Proud To Be Gay, Ashamed To Be Straight

Originally posted by deesw
And your warped views of right and wrong have no place in a decent society. God destroyed the Earth before for perverse behavior such as this. Do you honestly have an opinion on here about anything or are you just here to attack Christian viewpoints? You are not correct about homosexual behavior in the wild. You prove it to me that any animal besides a human has homosexual sex just for the thrill of it and I'll back off. Point is it just aint so.

news.nationalgeographic.com...

www.bidstrup.com...

www.livescience.com...

Well tell the whole truth... animals do that until they realize their mistake and find another mate. Most news outlets use this to justify
homosexuality in "nature" and dont mentiont he part where they go to find another mate.

And some of these animals, the animals that form pair bonds [most mammals, including humans, are NOT naturally monogomous and don't stay with one partner for more than a day or week, after which the female provides all of the care for the baby], actually stay together. Its not just a passing 'confusion', sorry. You aren't taking into consideration that most mammals don't stay with the same mate anyway.

If you use one book to define how all things should and must work, no wonder you're so judgemental. There is no proof that the bible is infallible nor correct, thus you are making a leap of faith.

[edit on 23-2-2007 by BallOfPopulation]

Originally posted by deesw
And your warped views of right and wrong have no place in a decent society. God destroyed the Earth before for perverse behavior such as this.

calling my views "warped" is not called for
here's how i view right and wrong

right is normally what harms the least number of people (ideally zero)
wrong is what harms people for the sake of pleasure or gain

that doesn't seem to warped, does it?

maybe you could say that you disagree with them
and also, again
here is the church here is the state
that's how it works

Do you honestly have an opinion on here about anything or are you just here to attack Christian viewpoints?

my opinion is that if people are gay, whatever
let them be gay
it doesn't affect me and i have no problem with it

You are not correct about homosexual behavior in the wild. You prove it to me that any animal besides a human has homosexual sex just for the thrill of it and I'll back off. Point is it just aint so.

i'll present the case of 2 gay penguins
wendell and cass of the new york aquarium
www.jrn.columbia.edu...

If you use one book to define how all things should and must work, no wonder you're so judgemental. There is no proof that the bible is infallible nor correct, thus you are making a leap of faith.

Nor is there any disproof of the Bible. Many have tried, and many have failed. If the Bible said it was ok to be queer, I would imagine that you'd have no problem with the Bible. When society or the Bible or anyone else says you are wrong in your lifestyle, are you ever? Have you ever taken responsibility for anything in your life? By that I mean admitting you've done wrong and ammended of your ways?

He likes it when we fight...he really likes it when we hate ourselves. He loves it when we hate our selves over something we have no control over.

Originally posted by BallOfPopulation
If you use one book to define how all things should and must work, no wonder you're so judgemental. There is no proof that the bible is infallible nor correct, thus you are making a leap of faith.

There's actually no proof whatsoever that the bible (the original aramaic and greek) had anything negative to say about homosexuality at all. In fact, there were committed homosexual couples in the bible.

The Bible and Homosexuality

But try to tell that to someone who's betting the farm on the New International, Easy-Listening, made for TV version of the bible.

Originally posted by deesw
Nor is there any disproof of the Bible.

There's no disproof of Unicorns or the Easter Bunny, either. That doesn't mean they exist. The burden of proof lies with those who claim the bible is proof of something.

Originally posted by deesw
They can fight all they want, that doesn't make em right. Homosexuality has been considered perverse for thousands of years and are you telling me that now we have become so enlightened that it is no longer perverse? How arragant is that? Billions upon billions throughout history have been wrong? Don't even get me started quoting the Bible. But of course I'm not too sure that a God fearing man or woman would trust and believe in God and still support homosexuality.
Hate not the sinner, hate the sin.

So, I guess you missed all the man-love in ancient Greece?

Now consider which is more perverse, being gay or killing and/or torturing gay people. Can't forget the icing on the cake, damning them to burn forever and ever.

And please...PLEASE...don't get started quoting the bible...

Originally posted by deesw
And your warped views of right and wrong have no place in a decent society. God destroyed the Earth before for perverse behavior such as this. Do you honestly have an opinion on here about anything or are you just here to attack Christian viewpoints? You are not correct about homosexual behavior in the wild. You prove it to me that any animal besides a human has homosexual sex just for the thrill of it and I'll back off. Point is it just aint so.

You need to read some stuff on animal behavior.

But, I don't need to read that stuff to know better. I had a cat who would hump my other cat all the time. My other cat usually let him do it. And yes, both male cats.

I've also seen male dogs let other male dogs hump them. I've even seen some pretty nasty stuff left by one dog on another dog.

Like I said, read into it sometimes, as you damn it all to hell. (literally)

To show that you are proud of being who you are, when who you are isn't a minority in race, sexuality, traditions, etc. isn't exceptable. You are automatically considered a racist.

www.abovepolitics.com...

www.abovepolitics.com...

These are about race but I think you could substitute any of the above items and get the same result.

Originally posted by Royal76
To show that you are proud of being who you are, when who you are isn't a minority in race, sexuality, traditions, etc. isn't exceptable. You are automatically considered a racist.

www.abovepolitics.com...

www.abovepolitics.com...

These are about race but I think you could substitute any of the above items and get the same result.

You use a thread about gays to promote threads YOU created?

You never cease to amuse me, Royal...

just kidding.

It was to state the point. If their were any others talking about it I would have brought them in.


