9/11: A Boeing 757 *DID NOT* Strike the Pentagon

Originally posted by Jack Tripper
So now you have come full circle and understand what purpose an ATG missle would have served. Congratulations!

p.s. The hole was too small to be damage consistent of a 757. Although the fuselage is 13 feet the engines hang at least an additional 5 feet below the fuselage meaning if the impact point would have had to have been higher. Plus you are failing to account for the wings and the tail of the craft.

I’m sorry, but I’m confused. What are you claiming, that the hole was too big to have been caused by a 757. That the Kevlar would have prevented any hole from being made at all,


OR,


That it was too small, that the wings should have made a big hole also in spite of the concrete and Kevlar reinforcing?

Originally posted by HowardRoark

Originally posted by Jack Tripper
So now you have come full circle and understand what purpose an ATG missle would have served. Congratulations!

p.s. The hole was too small to be damage consistent of a 757. Although the fuselage is 13 feet the engines hang at least an additional 5 feet below the fuselage meaning if the impact point would have had to have been higher. Plus you are failing to account for the wings and the tail of the craft.

I’m sorry, but I’m confused. What are you claiming, that the hole was too big to have been caused by a 757. That the Kevlar would have prevented any hole from being made at all,


OR,


That it was too small, that the wings should have made a big hole also in spite of the concrete and Kevlar reinforcing?

If it was a 757 the impact hole would have been much larger and yes there would be more visible damage from the wings, tail, and engines.

I don't believe the kevlar reinforcing would stop virtually any craft traveling at top speed but I believe that perhaps an ATG missle or certainly additional explosives were necessary to increase damage, destroy the evidence of the smaller craft used, and make sure that whatever debris is left enters into the building.

Originally posted by HowardRoark
I’m sorry, but I’m confused. What are you claiming, that the hole was too big to have been caused by a 757. That the Kevlar would have prevented any hole from being made at all,

OR,

That it was too small, that the wings should have made a big hole also in spite of the concrete and Kevlar reinforcing?

Just because the theories are mutually exclusive doesn't stop the "truth movement" from claiming both of them are true. They are not necessarily at home to Mr Logic.

Originally posted by FatherLukeDuke

Just because the theories are mutually exclusive doesn't stop the "truth movement" from claiming both of them are true. They are not necessarily at home to Mr Logic.


Did you not read my response above?

What is illogical about my response?

Is it standard procedure in this forum for people to attack and ridicule?

I am not feeling like you guys are welcoming me as a new member very graciously since you insist on taking a sarcastic and patronizing tone.

I must admit this seems quite odd coming from people in a "conspiracy" site.

Originally posted by HowardRoark

He can start by apologizing for mangling my screen name.

Oh dear I miss-spelled your name howwerd, big deal, if you have ever noticed I never spell your name right, why are you all of a sudden getting upset now? At least mine was a miss-spell and means nothing other than lack of respect for you, which you have earned.
You deliberately mis-spelled my name in a way to be rude and confrontational.
I ask for no apology as I will not apologise to you.

Anyway I guess I hit a nerve hey? Your attempts to convince people of the official story is getting so weak it's laughable.
You have now successfully shown us your fear and desperation to have ppl believe the official story.
What's up? Your supervisor not happy with your progress on this mission?

BTW thanx Jack!

[edit on 7/2/2006 by ANOK]

I'm reading all this talk about "The hole is too small". Now honestly, do we really know what the hole would look like? I mean, can any of you honestly go about saying that?

How would any of you know whether or not the whole was too small or too big? Have ANY of YOU crashed a 757 into a building the size and shape of the pentagon? Has any of you ever ran simlulations that account for the all the factors involved I.E. Windspeed, speed of craft, mass of craft, volume of fuel on board, velocity and angle of the craft. All these factors would account for the end result being what it was. It's not like each time a 757 crashes into the Pentagon it's going to do predictable damage.

I'm amazed at the theories and conspiracies that sprout from such topics. On 9/11, several thousand innocent American Citizens died because of an act of terrorism, and all the American Public itself can do is blame the government for it? Sure it's easy, but in essence we're all to blame then.

A government in society exists for one purpose and one purpose only, to govern the people and protect a person's natural rights, now granted it hasn't always been done right the first couple of times in the past, but now I think we're getting there. Needless to say, yes, there is still some bumps and obstacles to overcome, but we should only want to progress, not regress.

