NATO SAYS 7000-15000 DEAD RUSSIANS-Evidence?

a reply to: Brassmonkey

I believe it. Have you seen what just one Rambo can do?



Im in the "First casualty of war is truth" section on it. It's like everyone suddenly forgot the Iraq War lessons.
Fated to repeat the cycle again only its on steroids this time psychologically.

i went though all the comments here and all i see is most of it isnt the goal of "deny ignorance" but spin, emotion and hatred for (pick a side).

lets put the hatred of Russia, Ukraine , obama, CNN or whatever "flavor" cause your supporting and lets boil it down to some BASIC FACTS.

one.
there will be NO ACCURATE CASUALTY numbers of ANY SIDE until after the battle, campaign, or war.
even then it WILL BE TAINTED by the side reporting it to hide something , deflect, justify or they just dont HONESTLY KNOW.
but WILL BE MORE ACCURATE (or at least researchable) than the current moment.

two...
russia had (pretty good estimate) 180,000 (give or take) troops on the boarder for the invasion.

three..
russia has to ATTACK AND TAKE the country. The Ukrainians are the DEFENDERS.

four..
alot of fighting goes from open fields to urban street fighting..
by any past military history it is quite messy and DEATHS DO HAPPEN.

Five... we are using weapons of war that today are designed and effective at causing death and destruction at ONE SHOT and maybe two.

especially anti tank and anti aircraft weapons that are designed to kill with one shot.


so given all this people are gonna die in large numbers and ESPECIALLY in vehicles killed by anti tank/vehicle weapons.

along with machine guns and Field artillery that have been proving since WWI they kill in great numbers.

so the death toll on BOTH SIDES is gonna be more than a few hundred
given soviet doctrine involves attempt to steamroll over opponents with numbers and they are not achieving the quick victory they said they would

why do you think they are not winning? Because people are just stopping and having (as my british friends say) "tea time"?

again i dont know what the true numbers are but all you NITWITS claiming either side is not having high casualty numbers is not living in the land of REALITY.

in short

this isnt the A team tv show or the GI joe comic (of the 80s) where you shoot thousands of rounds of bullets, lazers, missiles, shells, ect and all you do is destroy planes, tanks ect
where no one dies, they jump out of the way / out of the plane/out of the vehicle/ect ALIVE and taken prisoner.

lets try to find the FACTS and cut the bantha dung slinging because you support (or hate) a side, cause, whatever.

scrounger


PS.. if you want to look at what damage the weapons can do a You tube search is easy and quick.

a reply to: scrounger

a reply to: Gothmog

Website like what?

a reply to: Brassmonkey

They aren't photographing a bunch of dead Russian soldiers. That's most likely because it would make them look bad in the eyes of all these countries that are sending them support. Imagine them posting these pics of dead Russian boys everyday, that would look awful. So posting the destroyed vehicles instead is an acceptable form of propaganda.

a reply to: ISeekTruth101

I feel like the MSM has been pretty slow to accept that Ukraine might not loose. Which is understandable, I guess was surprised. I didn't think except they'd do so well.

And Russia probably has up to 1,000,000 active personnel but a lot of them are defensive forces and not suited for attack.

a reply to: Deepstatesecrets

The disabled warship isn't a horrific blow, it's an old landing ship. Still good it's purposes, maybe not for storming beaches but for transport. It'll make it harder to supply Russian troops in the south.

And I found this article where a US marine talks about how the Ukrainians are fighting. It's behind a paywall, you can only read a few per month I guess. I can post the whole thing if anyone wants, but basically it lists some reasons for why the Ukrainians are doing pretty well:

www.theatlantic.com...

Russian doctrine relies on centralized command and control, while mission-style command and control—as the name suggests—relies on the individual initiative of every soldier, from the private to the general, not only to understand the mission but then to use their initiative to adapt to the exigencies of a chaotic and ever-changing battlefield in order to accomplish that mission. Although the Russian military has modernized under Vladimir Putin, it has never embraced the decentralized mission-style command-and-control structure that is the hallmark of NATO militaries, and that the Ukrainians have since adopted.

“The Russians don’t empower their soldiers,” Zagorodnyuk explained. “They tell their soldiers to go from Point A to Point B, and only when they get to Point B will they be told where to go next, and junior soldiers are rarely told the reason they are performing any task. This centralized command and control can work, but only when events go according to plan. When the plan doesn’t hold together, their centralized method collapses. No one can adapt, and you get things like 40-mile-long traffic jams outside Kyiv.”

the advantage Ukrainians enjoy in night-vision technology. When I told him I’d heard the Ukrainians didn’t have many sets of night-vision goggles, he said that was true, and that they did need more. “But we’ve got Javelins. Everyone’s talking about the Javelins as an anti-tank weapon, but people forget that the Javelins also have a CLU.”

The CLU, or command launch unit, is a highly capable thermal optic that can operate independent of the missile system. In Iraq and Afghanistan, we would often carry at least one Javelin on missions, not because we expected to encounter any al-Qaeda tanks, but because the CLU was such an effective tool. We’d use it to watch road intersections and make sure no one was laying down IEDs. The Javelin has a range in excess of a mile, and the CLU is effective at that distance and beyond.

He also says that Ukraine has better morale, and that third generation main battle tanks are becoming obsolete because of anti-tank weapons like Javelin and NLAW.

Twitter is pretty good for tracking the situation in Ukraine.

I recommend these accounts...

Battlefield maps and analysis:
twitter.com...
twitter.com...
twitter.com...
twitter.com...
www.understandingwar.org...

For equipment losses:
twitter.com...
twitter.com...
twitter.com...

