Proof Beloved Disciple is Simon Peter

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: ChesterJohn


But there is no reason we should not love the word of God. Not above our love for Jesus Christ our God and Saviour but secondary to him and before our own family, neighbors and others.

That part just creeps me out
A book, words above any human being, family enemy, where do you get that from.
I just cant find that in the bible, where???

Blessings

The word of God is that important, David loved and said so. So why are you so cheeped out about it? David love God's word over men. He also did not obey it and paid dearly for it, yet he is a saved man.

I posted you the Scriptures in my previous post. So by those scriptures we know we can love God's words as found in the preserved word, the AV, of God.

I love everyone I meet, but that love is different type and applied in different ways than the Love of God and my family. Or even my friends.

It should not creep you out. Those verses are supportive of loving God's word. The priority of what or the way we love is from what is most important to the least important.

I still Love our Lord and Mighty God Jesus Christ above all things. Including his word, the true Holy Scriptures, my family, Friends, and the unsaved.

What creeps me out is when people who say or claim they are Saved and used word's like SOB, calling Paul a liar, and rejecting most of God's word.

Be blessed

a reply to: ChesterJohn

David was a Jew, under the law, the old covenant
I am not

a reply to: Raggedyman

I don't think David being a Jew makes us who are not exempt from loving God's word. It was not commanded Israel to love the scriptures but David did say he loved them.

So why can't we?

Because you think it is Idolatry?

You are judging me which you shouldn't do unless it violates and hurts the body of Christ of which I am apart and it does not.

I do not bow down before my Bible or believe that my Bible in and of itself is holy. Nor Do I thank my Bible for saving me or ask my Bible to bless me or give me things or protect me from harm. I do not put it on a pedestal and not touch it. I put it on the ground, I write in it, I read it, study it but that does not make it an Idol. Especially when it is God who says by inspiration we are to read it, study and share it.

Now you want to talk about those who idolize their scriptures look at the Moslem and how they wont put their Koran on the ground, wont write in it and believe that the Koran in and if itself is HOLY. They keep it in a bag and protect it from getting dirty and wont write notes in it, and only will put on their prayer rug or hold it in their laps while on their prayer rug, because they believe it is so in and of itself holy they would be cursed and not go to heaven for doing so.

I love my Bible, through it God speaks to me, and shows his love to me, however my love of my Bible is not idolatrous. sensual or abnormal in any way that would hinder God or stumble my brother in Christ.

a reply to: ChesterJohn

If you are a Christian, I have every right to judge you
I don't have a right to judge those in the world
That's biblical

Ok then you don't idolise your bible
Ok then your attitude is fine
You just love this thing, this book, these words, you claim to love this book more than people who Christ Himself died for.
Jesus didn't die to save bibles

Ok there is a fire at yours...
It's consuming everything, no time, you hear your family screaming for help
You run in and save your bible, your love for it usurps your family.

Yes, that is how strange you sound

How about you go speak to some good trusted Christian friends, tell them how you feel, this love for the bible
If Jeus said, love God, love your bible, love each other, then we wouldn't be here
King David was a Jew, David was under the law of Moses, the law. We are not, we have Jesus, the living word

Oh and you say your bible is perfect, we know only Jesus is perfect


The Greeks have five different words for love, I hope I am just miss understanding the context you are using for the description of this so called love

a reply to: Raggedyman

You do exactly as every AV bible corrector does, go to an unverified koine Greek for the meaning of the a word.

Why not just go to the ENGLISH and learn the many different meanings of love that are far more than the Koine Greek could every give you. Not only that all Koine Greek has the classical Greek meanings put on them by Strong, and others.

Come back and judge me when you master the English meanings.

Jesus did say this and it is important than we follow. My Bible teaches me How to love you as a brother in Christ Gentile or Jew, and unsaved Gentile or Jew. But I learn that from the word of God.

Matt 4:4 But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.
Luke 4:4 And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God.

The Bible is far more important and beloved of me than the world and all it has to offer.

you have no reason to judgement I have not openly sinned or caused anyone in the body to stumble. Plus if I did there are procedures to follow and you are very limited in that seeing we do not personally fellowship with each other. And I do not consider ATS a Fellowship of believers even if we have some who claim to be a brother. It never says online charge a person with what you feel is Idolatry. Or that that person loves the word of God differently than he love is family or the body of Christ.

My most trusted Christian friend is a pastor like myself and he loves the word of God as I do. Sorry you will find real true Christians do in fact love the word of God and find it to be far more important than anything else. the word teaches us to Love God above all else, to care for our families, love our wives and work hard with our own hands. I am not Idolatrous, I am not an adulterer, I am not a drunkard, drug addict or sex addict. I love my neighbors and care for them and what is theirs. I share the gospel with the lost, instruct the weak and feeble minded, I care for the poor, I love the beasts that are mine and even those that are not mine.