Seriously, this is why I have trouble digesting the information put forward to me when a conspirator goes out and says the government is at fault, the government is in place to protect you and here you are trying to get rid of it. Of course when I say "you" I'm not attacking any single one person here on the boards.

Albeit that's my .02 cents on the subject, but this is America, and we are allowed to say what we want and to have the opinions that we want and openly and freely express them, which is why I, as a Republican, love this country, because in the constitution it says I have the right to do so.

Shattered OUT...

Originally posted by ShatteredSkies

A government in society exists for one purpose and one purpose only, to govern the people and protect a person's natural rights.

If you really believe that then you are reading the wrong history books.
Governments are here to protect the rights and property of the previleged classes.
Where does it protect our natural rights? I garantee you I can come up with far more instances where our natural rights are violated not pretected.

And what are the government precting us from? Enemies that they created

Is this what most ppl in America think? If so I can see how the gov can get away with lieing to it's population so easily

And for the hole being too small, well the argument can go both ways. How do you know it's big enough? But from what you said above it's obvious you put far more trust in your government than is healthy for any society.
But the hole is not the whole story now is it?
So the hole was the right size? OK, what about the rest of the damage, or lack of, from the engines particularly. Cause if the A/C nose made that hole then the engines, which are heavier and stronger, would also have made at least visible damage.
Also think about the holes position, right on the ground. How did the A/C manage to do that without dragging the engine cowlings on the front lawn?

So the hole is not whole strory is it?

[edit on 7/2/2006 by ANOK]

Sadly, I'm not even full American, I get these ideas from the philosophers of European society of long past, during the Enlightenment Age.

Shattered OUT...

Originally posted by ANOK

Originally posted by HowardRoark

He can start by apologizing for mangling my screen name.

Oh dear I miss-spelled your name howwerd, big deal, if you have ever noticed I never spell your name right, why are you all of a sudden getting upset now? At least mine was a miss-spell and means nothing other than lack of respect for you, which you have earned.
You deliberately mis-spelled my name in a way to be rude and confrontational.
I ask for no apology as I will not apologise to you.

Anyway I guess I hit a nerve hey? Your attempts to convince people of the official story is getting so weak it's laughable.
You have now successfully shown us your fear and desperation to have ppl believe the official story.
What's up? Your supervisor not happy with your progress on this mission?

BTW thanx Jack!

[edit on 7/2/2006 by ANOK]

B.S. You deliberately misspelled my name and I quite rightly took offense. Your current posturing is nothing more than thinly veiled flame bait.

Rather than address the fact that your arguments have been debunked and refuted, you’ve chosen to launch an ad hominem attack.

Unfortunately for you, most people can see that tactic for the losing gambit that it is.

Originally posted by HowardRoark
Unfortunately for you, most people can see that tactic for the losing gambit that it is.

Get lost howweird, you're the first to start the ad hominem attacks.
You couldn't refute my statement so you picked on a typo to devert from your inability to prove me wrong. And as far as being de-bunked, I think unfortuneatly for you, most people can see that is far from the truth.
Maybe you should start looking for an alternative line of employment.

[edit on 8/2/2006 by ANOK]

I can see that it's de-bunked, I'm sure alot of people would agree so too, I mean, can you or I really speak for the masses?(Remember, I didn't say MOST I said ALOT).

Howard is right, you're attacking him when you can't seem to provide proof towards your arguments.

Shattered OUT...

Originally posted by ANOK
So the hole was the right size? OK, what about the rest of the damage, or lack of, from the engines particularly. Cause if the A/C nose made that hole then the engines, which are heavier and stronger, would also have made at least visible damage.
Also think about the holes position, right on the ground. How did the A/C manage to do that without dragging the engine cowlings on the front lawn
[edit on 7/2/2006 by ANOK]

Why don't you look at CatHerder's post where he goes over this in forensic detail? People can't be expected to go over this stuff endlessly when the evidence and analysis is but a few clicks away.

You would disagree with the governments position whatever it is they said. I can imagine if they had claimed a missile hit the penatagon you would be saying "Ha! These guys are lying...look at all the debris from a plane on the lawn and that hole isn't consistant with a missile etc etc..." However you would actually be right in that instance.

[edit on 9/2/06 by FatherLukeDuke]

Originally posted by Jack Tripper
I am not feeling like you guys are welcoming me as a new member very graciously since you insist on taking a sarcastic and patronizing tone.

