Secret Stations in Earth Orbit

I just recently read about these space stations, or at least their alleged existence in orbiting the earth in secret. Just a thought, but wouldn't those among the civilian population that observe stars in the nights sky etc. notice these orbiting stations?

Yes, there is nothing to hide behind up there, so these would be easily detectable.

KH-10 DORIAN 'MOL' (Manned Orbital Laboratory)

An ambitious Air Force project to have a manned reconnaissance platform in outer-space. The MOL was a cylinder with roughly 34 cubic yards of work space. A broad array of tasks were assigned to the MOL but ELINT and reconnaissance duties were certainly intended to be paramount. The project was finally axed in 1969 having consumed over a billion dollars in development.

...maybe, hummm...

I don't see how they can have a secret space station up there. Like Valhall said theres not really anything to hide behind.

Well,

I've butted horns over this before, but it is possible to launch armed stations that the general public is unaware of (or armed spacecraft that the public perceives as unarmed).

In the 80s, the Soviets launched the 'Almaz' series, one of which was armed with a bona fide 'space gun'. Now, though people on our side of the ocean knew about this, so far as the public went, no one outside of the Kremlin (or, perhaps) the Pentagon knew that the thing was armed.

So, yes, it's probably near impossible to orbit something without anyone knowing (though various visual stealth tactics can be thought of)... But it is possible to hide something in plain sight.

I'm not saying that there are giant stations in orbit that we haven't heard of (I don't want to get into that again), but it is possible to hide all the capabilities of something... especially something no one will inspect, ever, after it is launched.

[Edited on 10-9-2003 by onlyinmydreams]

I would agree... considering that the closest inspection you might get is a flyby of a surveillance satelite at thousands of miles an hour, and that normal security would preclude anyone getting close to it prior to launch, I see it being very easy to label something a communication or weather satelite, and put any kind of weapon in orbit you could want.

It is my understand that the BrightEye satelite was put in orbit as a new generation KH-11 spy satelite (well, it is a spy satelite... just 5 generations ahead of anything else, and likely with some kind of offensive abilities as well)

The Russian manned (military) space craft the Almaz.

This is a great site with plenty of information and pics:




Vladimir Chelomei's Almaz was the only manned military space craft ever actually flown. The project continued through many twists and turns over a period of 25 years. As with many Soviet space endeavours, the technical merits of the project are impossible to separate from the combative personalities and intense politics involved. The stations that flew were equipped with an unprecedented array of sensors for �man-in-the-loop� observation and targeting of mobile ground units. Combat equipment included a space-to-space gun, which was tested in orbit. In the end the station officially proved that manned systems were not a cost-effective method for space reconnaissance and targeting. However the designs of the Almaz station and its TKS resupply vehicle lived on as the Russian space station modules for the Salyut, Mir, and the International Space Station programmes.


www.astronautix.com...

Almaz interior
Close-up view of interior of Almaz space station. Note large white film cassettes of reconnaissance camera, and cosmonaut at the control station of the camera systems.


www.astronautix.com...

Almaz Shchit-2 Gun
The single-barrel gun fitted ventrally to the Almaz OPS-4 station.





www.astronautix.com...

Originally posted by onlyinmydreams
Well,

I've butted horns over this before, but it is possible to launch armed stations that the general public is unaware of (or armed spacecraft that the public perceives as unarmed).

In the 80s, the Soviets launched the 'Almaz' series, one of which was armed with a bona fide 'space gun'. Now, though people on our side of the ocean knew about this, so far as the public went, no one outside of the Kremlin (or, perhaps) the Pentagon knew that the thing was armed.

So, yes, it's probably near impossible to orbit something without anyone knowing (though various visual stealth tactics can be thought of)... But it is possible to hide something in plain sight.

I'm not saying that there are giant stations in orbit that we haven't heard of (I don't want to get into that again), but it is possible to hide all the capabilities of something... especially something no one will inspect, ever, after it is launched.

[Edited on 10-9-2003 by onlyinmydreams]

I do agree, it is entirely possible to hide stuff in orbit - from the general public. The research project launched by the Air Force, Air Force 2025 talked about it - but not manned stations. Some military spysats are HUGE! That's why the Air Force pushed for the shuttle to have a large cargo return capacity (and in the process turning it into a useless flying brick/white elephant).

A manned station could be hidden by making it like angular ice cream cone - point the sharp end at the ground, coat it with RAM and paint it black. Somebody WILL find it, in the end, but it makes it very hard and it won't be Joe Bloggs the amateur astronomer.

I can just see Joe Professor at the Observatory looking up into his scope one day and finding someone looking back at him, supposed floating there by himself LOL.

If you want to hide something, you should keep it in the open.

or something to that effect.

What this means is, if they wanted to use military style stations/satalities, they could do so, just without the military part of it. Just call it a station, or a satalitie. Who in the general public will know the difference?

Yes agreed, the best way to hide anything is right under other people's noses.

How about looking at all the moons certain planets have? Do they all have to be real?

What about underground bases on the moon?

Or satellites close to the sun?

What about mining operations in the debris around Saturn?

Bases and satellites could also be cloaked' and thus not always visible if at all.

What about existance in over densities or dimensions?

That is when something would be right in front of your face and yet you could not see it.

Then of course there are underground bases on earth, many of them according to some people.

Originally posted by THENEO
Yes agreed, the best way to hide anything is right under other people's noses.

How about looking at all the moons certain planets have? Do they all have to be real?

What about underground bases on the moon?

Or satellites close to the sun?

What about mining operations in the debris around Saturn?

Bases and satellites could also be cloaked' and thus not always visible if at all.

What about existance in over densities or dimensions?

That is when something would be right in front of your face and yet you could not see it.

Then of course there are underground bases on earth, many of them according to some people.

or even easier options like

- hiding on the dark side of the moon
- hiding on the other side of the sun
- hiding behind our geostationary satellites (they tend to look down, and those that look "up" are easy to spot)
- cloaked in orbit

just some more to mull over. but I think THENEO has the right of it. It's easy to hide stuff from our 20th century technology. Easy as beans.

And the Lizards in the 4th density don't even need to hide anything - we can't see them anyway. They are all around us.

You guy's ever hear about the Lizards?

Speaking of hiding a satelite, I would imagine that BrightEye at least has one defensive option... with a high energy variable wavelength active imaging laser, I would imagine it would be easy to completely blind any camera or telescope turned its direction...

What, may I ask, is Brighteye? Some kind of spy satellite?

Originally posted by DeltaNine
What, may I ask, is Brighteye? Some kind of spy satellite?

Yes, an orbital active laser imaging system that can see through almost any and all environmental condition (rain, dust, ect) as well as penetrate to almost the entire depth of the ocean in the blue-green laser mode. In this mode it is used for communications with submerged nuclear submarines at great depth.

Here is a more descriptive thread:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Thanks DR. Sorry I didnt reply sooner; I had forgotten that Id even asked this