Atlantis: An Overlooked Element

I mean, obviously there have been lands that were once above water now drowned. But none of them will work as some lost civilization, and the concept of a truly ancient lost civilization itself is a non-starter because of the utter and complete lack of any evidence. For example, Atlantis conquered a humongous amount of territory. They weren't confined to one little island that could sink and destroy all this missing evidence. Yet they left nothing? When we can find million year old wooden spears, and dwellings built by Homo Erectus? Nah.

Please show the class exactly how much underwater archaeology has been done or has been commissioned looking for human activity at pre ice age sea levels and around pre ice age river mouths .
All the evidence you demand is a minimum of 400ft below the surface of today’s sea level.
Quite a preposterous argument seeing as no one is looking .


a reply to: Harte

This is Bright Insight's most recent video on the structure in africa.

originally posted by: bluesfreak

I mean, obviously there have been lands that were once above water now drowned. But none of them will work as some lost civilization, and the concept of a truly ancient lost civilization itself is a non-starter because of the utter and complete lack of any evidence. For example, Atlantis conquered a humongous amount of territory. They weren't confined to one little island that could sink and destroy all this missing evidence. Yet they left nothing? When we can find million year old wooden spears, and dwellings built by Homo Erectus? Nah.

Please show the class exactly how much underwater archaeology has been done or has been commissioned looking for human activity at pre ice age sea levels and around pre ice age river mouths .
All the evidence you demand is a minimum of 400ft below the surface of today’s sea level.
Quite a preposterous argument seeing as no one is looking .


a reply to: Harte

So, switch the subject away from seamounts? Okay.
There's been quite a bit of underwater archeology conducted around the world. It's far more expensive so there's not as much of it (giving you a reason to claim "no one is looking.") Add to that the fact that in many countries archaeological analysis of a new construction site is required. That creates a lot of dry land archaeology. There's nothing analogous to that with underwater exploration.

I know of some Jomon sites under the ocean that have been studied for decades, and still are being studied. Maybe you should find out for yourself if there's any going on at Ice Age river mouths. I don't know (but I wasn't talking about that, was I?)

Regarding the various seamounts that have been proposed as part of Atlantis, if you knew anything about this, you'd know that it's all based on core samples, not underwater archaeology per se.


Harte

Yep, I said core samples. 👍a reply to: Harte

a reply to: Akragon

Great thread, and I think it's definitely possible if Atlantis existed at all.

But I think this Thread from 2012 makes the best case that I've come across for the geographical location of Atlantis.

I'm sure you've read it at some point.

But still, thanks for sharing.

Some serious issues with the idea that the Richat Structure was Atlantis.
According to Critias (whom Plato used to speak through and not a person but a Philosophical Fallacy) then Atlantis was a huge, multi-centric Island just the other side of the Pillars of Hercules (known to be the high points in Gibraltar and Morocco). It's area surpassed the area of Libya and Asia Minor combined (several hundreds of Kms across). The Richat structure is puny by comparison (max 48Kms across).

Atlantis is clearly placed by Plato as being in the Atlantic Ocean, not inland, because the Antlanteans are described as being a mighty ocean going nation and being located (as the Richat Structure is) 100'sKms inland makes no sense at all.

No, and I really do mean NO, artifacts have been discovered in the Richat Structure other than a few rudimentary stone tools have ever been found there. No evidence for the massive constructions that are described in either the Critias or Timaeus dialogues have been found.

There is no recorded evidence anywhere of the mighty Atlanteans having traded, or fought, any of the ancient civilisations around the Med or even West Africa.

You would be better off looking into Hy Brasil (off the Irish Coast) as a possible location for Atlantis because that also disappeared beneath the waves and is equally the stuff of legends but with greater provenance than Atlantis.

