Which will you choose? Freedom or Security??

Interesting as in some circumstances you have or want both. If your parents tell you not to swim for 30 minutes after you eat they are offering security, if you choose to go swimming anyhow you are exercising your freedom (within limits). I feel that there are a lot of places where security is valuable. The govt (bad guys for some of you) are getting paid for things then they should offer security: nuclear waste, military weapons, the water supply. As for my personal self and my family well I believe there are certain things I(we) are responsible for. We should have the freedom to take out any book or research any topic available without hinderence. Othwise how did we achieve rockets and all other dangerous technology without sparking the mind of budding scientists. We should have the basic right to protect ourselves. Whether that means locking the house doors or carrying a .50 Desert Eagle with 2 spare magezines. I don't want my neighbors watching what I do and it has nothing to do with me doing something wrong. They have their own family, friends or hobbies and I really prefer not to be one of them. The job of all govt is to make their citizens lives as good as possible. Spend more time on fixing urban blight, educating our people (all our people not just the suburbs) and not just about making your stock rise 1/4 above analysts and we will all be better off. I know I know a pipe dream, rich people like being rich and they are just doing what they were trained to do. Well eventually if there are only a few super rich and a lot of everyone else, you willl have revolution. Just read any history book for proof.

Originally posted by toppdogg
I don't want my neighbors watching what I do and it has nothing to do with me doing something wrong. They have their own family, friends or hobbies and I really prefer not to be one of them. The job of all govt is to make their citizens lives as good as possible. Spend more time on fixing urban blight, educating our people (all our people not just the suburbs) and not just about making your stock rise 1/4 above analysts and we will all be better off.

Very good post I really liked th above portion I snipped from the rest. It just amazes me how many people will say: "If you dont have anything to hide, who cares?" this never used to be the American way of thinking. Never! Fascist countries are brainwashed to think this way, not Americans where privacy is a cherished ideal. Living life on your own terms (as long as it doesnt infringe on someone else), and the persuit of happiness and your own individual way of thinking, this is what made us unique and great. We have a president that is telling the people the The Patriot Act is somethng that will be handled carefully and will not be used against us in a way that will harm the innocent.

I must ask you this.

Have you ever heard of an American prosecuter that does not use every tool availible to him to get a conviction? Better think hard on this last statement boys and girls.

For me and my Family I'll go with security first. It seems logical to me as what security would anyone have if death knocks at your door and your family's too.

Dallas

Freedom ok lets examine that today...

Youre working talking to a fellow colleague, and you say something to him
or her thats off-color, however neither of you mind because its in jest...
now employee #3 who happened to be walking by overheard...now
employee can hold you personally responsible in court, and sue you and
hold the company responsible and sue them. By talking this way you were
not "infringing" on someone elses freedom you didnt force them to listen
nor did you prevent them from NOT listening. However, youre personal
"freedom" to do this has been infringed upon because of the legality. AND
your personal security has been breached because you would probably
lose your job, spend a good portion of your life paying for it, and because
of both could no longer support your family.

Somehow i find something just like this as a prime example of exactly the
type of "freedom AND security" that our government today seems to be
offering.

[edit on 4-8-2005 by alphabetaone]

The purpose of this thread was to get a feel or a poll of what the people think, thanks for your posts.

I think the USA has become a Fear society, where our politicans should be "leading us" they are instilling fear into most of Americans. What happened to the "i speak softly but carry a Big stick " in USA politics, unless of course they want you to be afraid, but why would they want that?

The 9/11 hijackers were all here illeagally, they got right in through our borders, and the Federal government did nothing to stop them then, and they are doing nothing to stop any future terrorist from slipping through again.

www.cnn.com...

www.azcentral.com...


This whole national id card thing is taking things too far, remember folks it was forgien terrorists that hurt us on 9/11...not any citizens of the USA, then why do citizens have to go through all the screening at the airports?
sobriety check-points, seat belt programs like "click it or ticket"

Spend some money on our borders people, thats the only way of keepin the terrorists out.

unbridled immigration

minute men

peace

Originally posted by LoneGunMan

Very good post I really liked th above portion I snipped from the rest. It just amazes me how many people will say: "If you dont have anything to hide, who cares?" this never used to be the American way of thinking. Never! Fascist countries are brainwashed to think this way, not Americans where privacy is a cherished ideal. Living life on your own terms (as long as it doesnt infringe on someone else), and the persuit of happiness and your own individual way of thinking, this is what made us unique and great. We have a president that is telling the people the The Patriot Act is somethng that will be handled carefully and will not be used against us in a way that will harm the innocent.

I must ask you this.

Have you ever heard of an American prosecuter that does not use every tool availible to him to get a conviction? Better think hard on this last statement boys and girls.

Exactly...

Oh, the prosecutors - They will with for knowlege, and conspiracy with hold information that would prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that you are innocent. All in the name of getting a conviction. - However their job is to find the truth. -->That should be a criminal offence more serious than Murder.

Oldest con trick in the book - create false danger and fear to motivate ‘free’ people to give up their freedoms in the name of protection and security.

Please think about this carefully before you sacrifice what so many fought so hard to gain for you. Please don't be so quick to give this away so easily as some seem to be prepared to do.

Let me also ask you a question or two.

How many people die each year as a result of disease and hunger? Would you be happy if I took your money and your house and gave it all to the less fortunate so they were no longer sick and hungry?

How many people die each year in road accidents? Will you give up your cars?

Then ask yourself how many people have die as a result of terrorist activities? This is the reason why we are told that we should be happy give up of freedom and our rights.

Originally posted by Conspicuouz
i shall quote a man whom had a better concept on both...

"Those who are willing to trade freedom for security deserve neither freedom nor security."
Benjamin Franklin

now, it's our countries duty to make us feel secure without any personal intrusion. if we are hunting "terrorists", why in the world do you care what i do personally? you have great intelligence on terrorist yet you want to be able to look into every American's personal file and conduct unconstitutional practices on them because you suspect them of being terrorists. bull#. when was the first time you heard of a terrorist who was caught thanks to the patriot act? because i sure haven't. it's just smokes and mirrors to slowly condition us for far less liberties and have us under control over fear of the boogie man. people need to wake the f*** up before they get the carpet pull up from under them.

/end vent

I was going to quote that myself for one simple reason: That man is our consitution and the patriot act spits on his legacy.

And those who may say that Benjamin Franklin does not live in our time aren't giving credit to the thought. That type of quote can never be used out of context or out-dated.