You have no claim to judge me. But if you do then come to the White Hart Cafe at 1200 Main St Lynching Va across from the City Market on July 22nd and I will bring my pastor (not my friend of mentioned earlier) at 1PM, I'll buy lunch and you can accuse me in front of him and let's see if I am indeed in sin for loving the word of God differently than I love you or my family.

Do you love a certain type of food? Do you love your wife the same as your son or daughter or you neighbors wife? Do you love to watch sunrises or sunsets? Do you love to see people get saved? Do you love to come to ATS and participate here?

I can say yes to all of those question but I love them differently than God and his word.

Come to the white hart Cafe as I gave the address too openly above. PM me if you can make it. And if not give me a time we can meet and you can openly accuse me of sin in front of my pastor and you can bring yours as well.

I have nothing to hide in my walk with God. But you have accused me openly of spending all my time in the Bible and that I ignore everything else around me and I don't. That is a false accusation. I spend most of my time currently working hard to pay for my house and feed my family. I love my wife and there is no one around me crying out for help and I am ignoring them. I took my family to the beach yesterday a 900 mile round trip drive for me. Just so we could spend a few hours in the car and at the beach and eating at a restaurant that is only found in Virginia Beach.

You are so off track and I feel you own me an open apology for your false accusations. But first accuses me face to face over lunch I am a patient man and will hear you out. But I tell you you are the one who is wrong.

If you truly love God you will love his word too and more than you wife or children. But it doesn't mean you don't love them.

originally posted by: ChesterJohn
a reply to: Raggedyman

You do exactly as every AV bible corrector does, go to an unverified koine Greek for the meaning of the a word.

Why not just go to the ENGLISH and learn the many different meanings of love that are far more than the Koine Greek could every give you. Not only that all Koine Greek has the classical Greek meanings put on them by Strong, and others.

Come back and judge me when you master the English meanings.

Jesus did say this and it is important than we follow. My Bible teaches me How to love you as a brother in Christ Gentile or Jew, and unsaved Gentile or Jew. But I learn that from the word of God.

Matt 4:4 But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.
Luke 4:4 And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God.

The Bible is far more important and beloved of me than the world and all it has to offer.

you have no reason to judgement I have not openly sinned or caused anyone in the body to stumble. Plus if I did there are procedures to follow and you are very limited in that seeing we do not personally fellowship with each other. And I do not consider ATS a Fellowship of believers even if we have some who claim to be a brother. It never says online charge a person with what you feel is Idolatry. Or that that person loves the word of God differently than he love is family or the body of Christ.

My most trusted Christian friend is a pastor like myself and he loves the word of God as I do. Sorry you will find real true Christians do in fact love the word of God and find it to be far more important than anything else. the word teaches us to Love God above all else, to care for our families, love our wives and work hard with our own hands. I am not Idolatrous, I am not an adulterer, I am not a drunkard, drug addict or sex addict. I love my neighbors and care for them and what is theirs. I share the gospel with the lost, instruct the weak and feeble minded, I care for the poor, I love the beasts that are mine and even those that are not mine.

If you truly love God you will love his word too and more than you wife or children. But it doesn't mean you don't love them.

No
Stop the pedantics
Jesus taught love, not what you or those you fellowship with believe, that the bible is holy or better, or you are smarter
JW.org members do the exact same thing with their own biblical translation, set themselves apart with a bible version
they are a cult, you are heading down that very road

Understand this carefully, you can shove your AV bible, I have Jesus
jesus, died, rose again, for me
No bible version has done that for me. No koine greek

and your a minister, God help those you teach, I fear they are lead astray
Mormons, JW, Seventh Days, all have their own bible versions, their understandings.
Christians are united under Jesus, not a book

I have not accused you of spending all your time in a bible, I have said exactly what you said. You put your bible before people, that is not biblical, it has never been if it is, then shut me up

You put your bible before people, that is not biblical, it has never been if it is, then shut me up

I will apologise that I hurt your feelings, that we are arguing, that this isnt the way that christians should act in public

Now go apologise to your family, you know your wife, the one you married, took an oath to, remember that oath.
Go read it again, that marriage oath that seemingly means nothing to you as a christian, that marriage oath that seemingly is a shadow of the love you have for the bible, then tell your children you love them more than the bible, with agape love.

