The Infinite Universe...

If the universe is infinitely large, then there must be an infinite number of habitable planets and races in the universe, and there must then be an infinite probability (99.9999% i suppose) that these beings have visited our planet, and with the infinite number of races there will be an infinite number of them who are advanced beyond our wildest imagination...

sorry if that was confusing, but I was just thinking random thoughts

Yes, but whether or not the universe is infinite in size is a big if, and unprovable by definition. That being said, there's loads of evidence of ancient astronauts.

If we're playing the infinite card, let's go a logical step further. If there are an infinite number of races in the universe and a 99.9999% chance that we've been visited by them, then doesn't that imply we've been visited an infinite number of times by an infinite number of races? Obviously, it does not mean this.

You could say the theory breaks down when we throw Earth into the mix, because planets are not infinite. Neither are stars. I think the universe itself, as a medium, can be infinite while matter is not.

I like the thought process though.

I think that I disagree with the infinite universe idea for a couple of reasons, I think my mind handles the enormanity of everything by telling its self that however immeasurably big it is, it still has to be finite.

If I were pushed to refine that point of view I would go down the road of if the universe WERE infinite it would be a boring dead place. Thermodynamics says that everything wants to reach equilibrium. There fore the reason we exist and everything we see around us is the result of the constant energy exchanges of our finite universe 'settling down' it will one day become a boring dead evenly spaced out universe, but till then we are free to rock on.

I just can’t see a universe without some sort of end; it has to be a massive but self-contained system. At the end it will have the same amount of energy and matter as at the beginning, just arranged differently. The up side is we'll all still be around - on a sub atomic level at least!!

haha i totally love this idea.. mind boggling, but yea, i dont see why it wouldnt make sence

The universe is infinite, so are possibilities of existances or non-existances. The universe never ends, it cannot end, why? To put it simply think of it this way: If we come to a wall, is there nothing beyond the wall? Or is there more space? There is ALWAYS and FOREVER something over the wall. Trying to put the universe in a box is what the inquisitioners and pope tried to do by burning people at the stake. Saying that things just END after a while, well thats what they said, and they were 100% wrong and absolutely the MOST idiotic people of all. They held back science for many hundreds of years because of that kind of stupidity. The fact we cannot see an end to the stars shows we have an infinite universe. If anyone tries to say: "well everything has a finitetive mass" they are wrong.
The earth as an example is this: We have a SPECIFIC amount of minerals on the planet, including gases. Because of this we can only be so big. The universe on the other hand, can be empty yet be full, it has OTHER THINGS WITHIN IT! Such as us, if the universe was finite, then we would be unable to exist within it, why? The universe would need to have a specific mass then, wich it does not, it is just a vacume that will kill you in a second due to the below freezing tempuratures. If the universe had a mass, we would thus be pulled TOWARDS that mass, gravity works. However it does not, so we float around in our solar systems and galaxies. The universe does NOT have mass, we do. The universe is the dark expanses we see out there.
Also as a side note: Those who say there is an end: Well try and tell that to astronomers, each time they develop stronger telescopes they find stars they could never see before. Those stars were SO FAR away that the light never reached us in a visible way, but with a HIGHLY and I mean HIGHLY sensitive telescope they can be detected. I know this, I was at one of these places a couple of times. To be specific I was at the VLA, or Very Long Array in New Mexico just west of Socorro.

Do not try and put yourself in a box unless you want to be a backwater person such as the ones in the DARK AGES! Think outside of the box, push the limits to the extreme then keep going, that is how science developed, but now some are trying to stall it with dark ages philosophy. Do not do that unless you want to be a primitive! So think outside the box, expand your mind, push the limits, that is how society grows, not by trying to stay INSIDE of a box.

if you have an infinite universe and not all planets are habitable would that then mean there are a finite amount of habitable planets in an infinite universe?

reply to post by steve22


I think it is more a case that we are here to create infinite experiences from the finite.

Its easy to point the finger outward and when that is the case, where is the solution waiting to be found?

With that being said though, I do not believe we are alone but I always question motive if the day comes.

[edit on 17-2-2009 by XXXN3O]

Originally posted by steve22
If the universe is infinitely large, then there must be an infinite number of habitable planets and races in the universe, and there must then be an infinite probability (99.9999% i suppose) that these beings have visited our planet, and with the infinite number of races there will be an infinite number of them who are advanced beyond our wildest imagination...

sorry if that was confusing, but I was just thinking random thoughts

I presume you’re referring to our Universe, and not to some of the others?

There are a vast number of Universes in the whole of Creation, and we live in just one of them. Creation is infinite, but for us currently living in the 3rd dimension on planet Earth, infinity is a difficult subject to comprehend.

Of course, in our Universe there are billions of planets in its whole vastness, and each universe must be similar. In our Universe there are other inhabited planets, but with our limited 3rd dimensional vibration frequencies, we are normally unable to see other beings unless they decide to switch to a lower frequency and show themselves to us.

