Evolution of Religion

Im curious to know what you believe.
This is off the top of my head.

Do you believe that Religion evolves, should evolve?

I think that religion should evolve as society evolves too meet modern day problems and what not.

Do you agree?

Im just curious.
Im not sure if someone has asked this before either.

Deep

Most important changes:

1. Politheic, primitive religions, in the stone age- They stuck a hatchet in a tree stump and they had a god...
2.Politheic religions with the king being raised to a holy being.
3.Monotheism, Echnaton who presents the new Aton religion in Egipt
4.Monotheism, the writing of the Bible
5.poli/monotheism- christianity with one god in three persons
6.Martin Luther who developed the ideas of christianity, along with other reformers
7.The evolution of today's churches, changing for the new world, their doctrine and interpretations of prophecies

It evolves, but I'm not sure that into a one-world religion.

[Edited on 19-12-2003 by Johnny]

Religion has evolved.
One example is where the Jewish religion evolved into Christianity.
Religion needs constantly to evolve. If it doesn't keep up with mankind's social progress you are left with the sort of result that the Taleban practiced in Afghanistan.

It should also be remembered that interpretations can and should be updated. Mistakes in interpretation are commonplace in any literature and it is reckless not to address these just because a theory has previously been accepted as being correct but then later found to be false.

Without reinterpretation and constant progress, religion will hold mankind in check and there is a strong possibility that it could actually cause our societies to regress. There aren't many things that are set in concrete and aren't open to question and improvement. Religion should be no different - especially when a large part of it relies on theory and not fact.

I can't think of any examples of religions evolving, but i'm sure they do. If they didn't, we'd still have people hanging 'witches' and being persecuted for their religous belief.. in the U.S.

[Edited on 20-12-2003 by Zodiac]

We are in a time where the "almightyness" doesn't fit just as easily anymore in the knowledge we have about stellar evolution, life on earth (longer then 12,000 years, yes), creation of menkind and animals (also a bit longer then 12,000 years ' ) and therefore religion is loosing ground.

Some people might say it is a good thing, because it evolves in something which is more personal, not a God which judges people litterally, but more a God which is inside you, motivates you to do good things itself, symoblically for the good, instead of a God which made the universe in seven days and stuff.

That is the evolvement of religion, should we be happy because of that? Some people say "yes" because the universe wasn't created in 7 day's and stuff. What is however the outcome:

* hundreds of thousands of pages which explicitely and in detail say what happened thousands of years ago. And because the idea of creation of the universe and stuff doesn't fit in the idea of menkind (even though it is very very small in comparison to the stories about menkind and the happenings themselves), all those knowledge is fading away, because it doesn't fit in science.

What however if it isn't really an almightyness, but looked almighty, if hell is true, only different then we think it is, and Apocalyps is true, just as hell, only because the people back then formulated it in that way (because they didn't have the knowledge) we say it is impossible, not thinking about how they would explain things, just looking at how they said it.

So what you get is that science eliminates science which doesn't fit into science, because it isn't interpreted as it should, but is litterally taken (creation in 7 days and stuff) as those people back then described it, not having understanding of technology and stuff.

If you look at it realisically I would say because of our ignorance we say hundreds of thousands of pages written back then are total bullshyte, even though there are airplanes, technologies and stuff described

The evolution of religion is just a way out, because it cannot be taken literally anymore, doesn't take away the other interpretation could be valid, and that the knowledge isn't used.

And yes, you could think of it yourself, how many scientists do you know which asks themselves "well if it is all just a lie, why then hundreds of thousands of pages, why airplanes describtions, technologies, statues, Sirius connections, pyramids, stonehedge and stuff", just as many people ask themselves that question as people ask the question "why did that bad Lucifer got 1/3th (!) of the angels behind him, while they knew they would be facing certain death".

And yes I know some people will answer "jealousy" that must be it

Agreed, i've been seeing things lately that are like.. "Religion not relevant anymore?" and whatnot. Though I think religion keeps most people sane.

LeenBekkemaa,

Maybe its me, Or im just still a but hungover from lastnight.
I dont know what the hell your going off about...no offence.

What I want to know is, wether or not Religion evolves over time to suit modern day needs?

Is thier a social aspect to the creation of religion, which changes over time?

