We are kicking that Student Loan Debt like a tin can

ANOTHER pause, seriously another one!

I have a sneaking suspicion what is going on and it isn’t pretty.

So firstly, if I read another story about somebody that has 350,000 in loans that they don’t know how they will pay off I’m going to vomit.
Secondly, we need to stop calling them Student Debt loans. In almost every case, in almost every single story, the theme is similar.
A person is going to school, and they are making some VERY bad decision while there and those decisions get lumped into the loans. Very few of these are actually just the cost of tuition and basic room and board. Many of these have other costs grouped in. The stories I’ve read aren’t shy to point that out either, so not something I’m making up.

Thirdly, Why isn’t there a cap to what can be taken out for student loan? Don’t you find that suspicious? People get capped all the time, for car loans, for house loans, etc. Someone for “student loans” they are allowed to take out in the hundreds of thousands of dollars when they haven’t even made a single RED cent? HAA HAA HAA. In college but soooo stupid.. Now to my theory.

The government doesn’t plan on wiping these out. These are merely tools to keep people enslaved and they are falling into the spiders trap so easily. I knew they were going to do this. Delay the payment, delay, let people build up their other debt, delay, debt. It will get to the point where people can’t pay it, and it will hinder them from upward mobility.


Somehow TPTB really hate it when the middle class climbs to the rich rung. You know why, you find out how much of it is complete Bullcrap! The whole system! Everything. You learn how to manipulate it to your favor, and they hate that!

Back to the Student debt, we gona keep kicking this can?

a reply to: JAGStorm

I’m just tired of hearing people complain about their student loan debt as if it were something that just “happened” to them. They were just innocently standing around and out of nowhere found themselves in debt.

No!

YOU filled out the forms (likely with your idiotic parents by your side). YOU decided to go to a more expensive school than necessary. YOU saw what the numbers were…. And YOU did it anyway.

I’ve been hearing people b-tch about student loans for years. It’s all over the news all the time. If YOU are still deciding to go ahead and do it….. in almost all cases…. You’ll get no sympathy from me.

a reply to: eluryh22

I’m just tired of hearing people complain about their student loan debt as if it were something that just “happened” to them. They were just innocently standing around and out of nowhere found themselves in debt.

I read this story about this guy that was 55, he was paying for his kids debt and his
FOUR Degrees!

Some of these people are just being students full time and not working at all. They should not be allowed another single cent until they work a length of time in a situation like that. They are merely living off the loans why they take
Silly classes.

a reply to: JAGStorm

The government doesn’t plan on wiping these out. These are merely tools to keep people enslaved and they are falling into the spiders trap so easily. I knew they were going to do this. Delay the payment, delay, let people build up their other debt, delay, debt. It will get to the point where people can’t pay it, and it will hinder them from upward mobility.

I think you're right about this. It makes no sense to just wipe their debt clean with any reasonable standard.

It's not fair to those who did the right thing and paid off their loans. It's not fair to those who worked their butts off to pay as they went. It's not fair to those who didn't get an education because they didn't have the funds nor loans to get an education/vocational training.

And worst of all, it's not fair to those who will have to pick up the tab -- the taxpayers! -- because we know the lenders aren't going to take the fall.

However, for those that created this debt and gambling based economic system, it makes perfect sense to keep the little people in debt... which keeps them in need... and keeps them dependent upon their masters holding the purse strings.

On the plus side, at least in terms of vocational training as opposed to (often worthless) college degrees, high schools around here are returning the shop classes for basic but vital skills and trades that once provided a decent living for many people, solid middle class at least. And these skilled tradesmen are quickly retiring out of the force, creating a huge demand for experienced and skilled workers, so it cannot come too soon.

That's good for everyone. Not just because we NEED these skilled tradesmen, but because the more people that are able to take care of themselves, the less people that need or want government interference into their lives. The more resourceful, self-sufficient and independent people are, the less dependent they are on anyone else -- especially a nanny government!

a reply to: Boadicea

On the plus side, at least in terms of vocational training as opposed to (often worthless) college degrees, high schools around here are returning the shop classes for basic but vital skills and trades that once provided a decent living for many people, solid middle class at least. And these skilled tradesmen are quickly retiring out of the force, creating a huge demand for experienced and skilled workers, so it cannot come too soon.

I actually believe the opposite.
Remember my when they Zig you Zag post, I believe this is it but completely veiled. Here is what I think.

Many many many manual and vocational jobs will be automated. I just saw two blips on the news “Why farmers should be getting robotic milkers for their cows”, Then something about robotic assisted elderly care. 😳

Back to my point. THEY do NOT want people to get an education. Yes there are silly degrees, yes there are people that waste their time during college. I still think for a lot of people it is worth it long term. It is all getting muddied by student loans. If they keep putting student loans in a bad light and highlight vocational careers, maybe enough people will switch over.

Yes the vocations can make a very good living, sometimes much more than a college degreed job, but without the debt…….BUT… and there is a huge BUT. A lot of those jobs take their toll on your body. I’m sure not all vocational jobs do, but I would bet a vast majority of them do. That is the payoff.

