Iran delivers some welcome conversation!!!

I am making no claims as to my belief in the antiquity of this Lost City as it seems like there are at least two viable options that make it less redefining.

I just love that we keep finding more and more and more things.

www.ancient-origins.net...

a reply to: atlantiswatusi

Maybe the ziggurat found there might be the original Tower of Babel?

a reply to: atlantiswatusi

Nice find!

The title is calling it ‘A possible cradle of civilization’. Then there’s this:

Based on radiocarbon dating, the archaeologists concluded that the Jiroft civilization that built the integrated urban complex had reached the peak of its power and prosperity around the year 2500 BC. However, signs indicated that initial construction on the complex may have begun as long ago as the fifth millennium BC.

With places like Gobekli Tepe, it’s quite a stretch to call this any type of cradle of civilization.

a reply to: KKLOCO

I am not sure Gobekli Tepe can count as a "civilisation" or simply as a place of worship but either way it is most definitely a lot older.

For some other context though, Jericho has been permanently settled for around 11'000 years, which would make it two and a half times older.

a reply to: KKLOCO

Personally while the older I get the more I realize that a ancient civilization might not be out there to be discovered.......finds like this always give me the slightest hope.

I get its a small scale....but still.

Besides....its not just Gobleki---have you heard about the other Tepe they found that might be older nearby?

No matter what we find--if it keep pushing back the timelines on what we know we live in exciting times indeed.

I believe that civilization is much older and likely more advanced than we can prove. The ravages of time and nature herself make discovery of any ancient civilization or tech unlikely.

a reply to: Metallicus

As a bit of a romantic I certainly believe that in my heart of hearts.

BUT the more I learn about Lidar and continue to see how it peels back the layers we just cannot penetrate the more I realize this is highly unlikely. Unless a continent type landmass (or rather large island) was directly pulverized into the sea and that ancient civilization has located there......we just don't see the midden pile a civilization of that size would leave behind.

And darn you Hartes and Hansluns of the board for drumming that idea into my head lol

originally posted by: atlantiswatusi
a reply to: Metallicus

As a bit of a romantic I certainly believe that in my heart of hearts.

BUT the more I learn about Lidar and continue to see how it peels back the layers we just cannot penetrate the more I realize this is highly unlikely. Unless a continent type landmass (or rather large island) was directly pulverized into the sea and that ancient civilization has located there......we just don't see the midden pile a civilization of that size would leave behind.

And darn you Hartes and Hansluns of the board for drumming that idea into my head lol

Don't fret.
I mean, it's only a classification. There's plenty of stuff still out there that hasn't been found. You just need to put away the modern idea of "advanced" when thinking of ancient cultures.
Plus, you still got ancient advanced alien cultures somewhere out there that are LONG gone.

Harte

a reply to: atlantiswatusi

Under the ice.

It's all under the ice.

a reply to: Harte

LOL. I always fancied myself different from most Atlantis believers in the sense that the technology and various spiritual rubbish associated with it was just that. So shimmering underwater crystal pyramids and the like just weren't believable.

I always imagined a series of coastal strongholds that would be unified by similar 'culture" in a way that was a loose civilization. Not even necessarily the same people---more likely a mash up of populations and peoples. Of course getting older I realize how highly unlikely something like that could exist given our recorded history.

As for the aliens---boy they certainly try hard for that stuff. I mean it sounds like there is a veritable fleet of UFO's parked underneath Utah.

originally posted by: atlantiswatusi
a reply to: Harte

LOL. I always fancied myself different from most Atlantis believers in the sense that the technology and various spiritual rubbish associated with it was just that. So shimmering underwater crystal pyramids and the like just weren't believable.

I always imagined a series of coastal strongholds that would be unified by similar 'culture" in a way that was a loose civilization. Not even necessarily the same people---more likely a mash up of populations and peoples. Of course getting older I realize how highly unlikely something like that could exist given our recorded history.

As for the aliens---boy they certainly try hard for that stuff. I mean it sounds like there is a veritable fleet of UFO's parked underneath Utah.

I always liked pondering the idea of Xenoarchaeology.

If intelligence evolved elsewhere, the odds that they are extinct today versus existing today are 50-50.

Harte

a reply to: Harte

I dunno....in the sea of scientific theories that strained my imagination the truest one I have heard is that if Intelligent life exists elsewhere---on a scale relatable to humanity--- the science would outpace their social progression and they would blow themselves up.

a reply to: Metallicus

Older I believe. More advanced I am not sure about.

While our progression is by no means a template (or maybe by no means should be?) for something that came before I look at our nuclear technology and our plastics. Thousands of years of reported life---what 24 thousand for Plutonium? 450 years estimated for a water bottle to break down. Just imagine how much of us will be left behind for thousands of years.

So I would think we would see evidence. Maybe its there and we just haven't found it---but for a culture like that you would have to assume it would be big and vast and much harder to wipe traces of.

I know we have conversations on here about ancient nuclear war....so full disclosure I do not believe in that stuff.

originally posted by: atlantiswatusi
a reply to: Harte

I dunno....in the sea of scientific theories that strained my imagination the truest one I have heard is that if Intelligent life exists elsewhere---on a scale relatable to humanity--- the science would outpace their social progression and they would blow themselves up.

And that would be the extinction I mentioned. Could have happened millions of years ago.
Imagine that archaeological dig.

Harte

a reply to: atlantiswatusi
Rather than an indivdual "origin of civilsation", it might be seen as part of a wider=spread early civilisation.

The last I heard (I might not be up-to-date), farming was thought to have originated in the mountain areas south of the Black Sea. From there, it would have spread both east and west along the plateaux developing communities from Turkey to Iran.

The Mesopotamian river valleys would be occupied a little later, because they were not really fertile until people had mastered the art of irrigation to spread the water away from the main river channels. In fact the Sumerians themselves first appear in the archaeology in a river valley leading down from the Iranian plateau. A couple of clues in Genesis back up this speculation- Cain goes east from Eden, and "mankind" later enters the Plain of Shinar "from the east".

So let's base early civilisation not on any one city, but over the whole mountainous region.

a reply to: Harte

That would be interesting to imagine.
Perhaps a city like Hatra that went extinct after a major public disclosure/assimilation.
Hatra was built with inner and outer city areas securing a sacred inner sanctum.
Not sure anyone today would be able to find it without inner sanctum remains and a recognizable Rosetta stone.
You really can't excavate with just some outer circle ephemeral winds of resonance, it would be like trying to reverse engineer "The Broken Bridge and the Dream" with the approaching darkness.

wanford.com...