In my opinion

If you want to think about it in Geological terms:

Australia is Atlantis

Island that was lost until the British supposedly "found it" again

Critias: Plato asserted that the Egyptians described Atlantis as an island consisting mostly of mountains in the northern portions and along the shore and encompassing a great plain in an oblong shape in the south "extending in one direction three thousand stadia [about 555 km; 345 mi], but across the center inland it was two thousand stadia [about 370 km; 230 mi]." Fifty stadia [9 km; 6 mi] from the coast was a mountain that was low on all sides ... broke it off all round about ... the central island itself was five stades in diameter [about 0.92 km; 0.57 mi]

This describes the Northern Territory. The oblong "Great Australian Bite" and Ayres rock

I think you'll find that the 12 Apostles are the "Pillars of Hercules"




Though, if you were speaking in terms of Tasmania, being the entry to the main continent. When it was possibly still attached to Australia. And when the Northern Territory was possibly still attached to Asia through Papua New Guinea and Indonesia, then I would suggest the dolerite pillars of Tasmania in places like Cape Huay and Cape Raoul would be the pillars spoken of

But,

Atlantis isn't what people think. It's not even a true geological aspect. It is just regarded as such. Atlantis actually refers to something completely different. It's non-geological. It's a riddle

It's not somewhere that is meant to be found. It's something geologically metaphored that is supposed to be understood, regarding your brain and intelligence

If you understand the patterns, you know what Atlantis is

But, if you don't understand and you want it to be geological? Australia is Atlantis

a reply to: keithisco1

Fundamental Error in understanding The city of Atlantis and the Land of Atlantis are not the same thing, it was a city on or the land or island of Atlantis or whatever the name of that place real or allegorical was.

As for the size.

Time Stamp 2:30 onward.

And compare to this that map showing the river system to the ancient map shown in this video.


Time stamp 3:30

There is one major difference and that is the huge river that bisected the area we would call Atlantis from the rest of the Sahara region (and indeed seemingly from the bulk of Africa as well), this would have made that area an Island?.

There is no proof it is Atlantis but it is a damned sight better fit than Australia or South America or even the possibly sunken islands off the Azores or Canaries OR Antarctica or Iceland or the British Isles (though we do have those stone circles - spooky right).

There were almost definitely MANY Atlantis (oh not by name but entire coast lines and even islands some very large have submerged and there are even sunken continents and past ones that we can prove, some are so ancient they have past under our modern continent's and other's such as Zealandia were not recognized until modern technology discovered them, humanity COULD BE far, far older and many of these other Atlantis/Mu's (they are not the same legend and not just two versions of it either) were probably sunken long before Plato's Atlantis was even supposed to exist such as the ruins off of Cuba.

It may or it may not be but none of us can prove our pet theory's.

12600 years ago and before there was a lot of rainfall, those were not small rivers but HUGE rivers, massive channels that may at times have been so wide in parts you could not see the other side or the other, natural borders between lands?.

a reply to: Akragon

I've seen this become the internets new fave spot the past year as atlantis home. Though i still believe its beyond the pillars and under the ocean, maybe encompassing the Azores pyramids found 30 years ago, cant believe its been that long and nobody has updated data when its quite an easy investigation sitting just below the water. I see the Richat as a plasma strike between a close body, Venus perhaps? It looks like many of our moons "craters" that litter the silver ghosts landscape.

a reply to: 64hawaiiguy

There are story's, one is about a Russian scientists during soviet times on an expedition whom purportedly (though I only can find the one source) pulled up statues and other Artefacts from a ruined city a few hundred miles out from the straits, according to that story the remains of a monorail system and buildings built with a kind of plastic as well as stone were supposedly found, I have just done a quick search but can not find an article though I read it many years back but any Atlantis buff here will be able to point out that article as I believe it was also quoted in the infamous book Atlantis by Charles Berlitz.

Still here is some reading to think on, without proof though many of these may be regarded as anecdotal at best just as that story was.
www.beforeus.com...

earthbeforeflood.com...
beforeatlantis.com...

www.akensai.com...

Older than Atlantis? (or was there a rapid continental tilting of the south American continent it's western sea board rising upwards while it's southern seaboard sunk down possibly during the end of the last ice age or even precipitating it along with the cometary strikes on the Greenland and north American ice sheet's? throwing this city deep under water and the likes of Lake Titicaca once a sea fjord and the city and port of Puma Punku and Tiwanaku up into the sky scattering there building blocks like a child's Lego pieces - which would have simultaneously forced the Atlantic sea bed down in that region as well and the underlying magma to move east toward Africa perhaps even pushing up the western seaboard of the African continent though the displacement of subcrustal material - on a much slower scale that subcrustal displacement is still easing out as much of northern Europe and America is rising, much of the sea bed in the world is under more pressure and slowly subsiding as the increased volume of the water pushes it down under pressure - remember all that water used to be locked up in a second continent made of ICE on top of the northern hemisphere such a rapid displacement of sub crustal magma would have left marks though, massive volcanic eruptions at time especially along the mid Atlantic rift which would have become super active and perhaps even a decan traps like lava flooding in that region, it could have also precipitated the sinking and rising of many islands in both the Atlantic and the pacific - near to the south American plate)
coolinterestingstuff.com...

