lucid dreaming, subliminal mesages, mind control?

Anyone really interested in some brain food pertaining to lucid dreaming should check out the movie Waking Life.

Its a great movie combining philosphy, dream studies, and really, really cool art direction. Check it out.

DaFunk-you're the the second person to reccomend that-I've really got to check into it.

Clarky-See I don't know...that doesn't seem to be something that would work for me, but I'm interested on how it works out for you!

I know when I am OOBE, as it's reality for me and I see all that is going on in my physical world, so I wouldn't need a card or something-unless someone else I know wanted to know for sure-like proof or something.

I just want a way to find out if I am OOBE when having a lucid dream...like maybe we are always OOB when dreaming, so when I become lucid in my dream...can I then somehow find out if I am OOB-you know? Not even sure how it could be done though...

as far as placing a card somehwere in my room...well hell, if I could make it to my room/house physical world instead of dreamscape when lucid then I'd immediately know I was OOB!

I know people who have had lucid dreams about being in their homes etc...but I've had both REAL conscious OOBE in my home AND lucid dreams, so I know when one is a dream and when I am just actually OOB...

I'm just trying to find doors...and ways to know if we are all OOB when we dream...but just ending up in different places...counsciously AWAKE in the physical realm, or lucidly awake in the dream realm...or in other realms/dimensions, astral planes...

In my experience i would say this.(for now)

When it comes to life you can look at it in this way there are two realms that we exsist in.Now those two realms consist of different parts but the two main ones that I am talking about is.Physical/conciousness what is deemed as being real,adn the ehteral/subconcious what is deemed as being not real.

The more you hold to this physical real thing the harder it is for your mind
to expand and travel/leave the body sos to speak.
Scarecrow

Originally posted by toraylin
When it comes to life you can look at it in this way there are two realms that we exsist in.Now those two realms consist of different parts but the two main ones that I am talking about is.Physical/conciousness what is deemed as being real,adn the ehteral/subconcious what is deemed as being not real.

The more you hold to this physical real thing the harder it is for your mind
to expand and travel/leave the body sos to speak.
Scarecrow

See thats just it, I think of physical as real, and when I am OOB in the otherwise (besides me) physical world I know, that too is my familiar reality...

when I dream...it is reality..but in a different realm-and usually without consequence

So I don't think of the physical realm I live in as exlusive reality, I do accept dreaming-as an alternate reality-especially lucid dreams...so I do not have that stumbling block per se, but I can not tell if I am OOB when lusicdly dreaming, and thus if I am free to leave the dreamscape or not...and how to find the door...

someone show me the door!

think2much,
thanks for the compliment in pointing out the peer pressure that effected your dream state.
You mentioned

"Regressed yourself? You mean like hypnotically, or just run of the mill second adolescence? "

I answered that question in depth on my 'healing energy' post under the subpost name
1. THE EMOTIONAL FEELING SEQUENCE (EFS) TRAINING

in short don't ever try it, you may end up eating baby food in the booby hatch, self-hypnosis to the day of your birth is not a good idea.

'

Honor Seed

Originally posted by HS
I answered that question in depth on my 'healing energy' post under the subpost name
1. THE EMOTIONAL FEELING SEQUENCE (EFS) TRAINING

in short don't ever try it, you may end up eating baby food in the booby hatch, self-hypnosis to the day of your birth is not a good idea.

Well, maybe I wont go back THAT far

as it is I've been experiencing a second adolescence WAY too early in life!

But I will check out that other thread and your post-thanks!

[edit on 26-1-2006 by think2much]

It is hard to go backwards when we go forwards too much
as time passes the clock goes tick tock.

Remember the time you scraped you knee or wanted to climb the really tall tree.Look in yourself not within me.For it is you my friend who holds this key!

Scarecrow

[edit on 26-1-2006 by toraylin]

Originally posted by toraylin
It is hard to go backwards when we go forwards too much
as time passes the clock goes tick tock.

Remember the time you scraped you knee or wanted to climb the really tall tree.Look in yourself not within me.For it is you my friend who holds this key!

Scarecrow

[edit on 26-1-2006 by toraylin]

*sigh*

I really like that last line....actually last 2 lines got me

Thanks

[edit on 26-1-2006 by think2much]

I am not so much into the lucid dreaming because I have only ever been able to think about the outcome with one dream, ever. That is because I had it so many times, I think it was branded into my mind as far as what needed to be done in what time.

