What if Bush has been right about Iraq all along?

War has never been about "liberation" or "doing the right thing" it's always been about God(money).

Big deal, they had elections...now comes the important question, will things start getting better for the Iraqis? Time will tell.

Originally posted by Seekerof
how about provide some links that show that the US, the UK, etc. are benefiting from this newly "acquired" oil. Hell, Phaethor, that OIL that everyone claims this and that about isn't even helping the Iraqis, who to this day are going through a severe gasoline crisis.

Strange, huh? OIL? Yeah...riiiigght.
Show me were it has dropped my gas and oil bills, k? Show me were it is benefiting the Iraqis. Or, simply you can keep claiming and asserting such with no remote sense of credible and factual backing.

seekerof

[edit on 1-2-2005 by Seekerof]

Oil 2003

Iraq = 481 Thousand Barrels/day

Oil 2004 Just Jan - Oct

Iraq = 660 Thousand Barrels/day

That doens't even count November and December. Yes we are getting more oil from Iraq. Your cost hasn't gone down, its gone up for profit margin reasons, because they need to pay for the cost of getting that oil (war) some how.

Phae

9-11 was one of the dirtiest most low-down stunts ever pulled,

all that can and does come from such things, can and does manifest before the event itself as well as after it,

there are things that happen and regardless of who you are you still get caught up in them, as if a thing happening makes other things bound to happen,

I did not agree with the Iraq invasion because of the way it was done - a lot of necessary structure being destroyed, but, I would say that as soon as 9-11 happened, it set the world on a specific path of various outcomes that couldn't be avoided anyway.

If Bush had not gone to war they'd have got rid of him and got someone that would have, which is fair enough - I know if anyone tries to attack me that I am not going to be happy to let them so much as think that they got the better of me, because to attck in the first place is also an invasion on spiritual levels to the soul itself, so you must sort it out, or they will eat away at you if only in their minds, and all reality manifests from thoughts first of all before it becomes physical-solid.

Remember what Bill Hicks said about Bush snr. in his Revelations gig (and probably other ones too) - cover of Newsweek, ''Wimp President'', then of course a war is going to happen, etc........it's the "stuck in his craw" bit I found the funniest.
Well - loads of people had it in for the current Pres. well before 9-11 happened, and those were some of the ugliest comments I have ever had the displeasure to see. It was terrible the way loads of people went like that, and didn't even let up - no chances given or anything. My point here is that, of course he'll be right about Iraq. He's been mostly responding to attacks so far - those have a habit of bouncing back to whoever launched them.

He's the sort of person that even if he didn't know who really did 9-11, he'd just end up doing stuff that would result in those responsible being payed back for it, even if it's never on the news. Even if no-one ever finds out. Even if he wasn't sure that he even did it.

Originally posted by Seekerof
Strange, huh? OIL? Yeah...riiiigght.
Show me were it has dropped my gas and oil bills, k? Show me were it is benefiting the Iraqis.

Well Seek.........seems oil companies can't seem to hide the record setting profits they've been reaping.
And since I went to one of those fancy business schools, I know max profit is attained by buying cheap & selling high. I wa sthere the day they covered supply & demand as well. And you know what the professor said? That if a seller has an excess inventory, they will drop the price to move merchandise. So, it would stand to reason that a Strategic Oil Reserve would be a great, great tool to help the S & D ratio, no?

I wonder where they've gotten the cheap oil from?

As with human nature, you're figuring things out via altruism, logic of the good action, if you will. That logic would say that these oil conglomerates will get it cheap, thus they'll sell it cheap.
In actuality, they are operating with the best cover of all possible covers = false crisis. Now anyone following Team Bush should know full well the benefits of False Crisis, no?

McFly huh(?) jsut gotta laugh man, I mean, I guess you suffer from the short man needs power syndrome as shown by your avatar. Do you come one hear to take out frustrations safely, or are you trying to learn something from others.


