"Proof" of D12 is DEAD!!!

Yet another proof (hah, pun) that music such as black metal and the likes doesn't make you violent, as opposed to this rap whinery.

Saphronia & DaFunk13

Not once in either of your replies did you mention anything about this guy shooting somebody before he himself was shot. It's funny how that whole point gets lost and it turns into a culture issue. The guy might have been a great lyricist and an icon in the hip-hop community, but he was also a major douchebag it appears. I'm always reminded of Allen Iverson when I think of situations like this. All the oppotunities in life afforded these guys because of the money they make, and they don't try to better themselves by removing the negative influences from their life. The fear of being portrayed as a sellout takes precedence over their own betterment. That's idiocy plain and simple. Iverson, although it's taken him a long time, has finally gotten it. I respect him for that.

Saphronia

Your justification of his lyrics really is laughable. You might want to re-read your post. Whether it's gansta rap or poser hip-hop, read the freakin' lyrics.
I know I definitely respect a guy that sings about g-moneying bitches. I would think you as a female would take some measure of offense to that garbage. I guess you just chalk it up to culture.

DaFunk13

BTW, Steve Miller's Take the Money and Run was not about him, it was about Billy Joe and Bobby Sue.


To both, no hard feelings I hope.

Peace

It does seem prophetic...It's like maybe he knew something because it came off like he was idolizing dead musicians, but I mean, he was going to die sometime just like with Pac & Big. It may just be coinincidential. Yeah it comes off as prophetic when it's really just sad for his babies, and we are looking for some way to rationalize the senslessness of the whole thing.

Not that anyone knows what actually happened, but it could've been a robbery that went bad. Even though Proof had a lot of respect around his way that don't keep hungry fools from running up thinking they can get paid. More or less that's the reason he had to carry a gun.

Dr. Love...no offense is taken because you may not understand or agree. Laughable as it may seem there is a difference. Proof was a musican by heredity his father played for Marvin Gaye--he spent his teen years hustlin to the top of the Detroit rap scene and his latter years until his death working with one of the most known rap stars in the industry...that's not a gangsta lifestyle. To me, real gangsta rap doesn't even exist in today's hiphop. I do listen to it--the old stuff--for nostalgia. It is part of my culture, it's what I grew up on whether that's to the good or the bad.

Nobody knows what the fight was about...and like I said in my previous post it could've just as easily been a robbery...it wouldn't be the first time a rapper got robbed. Then would Proof be vindicated for shooting someone? It's relatively easy for us to debate his actions and his music, but the kids is dead. Tis a sad reality.

edit: spelling; clarity


[edit on 13-4-2006 by Saphronia]

Originally posted by Saphronia
while it maybe pointless to continue because you can't hear above your own "opinions"

I was thinking the same thing. That and how my words keep getting twisted.

Originally posted by DaFunk13
We can all run around kickin dirt on a dude that just got killed over something probably pretty stupid because he lived in the ghetto.

I have already explained how Im not kickin dirt, but that doesnt seem to stop you from saying so.

Originally posted by DaFunk13
Its just easy to defame the dead black dude from Detroit, all because he rapped about the violence that surrounds him and probably carried a gun for protection.

Im leaving this thread before I get labled a racist next.

Originally posted by DaFunk13
You people have no clue what you are talking about because your entire sense of "ghetto", or "thug" is based entirely on the Real World, or BET.

My response is this quote

Originally posted by Saphronia
Judgement with no kind of basis in the truth...extreme embrace of ignorance

Originally posted by Panzeroth
Yet another proof (hah, pun) that music such as black metal and the likes doesn't make you violent, as opposed to this rap whinery.

Norwegian black metal band members go round killing people and burning churches! I remember my ex-girlfriend was telling about one guy who killed his friend because his band got signed!


I'll get more info and sources when I have time.

Originally posted by xeroxed88

Originally posted by Panzeroth
Yet another proof (hah, pun) that music such as black metal and the likes doesn't make you violent, as opposed to this rap whinery.

Norwegian black metal band members go round killing people and burning churches! I remember my ex-girlfriend was telling about one guy who killed his friend because his band got signed!


I'll get more info and sources when I have time.

Yep, allthough that wasnt the exact reason why he killed him. I think they burned or attempted to burn around 40-50 churches in the 90s. There has been only 2 murders that I know of in the black metal scene, yet still stupid countries like France ban certain black metal bands because they think they make people violent. Can anyone sum up the amount of people who have been murdered in the Ghetto Fretto Shiznoz Rap Scene?
Oh the contradictions!

