If you support the call for Israel to offer ceasefire, then you support Hamas.

originally posted by: DBCowboy

Of course you don't need to.

To actually state that hamas needs to be eliminated gives support to Jews and Israel by default.

And some people just can't do that.

Apparently.

You'll have to read my reply to Walpurgisnacht's post just above, if you want to know my position so badly.

My attention is square on your accusation that I am a liar.

Won't you prove that I am a liar so you can get me to resign from ATS? If anyone proves me a liar I will resign from ATS.

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: BiothermalReactor

What's the difference between hamas and a palestinian?

For that matter, what was the difference between a Nzi and a German during WWII?

What's the difference between Judiasm and Zionism, and Jewish Voices for Freedom, and "Not in my Name"?

And for the record?

I'm a Zionist.

a reply to: BiothermalReactor

I don't care what you do.

I'm just pointing out BS from pseudo-intellectuals who think they're smarter than everyone.

originally posted by: Walpurgisnacht

Hamas wants to get the support of the international community by using civilians.

This isn't the first time they've done this. They placed rocket launching sites next to the United Nations, Nursery, Mosque and School Buildings hoping the IDF airstrikes would bombard these structures in order to garnish more support for their 'cause'. There's overlays of this exact thing out there if you care to look. Its a common tactic of these cowards.

We can just be thankful that this goofy terror org hasn't damaged the Abraham Accords one bit. The Palestinians need better representatives. Representatives that will not risk killing their own people for an international hug-me-please session.

I agree with everything you have said here 100% except for the last 5 words, and yet I still support Israel offering a ceasefire.

originally posted by: BiothermalReactor

originally posted by: Walpurgisnacht
I'll just say this. When I look to the supporter orbit of Hamas I see radicals of every flavor. The American Futurist, a neo-nazi publishing front have been cheering on Hamas offensives on their telegram channel along with every loon from the left side of the fence to the right. Every anti-semitic dogwhistling collective is using this war to buoy their nonsense to the surface.

Yes I agree with this 100%

The Palestinians are a besieged people that need liberation, liberation from the the same governing authority that regards them as martyrs instead of human beings. Poker chips instead of people. I think, logically speaking, Hamas should be that one collective that everyone should agree needs to see a definitive end. Their goals are clear. They are a radical and extremist military order, not fit for a governing role. Regardless of your opinion on the regions politics, that group HAS to go.

(bold mine)

Yes. I agree with this 100%. Thank you for bringing logic and discernment to a board that is in desperate need, because a disturbing number of highly vocal and highly frequent posters on this board are lumping all Palestinians with HAMAS.

Do you agree that this is wrong?

As the vets on this board will no doubt understand when I type this:

FAFO.

/thread

Poor taste in acronym aside, I do not agree that all vets subscribe to the notion that this thread is over. I just agreed with the vast majority of your post.

Is there a difference between an armed combatant and a civilian? Yes. There is. My previous question on why didn't the civilian population oust Hamas earlier (c.2005) comes from an honest place. I don't care for the level of support the civilians have for the terrorists, I'm truthfully wondering why their political processes aimed, of all places, towards a terror group who has it in their operational parameters to invade and slaughter Jews. Period. They treat the civilians like bargaining chips. I don't understand the culture there, and I don't pretend to understand the culture there.

While the callous will say "collateral damage is normal", my whole point of asking these questions is that it doesn't have to be normal. There doesn't have to be collateral damage. You are faced with an irregular force that has had years to map out tunnel systems and run them through locations frequented and visited by civilians. Each hit against their positions will of course land the IDF a civilian casualty rate. It's a double edged sword, and its going to get worse before it gets better.

Thankfully reports are coming out that Gaza is no longer in the hands of Hamas. The bulk of the force, anyway. The sooner Hamas is gone, the sooner the civilians can heal and get their self-determination ACTUALLY on the road.

originally posted by: MoreCoyoteAngels
a reply to: BiothermalReactor

The calls for ceasefire from Israel around the world are being fuelled by the RELIGIOUS prejudice of 2 billion Muslims. They assist and enable their Muslim brothers in their Jihad against Israel.

I am not muslim. In fact I believe islam is not a religion, but a radical ideology of hate and violence.

That said, I'm not exactly calling for a cease-fire, I'm calling for an end to the blanket bombing of targets fiulled with innocent civilians.

This enables Hamas, 100%

Only from the perspective of your limited, blind support for Israel, who is no friend to the USA (remember the USS Liberty)..

To continue to condemn Israel for defending herself against the brutal attack perpetrated upon them, thus ending the PRIOR ceasefire, is enabling the attacker.
Israel is fully capable of going after HAMAS, especially their leadership, with surgical strikes (not bombings, except in very limited cases). I'm talking about boots on the ground strikes and take the terrorists out.

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originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: BiothermalReactor

I don't care what you do.

I'm just pointing out BS from pseudo-intellectuals who think they're smarter than everyone.

I do not appreciate you attacking my intelligence and assuming I have a superiority complex.

Why don't you attack the argument instead of slandering me without proof?

The topic is the logical fallacy of arguing supporting a ceasefire is supporting terrorists.

originally posted by: SomeStupidName

originally posted by: BiothermalReactor
If I am a Hamas supporter because I support ceasefire, and everyone else supporting a ceasefire is a hamas supporter, does that mean we are responsible for what Hamas is doing, just for calling for ceasefire?

