The Universe Creating Itself From Nothing

a reply to: merka
The key is that light was spoken into existence.
The word, ie Ein Sof -> Keter mechanism was the transference into the physical.
At least in Emanationism, which to me seems scientifically plausible.

a reply to: merka

our Sun AKA Sol
was not there at the 'let-there-be-light-moment'

our SOL and Heliosphere was birthed as a 2nd generation white dwarf star only ~4.5 billion years ago when a much larger Star went Super-Nova

try not grasping at tiny nuts-&-bolts strewn on the floor and seek the bigger picture for once my friend


hell, I didn't even go into the 10 dimensions (waters-of-the-deep) in breaking down the 7 stages of creation... otherwise I would be offering up a 10k word essay to the non-readers

whats the return in that sort of action ?




as for Light being 'spoken' into reality
instead of manipulating subatomic energies into birthing Photons… we, you in particular) are splitting hairs

I see Captain Piccard of the futuristic Star Trek uttering Make It So all the time to get things happen ---same deal with God, spoken into actuality is same as manipulating with your hands for example

I interpret the word, as the conceptual possibility, the underlying information, being the cause of the physical universe.
It seems intuitive that something would need a realm of possibility and formulation of sorts to exist, before it actually did.
Analogues to quantum fields, i guess.

Maybe space and time has always been 2 constants and the Big Bang is just a event. You have to have a place in space and a time in space for an event to occur within. When we observe the Universe as a whole we just see the expansion distance of the Big Bang the sum of 13 billion years, but there is a distance of 13 billion years of expansion on the other side of that event as well and all around it in a circumference. If that is the case, we really don't know how big the Universe space is, it could be infinite, or so large like a bubble among other bubbles that we really can't measure it or fathom it's size. You have to have light emitted or hit something to observe. Instead of looking into the center of Big Bang field of clutter, perhaps we should look further along the edges to see if we can detect an event that is separate of the big bang. Then we could ponder the notion that there is multiple Big Bangs among this great vast void. Furthermore, how do we know that what we are viewing is actually the center of a Big Bang from our point of view?

I always wondered what it would be like to do a experiment taking long exposure pictures with the Hubble on a flat plane N,S,E,W then flip it upwards at 90 degrees on it's axis and do it again N, S and then change the plane off like 15 or 30 degrees and continue on and then take all those pictures and stitch them together and create a 3D model so you can see it from the center of the sphere in panoramic like view in virtual reality with goggles on. The ultimate planetarium, but only deep depth views.

Another shell game with the word "nothing"?


You can think of the pea as representing everything that is wrong with what some people have to say about the word "nothing" or the notion of "A Universe from Nothing" (as the title of Lawrence Krauss' book goes, on which the arguments in the first video are based) or the notion of "The Universe Creating Itself From Nothing". Some people are very good at hiding the pea and making you lose track of it.

The truth as claimed by the Bible:

- God, the Creator of everything (that was created), is eternal
- God is not nothing
- therefore, there has never been a state where there has been totally nothing

God also did not create everything from nothing (as claimed by some theologians). One of this eternal God's attributes is an abundance of energy (see Isaiah 40:26). Energy can be converted into matter and vice versa (see the laws of physics and Einstein's E=MC^2 equation). Therefore God could have converted energy into organized matter* during the Creation of the universe described at Genesis 1:1 (*: matter being an organized arrangement of energy particles interacting in a specific manner with eachother forming different atoms, molecules and states of matter). That seems to make the most sense to me in regards to my observations and knowledge of realities/facts/truths, it fits the facts best.

Everyone can check for themselves whether or not these claims fit the observed facts around us.* Rather than getting distracted from the truth of the matter by means of shell games (either by trying to figure them out or being the one trying to hide the pea yourself). *: also keep in mind that as far as honest physicists can establish and as stated in the first law of thermodynamics, also known as the Law of Conservation of Energy, energy can neither be created nor destroyed. Compare the above claims with those talking about a universe creating itself from nothing when said universe doesn't even exist yet to do anything, let alone such a difficult task as creating itself, and if that wasn't hard or impossible enough, "from nothing" to boot. This mythological non-existing universe that can create itself from nothing is rather impressive in its ability to defy all logic and common sense and contradict all observed realities/facts/truths concerning the first law of thermodynamics. Either that, or the word "nothing" is simply misused to hide the contradiction in some sort of mental shell game.

By the way, the Bible does not claim that God is omnipresent in the sense that many theologians have explained that word to their flocks and students and as it is connected to the idea of Pantheism (everything is God) and Mother Nature-worship (nature is God):

Is God Omnipresent? (Awake!—2011)

The Bible’s Viewpoint

Is God Omnipresent?

MANY people believe that God is omnipresent, meaning that he is literally everywhere and in everything. Wise King Solomon made this request to Jehovah in prayer: “May you yourself hear from the heavens, your established place of dwelling.” (1 Kings 8:30, 39) According to the Bible, then, Jehovah God has a place of dwelling. Solomon referred to that place as “the heavens.” But what does that mean?

