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I'd like to point out a few bits of theosophic wisdom that should be obvious
page: 8share:
a reply to: Rhaegar7
Hmmmm . . . .
I'm gonna disagree with you Rhaegar7.
Hmmmm. . . .
Ahriman is a free agent, a Being. You'll find him in the realm outside religous and other collective consciousnesses (inner world "city states"). He does whatever he wants . . .
The "Great Powers of Evil" you'll also find in the religious collective consciousnesses as a part of the collective consciousness infrastructure.
Not outside.
Even the Kabbalah is simply a collective-system; a construct.
These things are all constructs.
To understand that, one simply steps outside of the collectives. The technique is relative positioning.
Karma is also a construct, and I don't mean a fictional construct. Karma exists, it was constructed as part of
humanity's parameters of growth. Karma is not a universal. It was introduced as a part of the infrastructure of a collective consciousness.
Going downwards is not neccessarily going towards depravity nor upwards neccessarily going towards perfection. Those things too are in the collectives and relative therein.
In theosophical terms it is said that going downwards is involution and upwards evolution. Yet even that is relative.
If one chooses to go into the lower astral, Underworlds and hells (hells are also constructs by the way, you find them under churches etc..) in order protect, heal and help those innocent Beings trapped there, is that depravity? It is certainly turning your back on the "higher" and going downwards.
I'm assuming something in the next paragraph Astrocyte, feel free to correct, or indeed shoot me.
Both myself and Astrocyte deal with traumatised people, and that in itself is traumatic. Astrocyte comes from a scientific position, I come from the opposite position. I can't speak for Astrocyte, but I reckon both Astrocyte and myself are dealing with the results of trauma caused by collectives a great deal of the time. I try my best not to be critical of Astrocyte for his position because I don't think much of collectives either, seen far too much needless suffering.
Life is not a "fun" game, people suffer . . .
Collective consciousnesses are places where people loose, to varying degrees, their sense of self. In any collective consciousness you surrender a part of yourself to the collective.
Some collectives are nicer then others. The Rocicrucians for instance, have a collective pool upon which initiates draw. That is a source of power for them to wield, they share their knowledge and protect it. Generally they mind their own business.
Another example of a collective is a cult that manipulates and swallows people whole untill there is nothing left of the individual's self.
Two examples poles apart.
Collectives become problems when the members loose their sense of self. That is deadening. The opposite of this is Astrocyte's enlivening. A wonderful word indeed.
True depravity comes from a rotting within, a rotting of the soul if you wish. Putrifcation of Being is another way to put it.
People need a strong sense of self to survive in this world.
Perhaps my biggest criticism of religion is that they want us to surrender our very being, our self.
My apologies for being forthright, yet I think it needed to be aired.
One last word, collectives are not neccessarily evil, some can be a safety net, a safe place to play. Others are not. In fact people need a nice collective sense that doesn't swallow their self. People need that
Before one ventures "outside the collectives" completely and into what lays beyond, one has to get streetsmart, otherwise one gets eaten alive. Not many survive for long.
Hmmmm . . . .
I'm gonna disagree with you Rhaegar7.
Yeah. I've been thinking that if there are great powers of evil like Satan, Ahriman and others - at least they have climbed the spiritual ladder upwards to achieve a high state of perfection. These forces however have turned the ladder upside down. That's what it means to be demonic - to climb the ladder downwards into greater and greater depravity. It's pretty cool that this option exists. Makes for a fun game.
Hmmmm. . . .
Ahriman is a free agent, a Being. You'll find him in the realm outside religous and other collective consciousnesses (inner world "city states"). He does whatever he wants . . .
The "Great Powers of Evil" you'll also find in the religious collective consciousnesses as a part of the collective consciousness infrastructure.
Not outside.
Even the Kabbalah is simply a collective-system; a construct.
These things are all constructs.
To understand that, one simply steps outside of the collectives. The technique is relative positioning.
Karma is also a construct, and I don't mean a fictional construct. Karma exists, it was constructed as part of
humanity's parameters of growth. Karma is not a universal. It was introduced as a part of the infrastructure of a collective consciousness.
Going downwards is not neccessarily going towards depravity nor upwards neccessarily going towards perfection. Those things too are in the collectives and relative therein.
In theosophical terms it is said that going downwards is involution and upwards evolution. Yet even that is relative.
If one chooses to go into the lower astral, Underworlds and hells (hells are also constructs by the way, you find them under churches etc..) in order protect, heal and help those innocent Beings trapped there, is that depravity? It is certainly turning your back on the "higher" and going downwards.
I'm assuming something in the next paragraph Astrocyte, feel free to correct, or indeed shoot me.
Both myself and Astrocyte deal with traumatised people, and that in itself is traumatic. Astrocyte comes from a scientific position, I come from the opposite position. I can't speak for Astrocyte, but I reckon both Astrocyte and myself are dealing with the results of trauma caused by collectives a great deal of the time. I try my best not to be critical of Astrocyte for his position because I don't think much of collectives either, seen far too much needless suffering.
Life is not a "fun" game, people suffer . . .
Collective consciousnesses are places where people loose, to varying degrees, their sense of self. In any collective consciousness you surrender a part of yourself to the collective.
Some collectives are nicer then others. The Rocicrucians for instance, have a collective pool upon which initiates draw. That is a source of power for them to wield, they share their knowledge and protect it. Generally they mind their own business.
Another example of a collective is a cult that manipulates and swallows people whole untill there is nothing left of the individual's self.
Two examples poles apart.
Collectives become problems when the members loose their sense of self. That is deadening. The opposite of this is Astrocyte's enlivening. A wonderful word indeed.
True depravity comes from a rotting within, a rotting of the soul if you wish. Putrifcation of Being is another way to put it.
People need a strong sense of self to survive in this world.
Perhaps my biggest criticism of religion is that they want us to surrender our very being, our self.
My apologies for being forthright, yet I think it needed to be aired.
One last word, collectives are not neccessarily evil, some can be a safety net, a safe place to play. Others are not. In fact people need a nice collective sense that doesn't swallow their self. People need that
Before one ventures "outside the collectives" completely and into what lays beyond, one has to get streetsmart, otherwise one gets eaten alive. Not many survive for long.
edit on 28-8-2017 by Whatsthisthen because: typo clarity
originally posted by: Whatsthisthen
a reply to: Rhaegar7
My apologies for being forthright, yet I think it needed to be aired.
By all means, feel free to express your own point of view. The goal of discussion is not to agree with everything the other person says. Quite the opposite.
Yeah. I've been thinking that if there are great powers of evil like Satan, Ahriman and others - at least they have climbed the spiritual ladder upwards to achieve a high state of perfection. These forces however have turned the ladder upside down. That's what it means to be demonic - to climb the ladder downwards into greater and greater depravity. It's pretty cool that this option exists. Makes for a fun game.
Hmmmm. . . .
Ahriman is a free agent, a Being. You'll find him in the realm outside religous and other collective consciousnesses (inner world "city states"). He does whatever he wants . . .
The "Great Powers of Evil" you'll also find in the religious collective consciousnesses as a part of the infrastructure.
Not outside.
Even the Kabbalah is simply a collective-system; a construct.
These things are all constructs.
To understand that, one simply steps outside of the collectives. The technique is relative positioning.
Karma is also a construct, and I don't mean a fictional construct. Karma exists, it was constructed as part of
humanity's parameters of growth. Karma is not a universal. It was introduced as a part of the infrastructure of a collective consciousness.
Karma is universal as a force that brings everything back into harmony. (As Blavatsky put it.) Karma can be sidestepped or ignored, but you can't unmake karmas you've already made. The general structure of spiritual evolution is such that if you choose to work with your karma, you advance upwards. You can certainly decide to ignore karma altogether and just live your life. It is not imposing. But it is truly an immutable law, since it's simply natural causality - it's the power that binds every cause to its appropriate effect. There are ways to live your life without creating karmas, but that's not some kind of universal cure for life's problems. There is also genetic karma - karma that is tied to the predestination paradoxes of Creation. This sort of karma has to be worked out.
Going downwards is not neccessarily going towards depravity nor upwards neccessarily going towards perfection. Those things too are in the collectives and relative therein.
In theosophical terms it is said that going downwards is involution and upwards evolution. Yet even that is relative.
We call the natural direction of spiritual evolution 'upwards', and its negation 'downwards'. The negation is also valuable and provides very interesting opportunities for various ends, including subsequent movement 'upwards'. It's not 'wrong' to go downwards. Actually - choosing the 'wrong' option time and again, is often an act of working out karmas in a very extreme way and thus can propel upwards in a powerful way.
If one chooses to go into the lower astral, Underworlds and hells (hells are also constructs by the way, you find them under churches etc..) in order protect, heal and help those innocent Beings trapped there, is that depravity? It is certainly turning your back on the "higher" and going downwards.
Upward progression is not bound to heavenly realms of 'good' or 'light'. Actually, the depraved forces of evil are much more likely to be found in various Heavens than in Hells. Like many people have observed - a fact of existence is that it is the good people that often find themselves in Hell, and the bad ones who usually reside in Heaven. Quite contrary to what mainstream religion teaches.
If you go downwards for long enough, you will eventually reach states of greater and greater depravity. 'Depravity' is our way of perceiving those who travel downwards. It's inevitable, because to go 'downwards' is to go against the natural order of things, against the very principles of life and beauty.