Oh well, another rapper dead, why I stick with oldies! Never heard Pink Floyd gunning down Queen, or Beatles doing a drive by on the Monkeys.

Originally posted by Saphronia
Dr. Love...no offense is taken because you may not understand or agree. Laughable as it may seem there is a difference. Proof was a musican by heredity his father played for Marvin Gaye--he spent his teen years hustlin to the top of the Detroit rap scene and his latter years until his death working with one of the most known rap stars in the industry...that's not a gangsta lifestyle. To me, real gangsta rap doesn't even exist in today's hiphop. I do listen to it--the old stuff--for nostalgia. It is part of my culture, it's what I grew up on whether that's to the good or the bad.

Nobody knows what the fight was about...and like I said in my previous post it could've just as easily been a robbery...it wouldn't be the first time a rapper got robbed. Then would Proof be vindicated for shooting someone? It's relatively easy for us to debate his actions and his music, but the kids is dead. Tis a sad reality.

edit: spelling; clarity


[edit on 13-4-2006 by Saphronia]

first off, rappers are NOT musicians! they don't play an instrument and they don't sing. they string together slang words that are sometimes in key and sometimes rhyme to glorify and exploit their the terrible upbringings, neighborhood and lifestyle's! though, that does require talent, they are not musicians! poets maybe, i'll give you that.

secondly, this guy was no exception. i read the lyrics that were posted. its the gangsta/thug mentality all the way! anyway way you wanna spin it, i find it utterly disturbing that gangsta rap has gotten so popular by easily impressionable people that it has evolved into a culture!

the facts seem to be that your "role model" pistol whipped and shot and unarmed man in the face. and then in turn was shot himself by security out of self defense. the man (that shot proof) has turned himself in and will most likely will not be charged with any crime. proof definately kept it real :shk:! what an honorable way to go out!?

www.vibe.com...

im sure now someone will say he was framed or it was discrimination.
:bnghd:

[edit on 13-4-2006 by HereticHulk]

Originally posted by HereticHulk
its terrible when anyone is murdered, but you reap what you sow.

ditto.
though im not a big rap/hip-hop fan and would have no problem if theses morons blew each other away.

"oh no man he insulted your crew. what do we do now?"
"light those mother f!@#$%^ n&^%!@ up!"

thats all it is

just another person dead, i didnt see a thread about all the others who died.

yeah I'm a big hiphop fan...and I must say this is a big blow to hip hop...proof was a founding member of D12 and is partly responsible for eminem's success and his posse D12, he was undisputed king of detroit and we have lost a real hiphop artist...the violence and stupidity needs to stop and hip hop artists need to address this...gun violence is unacceptable in society and for someone to die such a tragic death over soemthing so small as an argument over a pool game is simply incomprehensible to say the least...R.I.P Proof and my condolences go out to his family, friends and fans...

and even though hip hop artists aren't role models for society and most of them are sinners...tehy are still human beings and NOBODY deserves to die...proof left behind a wife and 5 kids for god's sake...and the latest news is that the bouncer pulled a gun out first and proof defending himself, pistol whipped him, knocked him to the ground and shot him, and was then shot by another bouncer who was the victim's cousin, 3 times to the head and once in the chest, the killer has already turned himself in to police...details will emerge slowly...the bouncer was also shot in the head and is in critical condition and not expected to live...

first off, rappers are NOT musicians! they don't play an instrument and they don't sing. they string together slang words that are sometimes in key and sometimes rhyme to glorify and exploit their the terrible upbringings, neighborhood and lifestyle's! though, that does require talent, they are not musicians! poets maybe, i'll give you that.

this right here explains your whole participation in this thread. Your obvious bias against hiphop is showing even though you try to tuck it back in when you sum up. hiphop is a culture by defination it has all the elements of a culture...art, music, fashion, and dance.

Do I have to say it again....no one claims to know what the two were arguing about before the drama jumped off. The guy that turned himself in for shooting Proof is the cousin of the Bender kid that Proof shot...they are going solely on his description of the event in the article you posted....no one really knows because when the police arrived at the scene the club was empty. All the so called "witnesses" were chased down after the fact through the family of Bender. The media coverage is being dictated by the family of the guy that killed Proof. Every story has more than one side and all we are getting is one side. It prolly was a robbery because Proof din have bodyguards they thought they would just rob him no questions asked.

Yeah, another guy who thinks rap is just simply stringing words together?

