Islam's justified terrorist atrocities.

I always hear politicians saying true Islam is a peaceful religion. I downloaded a Qur'an and found that according to Islams holiest book these terrorist's are justified by there religion for the atrocities they commit.

"Slay the idolaters wherever you find them. ... lie in ambush everywhere for them. If they repent and take to prayer and render the alms levy, allow them to go their way ..." (9:5)

"Make war on them until idolatry shall cease and God�s religion shall reign supreme" (8:39)

"Fight them, Allah will punish them by your hands and bring them to
disgrace, and assist you against them and heal the hearts of a believing people."(9:14)

"O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends;
they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend,
then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people."(5:51)


It's not that I hate Muslims. But rather that I am troubled by what I read from their most holy book, which they must obey.

I think Islam has an agenda for world domination and according to them they have permission from Allah in the Qur'an to take it by force . . . . It's spreading!

Religion in its self is evil. Look at all the death and destruction and humiliation it has caused throughout the world's history. If you feel that one religion is trying to "take over the world", then you are dead wrong. Religion has already taken over the world.

Throughout the centuries religion has been spun around so that the TRUE meaning of religion would be unknown to the common folk. There have been many "remixes" to these Holy books, so many infact that the TRUE message has been erased.

Now when someone like yourself comes along and points out that Islam is a religion that promotes violence, this is an act of ignorance. You are trying to promote an "organization" as an organization in which it promotes terror.

I calll religion an organization because that is what they are: one big organization. These different organizations have been a tool of the devil for many centuries; ever since the beginning.

But to get back on topic, every Holy Book has those same lines somewhere in them. You are just pointing out the ones in the Qu'ran because the media has been brain washing people, sterotyping Islamists as terrorists.

I am not calling you a racists, because I do not know you, so I can't judge you.

[Edited on 23-10-2003 by TheCatalyst]

If you read the bible., its pretty much the same thing, just different words and gods used.

Islam and Christianity are both oppresive, violent religions that want to force thier beliefs on everyone. I dont believe that Islam is essentially peaceful, but many Muslims do not condone or engage in terrorist acts, so i cant say they are terrorists or support it. Just like christians say, beat up, harrass, and try to kill Wiccans and pagans, because the bible says Thou shalt not suffer a witch to love. The bible also says homosexuals should be killed.

Originally posted by TheCatalyst
Religion in its self is evil. Look at all the death and destruction and humiliation it has caused throughout the world's history. If you feel that one religion is trying to "take over the world", then you are dead wrong. Religion has already taken over the world.

religion isnt evil. as opposed as i am to religion i dont find it to be evil as religion is neutral, it is the people who follow religion that makes it seem good or evil. many people have followed religions to help other people selflessly which is good and then we have islamic terrorists, the spanish inquisition, the crusades, etc. those are evil. man uses religion for his own purposes which can be good to teach others to care for one another or for evil and teach them to hate anyone outside of their religion and those who dont live their way of life (as they think is dictated by their religion)

then again your way of thinking has made it possible for inanimate objects such as knivesand guns to be viewed as evil when they are the same as religion, a tool which can be good or evil according the wielders intentions.

blame the person, not the tool.

To a Fundamentalist Islamic....JUSTIFIED would be the word

but to Everyone Outside Islam...RATIONALIZED would be the key word
~~~~
For
sane reason & rational thought...SEE: Skadi_ and Prank , posts---> However, sound reason, responsibility, individual accountability, ARE NOT WHAT Greases the wheels of this Litigious Society....
heck, the $moral imperative$ is with getting big-bucks from fast food & cigarettes & hot coffee & any one with deep pockets....
including the Boston, Dioscese of Catholics.

the only reason the Muslims & Islam ain't being slammed is because 'they' havn't found the right way to do it yet!....the 'distancing' of any linkage to violence & Islam...is only for the 'wiggle room' needed before the assault is made by govts & philosophers...against the fundamentaliam in all religions, incl Islam

the new high tech man-god scientific holy man will cast us all into the anti-utopia, orwellian, netherworld!

i heard this from BOB:
...and BOB knows things...-->

~~~~~

oh...YhwhsCreation; enjoy the journey...

absolute peace is never going to come until organised religion is banished.

Riff.........
I didnt know you were into the Church of the Sub Genius!

hi, again....

let me put this..
..hyper-secret-signate-ring seal, right 'chear...

OK, now, we're Official....thanks Skadi, for the reminder

YhwhsCreation... heres a NYT article---if you haven't read it yet...That is like "Peeking Under The Circus Tent"

and is probably as much of a look at the Politics of Population Manipulation as your likely to get from a Popular, Public, Information Disseminator under the sway of (NWO & Illuminati) Orgs.

