Myocarditis

originally posted by: Ksihkehe

Each injection increases your chance of getting COVID

This study was focused on the new updated (Bivalent) COVID-19 Vaccines developed after Omicron, it isn't peer review, but is interesting, so what is your point other than to wide brush it over everything while cherry picking what you like and ignoring what you do not like. You didn't debunk anything, and your linked study said this about the initial rollout of the vaccines...

The initial vaccines were amazingly effective in preventing COVID-19, saved a large number of lives, and changed the impact of the pandemic.

Do you agree with that statement from your own linked study?

Here is their conclusion...

In conclusion, this study found an overall modest protective effect of the bivalent vaccine booster against COVID-19, among working-aged adults. The effect of multiple COVID-19 vaccine doses on future risk of COVID-19 needs further study.

Further read from the study...

Although the in initial vaccines were very effective, the majority of the population in resource-poor countries could not get vaccinated in time, and waves of infection occurred around the world. Continued acquisition of mutations in the virus, from natural evolution in response to interaction with the immune response among the human population, led to the emergence and spread of SARS-CoV-2 variants. Despite this, those previously infected or vaccinated continued to have substantial protection against reinfection by virtual of natural or vaccine-induced immunity [6]. The arrival of the Omicron variant in December 2021, brought a significant change to the immune protection landscape. Previously infected or vaccinated individuals were no longer protected from COVID-19 [6]. Vaccine boosting provided some protection against the Omicron variant [7,8], but the degree of protection was not near that of the original vaccine against the pre-Omicron variants of SARS-CoV-2 [8]. After the emergence of the Omicron variant, prior infection with an earlier lineage of the Omicron variant protected against subsequent infection with a subsequent lineage [9], but such protection appeared to wear off within a few months [10]. During the Omicron phase of the pandemic, protection from vaccine-induced immunity decreased within a few months after vaccine boosting [8].

Recognition that the original COVID-19 vaccines provided much less protection after the emergence of the Omicron variant, spurred efforts to produce newer vaccines that were more effective. It is made available under a CC-BY-NC-ND 4.0 International license. These efforts culminated in the approval by the US Food and Drug Administration, on 31 August 2022, of bivalent COVID-19 mRNA vaccines, which contained antigens represented in the original vaccine as well as antigens representing the BA.4/BA.5 lineages of the Omicron variant. Given the demonstrated safety of the earlier mRNA vaccines and the perceived urgency of need of a more effective preventive tool, these vaccines were approved without demonstration of effectiveness in clinical studies.

Every time you post and link you really go off the path of what you keep linking in creating your own custom interpretations and then calling them fact.

No need for me to follow up as you ask since you will spew more BS and call it fact. This study also doesn't go into the level of illness with each case as in how many sick days did each of the 55,000 workers take, so the study was only focused on one area, but the level of illness is critical wouldn't you say? This is what I talked about in the post you replied to and not the increase in the infection rate after Omicron which is what you replied with that IDK why other than it seems you have reposted this over and over, so I guess it is now your go to on everything...lol

a reply to: Xtrozero
I repeat the same thing over and over to you because of my prior experience working with special needs children. It usually works with them though, so perhaps I need to change my approach.

You won't follow up on anything else in my post because you can't. That spike proteins are in the lymph nodes at two weeks after vaccination is completely over your head and blows your nonsense about natural infection being worse out the window. Most natural infections are cleared at 7 days and I linked that study to you a while back in the same thread you kept repeating the grossly ignorant claim that VAERS was overreported.

You dodged that question about being up to date on the vaccine booster, so I guess they have indeed failed the Dr. Dudebro risk/benefit analysis? Not safe and effective enough to counter the risk for Dr. Dudebro, but people should feel confident injecting their kids. The Science.

People should be aware that you're mostly asking me to agree with quotes that are not based on any data present in the study. All those funny little numbers in brackets? [8][7,8][10]? Those are all references to other studies and they're not part of this study data.

I'm not trying to convince you of anything, just prevent people from thinking you're anything more than a biological zerox machine for pharma propaganda. People can decide for themselves if they trust the guy that doesn't understand when he quotes secondary material from studies or me.

I do love that you quoted a wall of text you don't understand without any comment except "further read from the study", but it includes this delightful nugget

these vaccines were approved without demonstration of effectiveness in clinical studies.

LOL

originally posted by: zandra
Since covid and the mrna vaccines, we hear a lot about myocarditis, a kind of heart infection that often ends fatally in the short or slightly longer term. I myself didn't even know this disease existed... until covid arrived.

Like a lot of diseases and conditions that lead to disability, this is yet another condition that the public is generally not aware of. When it increases and researchers sound the alarm, it sounds to the average public as if it just "suddenly appeared."

You hear about it if you have certain symptoms, which include possible heart attack symptoms. It can occur as a result of any sort of infection, but most commonly something with a virus.

Everyone seems to talk about mild cases, but if I read correctly myocarditis is practically undetectable.