Jesus died for us, as christians we are to do the same thing for the people of the world. Jesus called us into relationship, with our spouses. to die for them as men...
Christians are the bride of Christ, He died for us.
Jesus said, love God, love each other, never said love the AV bible anywhere I have read

Yep, no. Its all about the bible, how we are to love that before family, how, what? Are we to marry the bible? Do/are we to sign a covenant with the bible, its getting absurd

Really
God created us for relationship with Him
God created us for relationship with each other
God created the bible as a tool, its a very good tool.
I will love my family, strangers, sinners over a tool, always.


Oh, no thanks, Esperance Western Australia is a looong way from the cafe, even for a meal, free or otherwise

Agape love is Gods love for us, Christs love for His church
You have reduced it into a love for the bible
Something that is UNBIBLICAL, completely unbiblical

If I am wrong, show me...


Have I judged you, I am warning you

If you feel judged then it may well not be my prompting

If another places their faith in your beloved AV and it is proven wrong, its their faith that is lost, maybe yours as well.
Faith in Jesus cant be lost, He is perfect.
Bart Ehrman comes to mind
Placed his faith in the bible, not in Jesus, when he found fault, he became an atheist. A very outspoken atheist.

In three words, blunt and absolute, Jesus commanded us, "Do not judge" (Matt. 7:1). But did he really mean that we should never judge others? He goes on to suggest that it's not the act of judging but the attitude with which we do it that God is most concerned about—"For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged" (7:2).
There are other Scriptures that either cloud or shed light on the issue. Paul told the Christians in Rome not to judge one another (Rom. 14:13) but taught the Corinthians that they were to judge sinful believers and leave people outside the church to God (1 Cor. 5:12-13). James said he who judges his brother speaks against the law (4:11) but also implied that our judgments of others must be done with mercy (2:12-13).www.christianitytoday.com...

a reply to: Raggedyman

your problem is only that you do not believe that the written word of God preserved into English has any relevance on your life or that of any other.

Jesus, the Living Word is worshiped, while the written words found int he Bible/scriptures are followed. But you must rightly divide the word of Truth so you are not following the wrong scriptures as the JW's do. I do not believe any Gentile under faith in Christ through the Grace of God, received as a gift from God is under any law except the law of liberty, and that is not a license to sin but one to refrain or abstain from sin.

This is the power of God in me.

But you still falsely accused me of ignoring my family, the poor, the downtrodden for my study of God's word. Come let's meet and see if you are as self-righteous in person as you are online.

a reply to: ChesterJohn

That's childish
I read the bible, study it and follow its teachings, by loving God first and others second, as the bible teaches
I follow its laws, unlike others.
This is me following Gods heart

I never accused you of ignoring your family, you said you loved your bible more than your family, that's weird, religious, idol worship.
That's what the Pharisees use to do. Loved the rules more than the people.

Yes let's meet, come to Australia

a reply to: Raggedyman

Well you made it very clear with this statement. Which is not true of me.

Ok there is a fire at yours...
It's consuming everything, no time, you hear your family screaming for help
You run in and save your bible, your love for it usurps your family

The love you say I have for paper and ink over my family is an accusation

That is not what I ever meant but when it comes to walking with the Lord, there is nothing wrong in loving his word.

If my house was on fire my family would be what I would go in for, If I was going down the street and another house was on fire and I knew there were people in there I would rescue them. The preserved word of God, the Holy Bible can always be bought or found for free at many thrift stores or churches that use it (though they are getting to be far and fewer in between).

I read my Bible, Study it and follow its precepts, and applications that are for me as a Christian, as the church, as the Body of Christ. I am not a Jew nor am I in the earthly Kingdom that is promised to Israel which is still to come. Those who have Kingdom Halls think they are the new Israel and that all the promises to that nation are now their own and they are in the greatest error that will not help them one bit.

I would love to come to Australia and visit with you. But Family comes first according to the word of God, I start my day by reading it, if I get more time I do deeper study, and I am writing a commentary on the whole Bible, basically it is my through the Bible teachings I have done over the years. Then I go to work 8 to 10 hours a day even at my older age to provide for them.

While in the Mission field for 15 years, I used to study my Bible for 6 to 8 hours a day for at least three days a week, but I always read it every day. My study was to prepare for 3 in home Bible studies, Sunday and Sunday night teachings, Wednesday nights.

I am not sure if you do not know or understand the many meanings of Love and the importance of that love in all that we do in the English Language. Or you are just actually just doing some sort of baiting and arguing for the sake of thinking you can accuse me of Idolatry. I love God, His word, my wife, my kids, my neighbors, even strangers, but my God and Saviour Jesus Christ I love above all else.

