British Hostages tortured....

Originally posted by marg6043
stumason

I base my opinion not because I am a female but because most of the UK soldiers are within my children age.

So it comes from my hart as a mother.

I am a father, so I understand what you say. However, if my child joined the military and behaved as Faye Turney has done, I would be ashamed.

I come from a proud and long family history of service to this country and this kind of behaviour is not only unprecedented, but repugnant and shows the Royal Navy and the UK as a whole to weak, spineless cowards.

Originally posted by marg6043
I said leave the UK soldiers alone they were in a situation that was forced upon them by their government.

They volunteered to be in the military.
They FAILED when push came to shove.

So now people are horrified that they didn't got tortured enough.

No. I'm complaining because they are saying that they were tortured, when they were not. I'm complaining because they gave up EVERYTHING to the enemy. I'm complaining because they WHINE that they were lied to, and teased.

Originally posted by stumason
Faye Turney, amongst others, effectively committed treason ...

I don't know what British military law is, but by her and the others behaving like they did, they put EVERYONE who was over there in jeapordy. They gave up positions and handed the Iranians a psychological coup .. which weakened the entire Iraq mission.

All of those sailors need to be put on trial.

Originally posted by marg6043
the UK government has given permission for the soldiers to tell and sell their stories.

No one here in America will buy it. No one here thinks they are anything less than 'meat heads'.

Originally posted by Landis
It could be that all these people were thinking about was being slowly beheaded with a dull butter knife.

Part of the training of military personnel is to not give up anything except 'name, rank, and serial number'. It doesn't matter if they were threatened with slow death (and there is no evidence that they were). THAT is part of their job - to be able to face that without caving and putting all their fellow countrymen (and MY countrymen) at risk.

They failed.

So now the entire world will believe (and rightfully so) that British Troops will crack if you tease them about their age and flick their necks with your fingers a few times.

Here's my thoughts on this whole thing..

I think that the Brits were a landing team heading into Iran. Possibly to collect intelligence or render someone. They were in inflatable boats after all, I cant think of the military "patrolling for smugglers" in small inflatables like the kid that are used for beach landings.

While on their way to their landing site they were caught, no doubt every one of them had a cover story.. and possibly fed that cover story.

I dont think the Iranians mistreated them at all, In none of the videos were there any signs of abuse of mistreatment. In ALL of the "Al Qaeda" and "Insurgent" videos out of Iraq there is always some fool with a hood and weapon standing over the kneeling victim.. This wasnt the case... the Brits where shown laughing and eating etc.. All of them together in their uniforms..

They could have very well been stripped of their uniforms and shown shackled and cuffed and under arrest, but they werent.

All of them said on video that they were treated well etc. Then as SOON as the British government has them back what happens... .. They say they were mistreated and abused... BLAH!

This is what I like to call "GPB" or "Government Propaganda Bull&#*@" it's just crap fed into the media to make Iran look like the bad guys that the USA is trying to make them out to be.. That's IT!..

Like I said.. this is just my view.. I could be wrong.. I wasnt there..

And occurs I disagree because when it comes to the war forced in the middle east by our nation and the coalition is not true purpose that can be called military, our military has been used in the most foul way by the governments that rules our nations.

So a true soldier knows when he or she is doing something for their nations, and truly is obvious that what our troops are doing in Iraq is nothing more than the will of corrupted politicians of private agendas.

So my views on our soldiers or the soldiers of the UK will always favor them as individuals caught in the grasp of power, greed and money.

If you think that this soldiers has acted shameful them what do you expect from the type of war that they has been forced into.

If our own leaders has not shame.

I feel that they are true heroes of the circumstances.

Originally posted by marg6043
If you think that this soldiers has acted shameful them what do you expect from the type of war that they has been forced into.

I expect them ....

To act like the soldiers they are and that they have been trained to be.
To act in a manner that doesn't put their fellow soldiers at severe risk.
To act in a manner that will honor the country they are from.
To act in a manner that will honor the uniform they wear.
To act like GROWN UPS and not crack like kindergardeners on their first day at school when they are told they can't have chocolate milk with their lunch.

