Bigelow, UFOs, MUFON and ‘DeLonge’ Road to AATIP

a reply to: 1ofthe9

Kit Green has explained on ATS about the damage to John Burroughs' heart. He is saying a specific frequency band of THz radiation can cause the damage. But the research on it has been minimal.

...John was hurt. He needed care, then, often, and now. He had injuries we now understand are related to narrow RF bandwidths that only in some cases in the past five years have become linked to the specific etiology of cardiac and other injury he suffered. There are likely other persons and other injuries.....

Broad-band Non Ionizing Electromagnetic Radiation caused the injuries. The RF is identified in a dozen classified and a half-dozen unclassified studies on cardiological and neurological injuries ... not thousands of reports. Very, very few physicians even care about this arcane area of research...and fewer know about the injuries sustained by near-field (< 100 M) to humans. The data is sparse, it is not properly Peer-reviewed, it is not understood, it is not the subject of current research. And that is the truth.

See full posting : Link

Now whether you agree or not with that statement it is a matter of record that it played a major part in Burroughs finally winning his battle with the VA to provide him with the treatment and care required. Burroughs was also the only guy who went out on two of the nights when the Rendlesham incident occurred and got close to whatever it was they were chasing after.

As for JV. He was working with Hynek when most of us weren't even born. Some thought Hynek was a being utilised or even working for the CIA. Hynek even admitted that he didn't make any waves because he had access to data no one else did. So I suppose it is fair to ask the question.

originally posted by: Erno86

originally posted by: Willtell
a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

KPB your saying JV visited your home.

Tell him to come on ATS so we could slap him around a bit

Just joking of course...

Me and GUT can cross examine him

You could be his defense attorney

mm could be the judge

I doubt that Jacques Vallee would bother to be so gracious to come on ATS, because he knows that his argument doesn't have a leg to stand on in this debate.

I think JV has a lot of respect on ATS. I respect his philosophy myself concerning ufology, though I'm more interested in his relationship with the IC.

a reply to: mirageman

"near-field (< 100 M)"

This is the kicker.

What did John get within < 100 meters from out in the forest?

a reply to: mirageman

I don’t know about Geller, he did get some scientific credence, but certainly had a lot of bs in him.

Randy, I always knew was somewhat full of crap. I loved the Johnny Carson part!


The lying preacher with the wireless radio God is still in business. He still comes on TV and is back in business.

a reply to: Willtell

So you don't believe in Geller and his miracle during Euro '96?

originally posted by: mirageman
a reply to: 1ofthe9

Kit Green has explained on ATS about the damage to John Burroughs' heart. He is saying a specific frequency band of THz radiation can cause the damage. But the research on it has been minimal.

...John was hurt. He needed care, then, often, and now. He had injuries we now understand are related to narrow RF bandwidths that only in some cases in the past five years have become linked to the specific etiology of cardiac and other injury he suffered. There are likely other persons and other injuries.....

Broad-band Non Ionizing Electromagnetic Radiation caused the injuries. The RF is identified in a dozen classified and a half-dozen unclassified studies on cardiological and neurological injuries ... not thousands of reports. Very, very few physicians even care about this arcane area of research...and fewer know about the injuries sustained by near-field (< 100 M) to humans. The data is sparse, it is not properly Peer-reviewed, it is not understood, it is not the subject of current research. And that is the truth.

See full posting : Link

Now whether you agree or not with that statement it is a matter of record that it played a major part in Burroughs finally winning his battle with the VA to provide him with the treatment and care required. Burroughs was also the only guy who went out on two of the nights when the Rendlesham incident occurred and got close to whatever it was they were chasing after.

As for JV. He was working with Hynek when most of us weren't even born. Some thought Hynek was a being utilised or even working for the CIA. Hynek even admitted that he didn't make any waves because he had access to data no one else did. So I suppose it is fair to ask the question.

mm I do believe John was hurt (really hope no one took me to be saying otherwise!), but the limited penetration of Thz stuff makes me wonder if its really the culprit here. Is there any chance Kit could share the nonclassified references?* I know its a very long shot, but I’m really curious about this stuff.

I have noticed certain things about JV. He’s revising some of his older books, and in one case I noticed some content that got removed. Not sure this is the thread for that though (same with stuff I’ve found on Randi). :/

There is also a skeptic that has been going after JV pretty hard in the last while, but I’ve been hesitant to bring him up as he seems a bit...combative.

*I suspect at least a few of the players here are following the thread. Not much discussion about this elsewhere on the internet. Gotta wonder what they make of us.

a reply to: 1ofthe9

I wonder that too.

When I met with him, I promised him that i wouldn't share anything from our
meeting, that wasn't already published in one of his books / articles / interviews
/ youtube. And I haven't. He never asked me to make this promise.. That was
my idea. I wanted him to be comfortable and to see that I had integrity.

I feel a little uncomfortable that I've said what I have said.. but it's my opinion
that portraying the man as he really is.. very intelligent, accomplished, reasonable,
polite, and very human.. not some weird "Aviary" creature would do a service to
both him and all of UFOlogy.

