All Just Theory?

So is there really such thing as fact? Or is our whole existance based on a pile of theories that "may" be true?

Sure there are facts.

Humans live on earth. I had coffee with my breakfast. etc etc.

definition of fact [ fakt ] (plural facts)
(MSN Encarta Dictionary)

noun

1. something known to be true: something that can be shown to be true, to exist, or to have happened


2. truth or reality of something: the truth or actual existence of something, as opposed to the supposition of something or a belief about something


3. piece of information: a piece of information such as a statistic or a statement of the truth


4. law actual course of events: the circumstances of an event, motion, occurrence, or state of affairs, rather than an interpretation of its significance
Matters of fact are issues for a jury, while matters of law are issues for the court.


5. law something based on evidence: something that is based on or concerned with the evidence presented in a legal case

actually, no. nothing can be proven 100% true. nothing happens 100% of the time. so we may have some things we know happen /most/ of the time, or very close to all of the time, but one out of the infinite rolls of the dice is going to eventually come up snake-eyes

Originally posted by Kano
Sure there are facts.

Humans live on earth. I had coffee with my breakfast. etc etc.

can you prove your memory of having coffee with breakfast is true? can you prove 100% that you didnt come into existance during this very moment, and everything you know to be true is an implanted memory designed to give you some sense of reality?

Originally posted by forsakenwayfarer

can you prove your memory of having coffee with breakfast is true?

I bet he can just by openning his dish-washer.

Of course, unless THEY putted the dirty dishes there, while THEY were programming his memory...

P.S. You don't really need to "Question Everything",do you?...

[Edited on 7-1-2004 by m0rbid]

even if it was 'true' theres nothing you or i could do about it, so it doesnt matter if we question it. im just trying to make some interesting conversation, and see where he runs with it.

I still think there's some fact we can't really deny, because doing so would be a bit ignorant.

the truth is becoming harder and harder to find everywhere you go. everybody lies and everybody has an opinion which in their own eyes is true. but there are facts and situations that can be looked at and the facts will slowly reveal them selves. some truths are easy, some are not.its a fact that there is religion, but its based on theories and opinions. the whole world is run by opinions. einstein had a lot of theories which could be true or facts, but for the most part where theories and alot turned out to be facts. theories and facts go hand in hand.

The only 100% safe fact anyone can know is that they exist. I think therfore I am. Two things that are 100% fact are I (or you) am, and I have senses.

Outside of this you get facts that are true in the world you sense. Be it a statement about reality, the matrix, or whatever else your sense might be of, you can have further facts.

The standard functional deffinition of fact tends to be anything that has enough public acceptance, unfortunatly. 1,000 years ago most people would tell you it is a fact that the earth is flat. Now most people will say it is a fact that it is round. Some would cliam it is a fact that *picks a random celeb* Britney Spears is attractive. As you can see, even popular oppion will start being quoted as fact.

These are the 3 types of facts i use.

Type 1:
For a lot of the world, especialy in science and science-minded people logical fact holds better. In this case logic plays a big role and Fact is something repeatable and with evidence. For example two scientist who are rather trust worthy productive member of the scientific community claim to have made Cold Fusion. However, since this doesn't have explination in physical laws nor can it be repeated it is not considered to be a fact.

Fact 2:
For me facts tend to be things that are hard to repute. Though when thing have some evidence and fit with other theories and facts of reality, i will be willing to consider them fact, though not as firm as the above description. For example the earth being round. I have never seen it myself, nor taken the measurments myself, however, given the photos and knowledge of large bodies forming under the laws of gravity, I consider this to be fact.

Type 3:
The last type of fact is trusted fact. It is where things start to get hazey and personalized. For example when a friend says he saw bigfoot i do believe he is telling the truth. However, when mixed Fact type 2's like the amount of US deforestation and lack of any physical evidence being submitted to the scientific community, i have to question him a bit. A fact 1 is that human sense can be fooled and people can jump to conclusions. The human brain has also been shown to purposly see shapes not there when see in perifrial vision. So, I hold as a fact that He thinks he saw Bigfoot, however i will not claim bigfoot existing as a fact. This also goes the other way. NASA says it landed a rover on Mars. Given that i know as Fact 1's that we have put thing in space, have the technology and will to land something on Mars, and that many other claims by NASA are true, I will accept this as fact, though a fact of Type 3.

Type 3s make the world and humans the way we are. Type 3s allow for religion as well as conspiracy theories.

In the end I never judge anyone or anything based on what they call fact. However I may also not agree with them if they can't make thier claims facts to me. After all, its not a fact to me until it meets one of those above discription.

But all this is just how I work.

[Edited on 7-1-2004 by ScienceGuyQ]

Originally posted by forsakenwayfarer
actually, no. nothing can be proven 100% true. nothing happens 100% of the time. so we may have some things we know happen /most/ of the time, or very close to all of the time, but one out of the infinite rolls of the dice is going to eventually come up snake-eyes

This is pretty much how I think too. For me, nothing is ever 100% certain. It might be 99.99999% but it's never absolute. So to answer the question, no I don't think there are actual facts, if by fact you mean something known with 100% certainty.

Originally posted by forsakenwayfarer

Originally posted by Kano
Sure there are facts.

Humans live on earth. I had coffee with my breakfast. etc etc.

can you prove your memory of having coffee with breakfast is true? can you prove 100% that you didnt come into existance during this very moment, and everything you know to be true is an implanted memory designed to give you some sense of reality?

I just wanted to say that was an excellent point. We really cannot prove anything to be 100% true. Perception is reality though.

it's all a matter of faith. We can't proove for sure that we exist. The line "I think therefore I am " is even argued over by philosophers as not being a true statement. (Don't ask me how the argument goes, it's way over my head)
In the end you just have to believe that we do exsist or else you will never be able to move on from it. And if we did prove that we don't exsist then what would happen then? would we all dissapear in a puff of non exsistant smoke?

Originally posted by ScienceGuyQ
As you can see, even popular oppion will start being quoted as fact.

True, true... I've seen so many times that someone thinks something is a fact, because "everyone says it".

These are the 3 types of facts i use.

For example two scientist who are rather trust worthy productive member of the scientific community claim to have made Cold Fusion. However, since this doesn't have explination in physical laws nor can it be repeated it is not considered to be a fact.

One thing though. Imagine if they were right. That means that the physical laws would have to be altered or revised at least to include such thing as cold fusion. Physical laws were developed by man through experimentation. Since then there were other experiments that may seem to break the physical laws.

101 years ago it was accepted fact that machine powered flight was impossible. Even after the Wright brothers did it, some skeptics said that it was impossible.

Originally posted by forsakenwayfarer actually, no. nothing can be proven 100% true. nothing happens 100% of the time.

If you drop something, it will fall. If get hit, it hurts. If you look at a bright light too long, your eyes will hurt. If you close your eyes, you no longer see your surroundings. etc. etc. etc. Questioning the basic physics and events of existence proves nothing.

We are just hologram projections. We won't exist when someone shuts down the holodeck.

You can choose to believe you are in a real world, and you can equally well choose otherwise. I have chosen the former simply for convenience.