America today is.....What kind of system?? I'm confused!!

Recently while thumbing through "archy's" "isms" & "acy's" I realized that the clearity of what America IS and WAS Supposed to be is a bit clouded.(To put it Nicely)

I put forth evidence to support why I'm confused:

Republic: a state in which the people are represented by elected agents and the head of state is an elected official.

Constitutional: a government subject to the provisions and limitations of a written and enforced constitution.

Democracy: a government with supreme power vested in the people and exercised by them (direct democracy through such things as referendums) or their elected agents (indirect democracy).

Aristocracy: a state ruled by a privileged class (determined by wealth or birth). Based on belief that the elite know better than the common person how to rule.

Bureaucracy: any form of government with power concentrated in administrative bureaus, often equated with formalism, red tape, and overorganization.

Despotism: government by a ruler who uses unlimited absolute authority to achieve his goals. (Bush certainly gave it a try IMO.)

Dictatorship: any form of government in which one person or group has absolute power without effective constitutional limitations.(Not quite but not as Unfamiliar I would like it to be!)

Fascism: a totalitarian political system with the goals of the nation more important than individual goals.(YIKES!!)

Federal Union: a country with a strong central government (i.e. federal Government) and individual provinces with limited, clearly defined powers.(If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck...It is certainly "Duckish" to some degree.)

Imperialism: the policy of extending the rule or authority of an empire or nation over foreign countries, or of acquiring and holding colonies and dependencies.(Also "Duckish" when comparing our "Conquering"...I mean "Liberation" of Iraq.)

Legislative union: a country having one central government with all the power to make laws for the entire country.(I'd say 90-10 split in favor of "Federal" over "State" but maybe someone has better numbers.)

Plutocracy: a government in which the wealthy class rules.(Quack, Quack, Quack!)

Totalitarianism: centralized government with absolute control by one political party and/or the military.(No comment for fear I will be shot or imprisoned.)

No wonder this Country is so messed up!! We fit too many catagories to know what the hell is going on. Not many directions going in the Original "Of the People, By the People, For the People" direction either?!?!?

*15,15*
WOW mo!
I guess this make the US a psuedo-Constitutional Imperialstic Republic Union, right?

I never really thought about what the US really was.
This is horrible! And we're supposed to be the free people!!!
We really need to reform the government, may be a Consitutional convention hey?
If it really starts to heat up, I'm off to Mexico, then Brazil.

- Tass *40*

[Edited on 9-10-2003 by Tassadar]

Others are finally noticing that the puzzle does not fit together,if the media were honest a lot more of the pieces would fit better.
We are in the dark,but something smells funny,I wonder what that smell is?.

In my opinion America is currently in a pre-fascist state, i.e. gearing up and putting the finishing touches to a complete fascist state. They don't have to be goose-stepping and unfurling swastikas for this to be the case.
Again, it's my opinion. So shoot me.

Interesting, there's no option for a country run by and for big business.
What would be the individualistic term for that? Perhaps we�ll have to invent one!
I�m pretty sure there is one, my brain is a little fuzzy today.
I suppose it could fall under a couple of those.

Right in the Constitution, and in the Pledge of Allegiance...

We are a Republic.

I pledge of allegiance, to the "republic"......

*15,15*
Correction Gazrok...
"I plede allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."

When the republic no longer stands, the allegiances no longer stand.
You cannot deny the existence of Imperialism, Federalism, and a supremacist aristocracy trying to transform us into a facist technocracy.

- Tass *40*

Makes for some good reading,the only reason it is still displayed is so no one notices it is no longer used as the guidelines which the US government is supposed to be working within,but isn't.
Let's try and reinstate it's power over government,then America will be a republic again.
Voting won't help,complaining won't help,the only way it can be fixed is for the little people to start addressing the injustices through the legal system.
Direct involvement by all of us is the only answer.

Originally posted by uNBaLaNCeD
Makes for some good reading,the only reason it is still displayed is so no one notices it is no longer used as the guidelines which the US government is supposed to be working within,but isn't.
Let's try and reinstate it's power over government,then America will be a republic again.
Voting won't help,complaining won't help,the only way it can be fixed is for the little people to start addressing the injustices through the legal system.
Direct involvement by all of us is the only answer.

Right!!!

Notice Gazrock, I mentioned that what America IS and what it WAS and Started out AS are not the same. The Republic would be nice!!! I do not think that is what we live in today however..