However, my boyfriend is really into his dreams. We will be lying in bed and a minute later, usually sooner, his foot will twitch or his body will twitch real bad. I laugh cause it is funny, asking him what he had just done. Usually he kicks someone or something. But his body moves with the dreams moments in.

Once he is actually dreaming he knows he is dreaming and that anything that happens is not real. That it won't effect the real world. He makes consious decisions in his dreams. It is not with just one or two dreams every once and a while, it is every dream he has.

He cannot change a dream he is having, as in, change the scenario of the dream. he can just make actions in a dream he is having.

He is highly interested in sleep studies because he wants to know all about the state of mind before you get into the deep sleep. Why I can have a conversation with him in the first few minutes of his sleep. And, why he kicks without knowing it.

Talking about subliminal messages I would like to tallk a bit about fate and lucid dreaming for a second.

These thoughts are based on my personal study results thus far.

Fate is joined to the theory of life being somewhat scripted.While some would describe fate or destiny as great threads of time and exsistence within the etheral realms.Others would say that we could simply be part of a story on a page in a great book.in the halls of the gods....whatever.

We being alive are carying out what has been laid before us.This person meeting that person.Your friend dying.Every single event and instance effects the whole so to speak.

Which brings me to the bubble web theory.As we are growing within our exsistence we go through many different experiences conversations and so on.We play a role in anothers or many others journeys through life.

All of these events are stored within our minds.Now supposedly all of us are shown the keys to unlock the doors to understanding by the universe through these events.Everything from a memory of being pushed down by a bully,to the greatest day of your life is supposed to be little bumps on the edge of your key to understanding who you really are.

Many people are too overloaded with the way others already think to pay attention to who(destiny) they are and want to be.

I can say more but I am very busy....

Scarecrow.

Originally posted by toraylin
Many people are too overloaded with the way others already think to pay attention to who(destiny) they are and want to be.

I can say more but I am very busy....

Well, please know I appreciate you saying what you did. Truly.

I believe we are born with some of the the keys we need, the knowledge needed, to understand who we are and what we are really here for-individually and as a whole.

I think it is our responsibility and destiny to seek these truths.

I also think, that though we are born with many keys, have knowledge, much of it is hidden...within ourselves, and we have to seek the keys to unlock the doors to understanding

I wonder sometimes if these keys and/ or doors are in our dreams, or reached through our dreams etc...and if you have to hold the key of understanding before you can walk through the door to obtain the knowledge beyond it...you know?

Maybe it's not always the point of finding the door that is always there in otherwords, maybe it's finding the key...

I don't know...I know we are born with much truth within us, and need to find ways of unlocking it, remembering it, understanding it

Inanna

I don't know what to say about your boyfriend's experiences, but I would say he should really practice thinking about what he might want to accomplish in his dreams, as far as possibly changing the theme etc...and then fall asleep with that intention.

I'm just saying he should really concentrate on doing something new in his dreams and trying to see where it can take him.

I know of a lot of people who "fall" or feel like they are falling, or trip over something or kick something/someone in their dreams and legs/their bodies jerk and they awake immediately, just shortly after falling asleep. Some people do the jerk/wake without dreaming, or recalling their dreams too.

Lucid dreaming is one of the most pleasurable, healthy experiences one can have. Back about a decade, I was undergoing cancer treatment, and was having serious discomfort and trouble sleeping. A doctor who was treating me suggested that I try one of the "Light & Sound" machines on the market. These are gizmos that have headphones and a set of goggles that play patterns of sound and lights. The theory behind these devices is "entrainment" which means that when the brain perceives certain patterns of light and/or sound, it will synchronize with those patterns, creating certain brain states. So, if you are listening to something that has a rythmic pattern at 7 hertz (cycles per second), your brain will soon start producing electromechanical activity at 7 hertz. This frequency is in the band known as "Alpha" and is associated with a certain type of brain activity. There is also Theta, Delta and Beta frequencies and each of these is associated with certain types of mental states.
After using a Light and Sound machine for a while, often just before going to sleep, I started experiencing the most lucid dreams. They were just like "ordinary" dreams (if any dreams can be considered "ordinary") except they were much more vivid and I was aware that I was dreaming. Sometimes, I could interact with my dream state in different ways. For example, if my dream turned frightening, say because a monster was chasing me, I could simply decide to fly away and that's exactly what would happen.

