Students reject honor to 'Baa Baa Black Sheep' hero

Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
Wait. Are you serious? The idiot inferred that an actor is great and nobel and that one who defends one's nation from attack is a murderer?

I have GOT to get a passport. It seems the academic infiltration by the Soviets many decades ago has just about destroyed out nation, as planned.

Soviets?

Pappy Boyington was a hero and should indeed be recognized as such. Winning the Medal of Honor and Navy Cross clearly shows the courage and ability of this man. Yes, he was a heavy drinker and fighter and made mistakes but how does that over shadow his contribution to our freedom? U of W's action doesn't surprise me as much as bitterly disappoint me it just shows that many not all but many young people don't honor and respect people who are willing to lose all to defend freedom and our way of life.

The minutes of the meeting relevant to the proposal

senate.asuw.org...
Andrew Everett, sponsor of the legislation, summarized the resolution.
He said he wasn’t interested in a large statue, but rather something on a
small scale.
Jill Edwards moved to table the resolution until next meeting. Seconded.
Objection.
Jill Edwards said other legislation needed to be considered as other
resolutions have been on the docket longer.
Mikhail Smirnoff said he didn’t see the issue as controversial and that
because Senate had voted it to the top of the agenda it should be
considered immediately.
The motion failed.
Travis McCoy asked how the construction of the memorial would be
funded.
Andrew Everett said he had drawn up funding proposals for the UWAA,
several UW departments, and other private sources of funding.
Jono Hanks asked why Andrew Everett was interested in honoring this
particular alumnus.
Andrew Everett said he had read about Colonel Boyington and thought
his achievements warranted recognition.
Tyler Dockins asked why the monument shouldn’t commemorate all the
alumni who fought in the war.
Andrew Everett noted that several statues around campus already serve
such a purpose and that Colonel Boyington had many of the qualities the
University of Washington hoped to produce in its students.
Jill Edwards questioned whether it was appropriate to honor a person
who killed other people.
She said she didn’t’ believe a member of the Marine Corps was an
example of the sort of person UW wanted to produce.
Ashley Miller commented that many monuments at UW already
commemorate rich white men.
Karl Smith amended the first ‘whereas’ clause to strike the section “he
was credited with destroying 26 enemy aircraft, tying the record for most
aircraft destroyed by a pilot in American Uniform for which he was” and
leaving the reference to the Navy Cross. Seconded. Objection.
He said the resolution should commend Colonel Boyington’s service, not
his killing of others.
Andrew Everett said a destroyed aircraft was not necessarily indicative
that a pilot had died. He said the statistic on aircraft downed explained
Colonel Boyington’s achievements and why his performance was
noteworthy.
Deidre Lockman said she was in favor of the resolution and approved of
Karl Smith’s amendment.
Sam Al-Khoury moved to close debate on the amendment. Seconded.
Passed without objection.
The amendment passed.
Erin Shields asked what the process is for erecting a memorial on
campus.
Andrew Everett said it was a process he would push through personally.
He said it would go to the university administration, then to the Capital
Projects Committee for placement consideration, and back to the
administration for a final discussion on the monument.
Niki Iglesias moved to close debate. Seconded. Objection.
The motion failed.
Shawn Fisher moved to amend the second ‘that’ clause and strike the
deadline of 11 January 2008.
He said he was against the resolution, but that if it did pass, he wanted the
statue to be of a high quality and said the project shouldn’t be rushed.
Mikhail Smirnoff noted the resolution didn’t require the statue to be
finished, but merely have the process started by that time.
Melissa Aar said she was against the amendment because of the
significance of the date.
Shawn Fisher moved to close debate. Seconded. Passed without
objection.
Debate was closed. The amendment failed.
A Senator said he feared Senate was rubber stamping a project that it
didn’t know enough about. He noted that Senate didn’t have any
specification for the statue’s appearance or details on its placement.
Jon Lee said he didn’t want to see a campus inundated with memorials.
He said he feared this would open the invitation to multiple other
memorials.
Andrew Everett said he envisioned a monument similar to the Lincoln
Brigade outside of the HUB. He said he respected the history of the UW
institution and the people it has produced and that the UW owes it to
students to honors those from the past.
Deidre Lockman moved to strike the quote from President Roosevelt.
Seconded. Objection.
She said the resolution focused more heavily on the negative aspects of
war and should instead focus on more positive aspects such as the
awarding of the Medal of Honor.
Travis Grandy moved to amend the amendment to restore “whose
citation was signed by pres. Franklin D Roosevelt in March 1944”.
Seconded. Passed without objection.
Shawn Fisher said he thought the quote was unnecessary and reflected
badly on the resolution.
Alex Kerchner said the issue was clear cut and that it didn’t make any
sense to commend Colonel Boyington for his Medal of Honor, and yet
remove the reason it was awarded.
Mikhail Smirnoff said it was important to note what the Colonel actually
achieved. He said it didn’t make sense to not acknowledge why he was
awarded the Medal of Honor.
Jon Evans moved to close debate on the amendment. Seconded.
Objection.
The motion passed. Debate was closed on the amendment.
The amendment failed.
Mikhail Smirnoff said he supported the resolution. He said the resolution
does not support a final product, but that it only supports the concept of
the monument. He said he understood the sentiment of not wanting to
reward those who fought in the war, but that he thought those who fought
in WWII were heros and that it was a much different war than the
controversial war in Iraq.
Evan Roberts moved to close debate. Seconded. Objection.
The motion failed.
Division was called. The motion passed.
Debate was closed on the resolution.
Division was called on the resolution. The vote was tied 45-45-10
Alex Kim noted that in the case of a tie, the Senate Chair cast the tiebreaking
vote.
Alex Kim voted nay. The resolution failed.
Zachary Tobin called for a roll call vote.
Alex Kim called the motion out of order as the results of the vote had
already been announced.