Kegs, they do have a word for it....Capitalist or Capitalism.....Although I don't know if that is an official Definition used for Government....And should not be one either......

By mOJOm
Kegs, they do have a word for it....Capitalist or Capitalism.....Although I don't know if that is an official Definition used for Government....And should not be one either......

LOL, I doubt that would be the official title for it, but with modern Capitalism I'd say it's probably fitting enough.

The system is a produced and co-created paradigm of
humanity and its achievements which exists as a by-product
of our summation as per empirically stored and cumulative
modus operandi for continuum as a species.

In essence it only exists in our minds as we have seen it to
be through interpretation and collective common goals as a
majority. The 'truths or axioms' that we decide are relevant
or profitable (I'm sure it was once pursuit of understanding
and awareness that began it as motivator) and are in and of
themselves apparent universals, consolidate their factual as
ascribed-absolution.

Nature has a funny system of its own yet its perfection and
dynamic complexity: balance of chaos and order indivisible. It
in its own regard is far superior as by design and execution of
design than anything humana has done in its 'artificial dominion'
of comfort over condition.

It may be that once we began to understand self-preservation by larger numbers and cooperation through communication that self-awareness led us to more intricate interpersonal communication and existence. While we have spent aeons trying to once and for all asnswer why we are here, we have lost
sight of that goal. Profit, self-indugent hedonism and pleasure
at any cost have twisted the aim of the whole which creates the
individual-you are a product of a system yes. So, I personally
write in regards to the 'System,' as the illusion of control by
illusion of existence. Popular opinion or majority rules as far as
that goes. You may say no, the gov't sucks, we don't have a
say....etc. But consider this:

Until people actually know themselves as existential beings
that are guided by causality as subjects to its domain, people
will still allow others to shape, control, decide, persuede and
dictate their own state of being whether you let an oaf at some
party haunt your angry place for a week as you allow energy and
effort to it while trying to understand that which itself does not.
Anyone who acts in any way that they themselves do not approve
or appreciate unto themselves-deserve whatever they get. It
is only the righteous being that can by rights choose to dictate
this from that. It is for the average person by and large all of us
as far from perfect to ignore the fear and pressure by others to
shape us when they are no testament to absolution or perfection.

There is only you in your mind. Everyone else is you as you would
be in exchange of place by perception. The only truths are those
that apply to you. The only requirement to existence as far as I
and others I know, to being, is to have a good time and don't hurt
anybody. To start theological protest or argue this point is to offer that God doesn't want us to behave and enjoy being. Wanna be
a contestant? I don't know much, but I don't think anyone who
worries about satellite factors of our world and bares the world
in fear and subjegation or duress ought to ignore the rules as
ordained by human standards or need to wound-share, and get
on with being who they want. This does not lead to decay but
to salvation. To create my life by my hand while not allowing any other to impede my growth by allowing my own negative reactions
to them overshadow my need for equality or my need to maintain
mastery of self, is my lifeplan. Why cannot another see it? If I
know I am not offering these words to improve myself in the eyes
of others as prideful or arrogant assertions, then why will some
undoubtedly not read all of this before making inevitable excuses
for their own KNOWN behavioral truths to one who chooses awareness as seeing another's actions as an invitation to see
a part of them in their logic while not losing them in blindness to
my own emotional reaction or desire to react as is compulsive and
obvious of the human condition by and large?

There is what you believe there to be. There is only that which
you believe to affect you that you operate as such. There is only
a system, government, hierarchy, class, war, economic stability,
and the like if you allow these non-realities or imagined rules to
apply. They are conceptual, not actual. The gov't is not one mind
of single concious control and initiative. Ironically, it is generally
the individuals who are capable by design (good, law-abiding,
common sense and just decent people), who suffer unto the system most by allowing its assured reality the most by civil understanding.

The naive are the victims in a world now based on survival of the
smartest not the fittest now. I don't care if I digress, I just offer
what I was inspired to write as one who knows where they stand
and likes it. I am and so, I apply the golden rule, avoid sins and
appreciate every moment I get to be, in existence. I am of the
school of thought that sees ideological precepts, dogmas and
other institutions of complex design models as merely philosophical formulas to give reason and motive for justification
by those that be in power so they can keep their power.

Most of us probably agree that (I assess that people who go to
debate or intellectually motivated websites are not the feral underbelly of society's evils) we don't need anyone watching over
us the general public. If people act as they like to be treated, there usually isn't a negative occurance. Food for thought, I
suppose.

