Billy Meier UFO Contact Hoax: Discussion

...and, out of curiosity,
did Meier shoot any dinosaurs with this gun?


Sorry, I couldn't resist.

Okay, so please answer my previous questions though.
Thanx.

I think if you want to see some laser action your best bet is to watch Buck Rogers.

As for whatching some that has come from billy or his friend's maybe dont hold your breath for anything to happen in the near future.

Zomg! this Must be real!
alien ray gun...lol

sorry....i couldn't resist.

Originally posted by WhiteWash
Zomg! this Must be real!
alien ray gun...lol

sorry....i couldn't resist.

Its the hand grip's that nailed it for me yer thats real maybe send it to Mr Lear for testing in the near future.

Originally posted by h3akalee
maybe send it to Mr Lear for testing.......

I don't know....feels too easy...

Ya' know how party clowns have the balloon figure shtick? You know, the one where they twist up different little critters and figures?

Ah hell, I'll go for it....

Yeah, go ahead and send it to him for professional evaluation. Looks like something a clown may have crafted at some kid's party anyway.

Originally posted by johnlear
Originally posted by h3akalee

You can breath on the moon ?

Yes, for a little while. The atmosphere is equal to about 18,000 feet here on earth.

For a little while Mr Lear ? Please explain so i understand this more once again i am sorry for my beyond topic request's.

Do we inhale it all after a little while ?

[edit on 18-4-2007 by h3akalee]

Originally posted by h3akalee

Originally posted by johnlear
Originally posted by h3akalee

You can breath on the moon ?

Yes, for a little while. The atmosphere is equal to about 18,000 feet here on earth.

For a little while Mr Lear ? Please explain so i understand this more once again i am sorry for my beyond topic request's.

The moons atmosphere is similar to about 18,000 feet here on earth. If you are not acclimated or decompressed you will have problems breathing for any length of time. If you went from earth to the moon and jumped out you would have a useful consciousness of about 15 minutes. that is why they have giant domes over many of the craters on the moon so people can breath without wearing a cumbersome spacesuit.

Domes on the moon ? Ok let me ask this who are you ? And what level of expertise do you hold to be in control or atleast awareness of such information ?

You must understand i am someone trying to personaly identify if you know what you are talking about. Or if you are someone that tries to open the already open bottle of beer.

This is in no way a personal attack but more of a character assesment from one human being to another.



[edit on 18-4-2007 by h3akalee]

As I implied, in the real world life is messy. And it's simply not true to say, "He's ruined his credibility completely. The damage is done." because, in the real world, we use a preponderance of evidence to draw our conclusions. If the standard the writer offers really was true, he/she, along with the rest of us would have zero credibility.

It's also not true, demonstrably, because more and more people are determining the truth for themselves and, as a recipient of a huge amount of correspondence from all over the world, I can tell you that such a conclusion is a minority opinion.

Of course, when you come down to it, proof is a personal matter, i.e. people decide for themselves based on their own review, and understanding, of the evidence. For those who require that the case and Meier be false, fine, you needn't even bother to go any further. Really, why challenge any more since it's obvious that no answer would satisfy and there'd always be another, "But what about this...?" For those who still haven't made up their minds, going further is recommended...and all that it will cost you is your time.

And for those who continiue to cry hoax, etc. I'm sure I speak for many people who'd like to know HOW he did - and continues to do - it. I don't mean armchair theories that are embarrassingly transparent in shedding light on the paucity of their proponent's thinking skills, I mean really showing HOW it's all been done by...doing it yourself. And if one claims that the man has had co-conspirators then prove it. So far none have been found or heard from in over 30 years, defying all predictable behavior on the part of people who surely would find it irresistible, to say nothing of profitable, to blow the whistle and get their 15 minutes in the spotlight.

And all the presumed models for the six or so different variations of the UFOs - where'd they go, who made them, why haven't any movies even up until today shown anything as clear as those ships flying around in broad daylight in Meier's films? What about the witnesses, who came from over a mile away to investigate the booming sounds of the UFO that Meier and his wife (who actually is on film giving a very detailed description of her own sightings), how were they fooled for almost an hour - standing in the middle of an open field while they listened to the sounds?

The questions that I could ask YOU are far more vast and confounding than the ones about the dinosaur pictures.

Regarding the Asket photos, this is a response I got from Wendelle Stevens to a similar inquiry from another person several months ago:

"Dear Gary:

The fuzzy photo of Asket, a DAL, was taken inside the ship in a room only about 10 feet wide, and well inside the jammed focus ring adjustment on Billy's broken camera, thus the "fuzzy" out of focus reading.

