Why do we assume that.....

Other lifeforms out there are vastly more intelligent than we are? Could it be that yes they've mastered interstellar travel yet they are ignorant in regards to some of our present technology? It's like Einstein was a genius in mathematics but if you put him in an auto shop with a master mechanic who would be the most intelligent then? I just don't buy into the theory that they are so many years more advanced than we are.

By the way, I'm new here.. HI EVERYBODY!!!!

because the universe is so vast, that life forms should be, or it would make sense that, they are at different levels of understanding. we are at a different level of understanding than dogs, and they are at a different level of understanding than fish.

i think the assumption comes from the fact the universe is 12 billion years old. its taken 5 billion years on earth to get intelligent life but it could very well happen much quicker by millions of years on other planets- depending on their conditions.

poeple then take the next logical step and say some are likely to be far more advanced than us.

I dont buy interstellar travel by any civilization so im a bit of an oddball here

heres something to think about: if there has been civilizations to aquire interstellar travel why havnt they colonized the earth? theyve had a good 500 million years to do it before we evolved to homo-sapiens. But it hasnt happend.Lucky us!



[edit on 28-2-2007 by yeti101]

im sure there are civilizations 1 billion years more advanced then us and civilizations that are just now getting their first breath of fresh air

Originally posted by yeti101

heres something to think about: if there has been civilizations to aquire interstellar travel why havnt they colonized the earth? theyve had a good 497 million years to do it before we evolved to homo-sapiens. But it hasnt happend.Lucky us!

[edit on 28-2-2007 by yeti101]

they probably found better, more suitable planets than ours.

Originally posted by yeti101
i think the assumption comes from the fact the universe is 12 billion years old. its taken 5 billion years on earth to get intelligent life but it could very well happen much quicker by millions of years on other planets- depending on their conditions.

poeple then take the next logical step and say some are likely to be far more advanced than us.

I dont buy interstellar travel by any civilization so im a bit of an oddball here

heres something to think about: if there has been civilizations to aquire interstellar travel why havnt they colonized the earth? theyve had a good 497 million years to do it before we evolved to homo-sapiens. But it hasnt happend.Lucky us!

[edit on 28-2-2007 by yeti101]

Actually, the argument is stronger than that. It rests on the fact that our technological civilization is so young. If we encounter another technological civilization, the probability is very high that it is much older than our own. Now, older doesn't mean smarter, but it should mean far more advanced and almost certainly a merger of biological and machine intelligence - something that I think is likely for us humans in the 21st century.

How one actually measures intelligence across civlizations is in my view not so clear.

they probably found better, more suitable planets than ours.

souls theres tons of valid theoretical answers you can give to my question and your is 1 of them. The fact remains colonization hasnt happened ..touche my friend touche!

but you never know maybe our planet is next on their list!

[edit on 28-2-2007 by yeti101]

Originally posted by souls
because the universe is so vast, that life forms should be, or it would make sense that, they are at different levels of understanding. we are at a different level of understanding than dogs, and they are at a different level of understanding than fish.

What you're talking about is known as the Fermi paradox. Quite a lot has been written about this by some clever people, and it remains unresolved.

What you're talking about is known as the Fermi paradox. Quite a lot has been written about this by some clever people, and it remains unresolved.

yeah this is what my colonization question gets at. Fermis paradox- if intelligent life is so abundent in the galaxy- why do we hear or see no sign of it?

well theres alot of answers to that.

1.Maybe they dont want to be discovered
2 nobody is broadcasting a signal for us to hear. evryone is just listening
3.perhaps they havnt reached our region of the galaxy yet
4. maybe civilizations arent capable of interstellar travel- (my belief)
5. maybe those who can decide limitless expansion isnt they way forward for their society...
6. maybe the UFOers are not all wrong and we are being visited by ETs!

the list goes on, but yeah fermis paradox annoys me becuase despite all these answrs the fact remains we have not found ET life or signs of it yet :/



[edit on 28-2-2007 by yeti101]

Originally posted by yeti101

they probably found better, more suitable planets than ours.

souls theres tons of valid theoretical answers you can give to my question and your is 1 of them. The fact remains colonization hasnt happened ..touche my friend touche!

but you never know maybe our planet is next on their list!

[edit on 28-2-2007 by yeti101]

you are right, theoretically, there is many, but why does there necessarily have to be a colonization. Exploration can exist without it. And theoretically, maybe they already have. Like a lot of the stuff you read here and else were, they can be living right under our feet, or our oceans.

Originally posted by disownedsky

Originally posted by souls
because the universe is so vast, that life forms should be, or it would make sense that, they are at different levels of understanding. we are at a different level of understanding than dogs, and they are at a different level of understanding than fish.

What you're talking about is known as the Fermi paradox. Quite a lot has been written about this by some clever people, and it remains unresolved.

