The Dogon Tribe Research Project

Dogon migration

Early history is informed by oral traditions, which claim that the Dogon originated from the west bank of the Niger River (10th to 13th centuries). They emigrated west to northern Burkino Faso, where local histories describe them as kibsi. Around 1490, they fled a region now known as the northern Mossi kingdom of Yatenga when it was invaded by Mossi calvary. They ended up in the Bandiagara cliffs region, safe from the approaching horsemen.

Between the 10th and 13th century they fled already to Burkino Faso (Mali) and in 1490 they fled to the Bandiagara cliffs region.

And next the �fertility symbol called Dagon�

Uhm� Dagon does represent a lot more then just fertility, he was the God of the philistines which was cut into pieces. Well and what I also could tell you, Dagon was a machine. And it was seen as a fertility symbol because it was associated to the Ark of the Covenant which made the Manna.

But let�s stick with the Nommo

The Nommo again

The organisation and pacification of the world was characterised by 5 attributes, known as the �5 attributes of Nommo�, all of which were associated to the fertility of the earth. Their names were day, humidity, fertility, order and life.

The Nommo where also associated with fertility, very much indeed (what would you expect if it is said they created earth and the universe). Well let�s take a little review, the creation of the Nommo was done in the Anthill (the spacecraft), the creation of the universe was referred to as the 10 fingers, and the making of the earth (the third Word) was making it accessible to grow crops on and stuff. I think you realise why it is associated with fertility, and it is just the description of how persons back then described what happened.

anyone still dealing with this topic? - haven't seen anything posted for a while.
I've got some stuff, but don't know whether or not I should post if this thread has died.

Phantomroyce never posted anything,
Exdog did had personal problems which prevented him from doing research.

I think it's save to say the thread died

Originally posted by LeenBekkemaa
Phantomroyce never posted anything,
Exdog did had personal problems which prevented him from doing research.

I think it's save to say the thread died

no worries on my end my friends, my apologies for my lack of participation. Much has been done to settle my personal worries.
to be brief, I will share a small amont of the details. The day after Xmas my 14mos old son suffered a seizure brought on by a high fever (scariest day of my life, he turned blue on the way to the emergency room, police escort and much more). He has since switched child care providers to be closer to his mother and I at work and the hospital as well (more reasons for switching daycare that I don't care to share). We have been making preparations to have his mother become a full time stay at home mom, and that time draws near. Much of my energy and time has been focused on the well being of my family. I will do my best to refresh my energies and focus, thanks toall concerned...especialy you LeenBekkemaa

Family always comes first, exdog.
Hope all's well just now and for the future buddy.
take care

regards
flc

Ow well I guess we can go on again No thanks man

Originally posted by LeenBekkemaa
Ow well I guess we can go on again

No thanks man

fine by me, LeenBekkemaa.

what angle would you like me to start from again?

Hey, I am sorry it took me so long to respond again. There was also a certain period for me in which happened a lot so I didn't do much research anymore (and neither for school). That period is really in the past now, so I am really going to start posting again

Phantomroyce will be 'deleted' from this research investigation because of non-participance.

Funlovincriminal I heard you had some nice stuff you wanted to post but wasn't sure because the topic wasn't very active anymore, just post it It doesn't hurt so

What we still have to do is a lot (and I must admit, I have done almost a half a year of research before, but still most of my knowledge are like the things I posted before, not really specialized knowledge about the connections with the Egyptians and stuff).

* There is still an argument from the beginning of this research (the trade route with the Western world, and the idea that the Dogontribe aren't isolated) which need to be taken a closer look at.
* More connections with the Egyptians, like the Nommo in comparison to Ra and Isis for example.
* The other tribes and their similarities.
* More evidence that the ceremonies concerning Sirius B go back to the 13th century.
* Looking for Sirius connections at the other tribes.
* More information about the investigation of Griaule and Dieterlen and about the traditions, beliefs and stuff.
* More information concerning the arguments which were given at the beginning of this research.
* More detailed information about Sirius C (by astronomers).
* Looking which animals represent what, and why.
* Comparing those animals to the animals with the Egyptian belief.
* More information about the statues.
* Looking for any connections with the Dogontribe concerning Virgo, Ursa Minor, Ursa mayor, Orion (because of the Egyptian connections to those stars).

