Turkish TF-X 5th Gen Fighter META Thread

Without sounding like I'm jumping on the 'it's an F-22' bandwagon but are we as humans at a point now where the ideal shape for a fighter aircraft is the shape and looks of an F-22/F-35. Have we reached the limits of manned aircraft design, I say that because I know some drones can look a little crazy. Even the supposed new Tempest for the RAF has a whiff of F22/35 look to it

Sorry hope the question makes sense

a reply to: ThePeaceMaker

Some part of it is physics. You want a long moment-arm, so the tails go back as far as you can. You want planform alignment for signature management. You need a wing angle and shape that works well aerodynamically with your design performance goals.

Here the general shape and compromises are already proven. That means you save money on development, and you have a pretty good idea that your modeling will be faithful to reality.

The shape itself is probably not ideal for what current doctrines and trends are, but it's easy and cheap (relatively speaking) to replicate. T-50 and J-20 are probably kinematically superior (particularly at supersonic speeds increasingly relevant), and if they are not, it's because of lack of thrust. But again, easier to develop something around a proven design than start one from scratch.

www.defensenews.com...

a reply to: anzha
Oh well will give the new Egyptian Rafaels something to play with..
30 Rafels to Egypt
Wonder if they used the Pyramids as collateral?

Supposedly, Turkey has set a date on the unveiling for the TFX program: March 18, 2023.

www.dailysabah.com...

Russia is in talks to work on the TFX.

www.ruaviation.com...

a reply to: anzha
If they get the engines to hold together they might get up to just under an F22 in tech..

www.janes.com...

How is a country, or companies, that have never developed a 4th generation fighter, let alone 3rd gen, going to come up with something almost on par with tge worlds premier fighter in service today?

What, because it looks a certain way, you think its almost as advanced as an F22?

Take away the blueprints and tech that they buy for all their defence projects, and I mean all of them, this thing will largely be a failure in comparison to established manufacturers offerings.

Turkeys economy is sinking fast, its currency worth less then toilet paper. Erdogan pissing off everyone possible.
He will be taken out eventually, and replaced with a Western puppet who will cut all these programs.

If it even manages to enter production, it would be a surprise.
Theyve pushed the date back again.

a reply to: Blackfinger

a reply to: mortex

F-22 is 20 years old now. A developed country could certainly create a clone.

Turkey has an aerospace industry, building and upgrading F-16s, manufacturing components for a bunch of other aircraft. More recently they've been very actively developing drones.

The issue would be mostly about financing and getting some decent the engines I guess.

a reply to: moebius

In addition, they were part of the industry pipeline that built the F-35 until Turkey bought the Russian SAMs.

www.janes.com...

Turkey is bringing in Pakistan to work on the TFX:

www.janes.com...

Tremble in fear, Pakistan which is surely known for fighter jet technology is joining.

Tfx if it ever makes it, will just be a mishmash of foreign technology and software like the rest, with foreign engineers brought in to make it work.
Thats the facts that are often hidden by Turkish nationalists posting on the Internet.


All Turkey did for the F35 is produce parts according to plans provided. And the reality would be that it was all tightly controlled. Otherwise your factory would have been stuxnetted and gone kaboom, because Turkey is such a trustworthy ally of the west that its nationals commit espionage and fraud.

originally posted by: anzha
Turkey is bringing in Pakistan to work on the TFX:

www.janes.com...

Wait isn't their economy like...kinda crashing...how is it they'd will afford to make a 5th gen fighter?

Engine competition for the TFX:

www.defensenews.com...

First pix in the factory:

www.janes.com...

More pix and a drive by of the sensor position.



www.thedrive.com...

LOL

A country that can't build a UAV without relying on foreign components.
A country that can't build a tank engine, and is still trying to source an engine from a foreign supplier.
Said tank being based on not their own designs, but on a foreign suppliers designs. Said tank that still hasn't rolled off the production lines as promised years and years ago.
A country which needed another country to come and upgrade it's 50 year old tanks.
A country whose "pride and joy" corvette/frigate, is based on a foreign design.
A country with no experience building 4th gen jets, let alone a learjet, is going to build a 5th gen fighter?

It's going to build 5th gen fighters, in a project they've allocated what, $2 billion to? When France and Germany, both experience in building previous gen aircraft, are allocating over $40 billion to their latest jet development program?

Turkey couldn't build it's only helicopters. So it bought Italian designs and technology.

Whose going to sell Turkey anything to build it's own 5th gen fighter?

They're going to build a 5th gen stealth fighter, with no experience or tech in stealth coatings, but they're begging the Americans for new F16's and F16 upgrade kits? After they made a big song and dance to their people about their so called "indigenous" F16 upgrade program?

Can't upgrade an F16, but is going to build a 5th gen stealth fighter.

Laughable.
The next Iran banana republic. Sadly this banana republic borders Europe directly.
No wonder Greece and Europe are building a border wall.


Turkey has elections this year. If the EU/USA/World cared, they'd send in observers to make sure Erdogan doesn't steal another fake election and cement him self as dictator once and for all. This is Turkeys last hope now lol.
With a different government in Turkey, they could bend the knee (because that's the only way they'll recover economically and be let back in the fold and even then not entirely), and repair relations.
They could drop their neo-ottoman fantasies, start behaving in accordance with International laws and norms, and if they gave up the S400 entirely probably end up getting the F35 next decade after Greece gets it which is slated to be in the later part of this decade.

If Turkey stays under Erdogans rule, it's going to be an accelerated down hill trend. The TFX will be nothing but talk and internet forum lore.

a reply to: mortex

A country that can't build a UAV without relying on foreign components.

Well, in that case, every country has a problem these days. Even the F-35 has been using components from China. The UAVs in Russia have been using American, Chinese, Japanese, and European components. Likewise, the same is true of the Iranian muntions.

No one makes all their stuff anymore. Welcome to the global economy and supply chain.