The only real answer for most of those knuckleheads is to leave the country. Problem for most of them though is their degrees are useless. What most of these teenage college prospects should have done is plan for a degree that would get you a job anywhere in the world and some foreign language studies so they could go to those said countries and survive there. Owe 10,000 to 100,000 dollars and it's your problem. Owe more than that and leave the country and it's their problem.

a reply to: JAGStorm

Back to my point. THEY do NOT want people to get an education. Yes there are silly degrees, yes there are people that waste their time during college. I still think for a lot of people it is worth it long term. It is all getting muddied by student loans. If they keep putting student loans in a bad light and highlight vocational careers, maybe enough people will switch over.

I agree and disagree. Automation is here to stay, but can only do so much, and this is being understood. We will always -- ALWAYS -- need skilled tradesman and craftsmen. So the trick (for the elites) is to make sure the training is available, but to ensure the skilled are indebted to the masters.... student loans.

When they started removing shop classes back in the '70s and '80s, it wasn't because there was no need for those classes in high schools, but because they didn't want it provided for free. Bush Sr got a whole ration of grief for daring to suggest that not all students want a college (academic) education, but that many wanted hands-on training in the trades. But others wanted to force students into for-profit vocational schools right along with the attendant debt and servitude, and they got what they wanted. It worked just as they wanted it to, and in ways they didn't want or expect.

By returning those classes to public schools, that debt and servitude is eliminated, but the skilled tradesmen are not.

Our county has seen a huge success -- and demand -- for vocational training via EVIT, which provides vocational training for high school students at their campuses, and also night classes for adults to learn a new vocation, or to improve their existing skills. It's free for high school students, and very affordable for adults.

im still paying mine every month; even paying more than my monthly bill. its been a nice opportunity to pay down the principle without incurring interest. personally, i hope they keep it up....or make the loans interest free in perpetuity.

a reply to: JAGStorm

Student loans are such a tough issue. I genuinely believe that it is a massive scam, perpetrated on an entire generation of youths and their families. University tuition and costs are super massively overblown compared to history because the government and lenders guaranteed universities that their students would have access to massive debt.

The students and families that took out these loans were predated on. It's a huge monstrous system, reinforced very heavily by a society telling them that to make anything of yourself you need a degree. I'm biased of course, I fell for it myself. I got an engineering degree, and won't have trouble paying off the loans, but if I'd been awake to reality at 18, I would have gone to trade school or a coding boot camp.

The real problem comes in deciding what to do about it. It's the least fair to pay off the loans with tax money, and I think most people understand that. You're taking money out of the pockets of all the people that managed not to get fleeced to try and "help" those that got fleeced, and in the end, those that got fleeced will get an unfair advantage in the form of whatever education they did manage to get without having to pay for it.

The "Covid Deferment" is a crock of baloney. Essentially they're trying to take a portion of the population hostage by hanging this massive debt on them, then saying "vote for me or it comes crashing down on you". The longer it goes on, the worse it gets.

The people having trouble paying their loans generally live paycheck to paycheck, by choice, because they refuse to live "under their means". With this deferment, these people will adjust to their new paycheck to paycheck and IF it ever stops, they'll find themselves immediately underwater because they stopped counting in the debt that they do in fact still owe.

As someone somewhat affected, it sucks. I just take as much comfort as I can in knowing that people are starting to wake up. I know enough now not to pigeon-hole my own children into massive debt so they won't have to live through it like I do.

I have around 30k in student loan debt. I will say this. The lenders were 100% using predatory lending tactics back then. I remember being 18 and handed a form. The person with the form just said "fill this out and we will pay for your school and you can pay us back later". There was nothing else.

What we need is a real education system that teaches kids about credit, money, loan, ext. Our entire system is broken and there is no fixing it at this point.

originally posted by: WeDemBoyz
im still paying mine every month; even paying more than my monthly bill. its been a nice opportunity to pay down the principle without incurring interest. personally, i hope they keep it up....or make the loans interest free in perpetuity.

Not giving financial advice. But if it were me this is what I would do.

If you put the amount you were going to pay to the loan into an interest bearing account, or into a large company stock... oh like Pfizer or such, by the time you have to pay you will have paid it down at a much higher level.

a reply to: MPoling

I’m not sure how long ago you took out your loan and that makes a big difference, in my opinion. There was sort of a “first generation” of student loans/tuitions that created a relatively new situation. Those people, I feel for.

That being said, any who today, knowing everything we know, STILL goes into large scale debt for college….. I’m sorry to say but they more or less get what they have coming to them.

I believe parents shoulder some of the blame as well. A generic 18 year old that has someone tell them, “We’ll pay for your school and you pay us back later” should have already been warned by their parents that there’s no such thing as a free lunch. Even the 18 year old, if he has ever picked up a newspaper in his life, should already know what is going on.

This whole thing could stop now if people simply didn’t do it.

a reply to: eluryh22

That being said, any who today, knowing everything we know, STILL goes into large scale debt for college….. I’m sorry to say but they more or less get what they have coming to them.

