The American Civil War of 2005 as predicted by John Titor

Originally posted by grimreaper797
yes you did in fact say "I don't see millions of Americans fighting each other and dying by the hands of their fellow citizens" when (unless you can quote him with a link) titor never said such remarks about killing fellow americans. he states that it would be a country verse city type thing. not the people in the city but the people "holding people without due process" aka police ect.

So...Police officers aren't Americans?

Again, what do you think a Civil War is?
And why would Titor constantly refer to it as a civil war if it isn't a civil war?

i did not say that no one would be killed in these armed conflicts, please dont put words in my mouth. i simply said that people would get into armed conflicts. i concider the police and other government enforcers citizens but definately not fellow americans since they are not under the same rules as i am.

Exactly what rules are they under?

you should know i think titor is a fake

Good. You should

but im in here to watch people debate something very contraversal in their eyes.

What's the controversy?

you are trying to make an arguement but including insults along the way and a poor attitude when providing your views, with extreme sarcasim i may add.

Examples?

i have read this entire thread, very carefully, and its easy to determine the character of a person.

Off an internet message board?
No. It doesn't work that way. Otherwise I'd say you're not as educated as others based on your spelling and grammer.

See? Doesn't work that way.

you seem to believe a civil war could never be, which leads me to believe you havent been onthe other side.

I've stated previously in this thread what would need to take place in order for a civil war to break out here. (And I guess the same could go for most modern civilized countries, not just America)

The other side of what btw?

so that makes me believe your ignorant of other peoples situations since i know many people who would gladly pick up a gun to make changes.

It's obvious you're ignorant of other people's situation as you've come to some wild conclusions about mine and you don't even know me.

There are also people who educate themselves, get active in their communities, get into office and bring about changes that way. Are those people less effective than those who would pick up a gun and start killing?

maybe not around your parts but people around here are getting fed up. the gasoline is set, all it takes is a spark.

A spark for what?

And think this through. What do you think will happen if people started rioting and start civil conflicts? Honestly what do you think will happen?

i can tell that you havent though because had you seen this for any time in your life where you were capable of reason and understanding (not a young child that cant really comprehend its current situation) you would see how many people are just waiting for some one to lead them.

This just shows you how ignorant you are. You have no idea what I've been through. What I wrote earlier was just an example. You don't get out of that situation overnight. Again, please know what you're talking about before you post utter nonsense.

i dont think you can make a reasonable arguement of knowing what living in a poor area is like unless you lived it for a prolonged period of time. living there for a year or two is like taking a visit. especially since you were so young.

See above.

lol staying at the bottom. dont tell me about that. you work your ass off so you can be another sheep? pay your taxes work to your death. im not materialistic, but i do have needs. define sucessful. i believe we have two totally different ideas of it. you seem to have an idea that if you become middle class and work for the rest of your life you have become a sucess.

Umm...could you write this in English?

I think you're accusing me of thinking being successful is being a workaholic in the middle class. Am I correct?
I'll go over how ignoran- no...stupid that paragraph is if you are indeed saying what I think you're saying.

the system we are in is depriving of truth and knowledge. to me sucessful is being able to give every person the right to do whatever they please.

The right to do whatever one pleases is freedom, not success.

I'm curious, what kind of laws would you have in your world of being able to do as you please?

we are deprived of education and the necessities to accomplish anything.

Define we?

rich get richer poor get poorer.

This is exactly the kind of attitued that keeps the poor poor and the rich rich. If you go around thinking that if you're poor then you're going to stay poor, then guess what? You'll stay poor. You have to free yourself from that mindset. If others can do it, then you have no excuse.
(when I say "you", I'm talking in general)

rebelling isnt about me getting out of this ghetto, in fact, it has nothing to do with me at all. its about everyone being able to truely be in control of themselves, instead of being tricked that they are in control. theres many things your not seeing and to say something isnt true without the best possible proof, or any proof, is to say the least biased or ignorant.

Slow down and just talk plainly and keep thoughts together.
You're not really making alot of sense.

are you the kind of person that says "dont bother voting for third party canidates, its a wasted vote?" because you kinda seem like it, but this is one thing im just kinda guessing on.

Why would you even guess that?
What are you basing this on?

the fact you stated its a persons fault for not being sucessful makes me even futrther my idea your ignorant to other sides of life, or at least bias to them. go to a school in the bad parts of new york or LA and see the kind of eduication is being given. the chances. you think everyone can get scholarships, especially over those rich private school kids who got a first rate education while you got teachers who were watching to see when the class is over because they wanna be there less then you.