Lucifer, I agree.

The system is an Illusion and can vanish along with those who weild it's Power just as soon as people wake up and decide to turn their back and deny it's existence. However there is around us a country full of blind, ignorant and cowardly people who forgot it was their Duty to stand up for Humanity. Instead they hide behind excuses and support the One's who keep them as slaves. People like you and I will be vaporized or locked up long before those people finally wake up as sad as that sounds. That does not change my opinion as to what side I stand for though. I do not need a Governing Body telling me what is right and wrong or how to be kind to the rest of Humanity or how to live in support with my fellow man. But unfortunatly there are still many people out there who see themselves as too unstable to figure things out on their own. Oh well....I hope for their sake they learn someday.

Your post actually should have been a topic all it's own though IMO because there are Philosophical Ideas represented here that My original Topic never intended. I appreciate the insightful post though!!!

...a fascist state & an oligarchy.

What we were on paper is not what we are in practice.

Originally posted by Bout Time
...a fascist state & an oligarchy.

What we were on paper is not what we are in practice.

Oligarchy.....Nice one!! Done some of your own research I see. I didn't include Oligarchy although I saw some ideals there as well. Good Job Bout Time!!

Oligarchy: a government in which a few people such as a dominant clan or clique have power.(Bush, Ashcroft, Blair, Rumsfield...Just a few off the top of my head.)

...that which remains even after you cease to believe in it.
The constitution was written to prevent governments from taking on a life of their own when they truly do not exist,a government is a legal fiction and has no substance and no rights,men have rights,fictions do not.
Fictions?,OK,WTF happened here then?.
So what is reality?.

Dont forget Technocracy, which the ruling system is people with technology using it to catalougue, control, and monitor the masses. Computers, securioty cameras, databases, Satlities, ect. Banking, govornment, law enforcement, all heavy handed with the technology, ithe privacy invasion, while the technocrats are rich and free and use thier toys to control us.

I dont think America is Fascist. we are:

Buerocratic Technocratic Legislative Union Aristiocracy.

And you forgot Monarchy in there as well. We not only have presidents who descend from and are related to European nobility, but look at the "Royal families:" of the US govornment: kennedys, Bush clan, Roosevendts, ect.

Originally posted by Skadi_the_Evil_Elf
Dont forget Technocracy, which the ruling system is people with technology using it to catalougue, control, and monitor the masses. Computers, securioty cameras, databases, Satlities, ect. Banking, govornment, law enforcement, all heavy handed with the technology, ithe privacy invasion, while the technocrats are rich and free and use thier toys to control us.

I dont think America is Fascist. we are:

Buerocratic Technocratic Legislative Union Aristiocracy.

And you forgot Monarchy in there as well. We not only have presidents who descend from and are related to European nobility, but look at the "Royal families:" of the US govornment: kennedys, Bush clan, Roosevendts, ect.

Technocracy...That's a new one...I'll have to update my list. Thank you!! Is that an Official Term BTW???

I didn't forget Monarchy. I left out a few that I felt were already redundant within others or on the fringe. But you may be right. In fact I did contemplate that one for a bit.

Technocracy is a relatively new term, because the emergence of technology is relatively new.

Fredrick Taylor was pretty much the start of the movement in the early 20th century, according to Encylopedia Britannica.

The offical definition is rule by technicians and experts in the scientific realms, a society that is ruled by science, technology, eggheads, ect. Theres alot more to it than that.

An example of Technocracy at its rising and birth would be in Europe. Technocracy and Buerocracy go hand in hand. Punch it in any search engine and youll get a million sites explaining in depth and further technocracy and all its aspects. I would post them, but my computer is too slow for search engines.

Anyway, yes its offical, tho it hasnt been offically implimented, you might say that yes, technocracy is alive and well in the US. The use of technology and experts as almost a ruling force in anything from medicine to biochemistry and such is evident. The most ecident is of course, the use of computers and electronic surveilance and privacy killers to invade our daily lives.

And also, add Theocracy to your list. Theocracy, technically, is the rule of a state by a church or religion. While we have no state church, we are heavily ruled by right wing christian nuts who try imposing thier religious ideals as a guiding force for thier law making, and such, so while we arent theocratic in offical terms, we do have that aspect of religoius superstition ruling and corrupting the system.