As for the alleged, and never supported story that she was first a German Fashion Model, then Billy's brunette wife in a blond wig, and then finally one of the dancer's in Dean Martin's program, all were quickly dispensed with by video split-screen imaging, where all can see that the faces simply do not match any of those allegations. That should have been done by the proponents first, but of course they all knew better and did not need/want such technology to interfere with their cute judgments.

All should do their own homework before making such silly allegations, or even accepting such.

Regards,

Wendelle Stevens"

Now, considering we've barely scratched the surface of the Meier case, do you really think that a one-armed man, on partial disability, living in a rural Swiss village, raising a family, renovating a rundown farm house, while taking over 1,200 UFO photos, films and video, sound recordings, metal samples and singlehandedly typing out 24,000+ pages of information, containing volumes of stunning, prophetically accurate scientific and world event related information - actually has been pulling off a "hoax"?

[edit on 18-4-2007 by Mi

[edit on 18-4-2007 by Michael12]

Originally posted by h3akalee
Domes on the moon ? Ok let me ask this who are you ? And what level of expertise do you hold to be in control or atleast awareness of such information ?

You must understand i am someone trying to personaly identify if you know what you are talking about. Or if you are someone that tries to open the already open bottle of beer.

This is in no way a personal attack but more of a character assesment from one human being to another.



[edit on 18-4-2007 by h3akalee]

If you don't know who John Lear is or what his expertise is, you should sit quiet and browse around a bit longer before such remarks. But who am I to say...

Originally posted by DarkOps
If you don't know who John Lear is or what his expertise is, you should sit quiet and browse around a bit longer before such remarks. But who am I to say...

John Lear

en.wikipedia.org...

John Lear (b. 1942) is an accomplished former pilot and well-known UFOlogist. He is the son of aviation pioneer, inventor and founder of the Lear Jet Corporation, Bill Lear.

Aviation background

John Lear, now retired from flying, amassed over 19,000 hours of flight time, and has flown in over 100 different types of airplanes in 60 different countries around the world. He flew both commercially and in missions worldwide for the CIA. John Lear is the only pilot to hold every airman certificate issued by the FAA, and has held many world records. [1]

Who is DarkOps?

Originally posted by Michael12
... in the real world, we use a preponderance of evidence to draw our conclusions.

Only in some courts of law. When it comes to determining the truth or fiction of somebody's nutty story, a simple "preponderance" of evidence just doesn't cut it. We need "beyond a reasonable doubt." And Meier has never been able to come up with anything we couldn't reasonably doubt.

The door is still open, though. All he has to do is have a Pjedleaindian land a beamship at the foot of the Eiffel Tower.

Or maybe, I don't know, offer one single piece of unimpeachable evidence.

...or maybe do your own homework. And yes, in real life we do look at the preponderance of evidence, especially since human beings are neither all good or bad and certainly not perfect. We weigh things and make judgments all the time. Of course, making our judgments doesn't in itself actually bear upon, or prove, the truth of a matter.

Making demands to satisfy one's own subjective and uninformed criteria - when one hasn't demonstrated a masterful command and understanding of the massively abundant and varied evidence - basically defines the demandee as worthy of only the above suggestion, "do your own homework."

I wasn't offended by that suggestion, it propelled me to indeed make my own discoveries and draw my own conclusions. Without having done, and continuing to do, so it would have been impossible for me to determine the truth of the matter for myself...let alone represent the case internationally.

MH
www.theyfly.com

I remember being 12 and reading a book about Meier... And even then I knew he was a liar. I wanted to believe so badly but most of it sounded so bizarre and ridiculous, even my 12 year-old mind knew that something *had* to be up.

It's not improbable to put together this kind of thing. Who knows how much preplanning would've gone into Meier's plans? I've pulled some pretty elaborate practical jokes before and it helps to preplan enough. It doesn't sound impossible that Meier could've done it, given enough time.

[edit on 18-4-2007 by Weirdoradio2]

And there you have it, the kind of reasoning that's not going to get worthwhile results. Some truths can be hidden in plain sight but because the necessary thinking skills - and patience - are sorely lacking, there's little danger that they will be discovered by those not ready to deal with them.

We've become addicted to beng spoon fed everything in this country, I don't know if it's like that everywhere now. So people give up easily and attack the subject matter (or other people) rather than take responsibility for their own inadequacies.

But offer up improbable ET conspiracy theories and all the nonsensical aliens-amongst-us stuff, wow, there's no shortage of interest and superficial conjecture. Think about it, if you could travel freely through space (and maybe even time) and lived many times longer than humans here do, if you had no need for our money, wars, politics, religions, etc., why on earth would you come here and get - a government job? Or insert yourself into this loonie bin for any other reason? We tend to project our own delusions out on others who would have absolutely no interest in what amounts to attempted suicide.