Yes it makes you accessories to their crimes, but wait you are going to ask if that same rule applies to the Israeli's. Nope they get a pass. Maybe you haven't noticed but there is clearly 2 tiers of justice going on, it is what is.

If there are two tiers of justice here then by that logic, if Israel offers a ceasefire, then they support terrorism.

A glimpse into the lives of the people of the Palestinian West Bank and guess who's next to be ethnically cleansed?

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: BiothermalReactor

If you are not for the elimination of hamaas, then that means you support hamas.

Just to be clear here, elimination of Hamas does not correlate to elimination of Palestine? Otherwise a smoking crater would wrap things up rather nicely?

originally posted by: BiothermalReactor

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: BiothermalReactor

I don't care what you do.

I'm just pointing out BS from pseudo-intellectuals who think they're smarter than everyone.

Why don't you attack the argument instead of slandering me without proof?

The topic is the logical fallacy of arguing supporting a ceasefire is supporting terrorists.

*sigh*

I have pointed out that you can't destroy hamas while calling for a cease-fire that will not destroy hamas.

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: BiothermalReactor

If you are not for the elimination of hamaas, then that means you support hamas.

Just to be clear here, elimination of Hamas does not correlate to elimination of Palestine? Otherwise a smoking crater would wrap things up rather nicely?

Dunno.

What's the difference between hamas and a palestinian?

So far I've gotten nothing for an answer.

originally posted by: tanstaafl

I am not muslim. In fact I believe islam is not a religion, but a radical ideology of hate and violence.

I do not agree with this in the slightest, but I respect that you have this opinion as is in your right.

That said, I'm not exactly calling for a cease-fire, I'm calling for an end to the blanket bombing of targets fiulled with innocent civilians.

Thank you for honesty. I'm sure the civilians in Palestine would settle for such a change. I wonder if that still makes you a Hamas supporter, based on the logical fallacy of the thread topic, since it ensures HAMAS a chance to kill more Israelis.

Only from the perspective of your limited, blind support for Israel, who is no friend to the USA (remember the USS Liberty)..

Some people forget or are never aware of the tiny bits of history that sheds new light on the progression of events that follow.

Israel is fully capable of going after HAMAS, especially their leadership, with surgical strikes (not bombings, except in very limited cases). I'm talking about boots on the ground strikes and take the terrorists out.

I agree with you 100%, but it could be said that doing so gives HAMAS a fair fighting chance and that supports terrorism, using the same fallacious argument.

originally posted by: DBCowboy

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: BiothermalReactor

If you are not for the elimination of hamaas, then that means you support hamas.

Just to be clear here, elimination of Hamas does not correlate to elimination of Palestine? Otherwise a smoking crater would wrap things up rather nicely?

Dunno.

What's the difference between hamas and a palestinian?

So far I've gotten nothing for an answer.

Same difference between nazi and caucasian. Maybe not the answer you wanted but still relevant.

originally posted by: DBCowboy

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: BiothermalReactor

If you are not for the elimination of hamaas, then that means you support hamas.

Just to be clear here, elimination of Hamas does not correlate to elimination of Palestine? Otherwise a smoking crater would wrap things up rather nicely?

Dunno.

What's the difference between hamas and a palestinian?

So far I've gotten nothing for an answer.

Here's the spoon filled with the nourishment you already ignored once. I found it on page 3. The spoon will not return a third time.

You:

No one talks about palestinians surrendering and stopping the war.

Makes me scratch my head in confusion.

Me:

I can see why that confuses you. Its because Israel is at war with the terrorist organization HAMAS. Israel is not at war with Palestine.

Not even Israel labels Palestinians as terrorists. Why do you?

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: DBCowboy

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: BiothermalReactor

If you are not for the elimination of hamaas, then that means you support hamas.

Just to be clear here, elimination of Hamas does not correlate to elimination of Palestine? Otherwise a smoking crater would wrap things up rather nicely?

Dunno.

What's the difference between hamas and a palestinian?

So far I've gotten nothing for an answer.

Same difference between nazi and caucasian. Maybe not the answer you wanted but still relevant.

Gonna make it hard not to leave a smoking crater.



And thank you.

We don't agree on much of anything but at least you gave an answer.

originally posted by: BiothermalReactor


Not even Israel labels Palestinians as terrorists. Why do you?

Because I'm not very nice, number one.

Two, because it's politicians talking.

And three, because I think "hamas" is just the name of the palestinian jihad against Jews and Israel.

originally posted by: DBCowboy

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: DBCowboy

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: BiothermalReactor

If you are not for the elimination of hamaas, then that means you support hamas.

Just to be clear here, elimination of Hamas does not correlate to elimination of Palestine? Otherwise a smoking crater would wrap things up rather nicely?

Dunno.

What's the difference between hamas and a palestinian?

So far I've gotten nothing for an answer.

Same difference between nazi and caucasian. Maybe not the answer you wanted but still relevant.

Gonna make it hard not to leave a smoking crater.

And thank you.

We don't agree on much of anything but at least you gave an answer.

It's very interesting to me that israeli military hasn't pulled the pin yet. Surely by now they understand the body count will only double and triple in the decades to come.