I am simply asking if you Can attempt to bring in a valid arguement rather than attempting to pin us all as Dubya bandwagoneers if we support Iraq. .

1. There were elections amid violence, but 5 years ago would ANYONE have thought this possible. If you don't want to give credit to Bush, fine, give it to our military.

2. Iraq was created by bringing together 3 tribes with different views, and made them to all try to live together. There have been decades of strife and war. Now that the dictator is gone, the power grab has begun and we are now in the middle, but again, there were elections. Why can this not be looked at as good.

3. Should we have waited 2 more years, have Iran get the bomb, and have HUssien do something stupid to spark a nuclear conflict?

4. If this war is all about the US wanting oil, how come i am not paying 34 cents a gallon yet. Don't blame Bush, blame Exxon Mobil...

By segment, the company's exploration and production operations earned $4.89 billion, an increase of $1.62 billion from the year-ago quarter. Oil and gas prices provided the boost as production declined by 2 percent on a year-over-year basis

Originally posted by esdad71
McFly huh(?) jsut gotta laugh man, I mean, I guess you suffer from the short man needs power syndrome as shown by your avatar. Do you come one hear to take out frustrations safely, or are you trying to learn something from others.

Exactly where that nastiness comes from, I don't know, but exactly what do you propose is to add to my erudition from false & party line bullsh**t? That the manufactured crisis of Iraq, it's destruction, the removal of a castrated 3rd world leader who was made such by the working sanctions against him stopping him from any WMD program reconstitution, and our Korean style decades long we-broke-it-we-bought-it committment to Iraq, is to somehow be cheered because the Shia majority got out & voted in the 40% of the country where polls could be set up!?!?
Do you suffer from the beer bong false nationalism that puts a kid on a tank & has you thumpin' yer chest for being a "real AMericun"?

I am simply asking if you Can attempt to bring in a valid arguement rather than attempting to pin us all as Dubya bandwagoneers if we support Iraq. .

Pay attention - it was a counterpoint to a specific poster about the false logic of applying American ownership of Iraqi oil translating to cost relief for the masses. I'm done attempting to convert anybody; I'm happy to let social Darwinism take care of you.

1. There were elections amid violence, but 5 years ago would ANYONE have thought this possible. If you don't want to give credit to Bush, fine, give it to our military.

And where were your thoughts on Iraq 5 years ago? Riiiiiight, the beer bong thing again

2. Iraq was created by bringing together 3 tribes with different views, and made them to all try to live together. There have been decades of strife and war. Now that the dictator is gone, the power grab has begun and we are now in the middle, but again, there were elections. Why can this not be looked at as good.

The Shia will exact bloody revenge for being suppressed by the Sunni, the Kurds will splinter off officialy bringing the Turks into war......yeah, sh***ts & giggles ahead for sure!

3. Should we have waited 2 more years, have Iran get the bomb, and have HUssien do something stupid to spark a nuclear conflict?

That's just plain ingnorant to offer up the proven false hype of Iraq's ability to rebuild....or are you still eating Yellow Cake!?!?

4. If this war is all about the US wanting oil, how come i am not paying 34 cents a gallon yet. Don't blame Bush, blame Exxon Mobil...

See my Answer to Seek that you over reacted to

By segment, the company's exploration and production operations earned $4.89 billion, an increase of $1.62 billion from the year-ago quarter. Oil and gas prices provided the boost as production declined by 2 percent on a year-over-year basis

Bush wasn't right all along! No nukes, no terrorist ties, no mass murders, nothing! He didn't say anything about elections until about a week before his election. Hell, what if a alien from Murdock Surri 4 and all his fellow black midget albino jews with chicken wings and monkey tails were right all along? Guess what, they weren't.