It probably isn't appealing that the Meier/Plejaren point of view is that abductions, mutilations and UFO sightings are effectively (with a few exceptions to the UFO sightings) ALL terrestrial in nature. If that's the case, then it wouldn't be important to think about what the purpose may be, especially of things like the O'Hare and other recent sightings?

They have warned, as others probably have too, of the danger of a false ET/UFO threat, especially here, that would cause a lock down on the citizens, suspension of rights, etc., which may not sound as far fetched now as it did some time ago.

As for that treasure hidden in plain sight, for those who have a sense of adventure, the willingness to learn and sufficient patience...there's gold in them thar hills.

MH
www.theyfly.com

Originally posted by Michael12
Of course, making our judgments doesn't in itself actually bear upon, or prove, the truth of a matter.

Fine. A person certainly has the right to believe whatever they want. You can believe in the Easter Bunny or leprechauns or whatever. However, when you want to try to convince others, then you need to present evidence and proof that the other person will accept.

So maybe you can explain for us exactly which specific piece or pieces of evidence was/were enough to convince you that Meier's story is acceptable as true to you. Or is it just enough for you that he "seems like an honest guy," or "the story rings true?" If you're just convinced by a story, that at least allows us to know where you're coming from, and how much value we can give your opinions.

Of course, your bail out of this challenge is to simply claim that our standards of proof are unrealistically high, or that we are so prejudiced that we'll never accept anything as proof, so you're not even going to bother.

The opposing argument to that is that you're gullible, and will accept extremely poor evidence as proof. Not that you're a bad person. It's just that you have poor reasoning skills. Which you will deny, because of your poor reasoning skills.

Juries have anywhere from 8 to 12 people to help reach a consensus as to the quality of the evidence and the level of proof required. But we're not a court or a jury. We're just a bunch of oddballs on an Internet forum. So we're never going to come to a mutually agreed-upon "answer" to the question.

All I can add is that I suggest each person evaluate the evidence honestly, while trying to be aware of their own prejudices, preconceptions and desires. At this point, nobody's life is at stake, so whatever you choose to think is not going to make a lot of difference in the price of Peruvian tin. You really don't have to make a choice or "decision" at all. You can just say, "I don't know," and wait for more evidence to show up, if that's what you want.

Other than that, I personally wouldn't suggest moving to Meier's Swiss compound, giving him any money at all, or putting on the Nikes and sampling the Kool-Aid.

But, hey. You're going to do what you want anyway, regardless what I say. Which is fine, 'cause I'm not your mommy, and at the very bottom line, I don't care.

There was another man people followed irregardless of proof or sanity...



Therein lies the danger in belief without reason coupled with fanaticism.

Originally posted by DarkOps

Originally posted by h3akalee
Domes on the moon ? Ok let me ask this who are you ? And what level of expertise do you hold to be in control or atleast awareness of such information ?

You must understand i am someone trying to personaly identify if you know what you are talking about. Or if you are someone that tries to open the already open bottle of beer.

This is in no way a personal attack but more of a character assesment from one human being to another.



[edit on 18-4-2007 by h3akalee]

If you don't know who John Lear is or what his expertise is, you should sit quiet and browse around a bit longer before such remarks. But who am I to say...

I would say exactly that! who are you to say ? I dont have all day to roam around this place and i would hardly want to as it would take a lot of time. So in answer to your remark i simply say i am trying to find out a person's identity. Do i really need to know who they are ? Yes if i am curious.

I commend you for aparently defending him but im pretty shure a man with such high regard by a member like yourself need's such protection.

Good day to you sir and also Mr Lear.



P.S

promomag

I thank you very much for that link that's all i was asking for. And after reading that small amount i am now in the picture about Mr Lear who is a very accomplished man indeed. I can now show the correct respect to the man for his career in aviation.

However for the other things he is said to be involved with i will just sit back and see what happens.

Now let's get back on topic about that bloody raygun lol.








[edit on 19-4-2007 by h3akalee]

Micahel12, It's apparent to me your stepping out of the Meire bubble with statements such as:
_____________

Michael12: "But offer up improbable ET conspiracy theories and all the nonsensical aliens-amongst-us stuff, wow, there's no shortage of interest and superficial conjecture"
_____________

Superficial Conjecture?, Nonsensical Aliens Amongst us? I'm not sure who your directing the post to or how this fits with or if it fits with the Meire/Figu arguments made here by you.

The continual support you give to the Billy Meire discussions with his ALien friends, say all but "conjecture" according to you. When you bring in other theories by other people on the UFO problem and refer to it as "Nonsensical" you get out of the Meire bubble and into face of people looking at the alien question at a different level.

No more or less factual as the Meire case as whole as far as I'm concerned Michael.

Dallas

It would appear that the aliens have given Billy the raygun that he would expect to see given the science fiction of the time. Maybe Billy himself is being hoaxed?