sensitivity

i was just wondering what are the thoughts regarding drugs? pot, lsd, ecstasy, more specifically psychoactives do they somehow enhance our connection with what around us, or awaken pathways in the brain or the body, or are they tools which we can use to develop or understand ourselves or the universe? when ive experimented i've felt a greater connection or enhancement of my understanding, sometimes of myself, sometimes of the world, sometimes both and i feel that there is much more we could learn if we were to explore this area. but i've also read that drugs can limit ones awareness. what is everyone elses experiences or thoughts?

Originally posted by cus420
i was just wondering what are the thoughts regarding drugs? pot, lsd, ecstasy, more specifically psychoactives do they somehow enhance our connection with what around us, or awaken pathways in the brain or the body, or are they tools which we can use to develop or understand ourselves or the universe? when ive experimented i've felt a greater connection or enhancement of my understanding, sometimes of myself, sometimes of the world, sometimes both and i feel that there is much more we could learn if we were to explore this area. but i've also read that drugs can limit ones awareness. what is everyone elses experiences or thoughts?

Drugs dull the sensativity. People who don't already aknowledge the perseptions beyond the typical 5 sometimes claim it broadens their view - but coming from someone with a view already broadened - no. It ruins the whole thing.

You need to be very aware, you need to tune into these things. For some it happens naturaly, for others, they have to focus. Iether way, it makes it more difficult to be on high awareness or focus more while on drugs.

PCP, Acid, Shrooms, other herbal 'dream plants' etc - these are hallusinations produced in the mind because of the chemical reaction in the synaps and the way they deliver the messages to your nerons etc. A real experience is not 'manufatured' in the brain, although it is precieved and sorted out in the brain.

i dont know if i agree with your statement...shamans use drugs to look into the future and enter a dream state that would otherwise not be availablet to them. i am however speaking of natural herbs that you might find in the rain forest with psychoactive properties, not manufactured drugs like lsd, coc aine, heroin etc. Drugs I believe though (don't get the wrong impression here) can help you to a certain extent, but yes you need to do the rest of the work on your own. If you are not at a certain spiritual level persay you will not get what you want out of the experience anyway. Just my 2 cents...

Well... if your not talking about getting waisted...

Yes, the properly functioning body works best on all levels. So proper nutrition, well hydrated and some supliments of amino acids and mierals we don't get enough of in our food... those are helpful. But no so much 'help to achieve', as much as help for your body so that it is capable of achieving what it is already ment to do.

And to add more, say Gaba for those who have a calming effect, or a cigarette for grounding ect - again, it don't 'help to achieve', but it may, as in the case of a sedative like effect, allow us to be quiet and peiceful enough to follow our thoughts through, meditate etc.

Drink and drugs can be bad news.
Yes some Shaman have used them. Some Shaman cultures do now frown on this.
The main prob is self-induced experience is easier to come out of. Your awareness is not clouded and your judgement of bad encounters is good.
Under the influence of drink or drugs we know people do things they would not otherwise do. Their guards are down and their awareness of danger is lessened. The English drink fueled "soccer hooligan" who would happily take on riot Police on a Saturday could be a mild mannered clerk on Monday morning.
I just heard of a local lad, someone who was a smashing guy and wouldnt say boo to a ghost as they say. He now is doing porridge for murder. He started taking drugs less than two years ago to keep up with his social circle.
People who have already undertaken assisted experiences will doubtless say "B.S nothing has happened to me".
I would say not yet.

For someone who meditates and does yoga, while being into shamanism I don't think drugs or even alcohol dulls your sense of perception. If you can control it, its all good.

We use many other plants than those who induce states of mind. For example, the rose can be used to percieve spiritual insight. Nightshade and Foxglove are also used.

If you take drugs and alcohol and being untrained for the outcome of it, then yes, it will dull your mind. If you control your awareness, then it will be like any other astral projection trip, lucid dream or clairvoyancy ride that others experience naturally. However, there are sometimes where you will come across a point where you for example will be unable to see the difference between a dream and astral projection or clairvoyancy and that will make your mind confused. I guess its steams from the hallucinational effect also combinded in these things.