Again, it's all about atitude. If you go around thinking like this, then that's how it's going to be.
There are tons of success stories from people who attended bad schools in New York and LA. What makes those people different?

quote: Originally posted by grimreaper797
yes you did in fact say "I don't see millions of Americans fighting each other and dying by the hands of their fellow citizens" when (unless you can quote him with a link) titor never said such remarks about killing fellow americans. he states that it would be a country verse city type thing. not the people in the city but the people "holding people without due process" aka police ect.
So...Police officers aren't Americans?

That is exactly what i was thinking ThatsJustWeird...


Also, grimreaper797, How can you have a Civil War without members of the same country fighting each other??

You seem to be saying that it will be members of the law enforcment agencies fighting the public. But they are still Americans.

Definition of Civil War dictionary.cambridge.org...

a war fought by different groups of people living in the same country

Definition of War (same source)

armed fighting between two or more countries or groups, or a particular example of this


Therefore a civil war must mean armed conflict between people of the same nation.

This was a question i asked LDragonfire...

Let me ask you a question Mr LDragonFire...


What have you done to prepare for the upcoming major events Titor suggests???


Please answer cos i would love to know!

LDragonFire has not yet replied so i direct this question to all Titor believers... What have you done to prepare... and please be honest!

Nothing. Because if it happens, we'll see it coming and then we will have time to prepare ourselves.

Originally posted by undercoverchef
This was a question i asked LDragonfire...

Let me ask you a question Mr LDragonFire...


What have you done to prepare for the upcoming major events Titor suggests???


Please answer cos i would love to know!

LDragonFire has not yet replied so i direct this question to all Titor believers... What have you done to prepare... and please be honest!

LOL, Im not prepared at all. But don't label me as a Titor believer, Im still skeptical. However Im a Gemini and I have the ability to see both sides of the issue. Unlike "others".

The "future world" JT describes resembles our world more and more. Can you agree with this?

Tell me this, if the world in which Titor describes becomes a reality would you:
1 reconize it?
2 how would you prepare for it?
3 Or would you just react to it?


other questions

Lets say the olympics are cancelled due to bird flu or terrorists, or natural disasters.
Lets say the same reasons above cause martial law in the USA and states that have laws of seccesion in case of such martial law succeed from the union. Could all these things be a coicidence?

Ill say it again, Dr. Brown is not Einstien or a Steven Hawkings, and much of there research is speculation at best. I still wonder if they have colllected the reward yet.

peace

LOL, Im not prepared at all. But don't label me as a Titor believer, Im still skeptical. However Im a Gemini and I have the ability to see both sides of the issue. Unlike "others".

HeHe... fair play... I honestly thought you had bought into it, sorry for the assumption.

The "future world" JT describes resembles our world more and more. Can you agree with this?

Sorry but i cant... I feel that some of his predictions are nothing more than an educated guess.

Like this whole GW Bush and the Iraq war thing. I was talking about Bush going to War with Iraq before he was elected too. So was many others... it just seemed obvious that he would want to finish what his father started.

The rest of his stuff is to open to interpretation. We seem to keep going on and on about western instability but, like i said before, when has the west been stable??

Tell me this, if the world in which Titor describes becomes a reality would you:
1 reconize it?
2 how would you prepare for it?
3 Or would you just react to it?

1. The only time i would recognize it is if the USA had a "REAL" civil war. You know 2 army’s fighting each other type stuff... that’s a civil war.

A major outbreak of mad cows disease followed by a nuclear war would also help.

Even then i would still be sceptical.

2. If (and that a very big if) i did believe what he was saying i would prepare by moving away from any major city, stocking up on food and water, getting myself some survival gear... that kind of thing

3. prepare and react i believe.

Lets say the olympics are cancelled due to bird flu or terrorists, or natural disasters.
Lets say the same reasons above cause martial law in the USA and states that have laws of seccesion in case of such martial law succeed from the union. Could all these things be a coicidence?

Hmm... ok... im gonna open myself up to some flak here...

I believe that we are approaching some major changes anyway... so i have prepared, spiritually and physically. I just don’t believe Titors version of it. I guess i see him as a kind of false prophet.

I follow Bible prophesy closely but really don’t want to argue about that here because it would be changing the subject.