For on the ground reporting:
twitter.com...
twitter.com...
twitter.com...
twitter.com...

Lots of good stuff out there that really puts the war into perspective. Both sides are taking heavy casualties. Russia is really in trouble. The question is if Ukraine can hold out for a long war of attrition.

a reply to: watchandwait410

why would you believe anything the news media tells you
when they have been proven liars for decades

staff edit

a reply to: NorthOfStuff

Thanks for that. Gonzalo Lira expresses thoughts and observations that agree with Doug McGregor, Scott Ritter and numerous other military observers. It makes sense to me, it seems obvious.

originally posted by: XXXN3O

I believe it. Have you seen what just one Rambo can do?

Rambo from the point of view of Ukrainian comedians.

a reply to: Salander

Gonzalo Lira is a Putin shill and was spewing pro Putin propaganda before the war even started. Look into the guy, if you want to believe anything he says, when the actual people of Ukraine are saying something completely different, then you are simply choosing to believe what you want to be true, rather than what is.

originally posted by: scrounger
i went though all the comments here and all i see is most of it isnt the goal of "deny ignorance" but spin, emotion and hatred for (pick a side).

lets put the hatred of Russia, Ukraine , obama, CNN or whatever "flavor" cause your supporting and lets boil it down to some BASIC FACTS.

one.
there will be NO ACCURATE CASUALTY numbers of ANY SIDE until after the battle, campaign, or war.
even then it WILL BE TAINTED by the side reporting it to hide something , deflect, justify or they just dont HONESTLY KNOW.
but WILL BE MORE ACCURATE (or at least researchable) than the current moment.

two...
russia had (pretty good estimate) 180,000 (give or take) troops on the boarder for the invasion.

three..
russia has to ATTACK AND TAKE the country. The Ukrainians are the DEFENDERS.

four..
alot of fighting goes from open fields to urban street fighting..
by any past military history it is quite messy and DEATHS DO HAPPEN.

Five... we are using weapons of war that today are designed and effective at causing death and destruction at ONE SHOT and maybe two.

especially anti tank and anti aircraft weapons that are designed to kill with one shot.


so given all this people are gonna die in large numbers and ESPECIALLY in vehicles killed by anti tank/vehicle weapons.

along with machine guns and Field artillery that have been proving since WWI they kill in great numbers.

so the death toll on BOTH SIDES is gonna be more than a few hundred
given soviet doctrine involves attempt to steamroll over opponents with numbers and they are not achieving the quick victory they said they would

why do you think they are not winning? Because people are just stopping and having (as my british friends say) "tea time"?

again i dont know what the true numbers are but all you NITWITS claiming either side is not having high casualty numbers is not living in the land of REALITY.

in short

this isnt the A team tv show or the GI joe comic (of the 80s) where you shoot thousands of rounds of bullets, lazers, missiles, shells, ect and all you do is destroy planes, tanks ect
where no one dies, they jump out of the way / out of the plane/out of the vehicle/ect ALIVE and taken prisoner.

lets try to find the FACTS and cut the bantha dung slinging because you support (or hate) a side, cause, whatever.

scrounger


PS.. if you want to look at what damage the weapons can do a You tube search is easy and quick.

I went through and read your posts. And Ukraine have antitank/vehicle weapons. Okay

And what do Russia have? Just a gun? And run towards the entrenched “defenders” ukranians?

Russia have more than just guns and tanks for ukranians to blow up. As you can see what they did to Mariupol. It’s been levelled. They have destroyed 4000 Ukranian military installations.

They most likely have inflicted massive damage to ukranians too. If 10,000 is the number of russians dead then fine, dont’t tell me Ukranians deaths are 25% of that. And thats what we’re discussing.

originally posted by: Cutepants
They aren't photographing a bunch of dead Russian soldiers. That's most likely because it would make them look bad in the eyes of all these countries that are sending them support.

It's also a potential Geneva Conventions violation.

a reply to: Brassmonkey

Their werewolf battalion was almost completely wiped out when Biden sent the Ukraine orc troopers silver bullets.
Seriously, this is most likely complete bull#. The russians have done what they wanted to who they wanted and serious resistance fell apart within days. Now its just very stupid propaganda we're meant to believe to keep the dream going that there's a brave fight for freedom going on. The NWO gave Putin the green light and Ukraine was thrown under the bus.

"Unfortunately, there are casualties among our comrades-in-arms during the special military operation. As of today, 1,351 servicemen have been killed and 3,825 wounded."

eng.mil.ru...

a reply to: Dutchowl

That must be why 5 generals have been killed after being forced to head to the front lines due to troop incompetence, and 500 were acknowledged Russian deaths over 3 weeks ago before the invasion really stalled and fell apart.

a reply to: Brassmonkey

Given that Russia isn't fighting a straight up infantry war, those numbers are simply unbelievable.

I could believe maybe 300-500.

So much of this fighting is being done at a distance, or with commando units that the Ukrainians simply aren't coming in to contact with that many Russians in order to kill them.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: Cutepants
They aren't photographing a bunch of dead Russian soldiers. That's most likely because it would make them look bad in the eyes of all these countries that are sending them support.

It's also a potential Geneva Conventions violation.

The Ukrainians were apparently contacting the families of Russians who were killed or injured. Which is also a violation of the convention.

It's something that the Taliban and IS did. They'd find a soldier with an iphone and use the face or fingerprint unlock and then dump their contacts. You get about 24 hours to unlock using these methods before the PIN lock kicks in.

a reply to: AaarghZombies

I guess the good news is the families of those soldiers actually know the truth instead of the bull**** the Kremlin is telling them.