Joe Rogan - Jacques Vallee and James Fox

originally posted by: beetee
What I find most interesting about the so called leaked photo is that these purported images that were "circulating" within IC circles was supposed to be of:

1. A cube within a sphere (or a cube - I have seen both claimed) taken by a F18 pilot with his mobile phone
2. A Triangle craft that came out of the ocean with very high level of detail (crystal clear, even)

And here we are with a photo of something that doesn't look anything like either, but a lot of people now claim this is one of those pictures.

There is no way anyone would even remotely describe what is in the photo that is circulating as either a Cube or a any kind of crystal clear image of any Triangle craft.

I find that very strange.

Also, Vallee claims in the podcast that he was told by someone very high up that during the 1952 UFO flap over Washington, they tried to shoot down one of the objects, and a piece flew off which was given to Batelle for analysis. That was a new one to me.

Edit: The person that told Vallee about them shooting at the 1952 UFOs was Arhur C. Lundahl according to Vallee.

That photo doesn't even match the "artist representation" from the article itself.

Here’s some Twitter dialogue exchange and pic/artist rendition from a different perspective....



For what it’s worth..to read the rest of the dialogue... and more

mobile.twitter.com...

(old news)....The Phenomenon trailer.... www.hollywoodreporter.com...

Why doesn’t Jacque get to the damn point? He avoids answering questions and obfuscates, he’s 81 years old, what’s the Govt going to do to him if he spills the beans? By doing ANYTHING to him, they’d be admitting what he said has truth.

a reply to: johnthejedi24

You nailed it.

I fell asleep twice watching it, going to give it one more try. It's Vallée after all.

originally posted by: chunder
a reply to: tjocksteffe

Artist rendition of the photo, which is pathetic.

Yeah, I was hoping for something more along these lines:

originally posted by: johnthejedi24
Why doesn’t Jacque get to the damn point? He avoids answering questions and obfuscates, he’s 81 years old, what’s the Govt going to do to him if he spills the beans? By doing ANYTHING to him, they’d be admitting what he said has truth.

Vallee rarely if ever just comes out and says what he thinks, because (from what I understand) it sounds kind of ridiculous, for one, and for two, he doesn't have hard proof that would completely nail it down. His "control system" stuff is interesting, but he never says specifically who or what is doing the controlling. Could be aliens. Or people working with aliens. Could be supernatural beings. Could be a manifestation of the living, "Gaia"-like existence system of Earth. He doesn't want to be pigeonholed.

Anybody care to join in on a Reboot of....



These are your best guesses of people who don’t wish to share what they know now, but when their life is coming to a close, they have an epiphany, a conscience to reconcile...and then reveal what they know before inhaling their last breath. Add to this list as names come to mind.

Jacques Vallee
Luis Elizondo

The most interesting thing about the entire interview, to me, are the references to Battelle. It was a totally unknown institution for me and they fit the bill for the supposed organization that controls everything. It's been said in the past that there's an external contractor or group that has access to downed UFOs, materials and it was said to be something not controlled directly by the government. I guess most people thought about Lockheed, Boeing or Northrop Grumman, but Battelle seems even like a more perfect match.

The rest of the interview was ok, it's always interesting to listen to Vallée, even if he has the tendency to not reveal anything.

originally posted by: Crusher
The most interesting thing about the entire interview, to me, are the references to Battelle. It was a totally unknown institution for me and they fit the bill for the supposed organization that controls everything.

The link between project Blue Book and the Battelle Memorial Institute is no secret (anymore), see for instance Wikipedia:

In late December 1951, Ruppelt met with members of the Battelle Memorial Institute, a think tank based in Columbus, Ohio. Ruppelt wanted their experts to assist them in making the Air Force UFO study more scientific.
Project Blue Book Special Report No. 14 was their massive statistical analysis of Blue Book cases to date, some 3200 by the time the report was completed in 1954, after Ruppelt had left Blue Book. Even today, it represents the largest such study ever undertaken.

However, the allegation that this institute investigated a piece of metal shot from a UFO back in 1952 seems to contradict the conclusion in their own (then secret, now public) Special Report No. 14 (published in 1955):

Therefore, on the basis of this evaluation of the information, it is considered to be highly improbable that reports of unidentified aerial objects examined in this study represent observations of technological developments outside of the range of present-day scientific knowledge. It is emphasized that there was a complete lack of any valid evidence consisting of physical matter in any case of a reported unidentified aerial object.

Rumors abound, but no hard facts so far...

Ah! the much revered Mr. Vallee who refuses to accept the null hypothesis. Thus answering the mystery with an idea. Yet another so called expert who solves nothing but proposes unfalsifiable solutions. Gotta keep the business rolling along.

Yet for a long time he has been associated with the bunch of shifty spooks known well in paranormal circles. A subject that for some reason is never brought up when he's interviewed.

However there is a finger of suspicion pointing directly in his face

His complicity [along with J.Allen Hynek] in the disinfo campaign against Paul Bennewitz.

.....The Air Force got angtsy about what Bennewitz had managed to uncover, but rather than spilling the beans and warning him that this was classified information, a dodgy misinformation campaign began against Bennewitz, with the objective of scrambling the information so that, rather than hiding it altogether, Bennewitz would continue to obtain new data, and with the help of the Air Force, misinterpret it horribly.

“To this end, an unnamed computer scientist was hired to write a program specifically for Bennewitz. Instead of words like “telemetry,” “range,” and “target,” others were substituted. The same signals would now spit out things like “aliens,” “Home planet,” and “death ray.” Now, the whole thing needed to be delivered to Bennewitz’s doorstep.”

