What do you think would happen if there was no political parties?

a reply to: CaliGirl69

What would happen if there were political parties? Not just phony ones controlled by the same puppet masters.

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: CaliGirl69

Then it would be simple.

Those that want bigger controlling government versus those who embrace freedom.

Define Freedom.

Is that where every single person is personally responsible and takes care of their own without sticking their nose in other peoples business?

that's an easy but complex one as freedom is defined by the social contract between peoples, its where the sovereign citizens misunderstand tomes like Leviathan as freedom exists within an agreed framework.

according to Hobbes we are all 2 beings the sovereign self and the political self.. if both are in balance within ourselves and with everyone around us no laws need ever be written because everyone would already do the things everyone else would consider right.

with social contracts laws become ways to either force change through punishment or denote the boundaries of the social contract.. the more laws/rules the closer that social contract comes to collapse.

the covid response ripped up the existing social contract for many, pair that with the removal of society's safeguards and it all becomes a price no establishment in the West can afford to pay.

we are already seeing how that's playing out in the West as we shift to division, strife and ultimately conflict.

neither Trump nor Johnson was the real problem, the real issue is the 2007/8 crash put a question mark by the existing social contract, and evrtything since then has added to the damage.

we lack the heavy weight thinkers who could shape a path back to the agreed contract.. instead, we are now left in the position we were post-reformation of sides trying to limit the freedoms of people they dislike and impose their views on everyone.

its the simple, fragile and complex our world doesn't understand.

originally posted by: Freeborn
a reply to: crayzeed

I've been saying for a long time now that our party political system here in the UK is morally redundant and no longer fit-for-purpose.

All elected officials, at every level, should stand as Independents with their own manifesto's and judged on their own individual performance by the electorate.

I've only ever voted this way, i voted libdem Norman Baker when he was challenging the dr Kelly narrative as soon as the libdems got a sniff at power he dumped the dr kelly affair like a hot potato.. leaving me certain that there is no point voting as it corrupts even the best intentioned

that's taken me back to my childhood of wanting to see an independent Sussex. UDI all the way..

a reply to: CaliGirl69

sorry forgot to answer the original post.. but whatever path we take we'll be back here in no time the reason is as nations we are peoples who hold remarkably similar views as each other.. where it goes deeply wrong is where our elites have taken us which is beholden to minority extremes that want extreme change.

there are ways of unpicking that but none are nice as minority extremes never go quietly away..

with that in mind there are no parties or political heavyweights backing or offering solutions that are not simply the same things rehashed.

originally posted by: merkins
a reply to: 1947boomer

Totally agree.

Lotteries for leaders and Direct democracy for making decisions and passing laws is the only alternative i can see but these things are also fraught with issues too.

I’m in the UK and wish voting was mandatory with one caveat. Put a box that says ‘none of the above’. This would very clearly show the numbers of disenfranchised people and spawn a new party to earn those votes. Of course we’d also need to be a constitutional republic too.

i honestly wonder how that'd play out with the uk population.. an unpopular Westminster making democracy mandatory with fines and threats of prison.. people will just find ever more inventive ways to F*ck it up, like everyone becoming jedis. It'll turn into a farce..

originally posted by: CaliGirl69
What if there was no political parties to align to? Even better, what if these elected parties were only elected as volunteers? I was just trying to think of how to unite as a Nation and stop some of the corruption. My thinking is, we vote for presidents based on what they can get done in office rather then who their alignment is to. Also, if they were volunteers, I think they would care more about serving citizens then themselves. More or less to be part of the system and history of this country. What do you think would happen? P.S. (I don't want to hear it wont work, be creative)

You know how you unite as a nation? You stay out of each others business. This means people worry about themselves -- infrastructure. We stop using banks and money, we go back to resourcing ourselves -- we help each other survive.

That's what government is supposed to do; provide basic services for the betterment of civilization. The betterment of civilization is the opposite of profit motivation. Politician's should be running on their policies, not their parties platform.

Public service is supposed to be about the betterment. Not about profit. People choose to become politicians as a career; career's are a job for profit. So when you get career politicians, what kind of decisions will they make?

Ones that will line their pockets for the most minimum amount of labor. This is why they created parties. On all sides of the field, they all work to line their own pockets for the most minimum amount of labor. All their grandstanding, arguing and what not; is to keep people distracted and to obfuscate that it's all about money.

The only people who make money are part of the club. If you make money and aren't part of the club; the club attacks you, deplatforms you, hems you up legally, and destroys your money. If you use your money to pay for "advice" attourney's are dictating how you conduct yourself, and then you end up pushing the agenda of the "club." People who make it rich and don't play ball get attacked by the IRS; get blackballed by banks, and lose their ability to profit and market.

