.

Again, I'm going to point you to this website so that you can read up on it. I think an excerpt is in order for those that don't go to the link:

The Bavarian Illuminati was founded in 1776 by Adam Weishaupt, who was born a Jew, raised a Jesuit and ended his life as an anti-clerical reformer. The Bavarian Illuminati had as "its professed object … by the mutual assistance of its members, to attain the highest possible degree of morality and virtue, and to lay the foundation for the reformation of the world by the association of good men to oppose the progress of moral evil." At first the Bavarian Illuminati was very popular, enlisting some two thousand members. In the United States, Thomas Jefferson wrote a tribute to Weishaupt's ideals and reformist zeal.

Now that covers the formation of the order. Here's the part where they were "absolved":

Weishaupt died in Gotha in 1811, although almost two centuries later he is still reviled by conspiracy theorists and religious fundamentalists who inexplicably still see the invisible hand of the long defunct Illuminati at work behind the scenes of modern world events. The Illuminati has been variously been accused of everything from causing world wars to conspiring with space aliens in order to bring about a One World Government under their mysterious rule.

With the effective end of the Bavarian Illuminati in about 1790, many mystic and hermeneutic societies formed and reformed to fill the gap, often with very grand names and claims to supreme religious or other mystic knowledge. Some were offshoots of Freemasonry. Others borrowed heavily from Islamic, Cabalistic or ancient Egyptian "knowledge". Alchemy and contacting the spirit world also featured in some of them. Most were short-lived or were eventually absorbed back into more mainstream societies, like the Masons.

So, as you can see, this isn't quite as clearly cut as you think it is. I want you to read all of what I and others have put here as evidence for their existence, and then ask yourself if maybe, just maybe, you could have been wrong. If any doubt has been thrown your way, then I'll have done my job. The evidence is overwhelming, and quite honestly, too large to dismiss by mere opinion alone.

You're going to need something more solid than your word to sway our opinions here I'm afraid.

Also, I find it interesting that everyone claims that the Freemason Fraternity are all members of the Bavarian Illuminati, when in fact they were only related in the sense that some fringe groups of the Masonic Brotherhood were involved with such a group. Let me know what you think everyone.

Respectfully,
TheBorg

Dude... are you kidding? Why are you using these sites as a source? They are as fake as Joan Rivers face. Anyone can buy a domain and put anything they want on the internet. Example: This site.

reply to post by Ickey


For most people the word Illimunati is just a label which represents a concept, like the NWO or Shadow Government. Very few people now mean the Baverian Illuminati when using the word.