Deep

Originally posted by Zodiac
Agreed, i've been seeing things lately that are like.. "Religion not relevant anymore?" and whatnot. Though I think religion keeps most people sane.

I agree, but this also depends on the subjective use of the word "sane".

I can't think of any examples of religions evolving, but i'm sure they do. If they didn't, we'd still have people hanging 'witches' and being persecuted for their religous belief.. in the U.S.

People are still being persecuted for their religious belief; they are just not being burned in the town square per se.

Peace,
BG

Agreed, i've been seeing things lately that are like.. "Religion not relevant anymore?" and whatnot. Though I think religion keeps most people sane.

I think religion teaches us morals, and whats important in life.

The problem is that the foundation of these morals were set hundreds, if not thousands of years ago.
Do these social problems of the past still surmise in modern day society?

I believe that religion sort of recycles itself, and creates new forms of itself, I believe that religion needs to his this cycle again.

Deep

Originally posted by ZeroDeep



The problem is that the foundation of these morals were set hundreds, if not thousands of years ago.
Do these social problems of the past still surmise in modern day society?



Deep

Yes and no. The root of all human problems is the same now as it was 2000 years ago: greed, power, ego, jealousy. But WE have evolved, we learned more about universe, about ourselves, and thats why we see religion with different eyes. It can still be applied to todays world, but it has to be interpreted differently.

One thing to consider, God is an all-knowing, all-mighty being who had to explain something to mortal humans with no education. It is like talking to a kid, you have to keep it simple and connect it to things they already know. You have to tell a story to make a point.
If you say to a child "take a step back" the child will literaly take a step back. But if you say the same thing to an adult, he might take that step back or he might see it as metaphor to take a step back in his mind, distance himself from something, look at it rationaly.
Thats the way we look at religious texts today. We look for meaning of things, for metaphors.
That can be seen as evolution of religion I guess.

Originally posted by Zodiac
Agreed, i've been seeing things lately that are like.. "Religion not relevant anymore?" and whatnot. Though I think religion keeps most people sane.

Personally i believe Religion creates insanity within various groups, that and the fact that most phych wards consist of religious people, the last i remember it was somewhere in the area of 70%

Originally posted by ZeroDeep
Maybe its me, Or im just still a but hungover from lastnight. I dont know what the hell your going off about...no offence.

What I want to know is, wether or not Religion evolves over time to suit modern day needs?

Is thier a social aspect to the creation of religion, which changes over time?

I think you have a hangover from last night, no offence I have said it evolves over time to suit modern day needs, the needs being to fit into science. (Creation in 7 days doesn't fit with the scientific evidence for example). So less and less people are going to believe those stories, that is the evolution which I made clear.

You can also see it now, look 100 years back, and look now. They have now more like a God which is good but isn't exactly the one of the bible, as long as you life good, are nice and stuff, God is with you... a chance from the Bible to a more personal God which fits society (people who don't believe go to hell isn't very social).

Originally posted by LeenBekkemaa


I have said it evolves over time to suit modern day needs, the needs being to fit into science. (Creation in 7 days doesn't fit with the scientific evidence for example). So less and less people are going to believe those stories, that is the evolution which I made clear.

It doesn't even have to be evolution. Regression can be just as advantageous.
Look back to the ancient Egyptian religions and you will see much that would be found to be very acceptable to our present day society. Much of our present day belief has evolved from ancient religions which contained no Hell and no vengeful God. New religons that sprouted up afterwards had to have a way to counter a faith that was pleasing to all and how better to do this than with a threat of Hell or creating a God who will condemn you unless you follow him?
Some scholars believe that Jesus' was teaching a return to ancient Egyptan beliefs but that the idea died when he was crucified and the disciples misinterpreted his teachings and turned them into Christianity.

Regression in relgion could be just as advantageous to mankind as evolution.
And who is to say that the ancient religions, when mankind was newer, didn't get it right?

