The Honorable And Noble Palestinian Warriors

thanks for the link you supplied with that photo junglejake. i went through the supplied slideshow on that page (378 photo's) a large majority of which show the destruction of lebanese buidings, distraught citizens, injured children in hospitals and various pictures of israeli tanks and soldiers and their advanced weaponry. i was unfortunately unable to find any pictures of hezbollah militants fighting near lebanese citizens. just that one of the palestinian militant in palestine not lebanon. below the commentary from some of the photos.

photo

Lebanese mourners pray over the bodies of fourteen civilians killed in Israeli air strikes in the southern village of Ghaziyeh, three kms south of Sidon. France and the United States battled to revive a desperately needed UN Security Council resolution on the Middle East conflict as Israel pressed its four-week-old military offensive against Hezbollah.(AFP/Oussama Ayoub)

photo

Two Lebanese women mourn during the funeral of Lebanese citizens in the southern town of Ghaziyeh, near the port city of Sidon, Lebanon, Tuesday, Aug. 8, 2006, after they were killed when Israeli airstrikes flattened three buildings Monday killing fifteen people. Israeli airstrikes hit near a funeral procession in Ghaziyeh on Tuesday, sending 1,500 mourners wailing through the streets and killing at least six people in nearby buildings, witnesses and the town's mayor said. (AP Photo/Mohammed Zaatari)

im not defending either side because as im sure you know that there are photos out there of israeli's using palestinian civilians as shields as well as hamas and hezbollah. it is a despicable act no matter who is doing it.

I've actually noticed that trend, too. There have been many, many pictures of the damage done in Lebanon, pictures of the victims, yet with 3,000 rockets fired, very, very few images of Israeli cities. At the same time, we have a reporter talking about killing the reporter if they took images of Hezbullah's rockets going out, and another Times reporter saying,

To the south, along the curve of the coast, Hezbollah is launching Katyushas, but I’m loathe to say too much about them. The Party of God has a copy of every journalist’s passport, and they’ve already hassled a number of us and threatened one.

Source
The Times reporter explained on his blog that the reason for the threats was the same as the US reaction to reporters not giving locations of potential targets, but given the first threat, it sounds as though their threats may be a little more...severe...than just being sent home.

That might help explain why there are so few photos along the lines you're speaking.

Originally posted by junglejake

Look at the photo again...

What immediately strikes me as strange, is that the shooter is holding a brand-new M16 carbine complete with new optics...where did he get this hardware?

Perhaps it's just one of the cache of 3,000 rifles and 3million bullets (amongst other munitions) that were sold by the Israeli Govt. to Fatah leader, Mahmoud Abbas only as recently as June.

Sources:
www.militantislammonitor.org...
www.jpost.com...
english.aljazeera.net...

Fair enough, my main argument though continues to be that neither side can be truly blameless, sure perhaps hamas and hezbollah are and have been the aggressors, i have never been there and do not know enough about that region. But the fact remains that photo's of Israeli's committing despicable acts can also be found. Playing the blame game everyone loses and there is no end to the cycle of violence imo. Which btw seems to be getting worse here lately (on ats), tit for tat solves nothing, genuine discussion and debate may get us halfway towards an answer though.

Regarding the count of dead Lebanese civilians and Hezbollah, it has been noted in another thread that, since it is impossible to tell a Hezbollah from a civilian since they have no formal uniform, the decision has been made that if you are carrying a weapon, you are Hezbollah. If no weapon is found with the body, it is counted as a civilian.

So what happens is, when a Hezbollah is killed, his weapon is immediately picked up by another Hez, and poof! a terrorist becomes a civilian casualty!

Originally posted by jsobecky
Regarding the count of dead Lebanese civilians and Hezbollah, it has been noted in another thread that, since it is impossible to tell a Hezbollah from a civilian since they have no formal uniform, the decision has been made that if you are carrying a weapon, you are Hezbollah. If no weapon is found with the body, it is counted as a civilian.

So what happens is, when a Hezbollah is killed, his weapon is immediately picked up by another Hez, and poof! a terrorist becomes a civilian casualty!

And poof! easy way to justify dead civilians.

So they have obviously killed nearly half the hezbollah militants then, over 1000 dead now isnt it.

Originally posted by ThePieMaN

Originally posted by junglejake

Israel responded to PLO rocket attacks on northern Israeli settlements by bombing PLO encampments in southern Lebanon.

source

LOL and where did the PLO (Palestine Liberation Organization) crop up from? Yeah Rocket attacks....what did those rocket attacks arise from?

All the evidence is there you just have to look.

Its all just filthy evil muslims as another member here put it so eloquently.

Now, I can not believe you have said this Pieman.

Well here's where the PLO cropped up from

Founded by the Arab League in 1964, its goal was originally the destruction of the State of Israel through armed struggle, and replacing it with an "independent Palestinian state" between the Jordan River and the Mediterranean Sea.

en.wikipedia.org...

It doesn't get much clearer than this my friend.


