A Free Society, are we truly free?

I was reading in ATS a thread on the price of security, and it came to my mind that freedom is very valuable to American citizens, at least to me.

But are we truly free? Is our society free?

What it means to be free under our government.

Many will argue that we are a Free society, with freedom of expression, religion and such, but that may not be so . . . everything is between the rules and guidelines of what our lawmakers and government deemed to be.

I thing that our society is control, by more laws that is needed.

One thing that I find oppressing in our free called society is . . . that we do not choose how our taxes are spend by the same government we elected.

Does anybody truly control their work environment, how many hours we should work, how much money is our work worth it, can kind of insurance and how much we should pay for it?

If you think about it, everything is regulated, for some it works but for others they get the long end of the bargain.

While we cherish freedom, does anybody really knows what freedom is all about, the meaning of the word freedom and if truly apply to our society and type of government today?

I think that we have not freedoms per say but rather are a very control society by our government.


[edit on 31-12-2006 by marg6043]

We do face many laws, regulations, guidelines, etc.

However, none of these detract from our freedom. Does anyone force us to work? Does anyone force us to do anything? When we wake up in the morning, are we physically pushed out the door to our job? Or are we left with the decision to drag our sorry behinds to our employment?

Sure, it is not much of a decision. We live in a materialistic world, where the decision is basically made for us. But, the fact of the matter is, nobody forces us to do anything.

Originally posted by marg6043
Does anybody truly control their work environment, how many hours we should work, how much money is our work worth it, can kind of insurance and how much we should pay for it?

But would this give a concise measurement of true freedom? Our work environment, is our work environment. It is nothing more. How much we pay for insurance? Is this a determining factor in our freedom? Honestly, I don't believe any of these aspects of our life can be used to measure our freedom.

Our society needs guidelines, we need laws. The absence of restrictions is chaos.

Are we forced into any political affiliation? Are we forced into believing in a God? Religion? No, we are free to think for ourselves. We determine who we vote for, we determine who we pray to. (If at all) We live in a democratic state, not a perfect one, but one at that.

If we compare ourselves to Darfur, would we consider ourselves blessed with a sense of freedom? I believe the answer is quite clear.

We as a society have room for improvement. We always will. But I think from time to time we forget how good we actually have it.

I was reading in ATS a thread on the price of security, and it came to my mind that freedom is very valuable to American citizens

I see some on ATS who are completly the opposite. They want a police state, they protect Bush and his croonies who are the worst defenders of the constitution and freedoms. Those should be deported, they are nazis.

I believe that too many regulations takes over our freedoms and our way of life and . . .

It can turn into oppression.

We tend to proclaim freedom in our country, but, how free we are . . .

Just because we are have more freedoms that other countries . . . are we truly free? Is what we have right now, what our founding fathers envisioned ?

Many things that are there to control our extension of freedom has nothing to do with keeping people away from harming others, that is why laws are enacted in society to keep the citizens from doing harmful things to each other.

And that is fine, but . . . we have many other regulations and laws that has nothing to do with that.

But more often than not to actually benefit the government and those in power.

As we are born into the regulations and rules that control our Freedom we actually have not idea what truly been free means because we know no better.

As each generation comes forward they will have less and less freedoms and still believe that they are free.

This latest regime seems to base their ideas on security over freedom. They want the masses to give up their freedom in order for security. Well, that is not something I am, or ever would be, prepared to do. Since 9/11, America has seen some drastic change. The government has openly admitted to illegal wire tapping, something they should be held accountable for. Nixon, anyone? anyone? We seem to get a way with a lot these days when the purpose is national security.

I do see the window for an argument here on this issue, but I feel it is only opened slightly. Comparing a nation to Darfur and proclaiming a victory on freedom is hardly a victory at all. But the fact remains, as society evolves, certain efforts are required. And at this point in time, we seem to be a step ahead of our brothers and sisters around the world.

I hope, for everyone's sake, that we do not have to trade our freedom for security. What's a life worth living, if we can not live?

It's either get busy living, or get busy dying.

Great thread marg, very thought-provoking.

That is what I mean chissler, are we supposed to accept the attempts of our governments against our freedoms let it pass by, without even asking us the people if that what we really want?

It seems that we have not learned from pass mistakes when the generations before us fought so hard to stop exactly what right now is accepted by this generation that is been treated, even worst of what happen the last time because many do not remember, either they were to young or were not born.