No, to serve in Hell is not depraved. It is rather heroic and it will result in leaps and bounds of upward progression. But it's also a valuable experience.
I'm assuming something in the next paragraph Astrocyte, feel free to correct me.
Both myself and Astrocyte deal with traumatised people, and that in itself is traumatic. Astrocyte comes from a scientific position, I come from the opposite position. I can't speak for Astrocyte, but I reckon both Astrocyte and myself are dealing with the results of trauma caused by collectives a great deal of the time. I try my best not to be critical of Astrocyte for his position, I don't think much of collectives either, seen far too much needless suffering.
Life is not a "fun" game, people suffer . . .
"Man only suffers, because he takes seriously what the Gods made for fun." The overarching design is such that everything exists in the way it does for purely aesthetic reasons. The Universe wants to enjoy itself to the fullest extent. Suffering is part of the ride. The soul actually enjoys it on some level.
Collective consciousnesses are places where people loose, to varying degrees, their sense of self. In any collective consciousness you surrender a part of yourself to the collective.
Some collectives are nicer then others. The Rocicrucians for instance, have a collective pool upon which initiates draw. That is a source of power for them to wield, they share their knowledge and protect it. Generally they mind their own business.
Another example of a collective is a cult that manipulates and swallows people whole untill there is nothing left of the individual's self.
Two examples poles apart.
Collectives become problems when the members loose their sense of self. That is deadening. The opposite of this is Astrocyte's enlivening. A wonderful word indeed.
I'm not much of a team player. I find collectives to dull the individual worth of their members.
edit on 28-8-2017 by Rhaegar7 because: typos
originally posted by: Whatsthisthen
a reply to: Rhaegar7
True depravity comes from a rotting within, a rotting of the soul if you wish. Putrifcation of Being is another way to put it.
In order to unlock the option of 'going downwards' you have to act on some dark and scary impulses of the soul. Each of us has all the light and all the darkness within, so we're all capable of doing it. 'Depraved' is what we perceive those who have traveled downwards long enough to be. It's only natural, because to 'go downward' you have to go against the natural order of things - to go against life and beauty themselves.
'Going downwards' is not 'wrong'. Actually, if you get into the habit of choosing the 'wrong' option that will be an extreme way of working out karma and will propel you upwards in your progression. 'Going downwards' is to willingly choose depravity as an end to itself.
It's actually a perfectly valid option and it is beautiful in its own way. We've been raised with Christian modes of thinking, so we tend to think in light-polarity terms. I have to object to the notion that we're all 'beings of light' that have to 'cleanse' themselves from the 'corruption'. That's extreme light-polarity thinking. Rather - we have to own our darkness.
Reward and punishment are tied to how each one of us deals with his own karma. It's important to note that each of our individual souls is a terminal which connects us to the Source. Each Soul is an infinite Absolute in itself, that can be visualized as an infinite, overflowing set of 1s and 0s that encode your own personal individuality. You've been given a soul, and this soul can be lost - something akin to destruction although it's simply an act of detachment. If you follow the downward direction for long enough, you will 'destroy' your soul and this is akin to 'facing annihilation'. You'll have to receive a new one, or maybe the demonic depths will provide a new, demonic framework for your further progression.
Addendum: Your true essence is your spirit, and it cannot be destroyed. The soul is a terminal by which the Spirit connects to the Source. Quite fittingly, the soul is actually a miniature version of the Source - it's an Absolute in itself. It's actually a complete copy of the Absolute that has been ordered in a perfectly unique way, to the benefit of the Spirit. It is a great gift that if appreciated will allow for the evolution of the Spirit. If thrown away.. well.. you'll have to do without the 'constrains' of the Absolute, or those of the natural order of things. Those are the demonic dimensions and they are largely unknown and mysterious to us. From the point of view of the demonic entity that experiences the destruction of the soul, it is actually a right of passage. It is the demonic enlightenment. A shedding of all limitations and the complete unification with the demonic essence. Like everything else in Creation, it's cool. I almost feel like doing it. Satan himself undoubtedly operates from the depths of the demonic dimensions. I think he was 'the first' to destroy his soul. There is great knowledge and wisdom to be gained by exploring the demonic side of Creation. It certainly has an important part to play in the grand scheme of things. It is not 'wrong' or 'defective'. It's there for a reason, and it's as valid a path as every other.
www.youtube.com...
'Satan.. God forsake me! I wait for you to take me! Grant me wings, and as your messenger.. I'l fly..'
Reward and punishment are dealt according to how we work with our own karma. When we create unnecessary sufferings for others, when we act against the principles of life and beauty, for completely selfish desires.. we will attract punishment. And subsequently - when we relieve the sufferings of others, or create something beautiful, or serve to advance the agenda of life.. We get rewarded.
Refusal to work out negative karma is a punishment in itself, because it denies you the opportunity to advance. The same opportunity is not given again. Selfless desire to work out karmas, that are not imposed, is rewarded by the same principle - you are given a unique opportunity. And by the same principle - the more that you choose to work out special karmas, the more special karmas you'll be given, so that's why many well meaning people have a hard and difficult, yet fulfilling life. So working out karmas is a reward for the good guys. I guess the prime reward of evil is the unbridled power and liberty it provides, and if there are subsequent possibilities for attaining rewards, they have to follow some different kind of logic altogether - once you've thrown away your soul you'll have to work with the demonic principles.
There is a very tiny niche in Creation that is reserved for rewards and punishments on the individual merit of our acts. These rewards and punishments are almost entirely symbolic in nature, yet they are extremely important, because.. after all.. good has to win in the end. They're not entirely symbolic though and they are permanent. Once you've been bestowed a certain reward - a kind of blessing, it is forever. Punishments on the other hand are either paid by facing very dire karmic consequences, or by the withdrawal of all possibilities for further advancement in this way. The least painful way to work out a punishment is to renounce the darkness that you created and change direction. But that is almost impossible in many cases.
One way or another, justice will be served. And I find that very, very pleasing.
People need a strong sense of self to survive in this world.
Only if you're very positively polarized. One great thing about this world is that it gives us the opportunity to polarize ourselves to our heart's desire. Both of us have polarized ourselves very strongly towards the positive side. The thing about polarization is that it cannot be undone. Once you have polarized yourself, you have to follow the vibrational curve of your polarization to gain the experiences targeted by your soul. Once you have gained all the experiences, you can once again reach a state of neutrality and go from there.
Perhaps my biggest criticism of religion is that they want us to surrender our very being, our self.
Religion exists solely to advance the plan of 'eyes wide shut' - to make you see white as black and black as white, it's purely dark polarity and its goal is to make us worship and deify the monsters.
edit on 28-8-2017 by Rhaegar7 because: addendum
a reply to: Astrocyte
The question was about you - yet as always you make many assumptions and judgements about me!
The reason I asked if you were happy is because you state that 'if human beings are ever going to be happy, the price to pay is to #-off with this metaphysical bull# - because it is speculative, and therefore, probably nothing more than a wishfulness than an expression of what-is'.
That statement make me wonder if science makes you a happy bunny?
Would you mind elaborating and explain what you mean by 'dissociated and disconnected'?
The question was about you - yet as always you make many assumptions and judgements about me!
The reason I asked if you were happy is because you state that 'if human beings are ever going to be happy, the price to pay is to #-off with this metaphysical bull# - because it is speculative, and therefore, probably nothing more than a wishfulness than an expression of what-is'.
That statement make me wonder if science makes you a happy bunny?
If enlivenment means happiness, it's more than ironic that you, who seems so dissociated and disconnected, would ask me if I'm happy.
Would you mind elaborating and explain what you mean by 'dissociated and disconnected'?
edit on 28-8-2017 by Itisnowagain because: (no reason given)
Funny, considering science is the prime way of dissociating and disconnecting from true reality, by subjecting oneself to the whims of an external
world.
a reply to: Rhaegar7
I was was a bit concerned I was a tad heavy handed,
On karma, are you sure all Beings are subject to karma? Ask around
And "yes" saints in hell and sinners in heaven.
I have seen the practice of dumping "karma" or "dirty deeds" by a saint onto his unwitting student in order to ascend into higher realms. Ascendancy is sometimes a tool to skip out on repercussions for one's dirty deeds. Hardly a universal "law".
In all these things spoken and written within -isms, catholicism, nosticism Bhuddism occultism etc., is the presence of agenda. That is to say; the presence of a certain bias and loopholes for those in the "know".
I keep harping on about relative positioning as a technique. There is a reason for this.
My first lesson in relative positioning from investigating a "haunted chimney".
There are folk stories that warn to look after the hearth in a home. To keep it clean, in good repair and in regular use. A hearth and fire go together. One could say that fire needs a container in good repair to keep it in bounds or disaster can result. It is also true to say that if a container is left empty for a length of time, something will make a home in it. Why not? Everyone needs a home.
In my case, it was a big black worm with a big mouth who resided in the neglected chimney and fireplace. Simply put; I walked into a trap and got swallowed by the worm's mind(?).
Inside the worm's mind(?) was an empty black endless world without entry nor exit.
So what to do?
In this case, the key to getting out was relative positioning. I was inside, I wanted to be outside. Change one's relative position . . .
Get it?