There are 3 books which are free to view and download, and which cover this subject better than I can; called The New Earth - Earth Changes and the Ascension of Planet Earth. The New Earth is primarily concerned with the Ascension of Planet Earth from the 3rd dimension to the 5th dimension, which is due to take place in December 2012.

In Book 1, Chapter 1, Creation; the whole hierarchy of Creation is discussed, as well as how dark forces manifested in the fallen universes, of which ours is an example. Here is an extract:

The constant interaction between the two opposing flows of Thought Energy causes the original Light vibrational frequency to progressively slow down, creating increasingly dense locked-up Matter in more dense and lower groupings of worlds. The original highest Planes of Pure Light at the center of Creation are seen as a brilliant golden-white luminance radiating outwards from the "Central Source/Sun" of our Creation. There is a descending pattern of lower Systems each with its own radiant Central Sun of intense Light, seen in the form of Universes, Galaxies, Star Systems and finally, Solar Systems. Each has its own "Central Sun" shinning forth as a stepped-down Light radiance of our Prime Creator's Thought-force. We can see this radiance within our Solar System as our own Sun shinning forth onto its orbiting Planets.

In Book 1, Chapter 3, Vibration & Density; the various dimensional vibrations are explained. Here is an extract:

The Veil between our Third Dimension and the Higher Dimensions has not made it easy for us to be aware of those higher Dimensions and their inhabited worlds. Our physical level Third Dimension frequency vibration-rate is far too dense to allow us to even see up to the next Dimension, the Fourth Dimension, which is made up of a less dense grouping of spaced-out atoms. A Fourth Dimensional Being would appear invisible to us, unless he or she deliberately lowered their vibration rate down to our own vibrational level. Only those Earth Humans who have over many lifetimes developed their powers of "extra-sensory-perception" are usually able to see those on a higher vibrational level or communicate with them through channeling their messages.

This is a fascinating subject, and for anyone interested in reading more, the books can be accessed here: www.thenewearth.org...

Well...by the same token there are an infinite number of uninhabitable planets, an infinite probability that on these planets none of the races are advnaced as us and an infinite probability that the races that are advanced enough will never ever visit us.

When using this sort of infinity model anything and everything is possible, with an infinite probability....interesting concept but pretty useless, especially, as someone else mentioned, there is no proof the universe is infinite.

I believe there is a general consensus that there are about 10^80 atoms in our 'observable' universe (that is the parts that we have potential to interact with) and thus our universe would indeed be finite.

If Aliens created us then that gives us no rights in the heavenly affairs so to say...

We'd be like children who believes that monopoly game money is real money as much we treat the laws that is governing us, relatively speaking.

But I don't give a damn about that crap. Every sentient being have their own basic inalienable rights, whether it was written or not, set on stone or not or w/e and it's definitely worth fighting for.

[edit on 18-2-2009 by ahnggk]

You're close here, Steve.

By all accounts, the universe is spatially infinite and unbounded -- that is to say, one could theoretically travel in any given direction forever, never reaching a boundary and never returning to their starting point.

The universe may also be temporally infinite -- time may not have had a literal beginning and may never end -- but our current cosmic epoch can be said to have begun with a singular event, i.e. the Big Bang. This means that although space may be infinite, there has been only a finite amount of time in which events in this space may have occurred.

Also, and more significantly, there is a finite and numerable quantity of arrangements of matter and energy for any given volume of space-time. This means that while events that may occur in the universe are theoretically infinite, in reality they are bounded by the potential matter-energy states of space-time.

So, point for point:

-Yes, this means that there is an infinite number of habitable planets and intelligent races in the universe.

-However, due to the finite nature of time (since the Big Bang) and of potential matter-energy state constraints inherent in space-time, it is likely that none of them have visited Earth.

-And yes, there must be an infinite number of races advanced beyond our imagination. However, they will not be advanced beyond the physical laws that govern the universe itself. They will have issues such as the speed of light and other basic constants of the universe to contend with.

[edit on 2/20/09 by MillionEyedMask]

It depends on what you consider inhabitable. We have found tons of Gas giants so far, we ignore these as non inhabitable, but what if there is a species in the vastness of space that thrives in these types of environments. If you only think of worlds like our own, it is my belief that theses types of worlds are out there but very rare. I do believe there are more than likely other worlds with different environments form our own that are inhabited by other species. It is not fact just a belief.

Sorry cant help myself

It is known that there are an infinite number of worlds, simply because there is an infinite amount of space for them. However, not every one of them is inhabited. Therefore, there must be a finite number of inhabited worlds. Any finite number divided by infinity is as near to nothing as makes no odds, so the average population of all the planets in the Universe can be said to be zero. From this it follows that the population of the whole Universe is also zero, and that any people you may meet from time to time are merely the products of a deranged imagination.

-THGTG

I believe the Universe to be round or spherical in shape. I do not think the universe is infinite , it just may seem that way because of the extreme size of it. IF there is an end to the universe maybe there are others joining to the side of it making it seem infinite. Just a theory
On with the show

-nasacarl