BTW .. they weren't 'forced into' being in the military. They volunteered.
They knew the risks. They FAILED.

Originally posted by Ox
Here's my thoughts on this whole thing..

I think that the Brits were a landing team heading into Iran. Possibly to collect intelligence or render someone. They were in inflatable boats after all, I cant think of the military "patrolling for smugglers" in small inflatables like the kid that are used for beach landings.

The Navy does that all the time. They weren't "small inflatables like the kid that are used for beach landings". These were military grade RIBS that can quite happily operate alone in the North Sea during Winter.

As for the rest of your post, well, fudge it...

Why are people getting so offended that they complied with their captors wishes? Not only would it make for a shorter hostage negotiation, they would treat all of them with better respect than if they had been defiant since the moment they were captured. You're pretty much wishing that they go through hours, days, possibly even weeks to months as tortured hostages and causing an armed conflict between Iran and Britain over a disputed GPS location.. A bit much to ask in my opinion..

This is the age of the media, every little piece of drama will be exploited, warped and retold for years to come..

Originally posted by bluesquareapple
Why are people getting so offended that they complied with their captors wishes? Not only would it make for a shorter hostage negotiation, they would treat all of them with better respect than if they had been defiant since the moment they were captured. You're pretty much wishing that they go through hours, days, possibly even weeks to months as tortured hostages and causing an armed conflict between Iran and Britain over a disputed GPS location.. A bit much to ask in my opinion..

This is the age of the media, every little piece of drama will be exploited, warped and retold for years to come..

Iran would never have done anything for fear of being pulverised. Besides, even if they did face torture, it's their jobs and duty to resist

As it stands, the Iranians just had to be rude and Turney gives it up!

On top of that, she then shames herself and her country by telling everyone how soft she was and thinking she's a hero! All while getting enough money to pay off her mortgage!!

Originally posted by bluesquareapple
Why are people getting so offended that they complied with their captors wishes? Not only would it make for a shorter hostage negotiation, they would treat all of them with better respect than if they had been defiant since the moment they were captured. You're pretty much wishing that they go through hours, days, possibly even weeks to months as tortured hostages and causing an armed conflict between Iran and Britain over a disputed GPS location.. A bit much to ask in my opinion..

This is the age of the media, every little piece of drama will be exploited, warped and retold for years to come..

Because its a matter of Honor. If you don't understand the concept thats the problem.

I am also very glad the prisoners were returned without injurty incident or harm.

I do find it difficult to work up a lot of sympathy or outrage for this "They asked me questions till I couldn't stand it any more"! type of "torture". They were prisoners. We treat our own prisoners (in the US justice system) worse than these people were apparently treated in Iran.

This is spin for the war. Nothing more.

Originally posted by bluesquareapple
Why are people getting so offended that they complied with their captors wishes?

I don't think that people are offended that they complied with the captors, if anything that is a good thing because it meant they got home unharmed.

The real issue here is that in reality the prisoners were treated quite well compared to how they could have been. But it seems like the sailors, probably with the instruction of the MoD, are exaggerating their stories to try and make themselves look like heroes and make Iran look evil.

And as for Faye Turney releasing an autobiography... I didn't know about that but tbh it just shows what our society is built on. She is a soldier who was captured and given a nice shirt, fed and returned home in one piece, she shouldn't be made a rich and famous celebrity for that, it's part of the job.

It just takes credit away from REAL PoWs and war veterans. I hope that her 'ordeal' doesn't give people the impression that this is the usual treatment for captured soldiers, because they would have a big surprise if they are ever in a real PoW situation.


stumason, those torture tactics are indeed terrifying, I really hope i'm never in their situation!

Originally posted by stumason
The Iranian's must have a few new tips to put in their "How to extract info out of an Infidel" booklet:

1)Steal iPODS
2)Threaten with jail.
3)Flick them
4)If that doesn't work, make them strip to their underwear.

Such brutal treatment by those nasty Iranians.......

heh

Maybe they were held at gunpoint to play ping pong hahahahahaha.....


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I agree, spin for the war.