The same with a collective consciousness such as a religion. It took a moment to get swallowed by a worm in a chimney and an hour or more to get out. A religion's collective mind will swallow people too.
I use the term collective consciousness usually, collective mind isn't wrong either. Collective mind might be a better term.
My friends teach me to survive by throwing me in the deep end of the pool,
Aversion and reward (karma) is what humans Upstairs use when they can't get you to willingly toe the line. The Powers That Be in the "spiritual worlds" get away with atrocities committed on innocent people in the world of the living. If a punishment or reward is to actually work, then the person being punished or rewarded needs to know why. Otherwise it is just good luck bad luck.
This is especially true when karma is said to pass over to the next life. A child does not know why it is being punished or that it is being punished at all. If an adult says "you got raped because of your bad karma, you evil person you!", that just wreaks a life, and is an evil deed in itself. This is not teaching at all because the child has no memory of doing wrong in the first place.
In our world the criminal courts don't convict a person of murder if there is a legitimate reason for the person not to have recollection of killing someone. The courts may put the person into care but the courts do not send someone to the gallows under such circumstances.
The idea that karma creates a "balance" is perhaps true in the sense of tit for tat. But that is also "balance" in the sense of an eye for an eye. We all know where that came from . . .
We can also look at the idea of karma as creating an eternal "imbalance". That is to say; an eye for an eye for an eye . . . ad infinitum. The world's endless wars, feuds and persecutions are an example. Almost no one would willingly accept a punishment for something they didn't do.
This suggests to me that karma could simply be a cause of unjust unending violence in our society: 'eyes wide shut'?
Anyway, the harvesters, as I call them, are a concern to more then just myself. The solution is not to simply destroy them for someone else would simply fill the vacuum created.
The solution is twofold. First we have to build a society that cares about people and which will protect people. Not just physically, but also emotionally, mentally and spiritually. With that in place, the harvesters can become a thing of the past..
I got called a "utopian" today, and it wasn't meant to be a compliment.
I told them that this world does not need to be this way, there is no need for people to suffer like they do.
They didn't have an answer . . .
That too, is Relative Positioning.
I was was a bit concerned I was a tad heavy handed,
On karma, are you sure all Beings are subject to karma? Ask around
Upward progression is not bound to heavenly realms of 'good' or 'light'. Actually, the depraved forces of evil are much more likely to be found in various Heavens than in Hells. Like many people have observed - a fact of existence is that it is the good people that often find themselves in Hell, and the bad ones who usually reside in Heaven. Quite contrary to what mainstream religion teaches.
And "yes" saints in hell and sinners in heaven.
I have seen the practice of dumping "karma" or "dirty deeds" by a saint onto his unwitting student in order to ascend into higher realms. Ascendancy is sometimes a tool to skip out on repercussions for one's dirty deeds. Hardly a universal "law".
In all these things spoken and written within -isms, catholicism, nosticism Bhuddism occultism etc., is the presence of agenda. That is to say; the presence of a certain bias and loopholes for those in the "know".
I keep harping on about relative positioning as a technique. There is a reason for this.
My first lesson in relative positioning from investigating a "haunted chimney".
There are folk stories that warn to look after the hearth in a home. To keep it clean, in good repair and in regular use. A hearth and fire go together. One could say that fire needs a container in good repair to keep it in bounds or disaster can result. It is also true to say that if a container is left empty for a length of time, something will make a home in it. Why not? Everyone needs a home.
In my case, it was a big black worm with a big mouth who resided in the neglected chimney and fireplace. Simply put; I walked into a trap and got swallowed by the worm's mind(?).
Inside the worm's mind(?) was an empty black endless world without entry nor exit.
So what to do?
In this case, the key to getting out was relative positioning. I was inside, I wanted to be outside. Change one's relative position . . .
Get it?
The same with a collective consciousness such as a religion. It took a moment to get swallowed by a worm in a chimney and an hour or more to get out. A religion's collective mind will swallow people too.
I use the term collective consciousness usually, collective mind isn't wrong either. Collective mind might be a better term.
My friends teach me to survive by throwing me in the deep end of the pool,
Aversion and reward (karma) is what humans Upstairs use when they can't get you to willingly toe the line. The Powers That Be in the "spiritual worlds" get away with atrocities committed on innocent people in the world of the living. If a punishment or reward is to actually work, then the person being punished or rewarded needs to know why. Otherwise it is just good luck bad luck.
This is especially true when karma is said to pass over to the next life. A child does not know why it is being punished or that it is being punished at all. If an adult says "you got raped because of your bad karma, you evil person you!", that just wreaks a life, and is an evil deed in itself. This is not teaching at all because the child has no memory of doing wrong in the first place.
In our world the criminal courts don't convict a person of murder if there is a legitimate reason for the person not to have recollection of killing someone. The courts may put the person into care but the courts do not send someone to the gallows under such circumstances.
The idea that karma creates a "balance" is perhaps true in the sense of tit for tat. But that is also "balance" in the sense of an eye for an eye. We all know where that came from . . .
We can also look at the idea of karma as creating an eternal "imbalance". That is to say; an eye for an eye for an eye . . . ad infinitum. The world's endless wars, feuds and persecutions are an example. Almost no one would willingly accept a punishment for something they didn't do.
This suggests to me that karma could simply be a cause of unjust unending violence in our society: 'eyes wide shut'?
Anyway, the harvesters, as I call them, are a concern to more then just myself. The solution is not to simply destroy them for someone else would simply fill the vacuum created.
The solution is twofold. First we have to build a society that cares about people and which will protect people. Not just physically, but also emotionally, mentally and spiritually. With that in place, the harvesters can become a thing of the past..
I got called a "utopian" today, and it wasn't meant to be a compliment.
I told them that this world does not need to be this way, there is no need for people to suffer like they do.
They didn't have an answer . . .
That too, is Relative Positioning.
edit on 28-8-2017 by Whatsthisthen because: typo
a reply to: Whatsthisthen
I've slept on what I wrote above, I'll try to explain a little in concrete terms.
The worm is a finite creature. It has length, width and height. It fits inside a household fireplace and chimney. Yet, at the same time it's mind is endless. The worm's mind is infinite.
Infinity within a finite container.
The worm's mind was also empty.
So, an example of an infinate closed space.
The house next door could also have a chimney worm. So two or more infinite closed spaces can exist next to each other.
So, just for fun, let's take an empty infinite closed space, a worm for instance. We know how to work relative positioning and move inside and outside of the worm's mind.
Gather a group of like minded people inside the mind of the worm and let's start furnishing our infinite closed space and turn it into a home. We add whatever we wish. Divide it into levels, add ornate stairways, rooms.
Now let's enclose our work and give it a limit, why not? We can create as many closed spaces as we want to inside an infinity. We can build a civilisation if we want.
Starting to sound like a computer game? Or a matrix movie?
We want more people, more minds to strengthen our closed spaces, more overlapping shared minds, more closed spaces.
Let's add laws and rules, we want these laws to keep our people in line. So let's add devils and daemons as autonomous background processes. Let's make a door into our infinite closed space and let people in.
Once inside, the new recruits see the inside of an infinite closed space and think it is everything. We let them, but don't tell them how it works.
Starting to sound like a computer simulation?
So in our example, who is the "world-mind", the infinite closed space? That would be "god", our worm.
Starting to see the "code" behind reality was in the matrix movie. That was a symptom of becoming aware.
So it follows that, if people start feeling like "codes of reality" are hidden from them in plain view, well, that is becoming aware. But the codes are not reality, they are just building blocks. Gotta step outside, past the "code" to see what the reality we thought was everything really is.
Inside the worm . . .
Outside the worm. . . .
Inside god . . . .
Outside god. . . . .
(evil grin) Did someone think it a "good idea" to add a "devil" inside the closed space?
Maybe our human world is just a manure heap full of worms?
The people who create ideologies and religions don't use worm's to build worlds. In the above example I was being simplistic.
After all, worms eventually digest what is inside it's mind, after all, even god has to eat.
Hope I don't give anyone nightmares.
Just don't fall hook line and sinker for the ideological/religious worm and you won't end up in the frying pan.
How's that for puns
Footnote
It's dangerous to put things into the mind of a worm, aside from digesting and assimilating it's meal.
you are what you eat
That is true also of worms.
. . . . and if the worm's food is loving and pours thoughts and feelings of love into "god", "god" will change.
. . . . and if the worm's food is hateful and pours thoughts and feelings of hate into "god", what then?
Get it?
I've slept on what I wrote above, I'll try to explain a little in concrete terms.
The worm is a finite creature. It has length, width and height. It fits inside a household fireplace and chimney. Yet, at the same time it's mind is endless. The worm's mind is infinite.
Infinity within a finite container.
The worm's mind was also empty.
So, an example of an infinate closed space.
The house next door could also have a chimney worm. So two or more infinite closed spaces can exist next to each other.
So, just for fun, let's take an empty infinite closed space, a worm for instance. We know how to work relative positioning and move inside and outside of the worm's mind.
Gather a group of like minded people inside the mind of the worm and let's start furnishing our infinite closed space and turn it into a home. We add whatever we wish. Divide it into levels, add ornate stairways, rooms.
Now let's enclose our work and give it a limit, why not? We can create as many closed spaces as we want to inside an infinity. We can build a civilisation if we want.
Starting to sound like a computer game? Or a matrix movie?