This is why Target is pushing Pride; this is why Budlight is pushing Pride. This is why DIsney is pushing pride. This is why the entertainment sector is pushing drugs and pride and sex and violence. You either know whats going on and sell out and profit. You know what's going on; you don't sell out, you end up in jail or in debt from fines and knocked back down to poverty. Or you don't know what's going on, and you'll never be successful.

Social credit has been around since the federal reserve. People who are successful are those that don't "rock the boat" and don't just keep their head low. They are people who are doing terrible things like to people using the excuse "It's not my fault, I'm just doing my job!"

Anyone with standards and ethics who is willing to rock the boat for justice ends up broke. Social Credit is the main currency of the matrix. Those that speak out about it; get made examples of. This is Andrew Tate's role. He sold out to become a millionaire by agreeing to be an example of what happens when you rock the boat.

That whole theater is exactly that; theater. Same with Kanye West. Look what happens when you notice? The PSA is; don't notice.

If you do notice; you'll be rewarded for proagating the myth that what you've noticed isn't real. If you do notice; you'll be punished for prograting the truth about what you've noticed.


It's been like this since the creation of the Federal Reserve. George Carlin was talking about it in the 70's and 80's. It's a big club -- AND YOU'RE NOT IN IT!

Why do you think we're destroying the education system? Why do you think that it's more valuable to recieve corporate training than it is to actually know how to do math and read statistics?

Why do you think you get fired if you notice that corporate reps are liars and you speak out about it? Why do you think you get promoted if you notice that corporate reps are liars and you promote the lies?

They want people stupid, because stupid people don't notice. They want the smart people who notice to allign with them. They don't want the smart people that notice to stand up. If you're smart and you notice and you stand up, they will create a reason to terminate you. They'll "document" everything you do with "formal" write ups; which gives them the protections to fire you and not pay unemployment.

Nothing in life is fair. Everything in life is about compliance.

originally posted by: CelestialAnomaly
a reply to: CaliGirl69

That would be a better world. One where people actually cared about each other

Once upon a time, it used to be like this more or less… from my point of view and growing up. Politics was sort of back burner and sort of and was just like, Ed likes Coca Cola and Steve likes Pepsi. But we’re great friends and neighbors. Now it’s been sort of a death match instilled philosophy engrained in people, where you’re instant enemies. Having said that, from where I stand and live that death match mentality comes from relatively probably 95% from one side.

originally posted by: Annee

If the Constitution is so great — why so many Constitutional lawyers?

Uh, yeah — too bad all individuals don’t have values of integrity.

The freedom you promote only works with those who think the same.

the constitutional lawyers protect against illegal constitution violations

intentional and unintentional

what did you think?

not everybody is honest and sane

is there a better system?

originally posted by: WingDingLuey

originally posted by: Annee

If the Constitution is so great — why so many Constitutional lawyers?

Uh, yeah — too bad all individuals don’t have values of integrity.

The freedom you promote only works with those who think the same.

the constitutional lawyers protect against illegal constitution violations

intentional and unintentional

what did you think?

not everybody is honest and sane

is there a better system?

Then they should all be in agreement.

a reply to: Annee

its not the constitution that is wrong, its the individual biases and agendas that are not in agreement. The times have changed and in such the concepts of the constructs that bind us as a society.
When I read the constitution, which I do frequently, early articles and bills are simple and straight forward, as time has progressed it is the changes and amendments to the ideas that have been obscured by legalese.
This has been caused by politicians, without them we would be much better off as a society

a reply to: CaliGirl69
IMO life would be good why do we such a HUGH Infrastructure ? The Govmt was designed to be OUT of our Lives No?

a reply to: CaliGirl69

Me,....A lot less money spent on government. Less Taxes, More Money in OUR Pockets, But just me.

What do you think would happen if the Gov we have were ousted and services were paid by you as you need them?
Roads - Toll
Schools - Pay tuition or school at home
Unemployment Insurance - pay premiums based on your likelihood to be come unemployed and have a hard time finding another job.
Health insurance - Argue the cost based on how easy you can get the same service for a human sized dog/pony or whatever.
Police - hire private security.
Utilities - pay for them.
Illegal aliens - They will leave on their own once the gravy train is cut off - If they stay more power to them they no doubt have a marketable skill.
Legalize all drugs - The addicts won't be a problem for very long.
Small neighborhood councils should be limited to 400-500 any larger corruption gets a foothold. The elected representative is part of another 500 pyramid and so on.

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: WingDingLuey

originally posted by: Annee

If the Constitution is so great — why so many Constitutional lawyers?

Uh, yeah — too bad all individuals don’t have values of integrity.

The freedom you promote only works with those who think the same.

the constitutional lawyers protect against illegal constitution violations

intentional and unintentional

what did you think?

not everybody is honest and sane

is there a better system?

Then they should all be in agreement.

?? explain ??