And Hezbollah has similiar aims yet questionable tactics

Hezbollah is reputed to have been among the first Islamic resistance groups to use tactical suicide bombing in the Middle East, and early bombings attributed to the group (e.g. the 1983 Beirut barracks bombing) inspired other militant extremist groups to adopt the tactic for their own purposes. The Palestinian Sunni group Hamas is perhaps the most well-known of these copycats, and while Hezbollah has largely ended its own suicide bombing campaign, some claim it continues to help Hamas in planning and training for suicide missions to this day.

en.wikipedia.org...

And can someone explain, how you train to get blown to bit's? It seems like a one time gig to me. Alright class, you push the button, and Booooom.

But then there is those who catch Bullet's in their teeth, and you wonder how they figured they could do this? I guess those are questions for another post though......


And then there's the Hamas

Hamas' charter (written in 1988 and still in force) calls for the destruction of the State of Israel and its replacement with a Palestinian Islamic state in the area that is now Israel, the West Bank, and the Gaza Strip.

en.wikipedia.org...

When this is what you are faced with, as partners to discuss peace, you have to give your head a shake.

You would think they would just one day stop being terrorists, and at least try and be neighbourly, and begin playing well with others in the region, but alas, Old Dogs do not learn New tricks.


And it's NOT ALL FILTHY EVIL MUSLIMS. It's just a few perverse freaks, from the Fringes that abuse the Muslims in their midsts through intimidation and summary executions, as is the case with most radical extremists. They work the Fear Factor.

Ciao

Shane

Shane
You can make these claims and I won't refute it. The whole thing is you are trying to raise the level of Israel as an entity that is of a higher caliber then any of these groups. They are no better. Just because they have written clauses in their little rule books does not make them any more dangerous then an organization that has unwritten agendas in place. Lets take for example Irgun. One of the first terrorist organizations in Palestine. One of its leaders and masterminds of the group went on to be Prime Minister of Israel. This supposedly being a democratic state, allowed a known murderer and criminal to be Prime Minister of Israel, a position of power in a country with power. This man while in office had access to some of the most lethal weapons known to man. He continued his murderous spree while acting as PM of Israel about 30 years even following his start of his criminal career. Did this criminal change his coat of arms during that time? Doubtful.

Here is his dossier as recorded by MI5

RELEASES TO THE NATIONAL ARCHIVES
Files of Jewish interest
Israel Panner (KV 2/2173-2174)

As one of the leading Communist Jewish writers of the period, Israel Panner (who often wrote under the barely effective nom de plume of 'Rennap') was an obvious subject of Security Service interest in the 1930s and 1940s. As documented in KV 2/2173 (1934-1947) he first came to the Service's attention through being mentioned in intercepted correspondence of other Communist targets, and was soon found speaking at meetings.

The file includes a Special Branch report of his arrest for obstruction in February 1941 while he was engaged in trying to propagate Communist ideals in the confined spaces of the communal air-raid shelters in London's East End. Initially working as a stretcher-bearer for a London council, he was eventually called up in July 1942, and the file contains a number of the Special Observation Report Forms compiled on him by his senior officers. Typical of these is the one at serial 68a which describes him as being a "barrack room lawyer and given to grousing. Argumentative towards his fellow soldiers."

Taken together these reports give a very full account of his (largely uneventful) military career. After demobilisation in June 1946, Panner returned to his journalistic work, and the Service continued to monitor his activities (as shown in KV 2/2174) until 1953.

Menachem Begin (KV 2/2251-2252)

Menachem Begin was the sixth Prime Minister of Israel (1977-1983) and leader of the country's leading right-wing party, Herut, from 1948-1983. He came to prominence as an advocate of the view that mainstream Zionist groups were too accommodating with the British authorities in pre-1948 Palestine, and advocated the use of force to establish a Jewish state. He joined the militant Zionist group Irgun during the Second World War and eventually became its leader. The Irgun's attacks on British targets in Palestine made him one of the most wanted men in the region, with a substantial reward posted for his capture.

The Security Service file on Begin consists largely of a collection of reports on his movements, contacts and activities culled from various sources. The Service was interested in building a detailed picture of his career, and the file includes much detail about his early life.

There is debate in KV 2/2251 (1939-1949) as to whether or not he had been in a position to serve in Spain with the International Brigade. The file includes a photograph purportedly of Begin with comrades in Spain, but also information from other sources suggesting that he was elsewhere for the duration of the Civil War. The possibility of Soviet control of Begin's Irgun organisation is one of the key concerns of the file, which records but otherwise does not go into much detail about various terrorist acts attributed to that organisation. The file includes a Polish Security Middle East group report on Jewish terrorist activities, dated April 1945; and a report of intelligence sourced from Chilik Weizmann by the Secret Intelligence Service that Begin had undergone cosmetic surgery in February 1947 to conceal his identity. The SIS report suggests that he "had undergone a plastic facial operation and that his appearance is totally different to that displayed on police photographs", but notes dryly that "We have no description of the new face."