Iraq now has 2 good days. Saddam found, elections. So, 2 days-3 years of hell from Bush=2years, 12 months, and 29(or 28?) days of hell from Bush. Sure, before if they said something bad about Saddam or didn't follow the law they were killed, but nowadays they are killed just because they are there. Oops, blew up a school, hospital, apartment building, another aprtment building, block of houses, another school. And before, no terrorists. No beheadings, no being blown up cause you were standing to close to the invading army. No being mowed down by the US army cause someone saw a shiny object that could have been a gun, but was a watch. How many terrorist attacks were there before we invaded? Sure, Saddam&Co. weren't saints, but with them they killed people who broke the law, with Bush? Kills people just because they there. Still funny that OBL/Saudi Arabia !TARGETS! civillians, 3000+. America "doesn't" target civillians 20,000+ dead. And we haven't invaded SA, a country that could teach Saddam new, old, and present tricks in the torture book.

Originally posted by Amuk


BUT....I think the entire matter could have been handled better by a backward Chimp than Bush

Just for chuckles, would you mind naming a few backward chimps you are referring to?

Sorry to disagree James the Lesser,
But this isn't only about the 3,000 people killed on 911. True it was the largest terrorist attack, but go ahead and add up all of the deaths caused by OBL/and Saudi Terror groups and I think you'll see that they have killed a comparable number. But somehow I'm sure it will be proven to be Bush's fault all along.

Bush hasn't been right about a single thing yet. WMD, Al Qaeda, hundreds of thousands of bodies in mass graves. All complete lies.

As for this election. An election where the voters don't even know who they are voting for is not a legitimate election. Its a publicity stunt.

The intelligence of humans can amazingly be manipulated by mere fragments of a man's thought processes. Lest we forget dear reader the reason for war in the first place. For it had nothing to do with freedom loving Iraqi's nor WMD's, and especially of all things especially not the spread of wonderful democracy. For anyone to think democracy is spread by invading a country and placing liberty on those who never fought for it themselves - you are surely misconstrued on the facts of history and certainly on reality in general. If gravity makes on fall surely do not disagree on this matter. However those of the Bush Administration will assure you gravity can be manipulated anyway they wish.

Lets not forget the following else you yourself once again be fooled into believing the lies of our democracy loving government.

#1 Oil company on the planet - American Exxon Mibil
#2 Oil company on the planet - British & American ChevronTexaco

Fact: Iraq is the second largest oil producing land mass on the planet and has been sought after since the 1940's where British rule lost it's grip.

For those ignorant of reality Condolezza Rice was a Director for Chevron from 1991 until January 15, 2001 when she was transferred by President George W Bush to National Security Adviser. She even has a 130,000lb Chevron tanker named after her called, you guessed it, Condoleeza Rice.

Lets look at the current directors of exxon shall we?

Michael J. Boskin
T. M. Friedman Professor of Economics, and Senior Fellow, Hoover Institution, Stanford University. Holds bachelor's, master's, and Ph.D. degrees in economics. Joined Stanford University in 1970. Adjunct Scholar, American Enterprise Institute; Research Associate, National Bureau of Economic Research. Director, First Health Group Corporation; Oracle Corporation; Vodafone Group PLC. Chairman, Congressional Advisory Commission on the Consumer Price Index, 1995-96; Council of Economic Advisors, 1989-93. Member, Commerce Department, Advisory Committee on the National Income and Product Accounts; Panel of Advisors to the Congressional Budget Office. Dr. Boskin is the recipient of numerous professional awards.

William R. Howell
Chairman Emeritus, J.C. Penney Company, Inc. Holds bachelor of business administration degree. Joined J.C. Penney, a department store and catalog chain, in 1958. Held a variety of management positions. Elected Chairman of the Board and Chief Executive Officer in 1983. Retired as Chairman of the Board in 1997. Director, American Electric Power Company, Inc.; Halliburton Co.; Pfizer Inc.; The Williams Companies, Inc. Mr. Howell is also a Director of Deutsche Bank Trust Corporation and Deutsche Bank Trust Company Americas, non-public wholly-owned subsidiaries of Deutsche Bank AG; and Viseon, Inc., where he will not stand for re-election to the board in 2004.