Originally posted by Leveller

Originally posted by LeenBekkemaa


I have said it evolves over time to suit modern day needs, the needs being to fit into science. (Creation in 7 days doesn't fit with the scientific evidence for example). So less and less people are going to believe those stories, that is the evolution which I made clear


It doesn't even have to be evolution. Regression can be just as advantageous.
Look back to the ancient Egyptian religions and you will see much that would be found to be very acceptable to our present day society. Much of our present day belief has evolved from ancient religions which contained no Hell and no vengeful God. New religons that sprouted up afterwards had to have a way to counter a faith that was pleasing to all and how better to do this than with a threat of Hell or creating a God who will condemn you unless you follow him?
Some scholars believe that Jesus' was teaching a return to ancient Egyptan beliefs but that the idea died when he was crucified and the disciples misinterpreted his teachings and turned them into Christianity.

Regression in relgion could be just as advantageous to mankind as evolution.
And who is to say that the ancient religions, when mankind was newer, didn't get it right?

Here's something interesting for you and a couple of quotes from the webpage here:

The Mighty Osiris and isis walked into the Egyptian Valley out of nowhere and assumed command. The myths and legends of Greece, India and South America describe their rule. They were taller and more imposing than the men of the time, with long blond hair, marblelike white skin and remarkable powers that enabled them to perform miracles.

There were the blue-bloods of Ancient Times which extended into European Times. . They actually did have blue blood, and it was not hemoglobin based but copper based. They were semi-human. There are still to this day, some animal species in South America that have copper based blood systems. There was a problem with hemophilia, and not because of intermarrying. The problem was that they started to marry outside of the copper based blood system. Hemoglobin and copper systems don't mix. That's where the laws against marrying commoners originated.

Upon reading this it made me think about something. Jesus apparently lived and studied in Egypt for some time before beginning his ministry at age 30. He's also been depicted by the Catholic Church as having blonde hair and blue eyes. I find this odd particularily since reading the gnostics and other writings pertaining to the life of Jesus.

www.burlingtonnews.net...

I dont think religion has evolved, people still read the same book, and still try to attack others with whats stated there...maybe the interpretation has changed a bit, indeed witches dont get hung no more but indeed still people are being putdown because they dont believe the same as the people around them..
I think the only evolving that goes on is that less and less people are going to church, or even stop believing for various reasons..
I didnt know that so many lunatics are also believers Sapphire, can u give some more info on this, why and how much there are..
pz. joz

Originally posted by Leveller
Much of our present day belief has evolved from ancient religions which contained no Hell and no vengeful God. New religons that sprouted up afterwards had to have a way to counter a faith that was pleasing to all and how better to do this than with a threat of Hell or creating a God who will condemn you unless you follow him?

Vengeful God

In the last days, Horus and Seth will fight one last time for the world. Horus will defeat Seth forever, and Osiris will be able to return to this world.

It is said that this battle of good verses evil still rages, but some day, Horus will be victorious and on that day, Osiris will return to rule the world.

I do understand what you are saying, and it is true, but what if Hell was something which began at a certain time. The people back then saw fire of the Gods (Gods war) and because the "evil" lost went up into flames, and hell was created. Just a suggestion.

Are we going to look at the Egyptians then we have to say they had a fight between good and evil (and I personally belief Seth was the Lucifer of the Bible).

And if you look at the Gods
Egyptian book of the death"Blazing fire, unquenchable, with far-reaching tongues of flame, irresistible slaughterer, which one may not pass through fear of its deadly attack.

Isn't the above about "evil" going into flames and therefore the word "Hell" becoming into being, an option?

But also think about the following, Lucifer was an angel, the highest angel, and he went to hell together with his 1/3th of the angels while fighting against God. Now the Egyptians had also their Gods, and in the Bible Moses and his God fight against the Gods of the Egyptians. So they were interacted with eachother, the God of Christ knew hell, why shouldn't the Egyptians?

And yes I am saying they were right, only hell is in my point of view something which happened at a time (the time Lucifer and his angels began fighting against God) and therefore in the oldest religions you don't see it back.

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And Sapphire, was Jesus also copper-based, semi-human and taller then the others? Next to this the blood was blue in the text you gave, not the eyes But that's what I think.

Originally posted by jozuph
I dont think religion has evolved, people still read the same book, and still try to attack others with whats stated there...maybe the interpretation has changed a bit, indeed witches dont get hung no more but indeed still people are being putdown because they dont believe the same as the people around them..
I think the only evolving that goes on is that less and less people are going to church, or even stop believing for various reasons..
I didnt know that so many lunatics are also believers Sapphire, can u give some more info on this, why and how much there are..
pz. joz

hmm ok .. here are some sites i've found for you on the topic. Im not judging anyone here i just want to make that clear. I analyze everything though now matter what it is.

www.cchr.org...