These are really things which I thought up in the last 5 minutes which still need to be done. Some things of the above we already know, or are possibly so. For the connections with Virgo, Orion and stuff just look at the connection of Isis with Sirius, and then it is very likely those other stars are where the other creational Gods come from (also Pauta).

Anyway, I don't have the feeling we have to give you guys certain directions to search in, or give you real tasks. If you would like to do something in particular just say so, and post everything which is valuable. If you would like to do a certain task that's fine with me, but I don't have the feeling it is necessary.

The above were just a few examples of the things of which you could choose.

What I highly recommend is the following:
* Use the advanced search of google and let Google search for .edu sites, so you will get the sites of universities.

Good luck and just do your thing

Website of the university

The drawing is at least made when the research was done by Griaule and Dieterlen.

[Edited on 1-2-2004 by LeenBekkemaa]

should be on the case again very shortly - had a few domestic problems myself the last week or so. I'll post some stuff within next 48 hours or so

see ya soon
regards
flc

Debunker.com

Sceptics site

I've U2U'd LeenBekkemaa to advise that due to unforseen circumstances I can't take part in this project for the time being. I'm a bit p1$$ed as I did enjoy it, but unfortunately I can't spare the time at present.
sorry
regards
flc

I'll get the feeling I am left on my own a little bit Ofcourse I understand personal problems are more important but the project isn't going that well at this momemt uhm... I think we need 2 other persons with this research because otherwise it isn't going to work...

Still, Exdog are you still out there?

Well, I am going to search for some information (and give conclusions from the ones I gave before) tomorrow. Exdog I hope to get some respons

I am here my friend...been very busy with work, we are being forced to implement a insane security system here at work (the cite the National Security Act as the reason)

my home life is back on track...I've been meaning to post some info I have derived from all the info you have supplied. When I get a chance to type all my notes down...I will post...forgive my lack of participation.

not that you couldn't run this thing all by yourself

Oke thanks man that's all I needed to know

Some information about the knowledge of the Dogon concerning Sirius B (not concerning if they got the knowledge from the Nummo or from the western world).

The Dogon name for Sirius B consists of the word for star, tolo, and po, the name of the smallest plant seed they know of. They say that it is "the smallest thing there is" and that it is "the heaviest star" since all earth on it has been replaced with an immensely heavy metal called sagala, and the star is white in color. They also claim that the star�s orbit is elliptical, with Sirius A as the focus of the ellipse. Scientific research proves that th is indeed the case. Furthermore, they claim that the period of the orbit is fifty years, which is amazingly close to the figure scientists derived: 50.04 +/- .09 years. In addition, they believe that the star rotates on its axis, and indeed it does. The Dogon also believe that there is a third star in this system, Emma Ya, which means "sorghum female," and is said to be orbited by a single planet. However, this star has not yet been discovered by astronomers.

While looking at the previous information about Sirius C, we have to say there is a big chance the Dogon really had this information while the western world didn't. Sirius C is still not discovered, but the information which the Dogon gave seems to be accurate concerning the high chance of another star being in the system, and also being in the place where the Dogon said it would be.

This information couldn't be given by the western world because the western world didn't had that information as we already noticed. Therefore assuming they got the knowledge about Sirius B from the western world becomes also very small, especially when saying the Sigi festival which began in the 13th century.

Oke well I searched around some more and I came up with this statue

This looks very much like the statue I gave before, concerning the legs being the horses. That was also the reason for horses being the first being on earth according to the Dogon.