Is sad to see other nations that are not as free as our, but to tell you the truth they have never experience freedom to compare if they have lost it or not.

But we do.

As generations go by the eroding of our freedoms is worst and nobody is fighting for them like our last generation did.

Thanks Chissler, you understand my point.

The perversion of the concepts of freedom and security of late are really disheartening.

In blind patriotism, they seek to make America and Freedom irrevokably one in the same, no matter what America does. When they say "we need this security to defend FREEDOM", they mean to defend AMERICA.

So they take away TRUE FREEDOM to defend AMERICA, using their statist redefinition of the word freedom to essentially say that the only way to save it is to destroy it.

Originally posted by The Vagabond
The perversion of the concepts of freedom and security of late are really disheartening.

I agree with you,

I feel that because Americans value and worship freedom so much, it can be manipulated and twisted by the ones that hold the power in our country to turned around and used against us.

In order to preserve our freedoms we must give away some of it for the good of all.

And people willingly will accept this type of mentality and agree with it.

But that is not only from our government. If you look at the restrictions and regulations to protect us citizens has grown out of proportion.

Many if no all of our life is regulated to fit every angle of our lives.

Even our business and corporations are all subject of regulations.

Are we able to govern ourselves like our founder father meant it to be? No a chance.

Isn’t self-government what we were mean to have in our nation?

How easily groups have been able to pervert this idea into the idea that majority rules.

Using collectivism does not help maintain equality but it opens the door to communism but a perverted communism still means not everybody is equal.

So where is the freedom of self rule?

Our nation has deviated from what freedoms used to mean and has turned in a perverted version of a kind of communism.

In which majority rules and everybody else has to sit down and go with the flow.


[edit on 1-1-2007 by marg6043]

Jannis Joplin said it best. er well sung it best...

Freedoms just another word for nothing left to loose. Nothing thats all you got if you ain't free.

Nope we are not free in America. Far far from it we are living in a society of laws those laws confine us suround us and enslave us.

Annother quote from fight club

Only when you have lost everything are you truly free to do anything.

So the only people that are free are those that refuse to conform or refuse to comply.

they are free but again they are also criminals.

Is that you Marge?

There is something different in the form or your recent posts in comparison to your past posts. No offense...but your spelling has improved dramatically lately too!

Anyway...I too feel a little shake down by government. Not federal government, but state government.

I live in Louisiana and as of today there is a major crackdown on smoking. Smoking is not allowed in places of business, excluding bars and casinos. To Hell with what business owners think is best for their business, the State knows best.

Also as of July 2006 it is a crime to smoke in a vehicle with children. Nevermind the fact the no child has ever died by riding in a vehicle with a smoker. However you can still yak away on a cellphone all freaking day while driving with a child, and nothing will ever be done about this.

[edit on 1-1-2007 by RRconservative]

Originally posted by RRconservative
Is that you Marge?

Hey I got 4 years of college just because I am Spanish and my spelling sucks when I do as I think it doesn't mean that I can not take the time and do the spell and grammar check.

Actually people love talking to me one on one. when I don't have to write.

Anyway I agree with you also.

One thing that hit me hard from the non-smoking regulations was . . . the way in the name of political correctness and for the good of all, a tradition like the cigar smoking in Washington is going to end.

Is like I said, we have no self rule, we have nothing but the so call majority rule.

Even if I don't like it, I have to eat it.

But are we truly free? Is our society free?

Of course not. Haven't you ever seen the Matrix? I believe that movie says it quite well... freedom is an illusion given to you by those who are in power (i.e. gov't, big business).

On a deeper level the whole point to life is to not be free. Your physical body has limitations as does your mind. So any concept (i.e. freedom) you can think of will have limitations too. Even if you choose to go live off the grid and not participate in the corporate world you're freedom is still limited. You can't just decide that you don't need to eat. You can't just decide that you don't need shelter. Purpose pervades every aspect of reality. Everyone is bound by purpose and as such no one is truely free.

If freedom means being able to do and have what one wants when one wants it, then the rich are the only people free to do what they want.

If freedom means contentment under any circumstance, or clear conscience, or the ability to renounce one's own desires and accept whatever circumstance life throws one's way, then freedom is not contingent on externals.

It seems in today's world the former is emulated and propagated by the powers that be and the latter is scoffed at and forgotten.

Not an unusual circumstance for a planet where wealth and resource has always been the basis of social power. However, the spiritual truths persist despite our best attempts to the otherwise.