Volatile

I see your points about the possible dulling of sensitivity and ability to control it. Indeed this is a thread about sensitivity.
But my point I think was probably a little off topic. I was really referring to the kind of "bravado" effect of such stimulation.
Over the years I have witnessed Ouija boards, seances, so called "Ghost Hunts" you know the usual stuff. At these events there are people, often men I note-but not exclusively, who, for example, will only get involved after several cans of beer or a good drink down the pub first. This was the type of thing I was referring to.
Their perception of danger to the physical world would be impaired as would their danger perception of the other dimensions. Drink and drugs may even make you more combative, perhaps giving an aggressive attitude towards spirit. but your "defensive" actions may not be as effective.

Regarding spirituality myself. I prefer to live life without any of drink or drugs. I do like to know whatever I experience is real. Not the result of some external chemicals. I play guitar a bit, occasionally write what I call songs. I am proud of the fact that every note and lyric is mine. I honestly believe that if I had written my "Sergeant Pepper" album and made a fortune and was a household name, that at this stage in my life with the feelings and opinions that I now have, I would be very disappointed with that hugely successful work if it was construcated will being influenced by drink and drugs.

I am going to have to say that it is something risky. I am telling you from experience. Drugs can help/take you to levels. I was doing shrooms from time to time and it was all great at first. What you need to watch out for is taking yourself to far. Without drugs you can get to these levels but at your own speed. You don't take a child and put them out into the world without developing certain skills and common awarness. They need to learn things like there are people out there that will not help them, but lead them into trouble.

There are things you just don't need to know yet because you are not ready. Start a thread asking people what they would do given all the power in the world. That's not what I experinced or was looking for but that's kind of personal so we will just have to go with something random here.

So, do what you feel is right. Just be look out for yourself and those around you. That's the best advice I can give.

StYkI

Styki

Not sure if you were refering to me but:

Originally posted by Styki
There are things you just don't need to know yet because you are not ready. Start a thread asking people what they would do given all the power in the world. That's not what I experinced or was looking for but that's kind of personal so we will just have to go with something random here.
StYkI

I would say someone starting out in this stuff had things that they did need to know.
Fore warned is fore armed. Even if you scare them off more the better. You do not want a weakness of spirit or morality in this gig. Although both traits are subjective of course.

My comments relate to the fact that I am aware. I have never needed artificial stimulus. I got to where I got purely by thought and meditation. No crackpot dry fasting, no drugs, just me, my mind and the cosmos.

My problem came about when I did not need to snap into spirit mode. Shut off was getting more and more difficult. Fantasy, realty all the same. You would think of a car parking space and there it was. I felt dillusional. My saving grace was starting to realise that everything is but a reality created in your mind. Everything could just be your imagination. An author of book creates a reality that may be no less real than our perceived reality.

Thats the state I am at now. At least I can sleep at night with no visions and voices now.

You see this is what I mean. Even with full control, interdimensional contact became I believe dangerous. Theres a pointer. I perceived danger. Was there danger? It became an addiction itself. Ironic eh?

Although I have always believed physical fitness was essential for a balanced life, I found my physical being deteriorating. Mostly through the lack of the ability ot sleep. I did seek medical advice and they suggested drugs of course. I do not take drugs for medical reasons either so I was stuck. I explained my anti drugs stance and he gave me something called zaleplon as it was
short acting non residual. Basically I was advised to keep them close by as it may be a psychological boost just to know they were there. It kinda worked. However, I was desparate enough to try one but never, never, never again. I was only out for an hour or so but I felt physically that someone had used my body for something other than sleeping. The moments before the drug took effect were really scary and I felt helpless as it washed over me. If you guys want that stuff you are welcome to it.

I was really scared at one point because I had been told, once you have opened up thats your lot, you are stuck with it. I am still not sure how I got out of it. Denial of existence or growing up I say, but I dont know. But I tell you I dont miss it one bit.

Just a story from me to you
You must decide if twas true.

Originally posted by something smells
My comments relate to the fact that I am aware. I have never needed artificial stimulus. I got to where I got purely by thought and meditation. No crackpot dry fasting, no drugs, just me, my mind and the cosmos.

Sarcasm: How can one be aware of his awareness?

My comment was just: "Well good for you!"

Originally posted by Volatile

Sarcasm: How can one be aware of his awareness?

My comment was just: "Well good for you!"

Thank you for your "mature" input into the debate.

peace and light

may not all your dreams be wet ones.

No problem, as you did the same to me, I payed you back with the same thing.

Thank you for making me post my opinion and some facts, in vain.
Time was wasted at that precious point, and unfortunately we don't have alot of it.