And then we have many far more recent (within the past few thousand years) city's such as those in areas were land has sunken, lost city's and town's washed away in areas were erosion destroyed the very land they were built upon such as Dunwich in England, the fact the Mediterranean basin is Sinking under the weight of the sea on top of it as well may indicate it is far younger than many believe and just perhaps the isthmus of Gibraltar really did get washed away in a tidal wave or broke flooding a once fertile and paradise like sub sea level dry valley region which had two great lakes, perhaps brackish or perhaps not?.

Hey you have to take a fisherman's tale for what it is, always bigger after the fact or just plain ridiculous but I even read a story that claimed the US navy was aware of and made off limits an area near to one of your islands were there was supposedly a modern city or the ruins of it deep under water on one of the former Hawaiian islands (you know your island chain moves with the crust over what is called a Thermal plume a region of hot magma that rises up from far below the crust and that is why Hawaii exists, there are many former Hawaii islands that you can see on a topographical map of the sea floor some just now sea mounts but many now very far below the waves as they have slowly sunken over time once they moved away from that plume.

And one more thing for your perusal.
www.apparentlyapparel.com...

And just to throw the cat among the pigeons.
creation.com...

And even in Known classical history look at the sheer size of some of there ship's, could they have reached the Americas, even Antarctica and Australia?.
ancientpatriarchs.wordpress.com...

Huay = Hercules
Cape = Pillars

Cape Huay = Pillars of Hercules

a reply to: Compendium

Sorry but NO, Hercules is the Latinized modern version of Herecles, also the straits of Gibralter were always known as the pillars of Hercules while to there south the Atlas Mountains are named after the legendary first king of that region ATLAS the same name as the first king of Atlantis, everything except that it is today landlocked matches the story more or less with one exception and that is that it is SOUTH of the pillars of HERECLES rather than beyond in a strait line but indeed if the entry to the city was via a sea channel or now long lost river system then it would have been beyond the pillars as the sailors would have sailed through the pillars then south and then turned back east into the river passage to the city?.

There is literally now way that Australia is Atlantis, though you know New Zealand does have it's own sunken continent and there is a competing - actually not just one but TWO sunken continents in legend other than Zealandia in the pacific, in fact in reality it may hold the remains of more than that under it's very ancient sea bed crust.

Kumari Kandam was said to possibly have reached even as far as Australia or very close to it - relatively speaking - and that is one lost continent of legend (with people as far as Madagascar having language and genetic link's to the Tamil people of Sri Lanka perhaps meaning that at one time just as they believe there homeland was part of a huge now vanished continent) and the other is Mu (another continent that may or may not be the same as Kumari Kandam) or which is most often mixed up with the hypothetical continent that was proposed to explain the presence of Lemurs on so many extremely distant islands known as Lemuria (which was a hypothetical creation of someone trying to explain how Lemurs manage to reach so many unconnected islands thousands of miles apart and from the mainland).

Atlantis has ALWAYS been connected with the Atlantic, even the Aztecs had legends of a lost homeland that sank beneath the waves to the east (Atlantic) they called Aztlan, it is possible that if Atlantis was real in any sense of the word though that it may have had maritime connections to many parts of the world.

In Australia though there ARE pyramid's some of which have been DEMOLISHED by morons that did not want to have to rewrite history to accept that ancient Egyptians had been there thousands of years before.

There are story's about the ruins of a Chinese town in some mountains in Northern Australia that I have heard relayed by another member whom lives there on this site and indeed there is evidence that far from being the first (even if we accept the Dutch also discovered it but only because they became stranded there) it would seem that Australia was discovered many times over, not least by the native peoples whom were there for maybe as long as sixty thousand years.