Oh dear... i can really feel the approaching flaming session now

Originally posted by Master Wu
Can anyone prove that the science guy who discredits JT's quantum mechanics is right? Can someone show me what those formulas mean (in laymans terms)? How do you know he is actually discrediting JT? Because he says so? How is that a substantiated fact?
...

let me just say that IF i ever get to find a respectable piece of info claiming that CERN's microsingularities are positively charged to an extent to allow their capture by EM force, i'll be back, because it would alleviate the problem of both, injecting electrons and keeping it in the loop, so to speak. if they could:

1. create
   
2. capture and
   
3. 'feed' it to size - 100lbs or so - while keeping it stable
   

you all would need a new device to close your mouths again, wouldn't you?


btw, since i failed to find the links i ran across posted here... political stability collapses in 2005, d'oh..


www.abovetopsecret.com...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

credits AceOfBase: viking-observer.blogspot.com...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

they are americans but they arent like me, we are not united and any person from my parts would say the same. personally i think it wont be a civil war like titor said. as i said before i dont believe in titor really, just that he made educated guesses. it will be a rebellion.

can you walk around with a gun in your downtown area, i doubt it. i also doubt that you are aloud to shoot anyone as long as they arent immediately threatening your life with a gun pointed at you. nor can you shoot at a man who has just killed some one next to you as they are walking away.

i see no controversy, but apparently people in this thread do, so its interesting to watch. step in whenever i have something to say

i would provide examples but right now i dont feel like looking through pages and pages of stuff just to prove your poor attitude toward anyone elses opinion.

please you tell me how hard youve had it, and how "successful" you have become. success doesnt come with materialistic value.

yes i would be saying that because unless you have some other definition of being successful i think your labeling it as purely material value. and there are the atheletes and the occasional lucky ones, but im not here for myself only. im trying to help everyone else thats having the same problems as me, and as a whole, we arent getting these "chances"

well its a success to be able to achive freedom, which we dont have right now.

what kind of laws, lets start with education laws. the facitilities should have a text book for every child, and that should be a law. the amount of money given to the school should be determind by the amount of kids in the school, and condition of the school. schools must be checked with extreme care at least once a month to make sure the facility is up to date and up to standard. books must be updated every 3 years, not just recopyrighted. ex. using a food science book thats information is from 1977. thats just scratching the surface of what i can think of off the top of my head for education.
now for laws with crime. premeditated murder is a death sentence, no auto appeal. if pleads guilty he/she gets moved to the front of the line. life in jail with no parol is scrapped. theres no reason to keep them alive if they are as good as dead. every state uses the death penalty. you want the killers off the streets well then lets put em underground where they belong. drug laws are changed based on how the public feels according.
i could go on and on, because theres are alot more laws and changes that i want to happen, but i wont since this is off topic.

we is people who are in the position that im in, which is a good amount of people. even you i bet. not by knowing you but just by the fact your on this board means that you probably arent informed of everything going on.

no its not my outlook, you and i, we are both poor. unless you are super rich then im talkin about you as well. just because you may be a middle class or uppermiddle class man now doesnt mean you will in 10 years. did you know that middle class is now anything between 80-130 (maybe 120) grand a year. that means that if your family income isnt over 80 then you are concidered a lower class american. and for the amount of single parents i know, this consists of A GREAT AMOUNT of people.

no im making sense, im saying both you and i are not seeing even half the stuff going on. we are ignorant to the real facts going on, everything is secret and confidential. defend the government all you want but they are the ones running off with your tax dollars most the time.

like i said it was just a guess based off personality about the 3rd party canidates, i could be wrong like i said.

give some examples of success stories, id like to see the idea of success you have.

o and by the way, just because you make it out of the poor nieghborhood and make a decent living doesnt mean your rich. theres either rich or poor, theres is no gray area as they like you to think. why say that, because in the end, your either the ones making the wars, or the ones who are sending your kids off to fight em.

you can think im not educated based on my spelling and grammar, i mean it seems your taking me that way either way so what does my spelling matter?

also nothing changes politically in this country, hey maybe if your one of the few straight politicians you might get a couple local schools in some better condition or might get a couple streets paved. but on a large scale, you cant make changes in democracy, doesnt work like that. the rich are on top, they'd like it to stay that way. you educate your fellow people for what? they still will never see that kind of rich that we are talkin about, they might make it to the point of middle class if they are 'successful' then maybe there children will own a business and they wont have to worry so much about money. but is that successful to you, they still arent in charge of weather or not their freedoms are endangered. they still are concidered another american. only those with major power are the rich. this is because they are rich with money and power. we as the people have no power. do you still believe we should be in iraq? if not, do you have any power to stop it? do you and your fellow americans have any power to say no? if you did say no and they still went, what would you do? go into office and pave a street, crack down on crime some and say thank god i helped my people so much?