Source


The PLO was organized due to the cruelty and opression by the government of Israel. Irgun , Stern gang and Hagannah were nothing more then murderers attempting to force their will upon the British government, nothing out of Defense for their lives or mistreatment. There is a big difference. You might flip your nose at me but I'd be ashamed to align myself with criminals such as that, who are nothing more then Mafioso. The ideals of these people are still alive and well and serving the interests of Israel. It is evident in the assasinations carried out, the intimidation, the harrassment of Palestinians on their own property and land, the collective punishment placed upon a people as a whole for not complying with Israeli wishes.


John Gotti claimed he was a Plumber.

Palestinian shot dead Friday by police was executed after arrest

A Palestinian suspected of attempting to carry out a suicide bombing who was shot dead by Israeli police in annexed east Jerusalem was "executed in cold blood half an hour after his arrest," Palestinian witnesses said.

"Around 4:15 pm (1415 GMT) on Friday, a car from the border guard police arrived in east Jerusalem's Beit Hanina neighbourhood. They were looking for two young men," he said.

He added that "when Mahmud arrived, he was immediately handcuffed, then (the policemen) raised his hands and threw him against my car. Minutes later, a police bomb disposal unit arrived on the scene."

[image removed]

"A policeman had put his foot on (Salah's) neck, another was holding his legs while and a third his hands. All the neighbours and myself saw from our windows and balconies how he was executed, more than half an hour after his arrest," he also said.

[image removed]

"The members of the special units threw him to the ground and cut open and removed his clothes with a special blade, leaving him with only his boxer shorts on," he added.

[image removed]

Yeah - so Noble.

So Honorable.

So Israeli.

So C00L.

[edit on 9/8/06 by Souljah]

New ATS Image Linking Policy
Specifically,

This system is in place to better support our recognition of image ownership, while offering members the means to hotlink inline images for which they have permission to post.

[edit on 8/9/2006 by 12m8keall2c]

Originally posted by marg6043

Originally posted by junglejake


Marg, are you claiming Arab states don't recognize borders?

For such a bright person like you Jungle some facts elude you but I guess is not your fault.

Arab states have borders, Tribal groups recognizes territories . . .

Marg, I believe that borders are used to define territories. the borders may be mountains, rivers, deserts, etc. but they are, nontheless, borders.

Originally posted by ThePieMaN
Shane
You can make these claims and I won't refute it. The whole thing is you are trying to raise the level of Israel as an entity that is of a higher caliber then any of these groups.

No Pieman, I offered those views in response to your questioning.


As for the balance of the Text you offered, I found it reflected nothing more than truth, as the Post I gave you.

But this starts to become part of the larger picture. The cause of the events that are taking place, and the way inwhich we have been manipulated to view the SCAM that is going on today.

There is just TWO POWERS at work here, and they play for the SAME TEAM.
White vs Black Majik.

It revolves around Demonic Worship, and the ones pulling the strings on both sides have created a masterpiece of deception.

It's all about SATAN, and it's all the handy work of his followers.

Here's a little piece to review my friend. You may need about 15 Minutes to read it, but when done, tell me this is not accurate.
www.sherryshriner.com...

How is your family? Are they safe?

Ciao

Shane

Originally posted by Souljah
New ATS Image Linking Policy
Specifically,

This system is in place to better support our recognition of image ownership, while offering members the means to hotlink inline images for which they have permission to post.

Can You Gladly Remove the Image in the First Post of this Thread also?

Or do rules just apply to Souljah?



^^^ Check your U2Us

[edit on 8/9/2006 by 12m8keall2c]

Originally posted by Souljah
Or do rules just apply to Souljah?

They apply to everyone.

The image on the first post of this thread uses the appropriate NEWS image tag that automatically gives credit to the source.

You took the pictures from their source, uploaded them to your member upload space, then used the tags to improperly display the intellectual property of someone else, hosted by the ATS domain.

Perhaps the gunmen was protecting those children from IDF soldiers who have a penchant for shooting Palestinian kids for sport? It kind of throws a pall of doubt over the original interpretation in the OP.

Don't worry he told them. Stay here so i can kill the jewish devils you won't die I promise.

Originally posted by spinstopshere
Don't worry he told them. Stay here so i can kill the jewish devils you won't die I promise.

What!!

I would have thought the idea would be to not kill anyone, Israeli or Lebanese. Or maybe im living in disneyland, dont know about you but i try to teach my kids that killing people is not a good thing. hey silly me!! No wonder the worlds (insert your favorite swear word).

I just watch an interesting vieo

Manipulating Media

So are there any reliable news source we can trust on? Both sides are putting on a lot of propaganda and it is so hard to judge anything.

Originally posted by NotheRaGe
I just watch an interesting vieo

Manipulating Media

So are there any reliable news source we can trust on? Both sides are putting on a lot of propaganda and it is so hard to judge anything.

I was waiting for them to mention that the settlement that was being "attacked" was an Illegal settlement on Palestinian land but they never mentioned that part. They also never mentioned the fact that those same factories, outposts and settlements also enjoy taking their solid wastes, their toxic wastes and junk and dump that onto other Palestinian lands illegally as well, contaminating their land as well as the Palestinian water table.


I don't know how people say they are the only representatives of democracy in the ME.

Originally posted by marg6043

The entire middle east is a war zone. . .

WTF are you talking about?