We want more people, more minds to strengthen our closed spaces, more overlapping shared minds, more closed spaces.
Let's add laws and rules, we want these laws to keep our people in line. So let's add devils and daemons as autonomous background processes. Let's make a door into our infinite closed space and let people in.
Once inside, the new recruits see the inside of an infinite closed space and think it is everything. We let them, but don't tell them how it works.
Starting to sound like a computer simulation?
So in our example, who is the "world-mind", the infinite closed space? That would be "god", our worm.
Starting to see the "code" behind reality was in the matrix movie. That was a symptom of becoming aware.
So it follows that, if people start feeling like "codes of reality" are hidden from them in plain view, well, that is becoming aware. But the codes are not reality, they are just building blocks. Gotta step outside, past the "code" to see what the reality we thought was everything really is.
Inside the worm . . .
Outside the worm. . . .
Inside god . . . .
Outside god. . . . .
(evil grin) Did someone think it a "good idea" to add a "devil" inside the closed space?
Maybe our human world is just a manure heap full of worms?
The people who create ideologies and religions don't use worm's to build worlds. In the above example I was being simplistic.
After all, worms eventually digest what is inside it's mind, after all, even god has to eat.
Hope I don't give anyone nightmares.
Just don't fall hook line and sinker for the ideological/religious worm and you won't end up in the frying pan.
How's that for puns
Footnote
It's dangerous to put things into the mind of a worm, aside from digesting and assimilating it's meal.
you are what you eat
That is true also of worms.
. . . . and if the worm's food is loving and pours thoughts and feelings of love into "god", "god" will change.
. . . . and if the worm's food is hateful and pours thoughts and feelings of hate into "god", what then?
Get it?
edit on 28-8-2017 by Whatsthisthen because: added footnote
The starting point is quintessential..
A zeroing in on eternity..
A tool to be used for Good and truth..; Perplexing thought.. which is always of the zeitgeist..
Fornication at a whim.. highest pleasures are sensed by a budgie of control..
Lateralus and effective method to aproach people..
You dare not aproach me or dare i will threaten you for eternity..?
Questioning themode of time? But for christ sake we have all the time in the world.. as a pamphlet, or packet of wave digitized drama.. ala Neem Karoli Baba.. and the brimstone effect.. which is all about Tool anyways..
A sober journey from here on, but why cant we not be sober.. oh the drawings themselves.. beg for a more integrated therapy.. Theosophy.. Thelema and the will of the republic.. breaching on trusts accords.. and patriot missles launched everyday..
George Bush did Mook our towers.. from which we have the beacon of insight.. Windrose and counter culture.. Yakuza and the will to die and live with your gentle partners of the East.. or otherwise Western Japan..
A nuclear patriot Rocket missle of the shuttle of the most forgiving infinity.. indeed asva rare sore.. the red is rubedo faction.. Orange cross and the cobstitution.. And the crucifixtion of eternity.. carrying your cross forever? Well is there anything better to do?
A zeroing in on eternity..
A tool to be used for Good and truth..; Perplexing thought.. which is always of the zeitgeist..
Fornication at a whim.. highest pleasures are sensed by a budgie of control..
Lateralus and effective method to aproach people..
You dare not aproach me or dare i will threaten you for eternity..?
Questioning themode of time? But for christ sake we have all the time in the world.. as a pamphlet, or packet of wave digitized drama.. ala Neem Karoli Baba.. and the brimstone effect.. which is all about Tool anyways..
A sober journey from here on, but why cant we not be sober.. oh the drawings themselves.. beg for a more integrated therapy.. Theosophy.. Thelema and the will of the republic.. breaching on trusts accords.. and patriot missles launched everyday..
George Bush did Mook our towers.. from which we have the beacon of insight.. Windrose and counter culture.. Yakuza and the will to die and live with your gentle partners of the East.. or otherwise Western Japan..
A nuclear patriot Rocket missle of the shuttle of the most forgiving infinity.. indeed asva rare sore.. the red is rubedo faction.. Orange cross and the cobstitution.. And the crucifixtion of eternity.. carrying your cross forever? Well is there anything better to do?
originally posted by: Whatsthisthen
a reply to: Rhaegar7
I was was a bit concerned I was a tad heavy handed,
On karma, are you sure all Beings are subject to karma? Ask around
You're only subject to karma when you create the karmas for yourself. 'The future is not set. There is no fate, but what we make for ourselves.' Karma is not fate. It is the physical manifestation of our own choices and inner nature. There is no reason to avoid working out karma, because to work out karma is to simply follow the path of your own creation.
Upward progression is not bound to heavenly realms of 'good' or 'light'. Actually, the depraved forces of evil are much more likely to be found in various Heavens than in Hells. Like many people have observed - a fact of existence is that it is the good people that often find themselves in Hell, and the bad ones who usually reside in Heaven. Quite contrary to what mainstream religion teaches.
And "yes" saints in hell and sinners in heaven.
I have seen the practice of dumping "karma" or "dirty deeds" by a saint onto his unwitting student in order to ascend into higher realms. Ascendancy is sometimes a tool to skip out on repercussions for one's dirty deeds. Hardly a universal "law".
Aversion and reward (karma) is what humans Upstairs use when they can't get you to willingly toe the line. The Powers That Be in the "spiritual worlds" get away with atrocities committed on innocent people in the world of the living. If a punishment or reward is to actually work, then the person being punished or rewarded needs to know why. Otherwise it is just good luck bad luck.
The powers that be like to twist every positive and natural aspect of reality into a grotesque tool that serves their own agendas. They've corrupted the idea of karma as well. Karma itself is an abstract equation that wants to be balanced. A natural disaster that kills thousands is not 'karma'. It's simply an experience. We attract various experiences with our own vibration, but that's also not 'karma'. These are simply experiences.
Karma is not imposing. It's simply an abstract equation that you may decide to work with. You can also choose to discard it, or even work 'against it'. Working 'against it' will result in 'downwards progression'. Karma is not some kind of chain that limits you. Quite the opposite - it's a tool that only serves to provide freedom.
This is especially true when karma is said to pass over to the next life. A child does not know why it is being punished or that it is being punished at all. If an adult says "you got raped because of your bad karma, you evil person you!", that just wreaks a life, and is an evil deed in itself. This is not teaching at all because the child has no memory of doing wrong in the first place.
This isn't karma. This is a devilish impostor that ties to take the place of what 'karma' really is. In order to create very negative karmic consequences, you'd have to travel the path 'downwards' for quite a long time. You can create negative karma for yourself, but is it really negative? It simply gives you the experiences that you yourself have requested. We attract necessary growth experiences with our vibration, but experiences are not karma. Karma is the abstract equation that you can use in order to progress in any direction you see fit.
Karma is not justice. The application of justice is largely unnecessary in the grand scheme of things, because there is no 'injustice' to be corrected. The equations of karma provide true freedom to all participants - the perfect circumstances for the application of free will. Logically, if you were to travel downwards you'd inevitably become a force for injustice, and if you traveled upwards - a force for justice. The karmic equations balance all acts, so that if you internalize 'injustice' you will have to face its opposite - 'justice'. If you internalize 'justice' - you'll have to meet its opposite - 'injustice'. The truth is there is no justice without injustice and vice versa. Justice/Injustice is what truly exists in a kind of quantum superposition. Someone remarked that those well meaning people who internalize 'the plus' will naturally face 'the minus'. That is a good example of how light-polarity modes of thinking betray their followers. 'The road to Hell is paved with good intentions.' You don't need to strive for Justice, because there is no Injustice. If you decide to be a righteous punisher of evil, the Universe (or karma) punishes you in turn perhaps for the act of seeing yourself as 'superior'. 'What you fight against grows stronger.'
Karma does not exist before the breaking of the initial harmony. After the undifferentiated Absolute breaks down into individual elements, Karma becomes Law. All karma is 'genetic', for we are all the offspring of the initial 'symmetry breaking'. Karma encodes the route back into the primordial harmony. The initial choice to become subject to karma, is the choice to abandon the harmonic dimension (home) and enter 'The Game'.
In our world the criminal courts don't convict a person of murder if there is a legitimate reason for the person not to have recollection of killing someone. The courts may put the person into care but the courts do not send someone to the gallows under such circumstances.
The idea that karma creates a "balance" is perhaps true in the sense of tit for tat. But that is also "balance" in the sense of an eye for an eye. We all know where that came from . . .
Karma does not 'create' Balance. It is simply the natural reaction mechanism of the Balance, who strives to correct itself. We live in a karmic world, because we've chosen to leave the dimension of Balance and plunge into the one of differentiation. Karma is the differentiated original Balance striving to restore itself and everything back into Harmony and it inevitably achieves it, because in its differentiation is encoded its subsequent restoration. 'Eye for an eye' is a light-polarity stupidity, which serves to create more injustice. The more justice you create, the more injustice you create. If you want to end all Injustice, you have to let the equation balance itself and become Justice/Injustice again.
We can also look at the idea of karma as creating an eternal "imbalance". That is to say; an eye for an eye for an eye . . . ad infinitum. The world's endless wars, feuds and persecutions are an example. Almost no one would willingly accept a punishment for something they didn't do.
That's not what karma does. This is a perversion of the idea.
This suggests to me that karma could simply be a cause of unjust unending violence in our society: 'eyes wide shut'?