[edit on 3-11-2005 by grimreaper797]

Lets not forget that in the last year France, Germany and Italy have had drastic changes in goverment. The EU is fighting with NATO over Turkey as well as starting an investigation into secret CIA prisons in eastern Europe.

Chavez is creating stink in the America's and Canada is in open revolt agianst US trade policy.

China and Australia are cozying up thanks to their joint membership in the Asian stock market. Russia just completed joint exercises with China.

Japan is considering a full fledged military.

I'd say the west has some stability issues.

Also, the equation presented seems to have used Einstien's equations to disprove the ability of time travel. Thats a pretty easy thing to do.

I would reply to you grim but...it'd be a waste of time. You aren't listening.
Also, your post is so jumbled and mixed up I wouldn't know where to begin. At least use the quote function.
So unfortunately you're going to have to wallow in your ignorance until I feel like going through that mess you just wrote, or you clean it up a bit.

Dragon:

However Im a Gemini and I have the ability to see both sides of the issue. Unlike "others".

I'm a "Gemini" as well. If you're referring to me as one of the "others" then I guess that's just more proof that stuff is meaningless

Lets say the olympics are cancelled due to bird flu or terrorists, or natural disasters.
Lets say the same reasons above cause martial law in the USA and states that have laws of seccesion in case of such martial law succeed from the union. Could all these things be a coicidence?

Well, given the history of the world since time began....
There's going to be pandemics, natural disasters, etc. This is no coincidence. Stuff happens. It's more than likely going to happen whether anyone says so or not.
As far as any state succeeding from the Union. Chances are it won't work. Only a couple of states are able to be their own country (Cali, Texas, maybe NY). It'd be an extremely unstable country for years should that ever happen, especially as far as it's economy goes.

Poo:

Lets not forget that in the last year France, Germany and Italy have had drastic changes in goverment. The EU is fighting with NATO over Turkey as well as starting an investigation into secret CIA prisons in eastern Europe.

Chavez is creating stink in the America's and Canada is in open revolt agianst US trade policy.

China and Australia are cozying up thanks to their joint membership in the Asian stock market. Russia just completed joint exercises with China.

Japan is considering a full fledged military.

I'd say the west has some stability issues.

Well according to Titor, the West was supposed to collapse this year...not just have issues....

[edit on 3-11-2005 by FernandoPoo]

Whats the matter Thatsjustwierd ya paranoid...lol

As far as any state succeeding from the Union. Chances are it won't work. Only a couple of states are able to be their own country (Cali, Texas, maybe NY). It'd be an extremely unstable country for years should that ever happen, especially as far as it's economy goes.

Now I do wonder why you would say this Thatsjustwierd? The whole deal of "The United States of America" is 50 seperate states that have joined together threw commerce, Law, and defense. If you are refering to resources I think Arkansas is the only state that produces all resources example. oil, natural gas, gold, silver, ect...ect. I believe any state in the union could leave and be prosperous without the Federal government. Im not sure why you think any state would be unstable of years, most Blue states if I recall support most Red states, If they kept there money in there own state, they would not need hiway money or money for there schools from the Fed. Gov. Is this based on size? or population? Industry? Lets just say I don't agree with you on this one. However I don't think the Feds would allow this, and would destroy them, or try too.

TEXAS its like a whole other country...lol

Cali... has the 3rd largest economy in the western world.

What would it take to break down western society?
1 Much higher unemployment than we have now:Ford,GM layoffs 10X
2 Real estate bubble, just a matter of time
3 Draconian reaction by government because of bird flu, terrorist attacks, or another Katrina.

I think its this simple. Do tell me what you think?????

Have ya read about Mr. Browns e-mails during the Katrina disaster, he should be tarred and feathered and run out of Washington.



[edit on 3-11-2005 by LDragonFire]

[edit on 3-11-2005 by LDragonFire]

Well according to Titor, the West was supposed to collapse this year...not just have issues....

Actually, what he said was "They are not directly involved but political situations are dependant on Western stability, which collapses in 2005." He is saying that the stability collapses, not the West itself. Time traveller or not, Titor was right on with this. Stability has indeed collapsed. And there are still 2 months of 2005 to go...

Thatsjustwierd...I think every state could infact survive on their own..With the state's citizens not paying an federal income tax...The state could raise the state tax to say 5 bucks more a week...I would gladly pay it instead of having all the federal taxes taken out of my paycheck every week.Wouldn't you?

That extra 5 bucks could go into industry,education,or things they would need to stay an individual state.