In its mildest form, people don't know there's much wrong... a patch of shortness of breath that goes away or maybe your ankles are swelling (could be a lot of things so you rest and elevate your legs and it's gone after a week or so (myocarditis healed) or things like that. Physicians don't test for it unless the patient actually brings a complaint of a long-term effect with a lot of good documentation.

They do make a diagnosis when it goes into heart failure, but by that time it's often a really grim diagnosis of permanent disability.

a reply to: LordAhriman

That is true, my friend, but I have learned many more new medical words than the word myocarditis.
Not since the last year, but from the very beginning of the covid outbreak. I also learned that myocarditis is caused by other viruses (so you don't have to point that out to me). If you know better than Professor Marelli-Berg (see first link) or have a link to a professor like her that contradicts her, please let me know. Btw, Most of all, I learned that what can be read in the big media is censored in an outrageous way.

How anyone supports the murderous criminals enriching themselves on other people's misery even after everything which has come to light recently is utterly beyond my comprehension.

Brainwashing is exponentially more effective than the vaxx: prove me wrong.

originally posted by: Ksihkehe
a reply to: Xtrozero
I repeat the same thing over and over to you because of my prior experience working with special needs children. It usually works with them though, so perhaps I need to change my approach.

You won't follow up on anything else in my post because you can't.

And there you go with the insults...

I could follow up, but I would be wasting my time and there is no reason why.

Just one question... This is from your link you have used a half dozen of times, so do you agree with this statement?

The initial vaccines were amazingly effective in preventing COVID-19, saved a large number of lives, and changed the impact of the pandemic.

a reply to: Xtrozero

This is from your link you have used a half dozen of times,

Can you supply a link for what you quoted in your post please?

originally posted by: Itisnowagain
a reply to: Xtrozero

This is from your link you have used a half dozen of times,

Can you supply a link for what you quoted in your post please?

You could look in Ksihkehe post as they link it over and over....

Link to Study

a reply to: Xtrozero

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: Itisnowagain
a reply to: Xtrozero

This is from your link you have used a half dozen of times,

Can you supply a link for what you quoted in your post please?

You could look in Ksihkehe post as they link it over and over....

Link to Study

I have checked every link provided on this thread by Ksihkehe.......and none of them are the pdf you have linked.

originally posted by: Itisnowagain

I have checked every link provided on this thread by Ksihkehe.......and none of them are the pdf you have linked.

So, what I been doing is going to the link that people here provide as their facts and then go to the actual study their article is based on (that you can get to from the original link) to research what they are talking about since they tend to cherry pick what they like to fit their narrative and conveniently avoid anything else, such as my link from the study and my question.

Here is Ksihkehe original link that you can also get to the actual study from too that I posted to you.

link

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: zandra
Since covid and the mrna vaccines, we hear a lot about myocarditis, a kind of heart infection that often ends fatally in the short or slightly longer term. I myself didn't even know this disease existed... until covid arrived.
Everyone seems to talk about mild cases, but if I read correctly myocarditis is practically undetectable. With 17 BIOPSIES, there seems to be a 90 percent chance of making the right diagnosis (cfr Professor Marelli-Berg ).
Now a blood test would be on the market, I estimate at the end of 2023 if all goes well. However, it may not yet be known to what extent this test is reliable. My conclusion: if covid and the mRNA vaccines have myocarditis as a side effect, how can one know how often this side effect occurs?

We need to look at it a couple of things here.

1. Before COVID no one really checked for it on a grand scale, just cases that got serious enough to warrant medical care. Now we look for it in everyone, especially young men and say wow look it is there. The question is whether it was there before too, and just not something we as a society focused on now. When Isriel came out and said they found 75 or so cases within their 5 million population after the vaccine I asked myself did they check the population before the vaccine too to get a baseline, nope, and why would they.

2. It seems spike protein does affect this to some degree. Looking at 350 million shots in young people they saw 4 per 100,000 got some level of myocarditis that the vast majority was either easily treatable as an outpatient or treatment was not needed. In that same group it is speculated there is 1 per 100,000 normally, but once again we never really checked before unless it was a more serious case.

3. The massive levels of spike protein from the virus is showing 150 per 100,000 for the young male age groups too, so vastly more and it depends on how long a person is sick. Sick a few days and not much of anything, sick a week or two and you might be in trouble even getting over it finally. It seems the big talk about here is just vaccine, but it seems the spike protein is bad either way and the virus will produce a massive amount more in your system than what the vaccine has.

First of all myocarditis is a serious adverse reaction from the mRNA products and most importantly there is no such a thing as mild myocarditis. Inflammation of the heart is a serious condition and regarding it as 'mild' is an attempt at excusing and apologising for the vaccines.

Even if we assume that the rate of incidence is 4 per 100,000 in young people imagine what happens when you vaccinate 100,000,000 (one hundred million people). Well... You have 4,000 cases of myocarditis at least. What happens when you vaccinate 1 billion people? You have 4 million cases of myocarditis. What about when you vaccinate 3 billion young people? You then get 12 million cases of myocarditis.