Karma does not create Injustice. Both light-siders and dark-siders create Injustice with their own free will, by stepping away from the Balance.
Anyway, the harvesters, as I call them, are a concern to more then just myself. The solution is not to simply destroy them for someone else would simply fill the vacuum created.
The solution is twofold. First we have to build a society that cares about people and which will protect people. Not just physically, but also emotionally, mentally and spiritually. With that in place, the harvesters can become a thing of the past..
I got called a "utopian" today, and it wasn't meant to be a compliment.
I told them that this world does not need to be this way, there is no need for people to suffer like they do.
Apparently, it needs to be this way and people need to suffer. You'll have to abandon the light-sider modes of thinking eventually.
originally posted by: Whatsthisthen
a reply to: Whatsthisthen
Gather a group of like minded people inside the mind of the worm and let's start furnishing our infinite closed space and turn it into a home. We add whatever we wish. Divide it into levels, add ornate stairways, rooms.
That's not how the forces of evil operate. The forces of evil do not respect any sort of limitations, they choose to limit everyone else and attain unbridled power for themselves. They do not respect karma as 'a law' and refuse to work with it in order to be submerged back into Balance. They see themselves as Gods (Deities) and feel no need to go back to the Source. They've inverted the karmic equation that would otherwise serve as a means of spiritual progression and use it to advance towards greater and greater evil and depravity.
Now let's enclose our work and give it a limit, why not? We can create as many closed spaces as we want to inside an infinity. We can build a civilisation if we want.
Starting to sound like a computer game? Or a matrix movie?
We want more people, more minds to strengthen our closed spaces, more overlapping shared minds, more closed spaces.
Let's add laws and rules, we want these laws to keep our people in line. So let's add devils and daemons as autonomous background processes. Let's make a door into our infinite closed space and let people in.
Once inside, the new recruits see the inside of an infinite closed space and think it is everything. We let them, but don't tell them how it works.
Starting to sound like a computer simulation?
So in our example, who is the "world-mind", the infinite closed space? That would be "god", our worm.
Starting to see the "code" behind reality was in the matrix movie. That was a symptom of becoming aware.
So it follows that, if people start feeling like "codes of reality" are hidden from them in plain view, well, that is becoming aware. But the codes are not reality, they are just building blocks. Gotta step outside, past the "code" to see what the reality we thought was everything really is.
A more straightforward way to look at all this is to suppose that the forces of evil simply wish for the subjugation of humanity and the 'prison' is manifested without any real effort on their part. In fact, the light-polarity builds its own prison for themselves in order to work out the fruits of their own personal vibrations.
Inside the worm . . .
Outside the worm. . . .
Inside god . . . .
Outside god. . . . .
(evil grin) Did someone think it a "good idea" to add a "devil" inside the closed space?
Yes. The light-polarity did. It enjoys seeing itself as a 'righteous' 'warrior' of 'light' and to gain this experience it has to manifest an enemy to fight against.
Maybe our human world is just a manure heap full of worms?
Well.. I wouldn't say that. Our human world is simply a framework that manifests by our own personal vibrations in order to allow us to live out our own fantasies. It is sort of a hologram projected onto the real world. The real world is as of now formless and void. Perhaps that's what '2012 - the end of the world' really meant. The real world is now void and we are all participating in some sort of hologram that is taken to be 'the real world', only subconsciously aware that it is the creation of our own thoughts.
The people who create ideologies and religions don't use worm's to build worlds. In the above example I was being simplistic.
Those are the dark-polarity, who are as deluded as the light-polaritiy. In order for this game to continue, the participants have to live out their fantasies - both the light-siders and the dark-siders. When they've achieved their initial goals, the system will balance itself out once again.
After all, worms eventually digest what is inside it's mind, after all, even god has to eat.
Hope I don't give anyone nightmares.
Just don't fall hook line and sinker for the ideological/religious worm and you won't end up in the frying pan.
This is a light-polarity perpetrated illusion. They need to live out the experience of 'saving others' and 'saving the world' and that's what they do. It is very real for them while they're at it. It's not real for anyone who does not feel like living out this experience any more.
How's that for puns
Footnote
It's dangerous to put things into the mind of a worm, aside from digesting and assimilating it's meal.
you are what you eat
That is true also of worms.
. . . . and if the worm's food is loving and pours thoughts and feelings of love into "god", "god" will change.
. . . . and if the worm's food is hateful and pours thoughts and feelings of hate into "god", what then?
Get it?
God is timeless and immutable by definition. If you want to work with the active Deity - find out who the active Deity is/are first.
a reply to: Rhaegar7
Gawd . . . . karma
I don't like to use the k-word.
It is a subject I like to avoid. Why? Simply because I suspect that it has been distorted far beyond it's original meaning(?) intention(?) of whatever system created it. As you have said yourself Rhaegar7.
I can't speak of any "truths" concerning the k-word, because I don't know any. If I ponder on the subject those around me simply point out "Look around you, there isn't any." and I cannot say otherwise. I will qualify that by saying I know it exists within certain minds. ("Worlds" if you prefer . . . .)
I have heard the modern new age interpretation, and watch how people project it on others. The concept vandalises people. I can't describe it as anything other then vandalism in how people apply the concept. That is the totality of my experience as I am aware.
Really, I am happy to go and sit with Astrocyte when it comes to the k-word.
Crikey Rhaegar7, people don't need to suffer in order to grow. To go without food at times makes us appreciate food. Being pennyless makes us appreciate a good job and providing for our families. But beyond that, you won't sway me.
Honestly? I have heard that one from both sides of the light/dark. The statement just sets off an "alarm bell".
(smile) But really; to infer I'm a light sider, or a dark sider for that matter, is just being mean
Gawd . . . . karma
I don't like to use the k-word.
It is a subject I like to avoid. Why? Simply because I suspect that it has been distorted far beyond it's original meaning(?) intention(?) of whatever system created it. As you have said yourself Rhaegar7.
I can't speak of any "truths" concerning the k-word, because I don't know any. If I ponder on the subject those around me simply point out "Look around you, there isn't any." and I cannot say otherwise. I will qualify that by saying I know it exists within certain minds. ("Worlds" if you prefer . . . .)
I have heard the modern new age interpretation, and watch how people project it on others. The concept vandalises people. I can't describe it as anything other then vandalism in how people apply the concept. That is the totality of my experience as I am aware.
Really, I am happy to go and sit with Astrocyte when it comes to the k-word.
I got called a "utopian" today, and it wasn't meant to be a compliment.
I told them that this world does not need to be this way, there is no need for people to suffer like they do.
Apparently, it needs to be this way and people need to suffer. You'll have to abandon the light-sider modes of thinking eventually.
Crikey Rhaegar7, people don't need to suffer in order to grow. To go without food at times makes us appreciate food. Being pennyless makes us appreciate a good job and providing for our families. But beyond that, you won't sway me.
You'll have to abandon the light-sider modes of thinking eventually.
Honestly? I have heard that one from both sides of the light/dark. The statement just sets off an "alarm bell".
(smile) But really; to infer I'm a light sider, or a dark sider for that matter, is just being mean
edit on 29-8-2017 by Whatsthisthen because: typo
op, is whacky....on the first paragraph.....even
god is not creator of reality........dude c'mon man.....so god was a seed on a tree that grew....crap fella....what powers that logic, a squirrell on a wheel
god is not creator of reality........dude c'mon man.....so god was a seed on a tree that grew....crap fella....what powers that logic, a squirrell on a wheel
a reply to: Rhaegar7
I just look at things simply if I can and as down to earth as I can.
The world of life is, for me anyway, the important place, more so then the worlds of religion, philosophies and ideologies.
For me, the whole subject of light and dark, good and evil, etc., boils down to this; I don't care what they do as long as they don't hurt others, as long as they don't enslave others, as long as they leave innocent people alone. Just that.
They can take their toys and go play in their own sandpits . . .
For me, a light sider or a dark sider are exactly the same if they hurt innocent people and other Beings.
There is a wonderous, yet dangerous vastness to be explored outside the ideologically civilised worlds of human thought.
I like it there. It is where my friends are.
But that is just me.
My only interest in the light/dark good/evil thing is tactical, I just protect those I care for.
I just look at things simply if I can and as down to earth as I can.
The world of life is, for me anyway, the important place, more so then the worlds of religion, philosophies and ideologies.
For me, the whole subject of light and dark, good and evil, etc., boils down to this; I don't care what they do as long as they don't hurt others, as long as they don't enslave others, as long as they leave innocent people alone. Just that.
They can take their toys and go play in their own sandpits . . .
For me, a light sider or a dark sider are exactly the same if they hurt innocent people and other Beings.
There is a wonderous, yet dangerous vastness to be explored outside the ideologically civilised worlds of human thought.
I like it there. It is where my friends are.
But that is just me.
My only interest in the light/dark good/evil thing is tactical, I just protect those I care for.
originally posted by: Whatsthisthen
a reply to: Rhaegar7
You'll have to abandon the light-sider modes of thinking eventually.
Honestly? I have heard that one from both sides of the light/dark. The statement just sets off an "alarm bell".
