Thank You Poland

Americas friends are few these days because most of the world is screwed up

That's funny. Most people in the world seem to think the other way ... Americas friends are few these days because America is screwed up.

[edit on 5/1/2006 by SwearBear]

Originally posted by SwearBear

Americas friends are few these days because most of the world is screwed up

That's funny. Most people in the world seem to think the other way

... Americas friends are few these days because America is screwed up.

If it were truly the other way, it would be "the world's friends are few these days because America is screwed up", you would need to include the world in there somewhere.

Originally posted by devilwasp

Originally posted by Souljah

Poland was main CIA European detention base

Poland was the heart of the CIA's secret detention network in Europe until recently, an analyst of the U.S.-based Human Rights Watch organisation was quoted as telling a Polish newspaper.

"Poland was the main base for CIA interrogations in Europe, while Romania played more of a role in the transfer of detained prisoners," analyst Marc Garlasco was quoted on Friday by Polish daily Gazeta Wyborcza as saying in an interview.

I am sure that the Bush Goverment is very THANKFUL to the Polish Goverment for Keeping Quiet and Completly Silent, what was (and maybe still IS) going on in the Main Base for CIA Interrogations in Europe.

We Wouldn't Want yet Another Abuse Scandal!

Care to find an impartial news source for you to qoute from?

I have always admired the Polish people here in the US and what I have read about them in their own country. They seem to be brave and honorable. In any case I believe the Polish soldiers are doing their job in Iraq and should be honored.

After reading some of Souljah's [and others) comments in this thread I wondered if my feelings about Poland were incorrect and they (the Polish people) and the US were as dastardly as Souljah portrays. So I did some searching.

It seems the beginning of this expose was the article the Washingtonpost.com website carried alleging "detainment camps in European countries".

CIA Holds Terror Suspects in Secret Prisons Debate Is Growing Within Agency About Legality and Morality of Overseas System Set Up After 9/11
By Dana Priest
Washington Post Staff Writer

Wednesday, November 2, 2005;

The existence and locations of the facilities -- referred to as "black sites" in classified White House, CIA, Justice Department and congressional documents -- are known to only a handful of officials in the United States and, usually, only to the president and a few top intelligence officers in each host country.

Notice: Known to only a handful of officials in the United States, etc

And here it is, all over Washingtonpost.com

The Washington Post is not publishing the names of the Eastern European countries involved in the covert program, at the request of senior U.S. officials. They argued that the disclosure might disrupt counterterrorism efforts in those countries and elsewhere and could make them targets of possible terrorist retaliation.

Notice: Not publishing names of countries at request of senior US officials?

This seems really nice of them, doesn't it?

Sources are quoted throughout article with this phrase.

current and former U.S. and foreign government and intelligence officials.

The words are switched around to different places in the sentence, and/or sometimes one or two are left out. There isn't anyplace where we are told the identities of these busy "officials".


Then on December 8, 2005 we have a news item from Pravda, News from Russia
website
Poland: defense minister meets with Rumsfeld under cloud of speculation over secret prisons

It was unclear whether Radek Sikorski's discussion with Rumsfeld touched on the allegations, which have been repeatedly denied by the Polish government.

Next we have December 9, 2005
CIA has secret prisons in Poland
websiteThis is the article quoted by Souljah.

Human Rights Watch stuck to its claim that Poland served as the CIA's main base in Europe for holding and interrogating terrorist suspects in remarks printed Friday, even as the country's leaders continue to vigorously deny any involvement. Marc Gerlasco, an intelligence expert for the New York-based organization, told Poland's Gazeta Wyborcza that Human Rights Watch had documents
corroborating its case about Poland, and showing Romania was a transit point for moving prisoners.

He did not show the newspaper the documents that he said were in his organization's possession, but said all relevant material has been passed to Swiss lawmaker Dick Marty, who has been tasked by the Council of Europe to investigate. This week, Poland's outgoing President Aleksander Kwasniewski stressed that "there are no such prisons or such prisoners on Polish territory" and on Nov. 28 went further, saying "there never have been" such jails.

Convenient not to show his proof of documents. So..no proof shown yet.

On Thursday, Prime Minister Kazimierz Marcinkiewicz said Poland will open its doors to Marty's investigation and added his country was "ready to show everything that moves in Poland to guarantee that there are no prisons or such places in Poland", informs the AP. N.U.