My daughter is attending University, they literally spell it out for you. This loan will cost this, here is the interests, etc.
Everyone now knows, there is no excuse.

a reply to: JAGStorm

My daughter is in her second year of college. It's been tough, but we've managed to get her to this point without loans. She's over three hours away, so has to live on campus.

We just filled out FAFSA for the next year and will have to look at loans to get her through graduation. Luckily, she has a scholarship to help bring some of the costs down. But, that also has strings attached with lots of extra time and work to keep it.

She waitresses on the weekends and is saving for a car. She has $5k saved, but finding a car is next to impossible right now. We pay for her uber rides, back and forth to work, so she's safe.

Sometimes I feel like we're in a hamster wheel. Just hoping it stops before too many of us fly out of it.

Edit to add: I just realized my daughter was 2 when I joined ATS. My how time flies.

a reply to: JAGStorm

And just like that, here is another article!!!

www.yahoo.com...

‘Going to college ruined my life.’ I have $85K in student loan debt for my ‘useless degree’ but only make $16 per hour. How can I cope?

Let's dissect this shall we...

went to a great college: It was private and costly,

I have learning challenges

the pandemic hit, jobs were scarce

mountain of other bills I owe to credit cards

refinancing is not an option because my credit score is so low

I don't even need to comment because enough said!

originally posted by: eluryh22
a reply to: JAGStorm

I’m just tired of hearing people complain about their student loan debt as if it were something that just “happened” to them. They were just innocently standing around and out of nowhere found themselves in debt.

No!

YOU filled out the forms (likely with your idiotic parents by your side). YOU decided to go to a more expensive school than necessary. YOU saw what the numbers were…. And YOU did it anyway.

I’ve been hearing people b-tch about student loans for years. It’s all over the news all the time. If YOU are still deciding to go ahead and do it….. in almost all cases…. You’ll get no sympathy from me.

100% agree. If you are dumb enough to go 10's or 100's of thousands of dollars in debt for a useless or semi useless degree than you are an idiot.

If your degree doesn't have a 90%+ chance of paying 6 figures don't do it.

In the 80s and 90s it was practically drilled into children to go to college.

Want out of poverty - go to college...
Your parents are poor - they didn't go to college
You want to eat and buy a home - go to college
You want to be a good person -don't have children in your 20s instead go to college

As a teenager living in poverty in the 80s, I can absolutely tell you that's what they told everyone.
No one talked about a rigged economic system only benefiting the elite - it's because people didn't get an education.
And this was coming from hard core Republicans as well as the left.

The left helped "solve" the issue not by helping to raise wages or provide health insurance but by "allowing" people to go into debt.

But poverty was really about a rigged economic system, so college didn't work to equalize wages. If anything, it made things worse for people, but businesses received the benefit of people paying for their own training.

So again, they will "solve" the problem by forgiving some debt, which will just be paid back in taxes.

But to all of you hard right posters, blaming people for taking out debt is just playing into the sick cycle when 30 years ago, the hard right was saying it was because the poor were too lazy to go to college

.

originally posted by: JAGStorm
.
A person is going to school, and they are making some VERY bad decision while there and those decisions get lumped into the loans.

.....
The government doesn’t plan on wiping these out. These are merely tools to keep people enslaved and they are falling into the spiders trap so easily. I knew they were going to do this. Delay the payment, delay, let people build up their other debt, delay, debt. It will get to the point where people can’t pay it, and it will hinder them from upward mobility.


Somehow TPTB really hate it when the middle class climbs to the rich rung. You know why, you find out how much of it is complete Bullcrap! The whole system! Everything. You learn how to manipulate it to your favor, and they hate that!

Until about 10 years ago, no one was telling these kids it was a bad decision - they were being patted on the back for going to school. Society was actually shaming kids for not going to college.

Your last paragraph I agree with, TPTB created this system. Don't blame some teenager or kid in 20's for falling for a well thought out plan..

a reply to: Daughter2

But to all of you hard right posters, blaming people for taking out debt is just playing into the sick cycle when 30 years ago, the hard right was saying it was because the poor were too lazy to go to college

We need to reel society back into taking the blame for their own poor decision. That is step one. Stop the Blame.

I'm not right wing, but I will say NObody held a gun to anyones head saying they had to go to college. Heck, "they" told me country crock tasted like butter, it didn't.
I still 100% believe in higher education. The problem is that many people are getting the wrong kind of education.
I mentioned the guy with 4 degrees and still can't pay his loans. What the heck is he doing? I'm not even going to trash liberal studies, I believe there are jobs if people have direction.

The problem is so much more than college, debt or loans.
The problem is that people don't know what they want to be when they "grow" up. Some people have zero direction.
There is ZERO excuse especially now. All the information is available. If you get a job at XYZ here is the average you will make. Is it worth a 150K student loan to work there? It's not rocket science!

Yes it is rigged system, so everyone should know by now and do everything to avoid it.