So if it comes to my grabbing my bible or my family from a burning house the bible can burn. I love what is in it not the paper book that the print is on. The inspired word has been loved by many people for thousands of years. David loved it and their is no requirement to love God's words but there is nothing wrong with it.

I can tell from the answer to this question if you really know anything about the Bible. Is the Gospel of the Kingdom (Mt 4:23; 9:35; 24:14, Mk 1:14), the gospel of the grace of God (Acts 20:240, Gospel of Christ (Roms 1:16), and the Everlasting Gospel (Rev 14:6) all the same?

a reply to: ChesterJohn

Wow
Here is me thinking that Jesus was the gospel and we His church the living gospel of His, on the earth
A book on its own, unread, untouched is just paper

But hey, if the bible is the gospel, then best I sit on my couch and let the bible do the work

I go to a baptist church where they read and study their bibles and they still think they are under the law, still think they cant work Sundays, still think that the 10 commandments are the new covenant
They read it and they do, none of them, understand it
I have come across many atheists here who cant differentiate between the OT and the NT, many christians as well.

So please dont tell me your bible is the way, the truth, the light.
Jesus is, not a book, no matter how good you think it is

Listen to yourself and your praise of the AV bible, thats just bizarre
You know Muslims love the koran, their word, its holy, they kill for it, they love it...

You put your bible before people, that is not biblical, it has never been if it is, then show me
The bible was written to teach us about Jesus, not the bible itself


We disagree, I see no further value in this conversation.

To me the bible is
Nothing without Jesus Christ

a reply to: Raggedyman

Hem, then through out your Bible and just pray to Jesus to reveal his word to you.

I do not put a printed bible before people. I place great importance of the preserved word of God over what men may say concerning spiritual things. But I love my bible ( the words in it) more than men and it is not wrong to do so.

You seem to be a bit immature to the many meaning of love in English.

In this world Jesus is first, his word second, and all other things fall after that according to their importance.

The bible is for

2Tim 3:16, 17 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

Without is men will fail to even serve properly for in it we are instructed in gifts and how they are to be used. The God/Jesus breathed words are important without it men err.

For example many churches teach that the Pastor is the leader of the local assembly but yet not one scripture supports that teaching/doctrine. While Paul taught that they appoint elders in every church to over see the assembly, these are to be the leaders, it never says that about Pastors.

Today's church only want Elite degree holding men to be a pastor and lead the church. Even children's ministries those who want it must have a degree in that, and worship also now required to have a degree from an accredited Christian University. None of which are in the Bible.

The Bible says they are gifts in Roms 12, 1Cor 12 and Eph 4 it is clear these are gifts given for ministry and teaching given by the Holy Ghost severely as he wills. But many have institutionalized the church so that is no longer operated as it should and we wonder why the church as a body of Christ is in such disarray. The assembly is not an institution but an organize that should operate as a body not a machine.

You are still wrong about me.

a reply to: ChesterJohn

You said
You love God, your bible then family

That to me sounds like you are personificating your bible
That is not christian, it is not normal, never mind christian

If you cant see that

I suggest you spend some serious time contemplating what christianity is.
Studying your bible, not loving it

I am not here arguing who is a leader, who should be and shouldnt be doing ministry, what the pope is or isnt, JW.org, cults, the laws, whatever you want to argue
I have issues with you loving Gods word, the bible in between loving God and your family, my issue is you personifying your bible

If you dont I am sorry for saying what isnt true, but it sure looks like you are personifying your bible to me. It sure sounds like it to me.

a reply to: Raggedyman

I understand what you are saying and the word of God should be a priority in any Christians life.

If they don't love God's word then they have a problem.

It was not an argument as it was giving info that supports what happens when people ignore the word of God.

Studying the Bible will instruct us in the doctrines in it. Many of which have been totally reversed and ignored. this problem is because of the lack of knowing which ENGLISH Bible is the the preserved word of God for this current generation.

The lack of love of the word of God is also one of the reasons people will reverse, replace and ignore the word of God,the Holy Bible, the scriptures.

Again I do not worship the preserved word of God, I worship the God, my Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ and him alone. As far as how it fits into my priority of love does not mean I love my family or neighbors or anyone else including you any less than what Scriptures demands on me.

Loving something is not always personifying it. That is where you need to educate yourself on the many meanings of the English word love. I am sure I made it clear that loving the word of God and choosing to let it burn in a fire over family are not in anyway personifying it, but actually showing my view that the written Bible is not as important as people are.

Muslims will not write in their Koran. They will not set it on the ground without a covering over it. If they sneeze on it they have it burned by an Imam and buy a new one. so there is a difference between their "love" of their Koran and my "love" for my preserved Bible. They truly idolize it while I give it a great place in my life without care of the pages or cover. I write in it, I have unintentionally sneezed on it, spilled a little coffee on it. I simply wipe it and keep on going. If it get's lost or ruined I care not for I know I can get another one very easily.