Re: Syria, Ruthlessly secular, has Frevent Islamic Resurgance !!

www.nytimes.com...
~~~~

you probably already know this...so i'm posting for the newer readers...having just the mudjaheen & AQ & Afghan as adversaries wasn't enough,,,crush the Baathists, create a Fatwa & Jihad response in the region...Iraq, then Iran, Syria, Lebanon, Egypt, Sudan, Libya...etc etc ....CREATE THE EMPIRE !!!
Clash of Titans.... (Islam v Christian)


AW, Darn, shucks....you know the ending....

....Troglodites Return, erect subterranian NewCity

Ok, so here's my take.. I speak as (not the world's most observant) Christian, but a believer, nonetheless.. Men are born with evil in their hearts. It is up to parents to "raise their children in the way they should go," as the good book sez. The need for correction and guidance bears that out.
I've read/studied the entire bible, new testament and old, as it is the book of my personal faith and I've come to some conclusions.

1. I'm sick to death of believers and non-believers attacking and belittling each other. It's not productive in the least. The New Testament sez we are not to judge one another. "He who has not sinned may cast the first stone."

2. God gets way too much blame for the actions of mislead, ignorant and evil men. That goes for men of every faith.

3. I don't go to church anymore because I think most church-goers are dead in their faith, trying to be seen as the faithful, or using it for contacts in the biz world and just plain judgemental and hypocritical towards their fellow man.

4. The New Testament is a new covenant of the church - and that includes EVERYBODY who seeks God. It is the doctrine of GRACE. Love one another. Treat one another as you would treat yourself. Think about that for one moment. If we all treated one another with respect and kindness, there wouldn't be any strife. But man cannot handle that, because of what resides within our hearts. There is no doctrine more simple than that. It is not evil at all. It is the doctrine of peace. Men just have a bad habit of perverting religion because the majority of followers DO NOT KNOW what their books or bibles actually say. That is what Martin Luther was about. Freeing the sheople of their ignorance through being able to study the word of God for themselves. Before that, the "Men of God" kept the bible chained to pulpit out of the church's reach, thus keeping them in darkness and bondage. That's how they make stoopid people do stoopid things IN THE NAME OF GOD.

5. It's my belief in God, good and evil, for example, that allows me to even contemplate such conspiracies. Were it not for that understanding, I would probably scoff at the thought that men could be so evil as to stoop to plotting something like the Reischtag Fire or 9-11. I believe these people - the controllers, the shadow government, the NEO CONS - are possessed by great evil.
Now, I'm sorry if I've offended anyone. That is not my aim. I am simply trying to explain the position of a Christian in all this. I believe racism, sexism, any kind of ism is just evil, pure and simple. PLEASE, do not judge Christianity by Bush, or Falwell, or Robertson or anyone like them.. They are deceivers.

It's funny that someone would download the Quran. It is available at the library. I guess that's part of the information age...I better get with it.

Religion isn't evil. I think they all have some good in them. It is those that twist the message to suit their own ends, such as the Bin Laden's and Farwell's of the world. They run around needing to feel important so they spout their non-sense to folk who wanna believe in a higher purpose. I think it's harder for a arab-muslim to reject these ideals because they live in a society without democracy. Joining these organizations give them control over their own destiny. Folk will follow anyone when they feel powerless.

There was a frontline special a few days ago about the six muslims in Baltimore that went to train and met Bin Laden...he asked them how was he seen by Muslims in the states...self-important--seeking self-acutalization through jihad. That's just how most occult leaders think. They want to be worshipped and they do it by exploiting folks through religion.

The fundies in democracies ususally aren't violent as their leaders would like them to be. There is a whole outside world that they have access to that keeps them from jumping off the deep end just like the six muslims in that special. Even though they were labled a sleeper cell most of them left without completing the training and rejected that form of Islam.

Originally posted by Saphronia

Religion isn't evil. I think they all have some good in them. It is those that twist the message to suit their own ends, such as the Bin Laden's and Farwell's of the world. They run around needing to feel important so they spout their non-sense to folk who wanna believe in a higher purpose. I think it's harder for a arab-muslim to reject these ideals because they live in a society without democracy. Joining these organizations give them control over their own destiny. Folk will follow anyone when they feel powerless.

That's just how most occult leaders think. They want to be worshipped and they do it by exploiting folks through religion.

In the Bible, Jesus warns in no uncertain terms to not be fooled/led astray/led into evil by the false prophets and the wolves in sheeps clothing. That's why self-knowledge is so important. If YOU know what the scriptures actually teach, you're not gonna be taken in by those who would pervert the word for their own sick causes. PAT ROBERTSON, for example, IS A FROKKIN' JOKE.

hmmmm
the exact same topic was started by the same person in Spirituality. I replied there:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by EastCoastKid

PAT ROBERTSON, for example, IS A FROKKIN' JOKE.


As far as I'm concerned, Pat Robertson is pure evil. I can see that and I don't even claim to be a christian.

Originally posted by kaoszero

Originally posted by EastCoastKid

PAT ROBERTSON, for example, IS A FROKKIN' JOKE.

As far as I'm concerned, Pat Robertson is pure evil. I can see that and I don't even claim to be a christian.

I saw that as a child flippin' thru channels when I landed on the 700 Club - before I "got religion." Since gettin' it, he thoroughly repulses me.

Originally posted by YhwhsCreation
I always hear politicians saying true Islam is a peaceful religion. I downloaded a Qur'an and found that according to Islams holiest book these terrorist's are justified by there religion for the atrocities they commit.

"Slay the idolaters wherever you find them. ... lie in ambush everywhere for them. If they repent and take to prayer and render the alms levy, allow them to go their way ..." (9:5)

"Make war on them until idolatry shall cease and God�s religion shall reign supreme" (8:39)

"Fight them, Allah will punish them by your hands and bring them to
disgrace, and assist you against them and heal the hearts of a believing people."(9:14)

"O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends;
they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend,
then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people."(5:51)


It's not that I hate Muslims. But rather that I am troubled by what I read from their most holy book, which they must obey.

I think Islam has an agenda for world domination and according to them they have permission from Allah in the Qur'an to take it by force . . . . It's spreading!

if this is true something must be done, i have no idea but what but it needs to get done

The only true religion is a private and personal one
The only true government is self- government


You are all absolutely free