[edit on 1-3-2007 by Royal76]

I wonder how many heteros would show up for a hetero parade?
There is also the problem of which parade (gay or straight) should the bisexuals participate in?

As a veteran of numerous gay pride parades, I do have to say that gays really know how to throw a parade!! Any gay parade would be, by far, a much more fun parade than anything straights could put on. For example, check out the pictures that Grady gave links to: now doesn't that seem like a bunch of fun partyers?
I love gay parades. I love the costumes, the humor, the theme floats and the whole atmosphere of "celebrate diversity". I love seeing parents of gays/lesbians marching beside their children, proud of who they are. I have marched beside many of my gay/lesbian friends in the gay parade. I guess you could call me a Proud Fag Hag. If you've never been to a gay pride parade, you've missed the best damn party of your life.

i love gay pride parades too.... well, i enjoyed the on i went to. last year one of my friends came out to all of his friends, so we came to support him at the parade because his dad wasn't going to be supportive whatsoever.


now the whole "ashamed to be straight" thing....
have you ever watched TV? everyone is proud to be straight, they just have never been oppressed for being straight so they have no reason to throw parades.

I really don't see what the big fuss is over sexuality. I can understand homosexuals heck I like men too. As far as lesbians not my thing but what the heck have at it. I just don't agree with special privilidges for any group.

If sexual orientation is a matter of biology (which I believe to be the case) as opposed to choice and effort, then either Gay or Straight Pride celebrations strike me as a bit silly.

If a group of anybody wants to get together and throw a party/parade, wonderful... go for it.

But being proud of being gay or straight is like being proud of being white or black or 6 feet tall or left-handed. Nobody puts any effort into being any of those things - they are just part of each person's reality.

Now before anybody flies off the deep end, I do see plenty of reason for being proud of the accomplishments of gay or black or white or 6ft tall or left-handed people. But that is a different matter than pride in simply being something.

Edit:

OK, I was just discussing this with my wife, who is quite sensitive and empathetic towards oppressed peoples, and she gave me a clearer perspective on this...

In that gay people have historically been trained to be ashamed of being gay, at least in the US. She tells me it is not so much pride of being gay, as pride in being who each person is, and part of that identity is being gay.

And I understand this viewpoint entirely, being left-handed, which has also historically been a frowned-upon condition.

Cool, eh? Ignorance reduction in action!

[edit on 4-4-2007 by Open_Minded Skeptic]

Originally posted by Open_Minded Skeptic
Cool, eh? Ignorance reduction in action!

Well, I try...



I'm looking at the title. Who's ashamed to be straight?

Originally posted by junglejake
So why do we have to be ashamed of who we are if we don't agree or change our politics/race/sexuality to be in line with these special interest groups?

That's exactly the point, love. You don't have to be ashamed. And neither do they!

As a gay man, I can proudly say that if the majority, heterosexual population wants to hold a parade in their honor, go ahead...it doesn't hurt me, does it?

I do, however, believe that many heterosexuals do not acknowledge the struggle of being in the stigma of a sexual minority, or the prevalence in the media of their lifestyle. Every day is a "straight pride day".

Then again, if we can have a parade to celebrate our own sexual identity, why can't others do the same? It's certainly not my place to stop them.

As far as I am concerned, the most definitive retort to the biblical attitude towards gays is an anonymous "Letter to Dr. Laura' that was found on the net. I did post it on another thread, but it is even more relavent here in this context. I'm including a link that provides further info, but the letter, while lengthly, says it all for me...

www.snopes.com...

Dear Dr. Laura,

Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God's Law. I have learned a great deal from your show, and I try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind him that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination. End of debate.

I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some of the specific laws and how to best follow them.

a) When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odor for the Lord (Lev 1:9). The problem is my neighbors. They claim the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?

b) I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?

c) I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of menstrual uncleanliness (Lev 15:19-24). The problem is, how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offense.

d) Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians?

e) I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself?

f) A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an Abomination (Lev 11:10), it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don't agree. Can you settle this?

g) Lev 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle room here?

h) Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev 19:27. How should they die?

i) I know from Lev 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?

j) My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev 19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? (Lev 24:10-16) Couldn't we just burn them to death at a private family affair like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)

I know you have studied these things extensively, so I am confident you can help.

Thank you again for reminding us that God's word is eternal and unchanging.

Your devoted disciple and adoring fan. As far as I am concerned, the most definitive retort to the biblical attitude towards gays is an anonymous "Letter to Dr. Laura' that was found on the net. I did post it on another thread, but it is even more relavent here in this context. I'm including a link that provides further info, but the letter, while lengthly, says it all for me...

[edit on 7-4-2007 by JohnnyCanuck]

[edit on 7-4-2007 by JohnnyCanuck]

Originally posted by JohnnyCanuck
As far as I am concerned, the most definitive retort to the biblical attitude towards gays is an anonymous "Letter to Dr. Laura' that was found on the net. I did post it on another thread, but it is even more relavent here in this context. I'm including a link that provides further info, but the letter, while lengthly, says it all for me...

www.snopes.com...

Dear Dr. Laura,

That was a great letter, thank! Perfect example of why we don't live our lives to the "standards" of the bible. The bible was meant to provide moral guidance during a very different period in the world ... the letter was a good highlight that you can't cherry pick rules out of there as many of them are considered barbaric by todays standards. We have moved way forward in moral, ethics and laws from what the bible purports.