(smile) But really; to infer I'm a light sider, or a dark sider for that matter, is just being mean
We've all been raised with light-sider modes of thinking. I myself am working on freeing myself from those actively. Why shouldn't I suggest you do the same?
edit on 29-8-2017 by Rhaegar7 because: (no reason given)
a reply to: Whatsthisthen
Sooo light-sider. You have to realize that there are no 'others' to protect. In this dimension you're alone with yourself. Linear time is mostly 'an intentional fabrication' (as Hidden_Hand put it in his thread). While you believe in an external world that shares the same clock as you do, you'll feel responsible to protect those who dwell in this world. But when you realize that there is no such external world, you'll start working on yourself, instead of spending all that energy on misguided light-sider agendas.
The light trap is very powerful. It feeds on our own good intentions and turns them against us. But to do this it requires that we first lose our true sense of the Source. To play in either side of the game - both light and dark - first you have to lose your conscious link to the Source. You still retain the link, but you lose conscious awareness of it. Only in this way can you participate in this imaginary world with its imaginary rules. If you had retained your conscious connection to The Source, you'd immediately realize just how illusory both the light and dark polarity games really are, so you'd be unable to play the game. It wouldn't be real to you.
One simple way to explain the light trap is that if you stop fighting against 'the bad guys' they suddenly lose their ability to hurt anyone. It is by fighting against them that you create them. 'What you fight against grows stronger'. So, this inevitably leads to the abandonment of the light-polarity, as it becomes irrational to pursue after all the desired experiences have been gained. If you want to reduce suffering - stop feeding the dark side by playing the light. The Universe is in Balance of light/dark, justice/injustice etc..
When you take one side of the equation, you create the opposite side. If you choose light, you create dark. If you choose justice, you create injustice. If you want to do the right thing, then simply stop playing the polarity game. Light feeds dark in this game. That's why the dark side totally approves of Hollywood producing all these movies of heroes that are always fighting against the dark side. The dark side appreciates well the fact that for the game to go on, there have to be more light-siders.
You can't beat the dark-siders, by playing light-sider. Playing light-sider serves only to feed the dark. When you've gained all the required experiences the game has to offer - both light-sider and dark-sider, you can simply move on. You won't be effective in helping anyone while you're still playing the game.
If you want a more detailed work on the polarity game - I suggest reading Matrix V. It's a damn good book.
Don't you understand?! You're playing the game in the 'light-sider' role. The game is such that the dark strives to attain more and more power and control, while creating obstacles for the light-siders and the light strives to 'protect the innocent', 'reduce unnecessary suffering', 'make the world a better place'. But you fail to see that there could be no light side without the dark side, and there could be no dark side without the light side. It's a game and you're feeding it. As the Author of Matrix V pointed out 'Whenever one light-sider leaves the game, a dark-sider is also removed.'
If you really want to do something meaningful and lasting, start working on transcending those light-polarity paradigms as soon as possible.
And, no, calling you a light-sider is not an insult. First - most people on this planet start as light-siders, and second - most light-siders keep playing the game, because they have good intentions. By my estimation, if you are still playing the light-side at 25yo, this means you're really serious about helping and in the Game for more than just the experience. You really want to protect. I know that. So, when I say you're a light-sider it's actually meant as a compliment, as I am certain you're not a light-sider simply for the thrill of it. You do mean it.
But to realize the goals of the committed light-sider, you have to transcend the light-sider paradigms. You cannot beat the bad guys by fighting them directly - the Game is based on reinforcing the illusion that you have to keep doing it, but the reality is that this is precisely the way in which you feed the dark side. 'What you fight against grows stronger.' In order to transcend the polarity games, you have to attain Balance and Balance is achieved by a synthesis of the dark and light polarities. Once you submerge Justice/Injustice, Light/Dark, Good/Evil, Right/Wrong back into oneness - then you eliminate Injustice, Dark, Evil and Wrong and restore Balance. Once you start attaining some level of Balance, you begin to regain your power and it is then that you can do something 'good'. But it requires a better paradigm, one that acknowledges the true Source. Therefore - you need to focus some conscious energy on understanding what the Source really is and what it isn't. This is the key to the puzzle.
I really advise you to give these ideas some deep thought. You need them to advance as quickly as possible and start a new level of progression and a new game with different rules.
P.S. One very important thing is to realize that the dark side isn't sick, insane, corrupted or whatever. The experiences the dark side has to offer are just as valid and meaningful as those of the light side. There is also much wisdom to be gained by understanding the dark. You can't really graduate from the game without having realized some basic truths of the dark polarity. Self-reliance, self-confidence, total lack of fear, emotional freedom and expression, total rejection of slave mentality, love for yourself, ambition, unscrupulousness, a love of life and the ability to let the Universe be your playground. The realization that you're the most important thing in the Universe, and that you should love and serve yourself to the fullest extent. Light-siders are completely irrational in their denial of this simple truth. They subconsciously want to be good people, so they fear 'the darkness' that is inside of them. It's quite obvious that the dark side creates these light-siders by means of the various religions, who instill the light-sider paradigms in us. Science is the new means of thought control, and it tries to create a new form of slavery - one that is even worse than before. Instead of spiritual oppression, we'll also have intellectual.
The dark needs the scientific paradigm to succeed in dominating the world, because the people are starting to regain their lost sense of the Source, and science has to quickly do something about it, by providing them a new, golden cage, in order for them to stay asleep and keep playing the victim part. If we could convince people to completely reject science, the dark side would take a very serious blow as it would be unable to continue further. It would end the game.
But people love science, because it provides them just what they think they want - 'a hope for a better world and a better tomorrow'.
(puke)
Sooo light-sider. You have to realize that there are no 'others' to protect. In this dimension you're alone with yourself. Linear time is mostly 'an intentional fabrication' (as Hidden_Hand put it in his thread). While you believe in an external world that shares the same clock as you do, you'll feel responsible to protect those who dwell in this world. But when you realize that there is no such external world, you'll start working on yourself, instead of spending all that energy on misguided light-sider agendas.
The light trap is very powerful. It feeds on our own good intentions and turns them against us. But to do this it requires that we first lose our true sense of the Source. To play in either side of the game - both light and dark - first you have to lose your conscious link to the Source. You still retain the link, but you lose conscious awareness of it. Only in this way can you participate in this imaginary world with its imaginary rules. If you had retained your conscious connection to The Source, you'd immediately realize just how illusory both the light and dark polarity games really are, so you'd be unable to play the game. It wouldn't be real to you.
One simple way to explain the light trap is that if you stop fighting against 'the bad guys' they suddenly lose their ability to hurt anyone. It is by fighting against them that you create them. 'What you fight against grows stronger'. So, this inevitably leads to the abandonment of the light-polarity, as it becomes irrational to pursue after all the desired experiences have been gained. If you want to reduce suffering - stop feeding the dark side by playing the light. The Universe is in Balance of light/dark, justice/injustice etc..
When you take one side of the equation, you create the opposite side. If you choose light, you create dark. If you choose justice, you create injustice. If you want to do the right thing, then simply stop playing the polarity game. Light feeds dark in this game. That's why the dark side totally approves of Hollywood producing all these movies of heroes that are always fighting against the dark side. The dark side appreciates well the fact that for the game to go on, there have to be more light-siders.
You can't beat the dark-siders, by playing light-sider. Playing light-sider serves only to feed the dark. When you've gained all the required experiences the game has to offer - both light-sider and dark-sider, you can simply move on. You won't be effective in helping anyone while you're still playing the game.
If you want a more detailed work on the polarity game - I suggest reading Matrix V. It's a damn good book.
Don't you understand?! You're playing the game in the 'light-sider' role. The game is such that the dark strives to attain more and more power and control, while creating obstacles for the light-siders and the light strives to 'protect the innocent', 'reduce unnecessary suffering', 'make the world a better place'. But you fail to see that there could be no light side without the dark side, and there could be no dark side without the light side. It's a game and you're feeding it. As the Author of Matrix V pointed out 'Whenever one light-sider leaves the game, a dark-sider is also removed.'
If you really want to do something meaningful and lasting, start working on transcending those light-polarity paradigms as soon as possible.
And, no, calling you a light-sider is not an insult. First - most people on this planet start as light-siders, and second - most light-siders keep playing the game, because they have good intentions. By my estimation, if you are still playing the light-side at 25yo, this means you're really serious about helping and in the Game for more than just the experience. You really want to protect. I know that. So, when I say you're a light-sider it's actually meant as a compliment, as I am certain you're not a light-sider simply for the thrill of it. You do mean it.
But to realize the goals of the committed light-sider, you have to transcend the light-sider paradigms. You cannot beat the bad guys by fighting them directly - the Game is based on reinforcing the illusion that you have to keep doing it, but the reality is that this is precisely the way in which you feed the dark side. 'What you fight against grows stronger.' In order to transcend the polarity games, you have to attain Balance and Balance is achieved by a synthesis of the dark and light polarities. Once you submerge Justice/Injustice, Light/Dark, Good/Evil, Right/Wrong back into oneness - then you eliminate Injustice, Dark, Evil and Wrong and restore Balance. Once you start attaining some level of Balance, you begin to regain your power and it is then that you can do something 'good'. But it requires a better paradigm, one that acknowledges the true Source. Therefore - you need to focus some conscious energy on understanding what the Source really is and what it isn't. This is the key to the puzzle.
I really advise you to give these ideas some deep thought. You need them to advance as quickly as possible and start a new level of progression and a new game with different rules.