Maybe you should have a record deal then. Don't like Ferraris or somethin?

Its not a race issue. Its a class issue. Another example of us killing each other rather than fighting a common enemy. The saddest part is people cannot see past their own lives. They can't be forced to understand the mentality of people who grew up knowing nothing but violence, and drugs, and death. When your life has been surrounded with so much bad, the good seems messed up. This is why people stay in the "hood." It can't be taught. Only understood. It goes way beyond music.

My only reply to Dr. Love and HerticHulk is this: Be glad you never have to live in a neighborhood where people could rush your front door with guns drawn and kill you in your living room. Be glad you can go to the club and not have to worry about robbery. Be glad people don't get shot on your block for mean stares. Be glad 13 year old kids aren't busting guns at the crowded Cereal Festival in your hometown. Be glad you live in the burbs kid. Be glad you will never understand.

lets no overlook the fact that proof pistol whipped and shot someone before he was shot by the mans friend. But for all the people who are paying tribute to someone who endorsed violence, and died the very way he would describe in his music. i can rest easy knowing the person who shot and killed proof most likely will not face charges conidering here in michigan we have a "in-defense of others" law.

Uh, did y'all read geddon's post? Probably not.

Anyway, I find it laughable that these people continue to call D-12 gangsta rappers. They are hardcore, no doubt, but not gangsta rappers. If they were, they would be more mainstream; not knocking them, though, they are pretty krunk.

Here is an example:

Bizarre - American Pyscho (I think)- "And I ain't got no food, my job, I been cheated/ My girlfriend had a miscarriage, I had to eat it."

Bizarre - Fight Music - "You know why my hands are so numb / Cuz my grandmother sucked my d#$% and I didn't c&%"

Bizarre - Under the Influence -

"I'm a compulsive liar, settin my preacher on fire
Slash your tires, flyin' down Fenkel and Meyers
Plates expired, soon as I'm hired, I'm fired
Jackin' my dick off in the bed of barb wire
(Hey, is Bizarre performing?)
Bitch, can't you read the flyer?
Special invited guest would be Richard Pryor
(Aren't you a male dancer?)
Nah bitch, I'm retired
#in' your bitch in the ass with a tire iron
I'm ripped, I'm on an acid trip
My DJ's in a coma for lettin' the record skip
Lettin' the record skip
Lettin' the record skip
(Damn!)
*DJ scratches*
I'm #in' anything when I'm snortin'
It's gonna cost 300 dollars to get my Pit Bull an abortion
Some bitch asked for my autograph
I called her a whore, spit beer in her face and laughed
I drop bombs like I was in Vietnam
All bitches is hoes, even my stinkin' ass mom"

Like Saph said, this is more bizarre rap (no pun intended) than gangsta rap. If you take someone serious who says they need to get their pit bull an abortion because of a tryst with the mutt, you might need to take another look at reality.

That said, this is a shame that Proof got killed. But, I find the "reap what you sow" people hypocritical. These same people would probably feel sorry for Kurt Cobain before Proof, because Kurt wasn't "gangsta.":shk:

And, BTW...

I have to keep from peeing on myself whenever I listen to Bizarre. This dude is frickin hilarious!

my point is, is that proofs music, be it gangsta rap or hardcore rap or whatever you consider it, IT GLORIFIES VIOLENCE for one, it also degrades women and basically incourages weak minded people to do some pretty irresponsible things! with absolutley no regard for the law or fellow humans! and he got killed for doing exactly some of the things he raps about!

that my friend is where "you reap what you sow" comes from or "you lie in the bed you make". the only thing hypocritcal about that is that you CAN'T see it and continue to support these criminals!?

BTW kurt cobain was a heroin junky who wrote some catchy tunes and ended up shooting himself. i'm not seeing the connection to pistol whipping an unarmed man and then shooting him in the face!



[edit on 18-4-2006 by HereticHulk]

[edit on 18-4-2006 by HereticHulk]

[edit on 18-4-2006 by HereticHulk]

[edit on 18-4-2006 by HereticHulk]

[edit on 18-4-2006 by HereticHulk]

Sigh.

According to armaggedon, it has now come out that he was shot by the bouncer's cousin after defending himself against the bouncer. But, you don't care, you just want to call him a criminal. Aight, your prerogative.

So, if Ahnold got killed, he would have reaped all those violent action movies he starred in? How about Jet Li? He's kicked a lot of ass in his movies. Bruce Willis? Chuck Norris? Sly Stallone?