This is where things get really strange, however. In 1982, UFO researcher Bill Moore would be in attendance at a MUFON annual symposium, the same year J. Allen Hynek of the Center for UFO Studies had been there lecturing. According to Bishop, Moore told him that while talking with Hynek over drinks at the bar that year, Hynek admitted to having presented the “bogus” computer setup to Bennewitz, describing it as one of the last “official” actions he carried out during his tenure with the USAF.

This is unsettling data, to say the least, and it suggests a number of things about Hynek and his work. These range from Hynek apparently being complicit with one of the most infamous and well-known Air Force misinformation campaigns against the UFO community, as well as questions raised in relation to just how much official work he may have continued to carry out for the U.S. government after his tenure with the Air Force.


Was Hynek Involved in USAF Misinformation?

It doesn't name the computer scientist. But it doesn't take much research to discover that Hynek's best buddy was a French computer scientist. Of course the story comes from Bill Moore. A man also deep in the machinations of American intelligence agencies use of the UFO subject

If this is true then Mr. V was compromised a very long time ago. Given the circles he mixes in I don't think we should totally dismiss these claims. He hasn't ever removed himself from his spook connections and remained on the board of Bigelow's BAASS until 2019.

Joe Rogan is probably totally ignorant about all of the above.

But he never even asked Vallee about Bob Lazar either.



Excerpt from Vallee's - Forbidden Science 4 -

Now that would have been interesting

a reply to: mirageman

In your view, why did JV 'tattle' on various people in his Forbidden Science series?

I don't think it's valid to say, "selling books" or being a 'UFOtainer'. He's certainly
not poor and has various income streams having nothing to do with UFOlogy.

Of course, if one wished to, one could say that he's positioned himself as the
'trustworthy one', without having really dished out any significant dirt.

Even so, he's been more 'chatty' about his friends and doings more than most
anyone else.

Your view?

It would be guesswork Kev. But there's obviously something more to come after he's left this world. He's donated his files to a local university only to be released 10 years after his passing IIRC.

Whether those files will contain anything earth shattering about UFOs? I don't know. I am inclined to believe that they won't. But I suspect they might reveal the position Mr. V found himself in [perhaps like Hynek] at a certain point in his life. Surrounded by various personalities and left with no realistic options than to carry on down the path he's already found himself on.

a reply to: mirageman

That's my assumption as well, but it's an assumption, yes.

I think that some more 'real dirt' will come out, after he no longer has to be in the
morally gray zone, of giving his friends the benefit of the doubt, when, for the
most part, they haven't been truthful.

Kev

I've never said this before, but when I had my day-long meeting with Mr. Valee, he told me in detail about two personal 'UFO encounters'. The one is relatively well-known. Mr. Vallee saw something at a fair distance that affected him intellectually/emotionally in some manner. Well, by his description, if it had happened to me, it wouldn't have been significant enough for me to write it down or tell anyone about it.. as there didn't seem to be much meat there... but maybe that's just me.

The second story was his story about the retrograde satellite tracking, that supposedly existed before humans had that technology. (of course the proof of that tracking was seized by 'authority figures' and 'buried').

I don't get really excited about that perception either.. it could have been almost anything.. or there could have been the human tech in existence at that time to launch such a satellite.

Now, how Mr. Vallee got so revved up over those two 'incidents' to spend a life as a vociferous UFOlogist, I just don't understand.

Now in my case, I had a CE5 in my living room, including 10-15 minutes of paralysis. Could all of that have been 'in my head'? I can't say for certain. But at least it was a substantial 'delusion', if it was a 'delusion', not some little light far away or some primitive tracking trace.

But look at me, how rabid I got after that... it's understandable.

I guess some people are easily converted to a life as a fringe researcher, with a reason that not everyone would concur was overwhelming.

Frankly ... I’m amazed how JV can write so much and reveal nothing earth shattering, i.e. SOLID PROOF.

I have to give him some credit, as he has certainly mastered how to “work the system” of ufology.... if not, helping to create it.

I agree, he’s certainly not hurting for $ ... www.jacquesvallee.net... ... scroll down to Abbreviated Bibliography.

How about it JV? Throw us a real bone......

originally posted by: KellyPrettyBear
I've never said this before, but when I had my day-long meeting with Mr. Valee, he told me in detail about two personal 'UFO encounters'. The one is relatively well-known. Mr. Vallee saw something at a fair distance that affected him intellectually/emotionally in some manner. Well, by his description, if it had happened to me, it wouldn't have been significant enough for me to write it down or tell anyone about it.. as there didn't seem to be much meat there... but maybe that's just me.

Or maybe that's all of us because what we see is just for us. I'm not saying it is, I'm just thinking out loud in your general direction, but I always think about Crazy Horse, he told the wise woman (or whatever) of his 'vision' and she basically said, you have to figure it out.

Vallee perhaps fell into the trap of letting others lead him away from his personal journey. Maybe now he's too far removed to be able to get back to there.

Just my tuppence worth.

a reply to: KilgoreTrout

It's not a bad thought.

It's just like my own encounter.

I learned much from it.. it affected me deeply, and it wasn't necessarily of any value to anyone else,
and that's just fine with me.

Let people have their own 'spiritual encounters' if they want them, and let them worry out what it means to them.

(anything that deeply affects us, is 'spiritual' (holistically affects us).

Give 'em hell Crazy Horse.

Kev

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

You won't get any argument from me there, Encouraging Bear.

(used to denote that I am at this minute literally smiling)