Ukraine President Volodymyr Zelensky was Irresponsible in Asking Citizens to Fight Russian Soldiers.

If the war effort is so critically in need of it's citizens to fight to save their own country and those that are capable won't fight to protect their homeland, they don't deserve their country and their country doesn't stand a chance against the invasion.

According to what I've been able to learn, Ukraine has approx 170,000 military personnel. Russia has sent approximately 150,000 to invade Ukraine. Yes, Ukraine has maybe 100,000 reserves but who knows. It appears the Russian military has more weapons to use.

Wouldn't you fight to protect your home? Why not your country? Because you can't honestly think that you can keep your home while the country burns down around you and is taken control of by another power.

The USA obviously didn't take Putin seriously, Putin's own military has actually been confused to what, why and WHERE they are supposed to be 'warring'

And the Ukraine military IS fighting back:

To be sure, Russia’s invasion is only a week old. The strategic southern city of Kherson fell on Wednesday; the Kremlin’s army has intensified its bombardment of Kyiv and other cities; and, despite a flow of fresh arms pouring in from the West, Ukrainian leaders say they desperately need more weapons to destroy Russian tanks and down Russian warplanes.

But the Ukrainian military is conducting a hugely effective and mobile defense, using their knowledge of their home turf to stymie Russian forces on multiple fronts, Gen. Mark A. Milley, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, said on Thursday.

General Milley said some of the tactics employed by Ukrainian troops included using mobile weapons systems to bedevil the Russians wherever they could. Ukraine’s forces, he told reporters traveling with him in Europe, are “fighting with extraordinary skill and courage against Russian forces.” U.S. officials have been impressed with the fighting prowess of the Ukrainians, but their assessment that Russia has the superior military has not changed. Ukraine has succeeded in slowing the Russian advance, but has not been able to stop it, nor is the resistance strong enough to shift Mr. Putin’s war aims. But over the long term, U.S. officials said, it will be difficult for Ukraine to continue to frustrate the Russian advance.

I honestly can't imagine not fighting for the country you live in.

The USA has drafted millions upon millions of people to fight in it's military, even had soldiers deployed to fight in wars that had nothing to do with our immediate security. I can't imagine people in the USA NOT fighting for our country if we were being invaded by a military force, regardless if we had military support or not. It's simply beyond my comprehension.

originally posted by: StoutBroux
If the war effort is so critically in need of it's citizens to fight to save their own country and those that are capable won't fight to protect their homeland, they don't deserve their country and their country doesn't stand a chance against the invasion.

According to what I've been able to learn, Ukraine has approx 170,000 military personnel. Russia has sent approximately 150,000 to invade Ukraine. Yes, Ukraine has maybe 100,000 reserves but who knows. It appears the Russian military has more weapons to use.

Wouldn't you fight to protect your home? Why not your country? Because you can't honestly think that you can keep your home while the country burns down around you and is taken control of by another power.

The USA obviously didn't take Putin seriously, Putin's own military has actually been confused to what, why and WHERE they are supposed to be 'warring'

And the Ukraine military IS fighting back:

To be sure, Russia’s invasion is only a week old. The strategic southern city of Kherson fell on Wednesday; the Kremlin’s army has intensified its bombardment of Kyiv and other cities; and, despite a flow of fresh arms pouring in from the West, Ukrainian leaders say they desperately need more weapons to destroy Russian tanks and down Russian warplanes.

But the Ukrainian military is conducting a hugely effective and mobile defense, using their knowledge of their home turf to stymie Russian forces on multiple fronts, Gen. Mark A. Milley, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, said on Thursday.

General Milley said some of the tactics employed by Ukrainian troops included using mobile weapons systems to bedevil the Russians wherever they could. Ukraine’s forces, he told reporters traveling with him in Europe, are “fighting with extraordinary skill and courage against Russian forces.” U.S. officials have been impressed with the fighting prowess of the Ukrainians, but their assessment that Russia has the superior military has not changed. Ukraine has succeeded in slowing the Russian advance, but has not been able to stop it, nor is the resistance strong enough to shift Mr. Putin’s war aims. But over the long term, U.S. officials said, it will be difficult for Ukraine to continue to frustrate the Russian advance.

I honestly can't imagine not fighting for the country you live in.

The USA has drafted millions upon millions of people to fight in it's military, even had soldiers deployed to fight in wars that had nothing to do with our immediate security. I can't imagine people in the USA NOT fighting for our country if we were being invaded by a military force, regardless if we had military support or not. It's simply beyond my comprehension.

My father fought in Korea,but believe he was drafted. I’ve heard the stories of bodies in piles, and saw what that did to him!

He loved this country though! He would be absolutely disgusted with the way this country is turning out. We can thank weak, pandering stupid politicians who care more about another dollar in their pockets more than any moral code.

I wonder how our people still stuck in Afghanistan feel about it?