I would like to say, that of all the scientists that I've met and known.. none of
them pay much (or any) attention to the Internet & Internet forums.. as the
crazies congregate on websites you know.. that is the general opinion that
I've seen.

It's probably the while academic thing.. if you don't have a PH.D, then in general
you are probably not worth talking to.. that is probably a pretty common
opinion -- when it comes to science and research anyway...

Kev

a reply to: Willtell

I think that it's fair to say, and I suspect MM & GUT would back me up;

take out the "IC" and there IS NO UFOLOGY.

Now is there anomalous stuff out there that needs to be researched?

Sure seems so to me.

But as Dr. Vallee has reported.. when three people look at a "UFO",
one might see a saucer, one might see the "virgin mary" and another
might see a helicopter. A 4th person a mile away might not see
anything at all.

But this isn't UFOlogy.

This is something else... it has nothing to do with UFOlogy.

If the IC wasn't BS'ing us that there are UFO's since WWII, we'd
ALL BE SEEING the virgin mary still. Or our personal delusion
of choice.

I wonder if a chill went down JV's back, the first time he
realized this? It sure did mine.

Kev

originally posted by: mirageman
a reply to: Willtell

So you don't believe in Geller and his miracle during Euro '96?

II never heard of that one...Ill google it

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

As the old Margin Gay song says
What’s going on




Something’s going on


Some of us want something to be going on


Some of us know something is going on but can’t communicate it to others

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

take out the "IC" and there IS NO UFOLOGY.

From my detached view from across the Atlantic, IC infiltration is almost exclusively an American problem. Nowhere else in the world are the intel boys so publicly active in the topic. The abduction stories, MJ12, alien bases, cattle mutilations, people promoting tall stories on paranormal radio shows etc, etc. They all come from America. It is a massive industry.

Now it may well be that international spook services get involved elsewhere. But what do you hear from them? Nothing.

So strip out America from the equation and maybe you get a clearer picture? Genuine unknowns are rare. Maybe studying cases outside America would be a more fruitful pursuit. Except for the problem that everyone thinks the American Govt. is covering up the existence of space aliens. Yet they also look to the American Govt. to tell them they exist.

That's the problem.

What mystifies us all is that the people with the capacity to have a scientific investigation of UFO phenomenon have never really applied themselves to this.

That’s JV’s complaint if I'm not mistaken.

Even other countries outside the US, have any of them had serious government sponsored investigations?

If so who, if not, why not.

Now there’s a good question for our scholarly friend Isaac. Who, where, and maybe why or why not.

You know after all of these years I wonder are we informed intelligently about this topic, of why or who has really investigated this.

When we come to the question about this, conspiracy seems credible if no country has done a serious investigation.

Strange

Another thing missing here is the hypothetical perspective of the hidden force behind said phenomenon. I know this is speculative, but to hypothesize about such a perspective may have a bit of credibility, of course, not in the David Wilcock vein.

But out of literally the thousands of supposed contact stories I venture some of them have credibility.

This post leads or is an extension of the last one, as relating conspiratorially speaking…

Vallee’s famous CONTROL SYSTEM.

I always thought of that from the perspective of the unseen force behind the UFO phenomenon, I mean non human, not IC.

The IC imo are interlopers onto something they themselves fear and can't comprehend

Of course, we have proof the IC wants to keep Ufology in the Dave Wilcock, AA, silly putty vein, and not let it filter to serious research institutions.

WHY

originally posted by: mirageman

So you don't believe in Geller and his miracle during Euro '96?

Uri sits under the unfortunate shadow of Spectra; whether it be real or more "fantasy borne out of the fantastic" is anyone's guess. It's difficult to accept as a reality, but considering his accomplishments in testing/lab environments one could argue that the results speak for themselves.

An extraterrestrial AI communicating with a psychic? So 1993...

a reply to: Willtell

The French sanctioned the COMETA report.

The British had the Condign Report and before that things like the Flying Saucer Working Party many years ago.

I am fairly sure the Latin American nations have had their own surveys and Australia, New Zealand and Canada have all released documents on UFO investigations.

But the problem you always have is people are poor observers of things they can't make sense of and our technology is not infallible. Add to that the poisoning of the evidence by IC agents, UFOtainers and radio show hosts and you have a right royal mess to sort the wheat from the chaff.

Hypothesis: The Governments know something. Contact is a straight forward warning to governments to keep things hidden from the public regarding certain contact.


US(IC agencies) are more active on this simply because of the dynamic mode of the American society: Americans are more culturally inquisitive; the leaders of the world culture; and the most populous free country in the world, and last but not least--the new Rome.

a reply to: mirageman

What if I venture to speculate those committees, reports, investigations may have been as superficial as the many American ventures. Window dressing.

I'd even bet every country has its own Robert Bigelow

Interesting…

Then maybe it’s clear the governments don’t take Ufology seriously

For if they did wouldn’t it be reasonable for them to form some kind of international collaboration?

I would also venture that if you look closely at these investigations they are all very insufficient to even get to the truth. Mostly quasi government, ex-government operations of often retired officials

Sounds familiar...

I see an obvious pattern there of obfuscation

And maybe even collusion

I rest my case