The Bible sometimes uses the words “heaven” and “heavens” to refer to the physical realm surrounding the earth. (Genesis 2:1, 4) However, since God created all things, his dwelling place must have existed before he formed the material universe. Hence, God must exist in a realm that is not bound by material things. Therefore, when the Bible speaks of heaven as the dwelling place of Jehovah God, it is referring, not to a location in the sky or in outer space, but to a spirit realm.
...
In All Places at All Times?

The fact that Jehovah has a place of dwelling indicates that he is not in all places at all times. How, then, can he be aware of what is happening? (2 Chronicles 6:39) One way is through his holy spirit, or active force. The psalmist wrote: “Where can I go from your spirit, and where can I run away from your face? If I should ascend to heaven, there you would be; and if I should spread out my couch in Sheol, look! you would be there.”​—Psalm 139:7-10.

To understand the pervasive effect of God’s holy spirit, picture the sun. It is at a specific location but distributes energy to a vast portion of the earth. Similarly, Jehovah God has a place of dwelling. But he can perform whatever his will is anywhere in the universe. Furthermore, Jehovah can use his holy spirit to perceive what is happening anywhere and at any time. Thus, 2 Chronicles 16:9 states: “As regards Jehovah, his eyes are roving about through all the earth to show his strength in behalf of those whose heart is complete toward him.”
...

Empirical reality shows us NOTHING comes from nothing folks. However we put it some force of intelligence had to create this universe.

Call it God or not it has to be.

originally posted by: Willtell
Empirical reality shows us NOTHING comes from nothing folks. However we put it some force of intelligence had to create this universe.

Call it God or not it has to be.

I suppose this begs the question. What lies outside of empirical reality,
nothing ?

Well there is the physical universe and then there is another dimension, a dimension that only has energy as a form, there is no atomic matter in this dimension, it has no physicality. This is what existed 300 trillion years ago, and it still exists today. What ever the age of our physical universe, the big bang was energy being channeled out of that dimension in a type of punch out rip from that dimension to begin physical matter and our universe.

The question is who did it, and why ?

a reply to: whereislogic

This one would have been more funny:

a reply to: Blue_Jay33
I would think all dimensional constructs are part of the physical universe.
The conceptual substrate that makes this possible is the mystery for me, being without form or dimension.

a reply to: rom12345

It's a hard thing to imagine, the closest thing to it in Sci-fi is this

Fluidic Space

It is a different dimension than the physical Universe itself.

a reply to: Hammaraxx

Hi Hammaraxx.
Thanks for the interesting thought exercise.
Haven't read the replies yet, but imagine that somebody must have brought-up the question, of how does that first 'single negatrine' appear ?

We're still stuck at: something out of nothing, no ?

For me: there is no something, that can drag us out of nothingness.

...
Conclusion? There was ALWAYS something, there will never be and CAN never be "Nothing."

What if you only think there is something, because you believe in 'thingness' ?

originally posted by: PsychoEmperor

...Truth is Truth.

Truth= Something has and will always exist, there will NEVER and can never have been "Nothing"
...

Hi PE.

How do you know what 'Truth' is ?
Should not 'Truth' be something that is self-evident, and unable to be contested ?

originally posted by: rom12345

originally posted by: Willtell
Empirical reality shows us NOTHING comes from nothing folks. However we put it some force of intelligence had to create this universe.

Call it God or not it has to be.

I suppose this begs the question. What lies outside of empirical reality,
nothing ?

No, empirical reality is what we see.
What lies beyond what we see is
The unseen

But we know nothing comes from nothing

So, we can surmise what is in the unseen is greater than what it produced.

Look. We don’t have a rat producing a universe, do we?

Or has anyone seen, heard, or thought of a mouse creating a solar system?

Or a monkey making a Galaxy

Or even a human being?

Behind the curtain is not a wizard of OZ

But maybe something great we call God!

originally posted by: PsychoEmperor
...
Simply "I AM" now THAT to me is a much more powerful and profound thing to try and wrap your head around.

Now yer talkin' !

What else is knowable, other than "I AM" ?

In a now disappeared vid by Jed McKenna: is described how the Cogito-Ergo-Sum, is not just another realization, but the deepest, most cutting realization.
There is nothing but this.
This awareness, not a thing.
The sense, of thingness is not real.

This is agreeable with religion, ancient spirituality, personal investigation, and QM.

originally posted by: Willtell

...There are levels of material reality all the way to relative invisibility.

Haven't you heard ? Materialism is dead.

The end of materialism.

originally posted by: Nothin

originally posted by: Willtell

...There are levels of material reality all the way to relative invisibility.

Haven't you heard ? Materialism is dead.

The end of materialism.

All I know is, nothin comes from nothin, Nothin

a reply to: Willtell

LoL ! Hi mate.

Have you considered the validity of Materialism ?
What if you must give that up ?
What's left ?