If Vermont indeed decided to do this The Federal Government would not allow it to happen..So what would happen then?Would the citizens of Vermont take up arms.There would be the civil war ...I would like to think or hope that one of our troops wouldn't fire on a citizen.Unless fired upon.

Titor as a time traveler?Improbable...but ,if true hey cool gimme a ride.
I'm starting to wonder if maybe he was just a very smart individual...or even someone with a special insight?

The Bush Administration isn't dumb.They know it's coming.Why do you think they want the power to use the military in a quarantine..Each state is more than capable to handle and outbreak on its own.They have OEM systems for such events.

Now you'll probably say this is just rambling blah blah blah...but that's cool you don't have to understand it....makes sense to me


Simon

what can be agreed upon as the final nail in the coffin for JT ?

1) 1/1/06 arrives, no civil war in the USA
2) 2006 olympics in February are held

or are some of you going to hang onto the 2% solution. I hope not, that would be sad to see.

Originally posted by syrinx high priest
what can be agreed upon as the final nail in the coffin for JT ?

1) 1/1/06 arrives, no civil war in the USA
2) 2006 olympics in February are held

or are some of you going to hang onto the 2% solution. I hope not, that would be sad to see.

I was watching the Colbert Report and they had a Historical Documentarian on as the guest. He said that it takes 20-50 years in hindsight to truely understand what is taking place in current events.

I have read every page of this thread, I even signed up for ATS because of this thread... and I have stated that I believe that JT was actually a time travelor.

But I understand that most of you won't get it until at least 2008.

So TJW, you say you can prove me wrong in 2006... I say we will prove you wrong in 2008.

So how long will this thread get? It just keeps going and going ...

Originally posted by syrinx high priest
what can be agreed upon as the final nail in the coffin for JT ?

1) 1/1/06 arrives, no civil war in the USA
2) 2006 olympics in February are held

or are some of you going to hang onto the 2% solution. I hope not, that would be sad to see.

1) It's growing... and growing... and growing....

John Titor
"By 2008, I would say the civil conflict is pretty much at everyone's doorstep."
"The year 2008 was a general date by which time everyone will realize the world they thought they were living in was over."

2) John Titor specifically named the official Olympics of 2004 and thereafter, otherwise he would have said "after 2006." The official 2004 Olympics was in Greece (Athens). Greece did NOT pass the torch to Italy (Torino) in 2006 but to China (Beijing) in 2008.

John Titor
"As a result of the many conflicts, no, there were no official Olympics after 2004."

news.bbc.co.uk...
Greece bids Games farewell

The 2004 Olympic Games officially came to an end in Athens with a spectacular closing ceremony on Sunday.

Greek music and dance kicked off an evening of celebration before the flame was extinguished and the flag lowered.

A firework display welcomed the athletes into the Olympic Stadium, with double gold-medallist Kelly Holmes carrying Great Britain's flag.

The torch has now been passed to China as Beijing prepares to host the Games in 2008.

[edit on 5-11-2005 by Roth Joint]

Yeah because the winter olympics are not the true ones because it was created by us not by the greeks...

So we'll see in the next few months...

And with the riots in France... and the riots in Argentina against Bush's administration... I don't know why people in the USA are not doing like those in Argentina against this criminal...


[edit on 5-11-2005 by Vitchilo]

Originally posted by RogerKint

Titor was right on with this. Stability has indeed collapsed. And there are still 2 months of 2005 to go...

I agree the events in 2005 have been the failure of the E.U. Consititution, Attacks in London during G8 Summit, Riots in France, Indictment of top WhiteHouse Officials, China's Military Buildup, One sided trade agreement between America and Latin America, The Rise of the Dictator Hugo Chavez, Rioting in Argentina during Summit, Civil War in Iraq, Huricane Katrina...

There's more... but that alone would be enough proof that the western leadership of this world has at least become "unstable".


I realised that the world wasn't what I thought it was right after I graduated from High School in 1998. It was obvious that what we were taught in our History Class and American Government courses... was NOT at all what we were taught, and that American's were living in an illusion. We don't live in a Democracy at all, let alone the one created by our founding fathers. Our government has become a Corporate Republic, the people will see this soon enough. The time has come for the people of America to install a virual democracy where all the people vote on all the issues via a secure internet site and do away with the Executive and Legislative Branches of our government all together.

But the human is human and it is hypocrit... so people will see the truth when they will be obliged to do so... when this mess will blow up in their faces.. anyway they won't do something until they must do it...

And I agree that at least the west is unstable and if the bird flu is now human to human and that it reich (reach) USA, it will be in a real police state and no more right and quarantine camps...

[edit on 5-11-2005 by Vitchilo]