�... referrals for psychiatric evaluation and treatment are being made with increasing frequency from the ranks of the clergy and the religious.�
Paul Pruyser Director of Dept. of Education, The Menninger Foundation


www.geocities.com...

One that struggles with guilt from being brought up in a fear-based religion



[Edited on 21-12-2003 by Sapphire]

Originally posted by LeenBekkemaa

Originally posted by Leveller
Much of our present day belief has evolved from ancient religions which contained no Hell and no vengeful God. New religons that sprouted up afterwards had to have a way to counter a faith that was pleasing to all and how better to do this than with a threat of Hell or creating a God who will condemn you unless you follow him?

Vengeful God

In the last days, Horus and Seth will fight one last time for the world. Horus will defeat Seth forever, and Osiris will be able to return to this world.

It is said that this battle of good verses evil still rages, but some day, Horus will be victorious and on that day, Osiris will return to rule the world.

I do understand what you are saying, and it is true, but what if Hell was something which began at a certain time. The people back then saw fire of the Gods (Gods war) and because the "evil" lost went up into flames, and hell was created. Just a suggestion.

Are we going to look at the Egyptians then we have to say they had a fight between good and evil (and I personally belief Seth was the Lucifer of the Bible).

And if you look at the Gods
Egyptian book of the death"Blazing fire, unquenchable, with far-reaching tongues of flame, irresistible slaughterer, which one may not pass through fear of its deadly attack.

Isn't the above about "evil" going into flames and therefore the word "Hell" becoming into being, an option?

But also think about the following, Lucifer was an angel, the highest angel, and he went to hell together with his 1/3th of the angels while fighting against God. Now the Egyptians had also their Gods, and in the Bible Moses and his God fight against the Gods of the Egyptians. So they were interacted with eachother, the God of Christ knew hell, why shouldn't the Egyptians?

And yes I am saying they were right, only hell is in my point of view something which happened at a time (the time Lucifer and his angels began fighting against God) and therefore in the oldest religions you don't see it back.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

And Sapphire, was Jesus also copper-based, semi-human and taller then the others? Next to this the blood was blue in the text you gave, not the eyes

But that's what I think.

Leenbekkemaa, everyone's blood is blue before being exposed to air, but not all have copper based blood

Jesus is always depicted by the Catholics as having blue eyes, however in ancient Egypt it is said that the people believed those with green and blue eyes were gods ... I have bright green eyes, i guess i really am a god

here, i'll show ya the quote ...

In the ancient Pyramid Texts, the Gods are said to have blue and green eyes. [Alford, op. cit., p. 232.] The Graeco-Roman author Diodorus Siculus (I, 12), says that the Egyptians thought the goddess Neith had blue eyes. [C. H. Oldfather, Diodorus of Sicily (London: William Heinemann, 1968), p. 45.]


[Edited on 21-12-2003 by Sapphire]

I wonder was religon formed to fill the abyss in our minds

Relgion existed to make mystic what we were ignorant about and of. And just like darwinianism in the animal world, it is present in religion. most polytheistic religions died out as more and more scientific knowledge accumulated. Montheism evolved from that, and depending where you were in teh world, it was either a good thing or a bad thing. In Europe, the church was a force for ignorance, repression, ect. In Islamic countries, they didn't much care either way. Look at your history. The only reason we have much of our knowledge of greek philosophies and such is because during the midfdle ages, Islam was at its peak, and so was monotheism.

However, we are outgrowing monotheism too. In the last century, it has done nothing but attack the (in my mind, at least) final culmanation of the mystic cycle- non-theism, the lack of any god or gods. Christians rabbidly attacked the idea of evolution. the middle east, once the seat of scietific and cultural power, lies in ruins and war. fundementalists (whom you only see in theistic religious settings) go about on crusades and jihads and whatnot.

We have come to the point where all we need is a way of life. Many follow science, and despite religious objectiosn, the fabric of society has yet to crumble.

DE