However now I see this statue I see a striking similarity with another belief. Ezekiel gives us a describtion of God. I know I said to show the connections with the Egyptians, only the similaritie is to striking to dismiss.

Parts from Ezekiel:
1:5 And out of its midst `is' a likeness of four living creatures, and this `is' their appearance; a likeness of man `is' to them. (just look at the right statue and you will see the four living createrus (the persons)).

1:8 and hands of man under their wings -- on their four sides, and their faces and their wings -- `are' to them four.

1:9 joining one unto another `are' their wings, they turn not round in their going, each straight forward they go.

As to the likeness of the living creatures, their appearances `are' as coals of fire -- burning as the appearance of lamps; it is going up and down between the living creatures, and brightness `is' to the fire, and out of the fire is going forth lightning. (concerning the living creatures being the rockets of a spacecraft this does make a lot of sense).

1:26 And above the expanse that `is' over their head, as an appearance of a sapphire stone, `is' the likeness of a throne, and on the likeness of the throne a likeness, as the appearance of man upon it from above. Compare this to the person on top of the Dogon statue, on the right it is very obvious what the throne is


I just needed to show the similarities between Ezekiel and the statue of the Dogontribe because it is to obvious.

A direct link to the Egyptians

The early gods of these Proto-Saharans included a serpent, the sun: Hercules, Amon/Aman/Amma, and Kush or Khons.

Comparison Dogon and Egypt

The next significant phase of my study was to compare these Dogon references to those of ancient Egypt � which was the original intention of the study. A simple comparison of the fragmented Egyptian myths and the surface storyline of the Dogon myths revealed many obvious similarities. The Egyptian god Amen was described in terms quite similar to the Dogon god Amma. Likewise, descriptions of the emergence of the original eight Ennead gods and goddesses of ancient Egypt ran parallel to stories of the eight Dogon ancestors. What was lacking in Egyptian lore was the kind of detail provided by The Pale Fox, and therefore it was also lacking a mechanism for testing the deeper meanings of Dogon myth. Fortunately, the Dogon creation story provided a remedy for this difficulty � language itself. Dogon mythology makes careful use of language as it describes each of the mythological components of matter, defining key words for each important concept, many of which carry dual meanings. For instance, the po � the Dogon counterpart to the atom � is described like an atom, but is also said to come from a root word that means beginning. The Dogon counterparts to electrons are called sene seeds. They surround the po and they are said to form a nest. These carefully chosen words, with their pronunciations and meanings, provide a linguistic link to the Egyptian hieroglyphs.

Edit:
Next to this I am still going to analyse these sites because I am sure these will come up with new arguments and information.
Site of the sceptics
Debunker.com



[Edited on 2-3-2004 by LeenBekkemaa]

Website

Griaule and Dieterlen report that the Dogon claim to have come from the Mande region, west of Bamako, where they were part of the ancient Mandingo empire of Keita, which dominated a greater part of West Africa in the 13th Century. (Ibid., 26-27). Some researchers, including Temple (1987) have attempted to trace Dogon ancestry back to ancient Egypt, and while this idea seems plausible due to the complexities of Dogon mythology, and its occasional similarity to Egyptian mythology, the theory appears unsubstantiated by evidence, and is contested by Picknett and Prince (1999).



There is no written text recording the Dogon myths as a story, instead they are passed down orally through the generations.

So it is possible that the story of creation is changed in some way or another. This does mean the story could be less acurate but on the other hand it does make it more believable that Griaule and Dieterlen got the information after 15 years (when it was written down they would have gotten it probably much earlier).

hi im a new reasearcher here but i found somthing that might be of some relavance

ok so heres a link:
www.crystalinks.com...

right now scroll down to where it shows the pink star and the jewish star i think i can see a pattern

if we see the jewish star as a object with triangles on the outside then invert them we get this!

looks fimiliar to the star eh? just a thought i could be a little sleep deprived or grasping at straws