Wheres the outrage about the crimes and tortures being committed at places like Guantanamo, or Abu Ghraib, do I have to post links to the pictures?

Worst of all, those prisoners are like front line goat herders, not any high level Al Queda or anybody.

But oh these british sailors were interrogated, oh my how terrible. What did you expect? They would put the soldiers in air conditioned plunt penthouses with their own personal servant?

They were even allowed to play ping pong and chess and laugh it up and they were given healthy meals, they came back to England showing no signs at all of abuse or neglect, when they were Iran they were saying, without much trouble, how they were wrong and how they are sorry for going into the waters, and thank you for not mistreating us.

Now they are coming out and saying, oh we were tortured, it was horrible, oh those evil Iranians. Talk about hyprocrites. Especially, especially, when their own government and allies treats captured PoWs horrifically.

Originally posted by MikeboydUS

Originally posted by bluesquareapple
Why are people getting so offended that they complied with their captors wishes? Not only would it make for a shorter hostage negotiation, they would treat all of them with better respect than if they had been defiant since the moment they were captured. You're pretty much wishing that they go through hours, days, possibly even weeks to months as tortured hostages and causing an armed conflict between Iran and Britain over a disputed GPS location.. A bit much to ask in my opinion..

This is the age of the media, every little piece of drama will be exploited, warped and retold for years to come..

Because its a matter of Honor. If you don't understand the concept thats the problem.

What the hell is honorable about fighting a war, being taken hostage, and dragging it out because of stubbornness? if you think its so noble and honorable, why arent u in the front lines fighting it??

Honor my ass. It takes much more honor, much more nobility, much more intelligence, to find a way to avoid war altogether.

If you cant understand that, thats the problem.

[edit on 9-4-2007 by LightWorker13]

Originally posted by malganis

And as for Faye Turney releasing an autobiography... I didn't know about that but tbh it just shows what our society is built on. She is a soldier who was captured and given a nice shirt, fed and returned home in one piece, she shouldn't be made a rich and famous celebrity for that, it's part of the job.

Excuse me?!?!?!

It was a Hugo Boss knock off. That was the real torture!!!

At the end we must ask ourselves who is winning anything out of this mess . . .

The UK government for allowing the soldiers to tell their story so they can add a spin to it . . . because it was not obvious torture. . .

The Iranian government that obviously was following their own agenda? and looks like they got away with it . . .

Or the soldiers that are to make money of their stories. . .

I think one and two are the most likely ones.

I can not way for the movie to come out.

I'll tell you is winning in this. The UK government, military and these soldiers.

Because no matter what crap they spew out and how obviously fake it is, the majority of the US and British public will believe it.

They were hostages not prisoners.

They were taken illegally since Britian and Iran are not at war.

They were blind folded with weapons being cocked behind them.

They were put into isolation

Turney was mock measured for a coffin

Turney was told she was all alone.

I agree that the British sailors behavoir in not resisting was truly pathetic and the fact that they are now selling their story is disgusting.

But it appears that the sailors/marines experienced psycological torture but to some of you that doesn't constitue torture.....

but being put in an uncomfortable positon is........

Hypocracy at it's best.........

Originally posted by ferretman2
They were hostages not prisoners.

They were taken illegally since Britian and Iran are not at war.

They were blind folded with weapons being cocked behind them.

They were put into isolation

Turney was mock measured for a coffin

Turney was told she was all alone.

I agree that the British sailors behavoir in not resisting was truly pathetic and the fact that they are now selling their story is disgusting.

But it appears that the sailors/marines experienced psycological torture but to some of you that doesn't constitue torture.....

but being put in an uncomfortable positon is........

Hypocracy at it's best.........

You need to insert 'claims' into each of those sentences.

The sailors claim that these things happened, the Iranians claim that they didn't. You can't just state one side as fact unless you were there.

Especially as the Iranians did show videos of them looking happy, then the prisoners started complaining of ill-treatment after they had been de-briefed. It sounds quite convenient no?

Originally posted by ferretman2


Hypocracy at it's best.........

Yes you are displaying a very good model of what hypocrisy is.


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