You read like someone who was here before... like an "early" poster in this thread. huh

You were away for a while, did you happen to catch this piece of tastey goodness?
The No-757 Theory Is Actually Coordinated Disinformation!
It's from your own "9/11 Truth Movement" people.

Originally posted by Grimm

Originally posted by Jack Tripper
I am not feeling like you guys are welcoming me as a new member very graciously since you insist on taking a sarcastic and patronizing tone.

You read like someone who was here before... like an "early" poster in this thread. huh

Oh no, that is Lyte Trizzle - one has to ask oneself why someone with such a strong argument who feels they stand the moral highground finds they need to use such disgusting tactics.

Prepare to hear some poor little Lyte story about how he was persecuted...

*Cue Violins*

So we're over and done with right? Terrorists really did crash a 757 into the Pentagon?

Shattered OUT...

Originally posted by ShatteredSkies
So we're over and done with right? Terrorists really did crash a 757 into the Pentagon?

Shattered OUT...

hahahahahaha.


ummm...............nope.

Not even close. Did you even read the article in the first post of this thread?

Originally posted by FatherLukeDuke

Why don't you look at CatHerder's post where he goes over this in forensic detail? People can't be expected to go over this stuff endlessly when the evidence and analysis is but a few clicks away.

Did you read the article in the original post in this thread?

Catherder's so called "forensic" analysis has been ripped to shreds and shown to be completely deceptive and false.

So yes....this MUST be gone over endlessly until the real criminals are exposed.

If you haven't realized it......this very event in which massive amount of evidence has been withheld, covered-up, and destroyed............is the pretext for a PERMANENT GLOBAL WAR that has already caused the deaths of many 10's of thousands of innocent people.

If you are fine just accepting what you are told despite all the glaring anomolies, contradictions, and questions while people are consistently dying EVERY DAY as a result......then you have nothing more to contribute to this debate and should just go turn your boob tube back on.

Originally posted by Grimm

Originally posted by Jack Tripper
I am not feeling like you guys are welcoming me as a new member very graciously since you insist on taking a sarcastic and patronizing tone.

You read like someone who was here before... like an "early" poster in this thread. huh

You were away for a while, did you happen to catch this piece of tastey goodness?
The No-757 Theory Is Actually Coordinated Disinformation!
It's from your own "9/11 Truth Movement" people.

Yes I saw that.

And the fact that you actually think it is significant is borderline hilarious.

Of course people within the truth movement will disagree on how the operation was carried out.

Why is that disinformation?

I will copy what I said in the other thread about this when you posted it while dancing around like a little girl who was just asked out for a soda by the boy she has a crush on.



Excuse me sir but how are people that may subscribe to different opinions in the truth movement all of the sudden "disinfo agents"?

That seems rather ridiculous.

No matter what different people in the truth movement think about how it was carried out the common thread is that we all know that the official story is a lie.

You really need to explain to me what your problem is with people coming up with different hypotheses.

YOU are the one trying to create a "divide" by making it look like ANYBODY in the truth movement are the bad guys here. Why would you do that?

None of us really care about any specific theory if the official story is exposed as a lie.

Originally posted by Jack Tripper
Did you read the article in the original post in this thread?

Did you read this material from the 9/11 Truth Movement?
The No-757 Theory Is Actually Coordinated Disinformation!

Originally posted by Jack Tripper
Catherder's so called "forensic" analysis has been ripped to shreds and shown to be completely deceptive and false.

It was ripped to shreds by outed disinformationists with an agenda to spread completely deceptive and false information about conspiracy theory research.

Originally posted by Jack Tripper
If you are fine just accepting what you are told despite all the glaring anomolies, contradictions, and questions while people are consistently dying EVERY DAY as a result......then you have nothing more to contribute to this debate and should just go turn your boob tube back on.

It is now clear, that your own "9/11 Truth Movement" classifies your "glaring anomolies", "contradictions", and "questions" as a coordinated disinformation campaign to discredit and confuse conspiracy theorists. If you are fine with being a part of this deceptive and disruptive effort to obfuscate the truth, then you have no possible way to contribute to any debate that values the truth and you should go back to your handlers and report that "there are no boobs at ATS."

Originally posted by AgentSmith

*Cue Violins*

And you don't stop.....and you don't quit.

Sarcasm.....


The communication method of choice by the pseudoskeptic army at ATS.

What a great way to "rise above" the other discussion forums.