This Fermi paradox sounds good i have never looked into it, but it also sounds like a lot of disappointing brain food.

souls , thats another good answer, maybe they just explore but dont colonize. but wouldnt they run out of space on their own planet and be forced to colonize?

Fermi's Paradox

Fermi realized that any civilization with a modest amount of rocket technology and an immodest amount of imperial incentive could rapidly colonize the entire Galaxy. Within ten million years, every star system could be brought under the wing of empire. Ten million years may sound long, but in fact it's quite short compared with the age of the Galaxy, which is roughly ten thousand million years. Colonization of the Milky Way should be a quick exercise.


So what Fermi immediately realized was that the aliens have had more than enough time to pepper the Galaxy with their presence. But looking around, he didn't see any clear indication that they're out and about. This prompted Fermi to ask what was (to him) an obvious question: "where is everybody?"

[edit on 28/2/07 by masqua]

Originally posted by yeti101
souls , thats another good answer, maybe they just explore but dont colonize. but wouldnt they run out of space on their own planet and be forced to colonize?

Yeah, that makes sense, population overgrowth, but I would like to think that they colonize planets that are in there immediate region of space, you know home sickness, and just learn what they can from the ones they can't colonize, or are to far away to move an entire population.

souls well done another good answer, but think of this....

if intelligent life is so abundant it means theres been civilizations created hundreds of millions of years ago maybe even billions of years ago, even if they expanded at a really slow rate they would cover the galaxy in a 10-50 million years. Long before we arrived.

but again fermis paradox remains intact, it hasnt happened. I wonder why sometimes and can only conclude interstellar travel is not possible. I think ETs maybe colonize their own solar systems but thats it.





[edit on 28-2-2007 by yeti101]

Originally posted by souls

Originally posted by yeti101
souls , thats another good answer, maybe they just explore but dont colonize. but wouldnt they run out of space on their own planet and be forced to colonize?

Yeah, that makes sense, population overgrowth, but I would like to think that they colonize planets that are in there immediate region of space, you know home sickness, and just learn what they can from the ones they can't colonize, or are to far away to move an entire population.

I don't know that it does necessarily make sense. You're applying the conventions of humanity to an alien race here, and sure - it's the only intelligent species we're familiar with so it's the only ground for comparison - but the comparison is flawed. There's nothing to say that these aliens haven't discovered methods of population control. There's no way to estimate the frequency of breeding for an alien race, nor the resources found on their home or other colonised planets, nor the rate at which they go through these resources. I don't think it's too much to suggest that a race advanced enough to discover interstellar travel would have made some serious inroad in terms of combating overpopulation.

Another problem with part of the thinking so far is that it follows the theory that 'life' enjoys a certain environment. It's a pet hate of mine when scientists talk about planets capable of sustaining life, when we've only encountered life on this planet and have no clue what 'life' it truly capable of. What's to say that other planets in our solar system and abroad aren't more suited to sustain the kind of life that is found in these alleged advanced civilisations? Why the assumption that they would want to colonise earth before colonising any of the other planets in our solar system or galaxy.

[edit on 28-2-2007 by TheStev]

You should also take into consideration that thought our history there have been periods of time who science was deliberately hindered, banned and research destroyed etc. Also we did not begin to evolve until after the dinosaurs became extinct its hight possible that another alien race was not only fortunate enough to evolve as there world was evolving but avoided any extinction level event.

Thestev touched on answer number 5 i posted earlier

5. maybe those who can travel through space decide limitless expansion isnt they way forward for their society

alot ofpeople can accept these kind of answers but i cant. which is why i reach my conclusion about interstellar travel being impossible. I hope im proved wrong.

Thestev , its not about whether earth is first orlast in the solar system or galaxy. Theres been enough time for verything to be colonized evrywhere! well at least so that we would notice

[edit on 28-2-2007 by yeti101]

Originally posted by yeti101
souls well done another good answer, but think of this....

if intelligent life is so abundant it means theres been civilizations created hundreds of millions of years ago maybe even billions of years ago, even if they expanded at a really slow rate they would cover the galaxy in a 10-50 million years. Long before we arrived.

but again fermis paradox remains intact, it hasnt happened. I wonder why sometimes and can only conclude interstellar travel is not possible. I think ETs maybe colonize their own solar systems but thats it.





[edit on 28-2-2007 by yeti101]

since we don't yet fully understand how the universe actually works, and you consider the theory of strings, they probably don't limit themselves to just interstellar travel, but also inter-dimensional. They probably do have interstellar travel but that alone probably wont get them to point B if it is Billions of years away at the speed of light.

Souls !! youve nearly hit upon my favourite current theory.

some physicists theorize there are actually an infinite number of universes but we cant travel there through normal space becuase our universe is expanding too quick.

but maybe we could get there through a type of wormhole or interdimensioanl means. I like to think of these possiblities.