P.S. One very important thing is to realize that the dark side isn't sick, insane, corrupted or whatever. The experiences the dark side has to offer are just as valid and meaningful as those of the light side. There is also much wisdom to be gained by understanding the dark. You can't really graduate from the game without having realized some basic truths of the dark polarity. Self-reliance, self-confidence, total lack of fear, emotional freedom and expression, total rejection of slave mentality, love for yourself, ambition, unscrupulousness, a love of life and the ability to let the Universe be your playground. The realization that you're the most important thing in the Universe, and that you should love and serve yourself to the fullest extent. Light-siders are completely irrational in their denial of this simple truth. They subconsciously want to be good people, so they fear 'the darkness' that is inside of them. It's quite obvious that the dark side creates these light-siders by means of the various religions, who instill the light-sider paradigms in us. Science is the new means of thought control, and it tries to create a new form of slavery - one that is even worse than before. Instead of spiritual oppression, we'll also have intellectual.
The dark needs the scientific paradigm to succeed in dominating the world, because the people are starting to regain their lost sense of the Source, and science has to quickly do something about it, by providing them a new, golden cage, in order for them to stay asleep and keep playing the victim part. If we could convince people to completely reject science, the dark side would take a very serious blow as it would be unable to continue further. It would end the game.
But people love science, because it provides them just what they think they want - 'a hope for a better world and a better tomorrow'.
(puke)
edit on 29-8-2017 by Rhaegar7 because: typos, addendum and clarifications
a reply to: Rhaegar7
Here's the DND picture from earlier in this thread. It is actually pretty good.
In the middle is good ol' earth where we are.
In those structures surrounding earth in a circle are all the worlds of man, plus some that are not.
Black lodge is there, white lodge is there, catholicism and so on. Those places are just worlds. Within those worlds are the respective structures that are those worlds. Worlds/minds/astral cities/closed spaces, call em what you like.
Occultism, religeous, philosophies, and such like are all to be found in those structures.
Really, living humanity just needs to spend time building a caring protective society on earth that protects people from most of those places.
Get that right and we may have a future free of light and darkness and the rest of it.
There are more wonders between heaven and earth Horatio, then dreampt of in your philosophies -- Hamlet.
footnote
I won't withdraw from the battlefield, I like the earth and everything seen and unseen therein, and some things need protection so they can become.
Gotta do something constructive while I am here
Here's the DND picture from earlier in this thread. It is actually pretty good.
In the middle is good ol' earth where we are.
In those structures surrounding earth in a circle are all the worlds of man, plus some that are not.
Black lodge is there, white lodge is there, catholicism and so on. Those places are just worlds. Within those worlds are the respective structures that are those worlds. Worlds/minds/astral cities/closed spaces, call em what you like.
Occultism, religeous, philosophies, and such like are all to be found in those structures.
Really, living humanity just needs to spend time building a caring protective society on earth that protects people from most of those places.
Get that right and we may have a future free of light and darkness and the rest of it.
There are more wonders between heaven and earth Horatio, then dreampt of in your philosophies -- Hamlet.
footnote
I won't withdraw from the battlefield, I like the earth and everything seen and unseen therein, and some things need protection so they can become.
Gotta do something constructive while I am here
edit on 29-8-2017 by Whatsthisthen because: added footnote
originally posted by: Rhaegar7
a reply to: whereislogic
Umm, where did I say that God did not exist?
You didn't spell it out, that's true. It was more of a swap, first you replace the only god who is worthy of being called God with a capital G, which generally is understood to be the God who goes by the name Jehovah in accurate honest English translations of the bible, with the god of "this system of things" (a.k.a. the Matrix), Satan. And then you call that god evil which is true, but since you said "God is evil" I responded as if you were referring to the only God who is worthy of a capital G. I ignored your swap because I was only responding to the phrase and argument "God is evil" (also a thread in the religion&theology forum, where this swap isn't made). And it is this God that you later on referred to as "a perverted fantasy", i.e. not real, doesn't really exist. I didn't feel like thinking too long on how to respond to your swap, which could be 'my mistake', as the expression goes. Cause now I did intentionally read something else into your words that you didn't actually say, but I did it because others can get the same impression when only thinking about or registering the claim that "God is evil".
'Evil' and 'bad' cannot be used interchangeably.
Well, they are synonyms the way I used them, other translations of Isaiah 5:20 use the word "evil" instead of "bad".
"You don't get to decide* what's good and evil in this world."
Oh, so I don't get to choose my own way of thinking. I mean, we have the Bible to do it for us, right?
I was talking about prerogative and ability with that phrase, since your thinking is flawed and manipulated by Satan and those who serve him (advertently or inadvertently). You do get to choose your own way of thinking, you're exercising your free will right now. It just has little to no bearing on the reality of what is actually good and evil (in Jehovah God's eyes, who does have the prerogative and ability to set the standards for both regarding His own creation, the creator of any type of machinery is particularly qualified to write the manual on how to operate said machinery and what is bad for the machinery or how not to operate it; that manual is the bible). That is, if you do the Isaiah 5:20 thingy as well.
There's evil and then there's depravity and irrationality. There is depraved evil, and there is irrational evil, but there is also natural evil, necessary evil, enlightened evil. One has to acquaint himself with the darkness.
Lucifer is a sort of enlightened, divine sort of evil.
Yes, just like many other words, there are many different applications and meanings for the word "evil". But I already explained how Isaiah 5:20 uses "evil" in other translations. You'd wanna avoid doing this though mentioned in the article in my signature:
Propaganda encourages this by agitating the emotions, by exploiting insecurities, by capitalizing on the ambiguity of language, and by bending rules of logic. As history bears out, such tactics can prove all too effective.
My whole argument is mainly based on the fact that a 'good omnipotent, active and interfering entity' is an oxymoron. Do you disagree?
I guess I do since it seems neither a "figure of speech" or contradictory (quoting from the google dictionary regarding "oxymoron"). Allthough it's a rather simplistic or limited description of the God that is good. There are a lot of things to consider when it comes to how God's omnipotence works in conjunction with His goodness, activities and limited specific interferences with mankind so far (with a specific purpose that actually also combines non-interference with human governance of themselves and the earth on a global scale since Adam&Eve made their decision to determin for themselves what is good/right and what is evil/bad, just like you want to do). Eating from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil does have its consequences though: death.
Proverbs 14:12
There is a way that seems right to a man,
But in the end it leads to death.
And this is what Jesus said about another way of doing things, John 17:3:
This means everlasting life, their coming to know you,* [Or “their taking in knowledge of you.”] the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ.
Well, at least you were reminded of one thing about "the only true God", his name is Jehovah, not Jesus nor Satan. Jesus is the one whom he sent (to earth and mankind) and Satan (a Hebrew word meaning “Resister.”) is God's chief Adversary. Jehovah is the Creator you speak of, he is the living God, not a fantasy or imagined god. Here's some more information about Jehovah God, the rightful Sovereign Ruler of the universe by reason of being the Creator of said universe:
edit on 30-8-2017 by whereislogic because: (no reason given)
a reply to: whereislogic
OK, that's a meaningful response. I think you for your participation in the discussion.
I was raised with the Bible and with all consequent Christian paradigms. Funnily enough, they seemed to have preferred to read me more of the Old Testament, so when I was acquainted with the idea of a 'son of God' that has a birthday and that's why I received presents.. I felt humiliated. And I trust the feeling of that child that felt mistreated. It is an ugly thing for parents to love their imaginary friend more than their own child.
I used to believe in Jehovah. I almost felt his presence and grand design. Now I suppose that Jehovah does exist, but that's he's just another powerful creative entity and not 'the one true God'.
If you simply care to examine what happens in reality it's basically the bad guys winning and the good guys suffering. We're supposed to thank the Biblical God for giving us suffering and to assume that since we're not this powerful entity, we should just accept that his good is mysterious and unknowable to us.
I have since rejected this. I will not respect a 'God' that rewards doing the right thing with suffering. I don't see how you rationalize the idea of a 'good God' with an entity that does whatever the # it pleases and puts the blame on the victim instead.
And since there does not seem to be an active, interfering entity that works for Good, I have since rejected the idea of a 'good God'. Yes, I'm fairly certain that there are many Deities. The Absolute, or the universal wave function if you will, undoubtedly encodes various deities. But I've come to the conclusion that if there is a Supreme Principle of Good, he does not see himself as a God, he is non-interfering and he is simply the basis that allows for the manifestation of the best of all possible worlds.
Theology has confused the two Principles at work, trying to merge the Principle of Good with the Principle of Evil into one entity. The misguided quest of monotheism. The Supreme Principle of Evil is active, interfering and imposing upon Creation. The Supreme Principle of Good is simply the base, a creative force that allows for all things.
When you do surrender your soul to this 'God' of yours, you are becoming a blind follower of an evil force. It will undoubtedly give you comfort and it probably has a special place in his Heaven for you. But don't think of yourself as 'good'. You're only 'good' according to this insane Deity, that considers 'good' only those who blindly obey him and surrender their individuality to him. For #'s sake - he threatens you with eternal punishment in a Hell of his own design, if you refuse to submit to him. This.. thing.. is your God?!
'The Devil does not think of himself as a Devil. He thinks himself a God.'
Praise Jehova? I'd rather thrust my blade into his black heart.
OK, that's a meaningful response. I think you for your participation in the discussion.