Now there is a link between Atlantis and Egypt but the Egyptians did NOT place there lost homeland in the east but as a mythical island in the centre of an allegorical Nile, so an island set apart form the world by RIVERS, this primordial mound was were the Egyptian God's were created (they were creatures and not divinely conceived but created so there god's were there Adam and eve with there high God that created them therefore being there only true God if you think about it like that).

Now while there are Egyptian remains indicating at least a short period but one of intense contact with the continent at some point in time and perhaps even a failed Egyptian Colony having once existed there but mysteriously for no known reason having failed?.
mysteriousaustralia.com...
It is also true that Egyptian Mummies have been found with Cocaine and Tobacco which come from the America's indicating that either they or some other maritime power they were trading with had access across the Atlantic - or was it the Pacific route that these things made there way to Egypt?.

Still there is no plausible way to connect Atlantis and Australia.

The Maori only got to New Zealand about several hundred years before the English did, there may have been a previous race there whom they murdered or TOOK OVER with some maori possibly actually being descended from these conquered older people - the ones that did not get eaten that is and there are ruins in New Zealand as well.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

We have had people trying to say that Atlantis is in the Andes mountains of south America, in Australia, is the British Isles, is Greenland, is Antarctica and and just about any other place they can let there imagination paint it.

But here is the point Atlantis if it was real was most probably a primitive society, the did not have space ship's and anti gravity cars or power crystals but they may have had a temple that was the ruins of an older civilization, let me explain, hot and cold running spring's, concentric circles are both perfect for a DC electrical generator that would use inductance to create electron flow in those ring's around the station using magnetic fields, the hot and cold spring's would be an excellent power source for a civilization that had not yet discovered or had for some reason abandoned AC.

The truth is that the past of Humanity is probably far older, if Atlantis of Plato existed it was a primitive society, the only metals they probably had were likely to have been hammered not smelted except perhaps copper though Orichalcum is an interesting part of the story and that is a Complex Alloy so maybe they were not that primitive but I digress, if it existed then it was probably mankind slowly climbing out of a very long dark ages and before the last glacial maximum and even earlier before or during the previous glaciation and warm period during which modern man DID exist there may have been many now lost civilizations and guess what they may have far exceeded Atlantis, perhaps even us and they were NOT Atlantis, the people of Atlantis if they were real may have had legends of these other lost civilizations that may have been far more glorious than the primitive society of Atlantis ever was.

And it is not inconceivable that such a previous epoch may have reached Australia even if they were nothing like our civilization.

Some civilizations may have had there science hidden behind there religion and priest king's ruling them hiding the arcane secrets of technological magic from the simple people seeing no reason to share the knowledge, we have built our civilization upon trade and that meant we had to share our knowledge but there is no rule that say's they had to, even an ancient civilisation that had the capability of high technology may have had the mass of it's population living barely above the stone age while only the priest hood and the kinds lived within the embrace of the technological wonders they were capable of, in fact as the Eco crazed greenies push ever further the same may be the inevitable fate of our own civilization, first an economic collapse perhaps accompanied by or precipitated by crop failures will pitch most of the people into absolute poverty were food is worth more than gold, the elite meanwhile will have positioned themselves to pick up the pieces and horde the technology for there own control in vast DUMB's, after a few thousand years the broken spirit of man will only remember the lost age.

Of wonders as legends while they eek out there existence worshipping there God King's in there flying chariot's.

And then many thousand of years hence some day this period will only be remembered in some backwater nations oral traditions while a new technological age begins and a new conquering society builds new empires over the bones of the forgotten God king's whom by that time may have retreated into there underworld or there lunar colonies or even left the earth in search of there very own shangri la among the stars.

Sound far fetched, maybe or maybe it has all happened before?.

Maybe some day in a distant future some archaeologist will be shown something by a miner, a small button with the word Levis on it found in a mine embedded in rock and he will wonder what it is, a curiosity that will likely not change his theory's that the people of his time are descended from the racoon's that rule the jungles of his world, even if he is actually human and looks just like us, the racoon's may have adapted by that time to fill the ecological niche left by the extinction of the primates and humanity may have entered yet another state of terminal amnesia not remembering what once existed long before.