Loving a sunset is not personifying it until I thank the sun for blessing me. That is true idolatry. I have never thanked my Bible for anything. I thank God, the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ for all things.

I am sure I never said the Bible was a person or the Bible itself was "the Gospel". Though there is a version of a group of men that is called the "good news". Then when they revised it it became the "good news for modern men". The two Bible books from the same group and publishers are very different if you read them side by side. It is more of a commentary version than an accurate Bible.

There is nothing wrong with loving God's word, I showed that David spoke openly of loving it in its many parts as precepts, statutes, commandments, judgements, or testimonies (forms of right division). But not once did David personify the word of God and neither have I.

To me Jesus is the God of the Bible. And because of his words which I love so dearly even as much as my own life still does not make me personifying the Bible.

Loving something does not make it a person. It shows how important it is to a person.

Be Blessed

a reply to: ChesterJohn

When you say
When you say you love God first, then the bible, then your family, it sounds like you are personifying your bible. Deal with that, do something, think about what you are saying, how it is heard
Maybe ....I love my God and family, I love to read and learn from Gods word, I love to grow as a Christian, my knowledge and living as Christ and the apostles taught in that book. I love the written instruction, the people written about, their message and how they inspired me to live a more Christ focused life, but NO.
You love the bible, that sound really weird, like you love a book and you love that book more than your family

I don't love my bible, I learn from it, rarely ever read it, I listen to it regularly. I listen to the great preachers exegete Gods word, I miss to much when I read it on my own, I need more input from others so I don't get stuck in a wrong understanding or take my pre conceived thoughts in
I didn't grow up in the A&NE, so I miss cultural things, not fully conversant in all the OT stuff so misunderstand some prophetic things. The bible on its own is a difficult book to read.

Funny, I took a bible study the other day and someone there said they draw no inspiration from anywhere other than the bible
Funny thing is till he started the bible study I was doing previously, he believed he was under the Jewish law, the Ten Commandments, he also complained when I said I wasn't under the Ten Commandments
Other people in the bible study said they got inspiration from preachers, bible studies, books other than the bible, songs, the radio and tv.
One guy said he only got what he knew from the bible, and he was wrong

You remind me of that guy, that's really sad.
The Holy Spirit still works, gently, quietly but still works


Me, I love God, then I love sunsets and then my family
And imagine how your family feels, that you love your bible more than them
You may not mean what you say the way it was said, but you do need to change how you say it, it sounds wrong

I love my God, His word, His instructions, I want to live just as His word instructs, so I can love my family as a better husband and father and please my God

a reply to: Raggedyman

So do you know the differences of the gospel of the kingdom Gospel , the gospel of the grace of God and the Everlasting Gospel or do you think they are all the same?

a reply to: Padawan Raggedyman

originally posted by: Padawan Raggedyman
a reply to: ChesterJohn

Yes let's meet, come to Australia

Nooooooo theres a Padawan in Australia!

God help us all.

Coomba98

originally posted by: coomba98
a reply to: Padawan Raggedyman

originally posted by: Padawan Raggedyman
a reply to: ChesterJohn

Yes let's meet, come to Australia

Nooooooo theres a Padawan in Australia!

God help us all.

Coomba98

Oh look my private stalker
Thats called love, you care, you want my attention, you have it?
What do you want

originally posted by: ChesterJohn
a reply to: Raggedyman

So do you know the differences of the gospel of the kingdom Gospel , the gospel of the grace of God and the Everlasting Gospel or do you think they are all the same?

I know Gods message was to love Him and those in the world.
You know, Fruit of the Spirit, Sermon on the Mount, nothing about theology

I recon I will work on those two
Living as Jesus commanded

a reply to: Padawan Raggedyman

originally posted by: Padawan Raggedyman
a reply to: Coomba98
Oh look my private stalker

I think you dont know the definition of 'private' and 'stalker' Padawan, this is a world wide internet forum. Guess thats that home schooling youngling.

Master Coomba

Raggedyman

Raggedyman, you didn't answer my question and I was really interested in reading your opinion/answer.

Here is is again just in case you missed it.

So do you know the differences of the gospel of the kingdom Gospel , the gospel of the grace of God and the Everlasting Gospel or do you think they are all the same?

Well the Bible is a learn it, love it, live it thing.

But you can only use what is written to you in this present age, and not all the Bible is written to us today, though it be written for us so we have it in our hands, so that we may know the beginning and the end of this world.

be blessed brother