And that's only myocarditis which is a short term effect. There are several serious adverse reactions in the short term such as pericarditis, myopericarditis, heart attacks, strokes, thrombosis with thrombocytopenia, alleging reactions, auto-immune disorders, and many other, as well as death.

You still don't know the medium and long term effects...

a reply to: Xtrozero


A very important study already posted long time ago in one of my threads. The risks and incidents of myocarditis post vaccination may have been massively underestimated

The authors argue that the risk is far more serious than thought before (although many of us here on ATS knew it already) and that not only it occurs to young and healthy people but to the elderly too.

Very important point is the underreporting of heart disease and death after receiving vaccinations. The numbers could be much higher than thought before

www.medrxiv.org...

Setting: Japan

Participants Vaccinated population was 99 834 543 individuals aged 12 years and older who have been received SARS-CoV-2 vaccine once or twice by 14 February 2022. Reference population was defined persons aged 10 years and older from 2017 to 2019.

Conclusion

SARS-CoV-2 vaccination was associated with higher risk of myocarditis death, not only in young adults but also in all age groups including the elderly. Considering healthy vaccinee effect, the risk may be 4 times or higher than the apparent risk of myocarditis death. Underreporting should also be considered. Based on this study, risk of myocarditis following SARS-CoV-2 vaccination may be more serious than that reported previously.


Further conclusions and policy implications

Despite above limitations, this study revealed that SARS-CoV-2 vaccination was associated with higher mortality rate from myocarditis, especially in young adults compared with 2017 to 2019 population. But it also revealed that myocarditis death occurs in older persons. If healthy-vaccinee effect is taken into account, the risk increases at least approximately 4 times more than the unadjusted mortality risk. In addition, underreporting deaths after receiving vaccine should be considered. Based on the results of this study, it is necessary to inform public about that the risk of serious myocarditis including death may be far more serious than the risk reported before and that it occurs not only in young persons but also in elderly

a reply to: Xtrozero


I am afraid you are trying to downplay the serious adverse reaction of myocarditis and you are engaging in vaccine apologetics and denialism of the reality of these unsafe and potentially dangerous products.

originally posted by: Asmodeus3

First of all myocarditis is a serious adverse reaction from the mRNA products and most importantly there is no such a thing as mild myocarditis. Inflammation of the heart is a serious condition and regarding it as 'mild' is an attempt at excusing and apologising for the vaccines.

OK whatever, but you are proving my point in what is considered serious in testing can also be something that easily and quickly treated as is suggested in 95% cases of myocarditis. This isn't my viewpoint, it is the world saying this from many countries, so either you are correct, or they are.

originally posted by: Asmodeus3

I am afraid you are trying to downplay the serious adverse reaction of myocarditis and you are engaging in vaccine apologetics and denialism of the reality of these unsafe and potentially dangerous products.

Cut and paste again...whatever...

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: Asmodeus3

First of all myocarditis is a serious adverse reaction from the mRNA products and most importantly there is no such a thing as mild myocarditis. Inflammation of the heart is a serious condition and regarding it as 'mild' is an attempt at excusing and apologising for the vaccines.

OK whatever, but you are proving my point in what is considered serious in testing can also be something that easily and quickly treated as is suggested in 95% cases of myocarditis. This isn't my viewpoint, it is the world saying this from many countries, so either you are correct, or they are.

My replies above show clearly that myocarditis is a serious adverse reaction from these vaccines and that there is a high chance of underreporting of the problem as well as a very good chance of the real cases to be much higher than it is thought.

No need for vaccine apology and denialism of reality.

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: Asmodeus3

First of all myocarditis is a serious adverse reaction from the mRNA products and most importantly there is no such a thing as mild myocarditis. Inflammation of the heart is a serious condition and regarding it as 'mild' is an attempt at excusing and apologising for the vaccines.

OK whatever, but you are proving my point in what is considered serious in testing can also be something that easily and quickly treated as is suggested in 95% cases of myocarditis. This isn't my viewpoint, it is the world saying this from many countries, so either you are correct, or they are.

Heart muscle doesn't heal, it's scars over, causing a big time risk of electrical abnormalities in your heart for the rest of your life, assuming you survived, and lowering your quality of life and preventing people from doing things that define themselves.

Trying to brush myocarditis off as "mild" is peak vaccine apologetics. Before 2021 it was super rare and now it's becoming very common. Just because there is someone health care metric that claims because the person isn't dead they are "fine" is bs. It's all propaganda and narrative control.

originally posted by: v1rtu0s0

Heart muscle doesn't heal, it's scars over, causing a big time risk of electrical abnormalities in your heart for the rest of your life, assuming you survived, and lowering your quality of life and preventing people from doing things that define themselves.

Trying to brush myocarditis off as "mild" is peak vaccine apologetics. Before 2021 it was super rare and now it's becoming very common. Just because there is someone health care metric that claims because the person isn't dead they are "fine" is bs. It's all propaganda and narrative control.

Before 2021 it wasn't tested for on a mass scale either...

But hey I get it. I follow what teams of doctors from around the world have said about it and you follow a few that say other things and here we are...