But also on December 9, 2005
Human Rights Watch: Poland Main CIA Center in Europe
website

BERLIN (AP) - December 9, 2005 - A Human Rights Watch investigator said in remarks published Friday that Poland was the CIA's main center for secretly detaining terror suspects in Europe. But the group later cautioned that it was too soon for any final conclusions because their investigation is still at an early stage.

So here we have the Human Rights Watch, who are being quoted in all articles saying they are not finished with their investigation.

Poland's Gazeta Wyborcza newspaper caused a stir when it published an interview with Marc Garlasco, a senior military analyst with the rights organization, saying his group had documents corroborating that Poland was the chief CIA detention site in Europe in a system of clandestine prisons for interrogating al-Qaida suspects. "Poland was the main base of interrogating prisoners and Romania was more of a hub,"
Garlasco was quoted as telling the newspaper. "This is what our sources from the CIA tell us and what is shown from the documents we gathered."

But, again, we have Human Rights Watch with the last word...

But Human Rights Watch quickly distanced itself from those remarks, with one of their researchers, John Sifton, saying they "had left a misleading impression with some people" that the group has more evidence than it in fact does.

And, again on December 9, 2005
Source: Reuters
Poland was main CIA European detention base-paper
website

WARSAW, Dec 9 (Reuters) - Poland was the heart of the CIA's secret detention network in Europe until recently, an analyst of the U.S.-based Human Rights Watch organisation was quoted as telling a Polish newspaper.

He said the allegations were based on information from CIA sources and other documents obtained by Human Rights Watch. "We have leads, circumstantial evidence to check but it's too early to reveal them," Garlasco said.

And, again, Human Rights Watch has more to say:

Human Rights Watch said in a statement it had not reached conclusions about CIA operations in eastern Europe.

The Washington Post first reported the alleged existence of secret prisons in eastern Europe and other countries last month.

I don't feel there is enough solid information to condemn Poland.



[edit on 1/6/2006 by Mahree]

*P.S.A. Use "ex" instead of "quote" for quoting external sources.*

[edit on 6-1-2006 by dbates]

Originally posted by curme

You know, homosexuals are not banned from military service in Poland. Granted, I don't know how many of those Polish soldeirs are gay, it's a private matter. So who knows how many gay soldiers you'd be buying a beer for? Why is it ok for gay Polish soldiers to fight in Iraq, but not gay US soldiers? Or would you rather not gay Polish soldeirs serve in Iraq? Without gays, Polish troops number may dwindle even more.

Once again, ignorance at it's best. Do you know what percentage of the population in Poland is gay?

There is a significant difference between the percent of homosexuals in America and Poland. There are less gays per capita in Poland. If you don't believe me then just look it up for yourself.

Considering the above, there are less gays in the Polish Army, and even less in the GROM, which is the active unit in Iraq.

And what does it matter anyway, a beer for a soldier is a beer for a soldier.

So I'm confused; what are you trying to say???

And as for your comment on Polish troops dwindling... Poland has not sent it's
entire army to Iraq, nor it plans to.

As of right now, I believe it is just select units, and special forces that are over there right now.

omega, we've moved past that as it isn't on topic.

Edit to add: That topic is being discussed here:

politics.abovetopsecret.com...

[edit on 7-1-2006 by intrepid]

Originally posted by LA_Maximus

Poland has decided to extend their troop deployment in Iraq till the end of 2006....I know their troop number are low, but its means alot to us Americans who are looking for friends in a world that is packed full of Liars, Cowards, Crooks and Murderers.

Its real funny how its the USA that has created the LIES with all the BS on Iraq, the murders out of your HONEST soilders and the crooks out of your corporate leaders.

If there are those three factors in the world at the moment, especially when it comes to IRAQ... I know EXACTLY where the blame is to go.

But I do agree with you, with Americas BLATANT disregard for international LAW, and human LIFE... they are VERY lucky indeed to have even the SMALLEST of countries befriend them and back them up.

Originally posted by Agit8dChop
Its real funny how its the USA that has created the LIES with all the BS on Iraq, the murders out of your HONEST soilders and the crooks out of your corporate leaders.

hmmm, still posting all that PTS-type rhetoric.

The topic IS:
A discussion of Poland as our ally in Iraq.

Further wanderings from the topic will force this thread to either be moved or closed.
Thank you for your cooperation.

Wow. For all of you knocking the contributions of Poland, and the other countries, for doing what it can. It must be nice to be perfect in all things, and all knowing. All this little thread is about is thanking those young men and women who are so far away from home doing a nasty job that must be done. Regardless of your stand on the war itself, can you not spare a moment to thank them? If not. Please find somewhere else to exercise your command of rhetoric.