I was raised with the Bible and with all consequent Christian paradigms. Funnily enough, they seemed to have preferred to read me more of the Old Testament, so when I was acquainted with the idea of a 'son of God' that has a birthday and that's why I received presents.. I felt humiliated. And I trust the feeling of that child that felt mistreated. It is an ugly thing for parents to love their imaginary friend more than their own child.
I used to believe in Jehovah. I almost felt his presence and grand design. Now I suppose that Jehovah does exist, but that's he's just another powerful creative entity and not 'the one true God'.
If you simply care to examine what happens in reality it's basically the bad guys winning and the good guys suffering. We're supposed to thank the Biblical God for giving us suffering and to assume that since we're not this powerful entity, we should just accept that his good is mysterious and unknowable to us.
I have since rejected this. I will not respect a 'God' that rewards doing the right thing with suffering. I don't see how you rationalize the idea of a 'good God' with an entity that does whatever the # it pleases and puts the blame on the victim instead.
And since there does not seem to be an active, interfering entity that works for Good, I have since rejected the idea of a 'good God'. Yes, I'm fairly certain that there are many Deities. The Absolute, or the universal wave function if you will, undoubtedly encodes various deities. But I've come to the conclusion that if there is a Supreme Principle of Good, he does not see himself as a God, he is non-interfering and he is simply the basis that allows for the manifestation of the best of all possible worlds.
Theology has confused the two Principles at work, trying to merge the Principle of Good with the Principle of Evil into one entity. The misguided quest of monotheism. The Supreme Principle of Evil is active, interfering and imposing upon Creation. The Supreme Principle of Good is simply the base, a creative force that allows for all things.
When you do surrender your soul to this 'God' of yours, you are becoming a blind follower of an evil force. It will undoubtedly give you comfort and it probably has a special place in his Heaven for you. But don't think of yourself as 'good'. You're only 'good' according to this insane Deity, that considers 'good' only those who blindly obey him and surrender their individuality to him. For #'s sake - he threatens you with eternal punishment in a Hell of his own design, if you refuse to submit to him. This.. thing.. is your God?!
'The Devil does not think of himself as a Devil. He thinks himself a God.'
Praise Jehova? I'd rather thrust my blade into his black heart.
edit on 31-8-2017 by Rhaegar7 because: typos and clarifications
a reply to: Whatsthisthen
Just realize that we're all existentially free. You need to step a bit sideways from the Game to look at it in perspective. Everything is our own creation and we're all participating in the Game for the various experiences. There are no 'bad' experiences. They're all precious. I sincerely recommend you read Matrix V. I'm sure you will enjoy it.
The Universe is perfect and benevolent. It itself is the 'one true God'. In my essay on Deism, I came to the conclusion that God's real purpose was to create the perfect Universe and he basically poured everything of himself into it. So you have 'a paradoxical Creation of a perfect Creator' that does not need the Creator anymore. The Deist God has basically made himself a part of his Grand Design. He values his Creation and through it he tests himself. He's not some lazy mother#er who wants to be obeyed just because. He wants to rather earn the affection of those who participate in his Creation by providing them with something beautiful and worthy of a God.
Those who worship the abominations of religion are basically insulting the real Deity, the one who destroyed himself in order for his perfect Creation - The One Supernatural Universe - to come to life. 'God is dead' said Nietzsche. He was quite right. Quite funnily, the Universe came into being when God committed suicide. The point is - neither of us can be free, as long as there is some kind of omnipotent entity that can do whatever the # it pleases. That's why the real God basically destroyed himself so that the Universe can be free.
The real God, if we can even call him a God since this title has always been given to various demonic entities, does not care for your worship. His only desire is to set you free. He'd rather you learn your lessons yourself and eventually come to appreciate his design and the value of doing good. But he will never interfere directly with the path you have taken. He will let you face the consequences of your actions. He will *not* interfere. The theistic God seems to love to interfere, as if he just can't get it right the first time.. That's a laughable concept of divinity if I've ever heard one. The Deistic God has allowed the Universe to be perfect and will not interfere. He will let you find your own destiny.
So, I think we should find a new word for 'God', because it's quite obvious to me that the Universe needs no omnipotent, interfering entity. If it ever needed one - it was for the Supreme Principle of Evil to test the potentials of Creation to their fullest extent. This entity is what the monotheistic religions call God, and Blavatsky was right to call him by his real name - Satan.
I deviated from the topic though.
What I meant to say is that you should realize that everything is the way it should be. The Universe is perfect as it is. You don't need to fix it. Well, trying to fix it, will provide you with unique experiences, but if that's not what you're after - then stop doing it. Otherwise you'll keep playing out experiential loops that serve little purpose, but to provide some valuable experiences.
You need to regain your power by implementing 'the darkness' back into yourself. Owning it. The polarity game creates some kind of twist in our perceptions, so that we demonize certain aspects of ourselves and then play out various dramas on the battlefield. If you really feel like playing it, then go ahead. It provides valuable experiences. But if it's something else you're after, then regain all the facets of yourself that you've accepted as 'wrong', 'bad', 'dark' and whatever.. Once you're whole, you'll wake up and realize the dream-like nature of this world, and you'll remember why you came here.
The light-dark polarity game makes it so that 'to love yourself' is considered lowly and unworthy. Which is funny, because there is nothing more natural and healthy than to love yourself. And since you're basically alone with yourself in this dimension, you'll keep looping until you stop playing the light-dark polarity games and regain your Balance. Look at animals. Try to imagine how they perceive the world. The little cat likes to eat, chill, to play around - bite and claw various little things. It's super happy to just follow its nature.
We, as humans, are basically part of a huge mind control experiment whose goal is to operate our inner nature out of us and replace it with an artificially designed sense of self, that cannot conceive of any external reality to the Matrix.
Learn from the cats. They're here to protect you.
Just realize that we're all existentially free. You need to step a bit sideways from the Game to look at it in perspective. Everything is our own creation and we're all participating in the Game for the various experiences. There are no 'bad' experiences. They're all precious. I sincerely recommend you read Matrix V. I'm sure you will enjoy it.
The Universe is perfect and benevolent. It itself is the 'one true God'. In my essay on Deism, I came to the conclusion that God's real purpose was to create the perfect Universe and he basically poured everything of himself into it. So you have 'a paradoxical Creation of a perfect Creator' that does not need the Creator anymore. The Deist God has basically made himself a part of his Grand Design. He values his Creation and through it he tests himself. He's not some lazy mother#er who wants to be obeyed just because. He wants to rather earn the affection of those who participate in his Creation by providing them with something beautiful and worthy of a God.
Those who worship the abominations of religion are basically insulting the real Deity, the one who destroyed himself in order for his perfect Creation - The One Supernatural Universe - to come to life. 'God is dead' said Nietzsche. He was quite right. Quite funnily, the Universe came into being when God committed suicide. The point is - neither of us can be free, as long as there is some kind of omnipotent entity that can do whatever the # it pleases. That's why the real God basically destroyed himself so that the Universe can be free.
The real God, if we can even call him a God since this title has always been given to various demonic entities, does not care for your worship. His only desire is to set you free. He'd rather you learn your lessons yourself and eventually come to appreciate his design and the value of doing good. But he will never interfere directly with the path you have taken. He will let you face the consequences of your actions. He will *not* interfere. The theistic God seems to love to interfere, as if he just can't get it right the first time.. That's a laughable concept of divinity if I've ever heard one. The Deistic God has allowed the Universe to be perfect and will not interfere. He will let you find your own destiny.
So, I think we should find a new word for 'God', because it's quite obvious to me that the Universe needs no omnipotent, interfering entity. If it ever needed one - it was for the Supreme Principle of Evil to test the potentials of Creation to their fullest extent. This entity is what the monotheistic religions call God, and Blavatsky was right to call him by his real name - Satan.
I deviated from the topic though.
What I meant to say is that you should realize that everything is the way it should be. The Universe is perfect as it is. You don't need to fix it. Well, trying to fix it, will provide you with unique experiences, but if that's not what you're after - then stop doing it. Otherwise you'll keep playing out experiential loops that serve little purpose, but to provide some valuable experiences.
You need to regain your power by implementing 'the darkness' back into yourself. Owning it. The polarity game creates some kind of twist in our perceptions, so that we demonize certain aspects of ourselves and then play out various dramas on the battlefield. If you really feel like playing it, then go ahead. It provides valuable experiences. But if it's something else you're after, then regain all the facets of yourself that you've accepted as 'wrong', 'bad', 'dark' and whatever.. Once you're whole, you'll wake up and realize the dream-like nature of this world, and you'll remember why you came here.
The light-dark polarity game makes it so that 'to love yourself' is considered lowly and unworthy. Which is funny, because there is nothing more natural and healthy than to love yourself. And since you're basically alone with yourself in this dimension, you'll keep looping until you stop playing the light-dark polarity games and regain your Balance. Look at animals. Try to imagine how they perceive the world. The little cat likes to eat, chill, to play around - bite and claw various little things. It's super happy to just follow its nature.
We, as humans, are basically part of a huge mind control experiment whose goal is to operate our inner nature out of us and replace it with an artificially designed sense of self, that cannot conceive of any external reality to the Matrix.
Learn from the cats. They're here to protect you.
edit on 31-8-2017 by Rhaegar7 because: typos and clarifications
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