I noticed that I would wake from these dreams with the most amazing feeling of joy and empowerment. This feeling would last throughout the entire day, and I found myself really looking forward to these "lucid" dreams. I researched certain Light and Sound programs that would enhance lucid dreaming and I eventually got quite good at it.

I'm not saying that the dreams had anything to do with it, but the cancer treatment was successful. I got better and indeed my health improved to a point that I felt better than I had ever felt before. My sleep was more refreshing, I had energy throughout the day, and I had a lasting feeling of well-being and strength.

I can't speak to the issues of mind control except to the extent that I believe lucid dreaming is the exact opposite of external control of one's mind. I encourage anyone who is interested to do a little research and try playing with the idea of becoming self-aware in one's dreams. It's tricky at first, but once you get the hang of it, you get better quickly. I hope those of you who decide to give it a try have the same positive experience that I have.

Here is a link to my research project on subliminal messages. I've done alot of reading regarding subliminal messages, and strongly believe that they exist, and are constantly used to persuade your thoughts and opinions.

Originally posted by vuoto
I can't speak to the issues of mind control except to the extent that I believe lucid dreaming is the exact opposite of external control of one's mind. I encourage anyone who is interested to do a little research and try playing with the idea of becoming self-aware in one's dreams. It's tricky at first, but once you get the hang of it, you get better quickly. I hope those of you who decide to give it a try have the same positive experience that I have.

Thank you!

Yes, exactly...concerning the issue of mind concrol and subliminal messages, it seems to me we are more apt to be prey to such when we don't lucidly dream. If we dream passively letting our subconscious roam...it seems all the crap we are barraged with on TV and in magazines and on billboards, be it advertising, news, or just programming selling us on false views and ideals of the world and what we should be in it etc... is more likely to ooze out and amuse us while we sleep.

As for lights and sounds...I am interested in this...

Originally posted by JBurns
Here is a link to my research project on subliminal messages. I've done alot of reading regarding subliminal messages, and strongly believe that they exist, and are constantly used to persuade your thoughts and opinions.

THANKS!

I don't have a second right now, but I will check that out for sure and appreciate it!

I just typed a massive essay out on here which didnt make any sense whatsoever so i'll just get straight to the point lol.

My dreamscape in the last few days is so acurate and detailed that whilst im dreaming im actualy thinking to myself 'is this a dream or OBE' but then I notice im with friends or family members and think 'ah no just a lucid dream again'.

So...... If im having a lucid dream and everything is perfectly acurate but theres friends and family on the scene, am I then wrong to assume that im having an OBE?

Also.. . Ive found that colours are more vivid and sparkling in my lucid dreams compared to my OBEs which are often really dull and murky.

I think the thing thats making me wonder about all this is from when people say they project and get the vibrations etc... and then they fly somewhere and all colours are vivid and sparkly and they meet up with friends etc.. a part of me is thinking 'are they just projecting but then going straight into a lucid dream?'...

Sorry if this is confusing im confusing myself here, the deeper I look into it, the more confused I become and find it difficuilt to get my thoughts across..

Originally posted by Clarky
I just typed a massive essay out on here which didnt make any sense whatsoever so i'll just get straight to the point lol.

BTDT! Though I often don't have the sense to trash it.

But from what you were saying I do kind of understand your confusion. I am just not sure how to address it myself. I will give you my experiences to compare it with though.

When I have had conscious OOBE I know it's not a dream. I know because besides everything being physically perfect, I know that I am traveling about in real time and in a real place. It never feels like a dreamscape, though being it is at night and the house I was in is dimly lit often, I can understand the dark/murky atmosphere you speak of.

The people I see when OOB I cannot interact with. They are not OOB but in the physical reality. My sister sometimes could *feel* a "presence" in the room when I was OOB and going throughout the house and would go to where she was, etc and this was interesting because she told me this without me ever telling her I had OOBEs etc. She didn't know it was me in other words.


As for other people seeing people when astral projecting...I think that is a meeting of other APers on the AP or those that have passed from this world-but I'm not sure. If that helps you distinguish between OOBE and lucid dreaming...in other words if you are OOB and seeing people who are not also OOB then you wouldn't be interacting with them unless you were dreaming.

Thats about all I can offer though! I've never really gone anywhere on the AP when consciously OOB so I haven't heard the buzzing or seen the vivid colors yet. My lucid dreams are sometimes vivid in color though. So much for people who said we dream in black and white