We need leaders who can think before they act, not push us all into nuclear annihilation!

I can think of a group of men that had no chance in a fight with superior forces. They took on the est military at the time with little to no experience. They saw themselves as defending their homes and families from invasion. Out of this fight the United States was born.

Washington crossed the Delaware River into Pennsylvania, where Lee's replacement John Sullivan joined him with 2,000 more troops.[143] The future of the Continental Army was in doubt for lack of supplies, a harsh winter, expiring enlistments, and desertions. Washington was disappointed that many New Jersey residents were Loyalists or skeptical about the prospect of independence.

a reply to: carewemust

Ukraine President Volodymyr Zelensky was Irresponsible in Asking Citizens to Fight Russian Soldiers.

Asking citizens to defend their homeland against foreign aggression, which many would gladly do (and which we have done at home), is irresponsible? I'd do the same. It's irresponsible to defend your home rather than surrender to subjugation and occupation?

IMO: Russia was doing its best to show restraint,

Attacking a sovereign nation, unprovoked, and bombing civilians, infrastructure, schools, etc is...restraint? Because you falsely believe it's a part of your national identity and history?

The Russians are starting to ramp up the deaths/destruction after allowing unimpeded evacuations.

Who invaded and attacked whom? Thanks for allowing us to attempt to leave before you bomb our homes and businesses?

Those who want to leave are mostly out of the cities now.

"You should have left when you had the chance?" They shouldn't have to leave their homes, because they are being attacked by a foreign aggressor that wants to change their lives. The aggressor should leave: Russia.

You're advocating abuser mentality, but it aligns with your well-known pro-Russia, autocracy-embracing misinformation campaign against western democracy.

Not surprising.

Continue with your pro Russian anti-American BS. As much as you post you must get paid, but probably not in rubles since it's worthless.

originally posted by: PatriotGames4u

originally posted by: crayzeed
a reply to: PatriotGames4u
Where did you get those silly numbers from? According to Ukrainians they have 130,000 active service personnel at the time of the "invasion". Russia on the other hand "invaded" with about 150,000. That's out of a million active personnel. So if Putin was serious about violently taking the Ukraine do you not think he would use a more overwhelming force?
Things aint what people think, it should (but might not, how regimes like to keep these things secret, like the US) be clearer when it's over.

I used the 80k AD, remaining 50k were reserves activated a couple months before russia invaded.

Russia invaded with over 200k, makes no difference that 50k of those are still on the russian side of the border, they are there supporting the invasion.

Russia is ALSO using another ~250k in their navy and air force for their Ukraine invasion.



Maybe you don't understand how few of those 1m are ground based warfighters?

putin didn't urgently beg belarus for 30k soldiers because russia has so many more soldiers than it needs.

It was because russia is in a surprisingly desperate situation as a result of what their putin idiot just did.



Are those the numbers you were asking about?

Request was a little vague.


Maybe crayzeed was wondering about the 10 million you were refering too, or are you calculating those 10 million as citizens fighting for their country?,,, if not, where are those 10 million and why are they not fighting instead of the civillians, all I hear in the media and online is stories about the civillians fighting but not much info about any military.

where are they??

originally posted by: carewemust
a reply to: bastion

Thank-you for sharing your thoughts so eloquently. What do you think of a leader asking civilians to stay and fight an approaching army, with Molotov Cocktails, Rifles, Rocks, etc..?

Do you think Zelensky is irresponsible for doing so?

That's a major question in the Opening Post of this thread.

I think it's a normal response to being invaded. - the public have a lot of bad memories from Soviet rule and don't want to go back to it. They've experienced decades of war and had militayt training (teritorial army reseverists) so know how to act and defend themselves.

Molotovs are suprisingly effectie - especially with the tanks traps the public have constructed. They're making either Naptha or Napalm as the fuel by disolving polystyrine in the petrol/gas - lots of videos of tanks getting attacked but it look a very nasty death for those trapped inside.

If the US was invaded by Russia or China I imagine/hope the president would call on the public to fight back rather than give up or run away. Same as the UK has defended itself for thousands of years against the odds.

If I was in your shoes I'd ensure my family got to safety (including sons even though they're of fighting age), then return to the front to try and defend and protect their future and way of life - there's a high chance of dying but at least it'd make a big dint in the invasion and personally I'd rather die a quick death fighting for a cause than a long and slow death from old age but dementia and alzhiemer's run in the family which skews my views.

a reply to: alphacenturi


10 million is the newly created territorial defense units made up of quietly trained civilians, each with a handful of professional soldiers as leadership ranks.

THEY are doing the russian repelling in most Ukrainian cities.

AKA "Kharkiv Kids"

Half of Ukraine's professional warfighters are blocking one end of the valley where those 100k russian solders are trapped as hostages.