In some military hanger somewhere the remains of a hand blender may be studied in detail by a bevy of scientists trying to figure out what the ancient device was used for and coming up with all manner of weapon ideas based upon there own creative re-imaginings of what it really was.

When the Earth first formed, it's bioelectrical focus point was Uluru (Ayers Rock). The mass of Earth faced the sun and orbited with a single pole and without its own spin, much like our moon orbits facing us today without spinning

At this point the Earth was what's referred to as a solar-moon (Solomon). We were the equivalent of Mercury

All the other planets and life formed from this, but I won't go into detail, as to avoid going too far off topic. Other than to say that all the planets are actually the same planet, in phase. Similar to white light being broken down into a spectrum of colours through a prism

The point is, Australia is the oldest land on Earth

Uluru (Ayers Rock) is the oldest existing point on Earth. The very first solid place to exist, before all land and all life

There is no older Island on Earth

If Australia is not Atlantis, Atlantis doesn't exist

a reply to: Compendium

You are free to your belief my friend, and it is a beautiful one and if you are happy with it I respect that, it is not my belief but that does not matter.

a reply to: LABTECH767

Probably the most respectful reply I could hope for on here, from what I've seen

Likewise to you my friend 👍😊

Sometimes, the question or mystery itself is the answer

All the best

Just a minor correction; Cape Hauy were named by French botanist Francois Peron on 17 February 1802. Peron visited the area as part of a French exploratory expedition led by Nicolas Baudin. Peron named the cape after Rene Just Hauy (1743-1822), a French mineralogist. Born at St. Just, in the department of Oise, Hauy was educated at the colleges of Navarre and Lemoine, became a teacher at the latter and turned to natural history. He founded the science of crystallography.

It does not translate to "Pillars of Hercules"

You may well be correct

What was it named before that?

Thor
Thoth
Theos
Thought

History tells us Theos means "God"?

But I assure you, Thor, Thoth and Theos all mean "Thought"

Who named it this? Or named the prior versions? How?

How could something historically reoccurring have a similar name but be given a completely different meaning?

Or more importantly, how could different languages possibly have coincided the same English word?

History is the effect of the system. Not the cause

If civilisation fell today and Cape Huay was rediscovered by a future civilisation, it would almost certainly have a similar, if not identical name

Cape Huay is the gateway of Saturn. A very important place Astronomically

Though I do understand how it is hard, if not impossible, for people to perceive anything but linear time and accept the limited history that can be seen, offered or "known"

originally posted by: Compendium
You may well be correct

What was it named before that?

Thor
Thoth
Theos
Thought

History tells us Theos means "God"?

But I assure you, Thor, Thoth and Theos all mean "Thought"

Apparently your "assurance" ain't worth much.

Thor
Odin's eldest son, strongest of the gods though not the wisest, c.1020, from Old Norse Þorr, literally "thunder," from *þunroz, related to Old English þunor (see thunder (n.)). His weapon was the hammer mjölnir ("crusher").

Thoth
ancient Egyptian god of wisdom and magic, hieroglyphics, and the reckoning of time, from Latin, from Greek Thoth, from Egyptian Tehuti.

from theos "god" (from PIE root *dhes-, forming words for religious concepts)

thought (n.)
Old English þoht, geþoht "process of thinking, a thought; compassion," from stem of þencan "to conceive of in the mind, consider" (see think). Cognate with the second element in German Gedächtnis "memory," Andacht "attention, devotion," Bedacht "consideration, deliberation."

Old English þencan "imagine, conceive in the mind; consider, meditate, remember; intend, wish, desire" (past tense þohte, past participle geþoht), probably originally "cause to appear to oneself," from Proto-Germanic *thankjan (source also of Old Frisian thinka, Old Saxon thenkian, Old High German denchen, German denken, Old Norse þekkja, Gothic þagkjan).

Old English þencan is the causative form of the distinct Old English verb þyncan "to seem, to appear" (past tense þuhte, past participle geþuht), from Proto-Germanic *thunkjan (source also of German dünken, däuchte). Both are from PIE *tong- "to think, feel" which also is the root of thought and thank.

www.etymonline.com...

You are a practitioner of Lego linguistics.

Harte