Must've been a slow news day at world nut daily.

[edit on 17-2-2006 by Nygdan]

Jill Edwards questioned whether it was appropriate to honor a person
who killed other people. She said she didn’t’ believe a member of the Marine Corps was an example of the sort of person UW wanted to produce.

Ashley Miller commented that many monuments at UW already
commemorate rich white men.

senate.asuw.org

Can you say, bimbo? Probably women's studies majors.


[edit on 2006/2/17 by GradyPhilpott]

Jill Edwards questioned whether it was appropriate to honor a person who killed other people. She said she didn’t’ believe a member of the Marine Corps was an example of the sort of person UW wanted to produce.
senate.asuw.org

She should have atleast thought of a better excuse and she should take a look how many Fortune 500 and big company CEOs, VPs, and head honchos are former Marines.

But I guess that's not the kind of people that UW wants to produce
and the fact that they're rich and probably white disqualifies them.....

Well, there's goes Captian Kangaroo's chances of getting a monument at UW.

The links below provide interesting lists of former Marines.

www.stevenshiles.com...

en.wikipedia.org...

www.usmchangout.com...

www.corpsstories.com...

My dad is on the list of Marines famous to Marines, but unknown to others for good reason.

He flew with John Glenn in VMF-311 in Korea, and was pissed when John got the slot to fly Sabre Jets with the Air Force. My oldest brother's middle name was Glenn, and our families are related by marriage.

He flew with VMF-214, and was top gun before there even was a top gun, with a 30ft from bullseye bombing average back before all the fancy guidance systems (some of which he helped design) came online. I have his footlocker from when he was a 2nd Lt. with VMF-214. It sits at the foot of my bed.

He was a test pilot at Pax River and at Edwards before moving to support roles. I have a picture of the YF-12 in flight over Edwards (or Groom?) that is signed by Don Mallick, Fitz Fulton, Ray Young, and Vic Horton. The inscription reads "Bob, Thank you for outstanding support on our test program." It is one of my prized possessions.

He knew Chuck Yeager, Bruce Peterson, all the guys I can't even name right now. He was bigger than life as a Bird Colonel to a little kid all starry-eyed about the access to Edwards and El Toro and Miramar. He taught me everything I know about how to be a man and stand up for myself and not take crap from anyone.

His last assignment was software manager of the team that programmed the microprocessor for the flight control system on the B-2. I have the watch they gave him when he retired. Its a gold Criterion with a B-2 on the face. He died in March of 2000. I miss him.

He told me "Don't believe anything you hear, and only half of what you see." He was sure right about that.

[edit on 17-2-2006 by Icarus Rising]