The other half is doing everything else.

a reply to: bastion


I observed what I know to be napalm manufacturing in an msm video a few days ago.

msm didn't appear to understand what they were showing.

a reply to: PatriotGames4u

Thanks Patriot, I thought thats what you might have meant.

It seems the media is focused on the civilian aspect for their own ratings and glory, honestly they make it seem as if only the citizens are fighting, not much footage of actual ukrainian military, except for a few snippets here and there.

The media focus is soley on the story of "civilians against Russia".

Not sure what the end game will be at this point.

originally posted by: alphacenturi
a reply to: PatriotGames4u

Thanks Patriot, I thought thats what you might have meant.

It seems the media is focused on the civilian aspect for their own ratings and glory, honestly they make it seem as if only the citizens are fighting, not much footage of actual ukrainian military, except for a few snippets here and there.

The media focus is soley on the story of "civilians against Russia".

Not sure what the end game will be at this point.

I think you are correct on this AND I also think Zelinsky is encouraging it.

Have repeatedly seen some not so subtle indications on this.

Not sure it's a good idea, but that is what I see.

I guess if you wanted to put a truly sinister face on this, it would be a good way to get rid of many of the people who "would" stay and fight if they needed to. Its no secret the US would love to round up that bunch of patriots right here at home. The difficulty is figuring out exactly who they are. All but the most vocal are pretty well hidden. So send out a rally call, and there ya go...

originally posted by: all2human
a reply to: mysterioustranger

Both sides suck
But i think it should be a choice,esp when confronted by such overwhelming force
Ukrainian men aged 18 to 60 have been banned from leaving the country and urged to join the army

Indeed. If Putin, Assad etc did this the msm would call it a human shield and blame their leader for condemning them to certain death under unbeatable odds. I’ve no doubt Putin is spinning everything the reverse way to his people. So much ‘perspective’ at work.

Personally I see a man in a bunker being brave with other people’s lives. I see a western media directed to prop him up as a hero for doing this in the hope that the sum of this bad publicity for Putin feeds through to his people and weakens his position at home.

All these ‘leaders’ in distant rooms or bunkers playing high stakes with the lives of their peoples

originally posted by: PatriotGames4u
a reply to: alphacenturi


10 million is the newly created territorial defense units made up of quietly trained civilians, each with a handful of professional soldiers as leadership ranks.

THEY are doing the russian repelling in most Ukrainian cities.

AKA "Kharkiv Kids"

Half of Ukraine's professional warfighters are blocking one end of the valley where those 100k russian solders are trapped as hostages.

The other half is doing everything else.

You are saying that 100k russian soldiers are trapped as hostages? Russia has air superiority right now - how exactly do you trap them in any way, shape or form when they can bomb your defenders into oblivion in an instant?

The propaganda that some of you are believing and repeating is honestly insane. I love the story about all the 'super elite russian assassin commandos' that zelensky murdered john wick style when they came to assassinate him. Matches with the 6k dead russian soldiers - seems legit.

Russians are showing a very large amount of restraint. They have given civilians a chance to leave without being attacked.

The Ukraine gov has conscripted civilian males 16 to 60. Do you understand the tactics employed by our enemies in the middle east? Seems like it is a direct mirror of it - mix civilians with military targets, shelter military forces and equipment with civilian locations - cry on tv about dead civilians.

If you cannot see that this is a major propaganda push.. well you did say that there is 'no law against being stupid'.

Open your eyes and stop letting your emotions control your thinking.

a reply to: Imperator2

"Russians are showing a very large amount of restraint."

Words fail me, they really do.

And what's wrong with being a bit emotional watching Russia raining down death and destruction upon a free and independent country in an unjustifiable war?

As for propoganda, there's a fair bit of that coming out of Russia.

Now that Russia has shut down foreign media and banned what the Kremlin deems to be "fake news" under threat of lengthy prison sentences, State propoganda is all the Russian people now have.

You pleased about that?

a reply to: carewemust

This is known as "victim blaming", and is pretty disgusting.

originally posted by: Imperator2


Russians are showing a very large amount of restraint.

I think this is the most asinine thing I have seen said of a nation since Comical Ali stood at the podium in Iraq. Did you pull that out of Putins ass while kissing it?

a reply to: Oldcarpy2

They weren't free and independent they were beholden to the west after we installed our puppets there.

Both sides have been mostly full of propaganda...and here in the west they are doing similar thing such as banning RT off platforms and trying to label any russian trying to report on events "state media".

Its amazing to me that people are still lashing out it others for the very same things they ignore in their own backyard.

a reply to: RickyD

No. They were free and independent.

Putin hates that and wants them back in the fold.

Have you not been keeping up?

Russia has just banned Western media and legislated to imprison anyone who spreads what it deems to be "fake news".

a reply to: RickyD


Hilarious.

Stoopid.

But hilariously so.

a reply to: Oldcarpy2

Whatever your need to tell yourself...still doesn't change history.