Lee R. Raymond
Chairman of the Board and Chief Executive Officer, Exxon Mobil Corporation. Holds bachelor's and Ph.D. degrees in chemical engineering. Since joining the ExxonMobil organization in 1963, Mr. Raymond has held a variety of management positions in domestic and foreign operations, including Exxon Company, U.S.A.; Creole Petroleum Corporation; Exxon Company, International; Exxon Enterprises; Esso Inter-America, Inc. Elected Senior Vice President and Director of Exxon in 1984, President in 1987, Chairman and Chief Executive Officer in 1993, and added title of President in 1996. Director, J.P. Morgan Chase & Co.; United Negro College Fund; American Petroleum Institute. Trustee and Vice Chairman, American Enterprise Institute. Trustee, Wisconsin Alumni Research Foundation. Member, The Business Council; The Business Roundtable; Council on Foreign Relations; Emergency Committee for American Trade; National Academy of Engineering; National Petroleum Council; President's Export Council; Secretary of Energy Advisory Board; Singapore-U.S. Business Council; Trilateral Commission; University of Wisconsin Foundation.

You'll notice one thing in common with these wonderful directors that they are directors with Halliburton and the American Enterprise Institute. If you are unaware of the American Enterprise Institute and it's grandiose ties to the White House and the likes of Richard Perle well I leave that up to you to read about yourself.

Shall we talk about Dick Cheney, Chairman and CEO of Halliburton in 1995 before becoming Vice President of our beloved country? No I don't think so anyone can read this very open information for yourself along with the companies running the oil from Kazakhstan to Iraq. Whether you choose to remain ignorant and keep on believing in the the 'liberation' of Iraq you go right ahead but what you are belieivng in is a fantasy of democracy created in your mind by those who will be lavishing in their wealth until their deaths while our sons and daughters sit in wheelchairs collecting socail security. Oh but upon your death you do now get $250,000. Sorry I failed to mention that. The righteousness of WWII is over has been for 60 years.

Why are the Americans and the British the majority bread winners in Iraq? Chevron Texaco. This is mere tip of the iceberg, scratch the surface information avaivalbe to any citizen that wishes to know about reality that the war in Iraq has always been and always was about oil and security in the middle east. Anyone who wishes to paint this as anything other that what it is - is simply ignorant of the facts and reality. No elections will change those facts nor will the ouster of the IPCC Chair, Robert Watson and the results of 2000 international scientists change the atmospheric conditions of our planet to suit exxonmobil profits.

There is of course damaging information readily available to anyone who will 'delve' into such hidden portfolio's but since I value my life as this forum is completely spidered of it's information I leave the search entirely up to you. For those who support the war in Iraq you may wish to pursue a career at one of these fine companies below watch out though as job requirements in foreign countries include mass murder:

Exxonmobil
Chevrontexaco
Schlumberger Limited
Halliburton here is a list of their subs:
Kellogg, Brown and Root - KBR (now a construction company Analysts at Deutsche Bank value KBR at up to $2.15 billion - not bad for a subsidiary making a quick elevation off Iraq eh)

Adute Pty Ltd. (Australia)
AOC Services Limited - (Jersey, tax haven)
Antilles Dresser-Rand (tax haven)
Avalon Financial Services, Ltd. (Cayman Islands, tax haven)
Axelson
Baroid Caribbean Limited Brown & Root (Overseas) Limited - (Jersey, tax haven)
Baroid CIMBAR
Baroid Drilling Inc
Baroid Drilling Fluids
Baroid Drilling Fluids/Plant
Baroid Filtration
Baroid Halliburton Offshore Services Inc.
Baroid IDP
Baroid of Nigeria Limited
Baroid Pigmina Industrial E Comercial Ltda
Baroid Plant
Baroid Solids Control
Baroid Tesoro Coastwide Svcs
Baroid Warehouse
Beheersmaatschappij Van Aandelen In Textielverwerkende O (Netherlands)
Bentonite Performance Minerals
Bitc (Us) Llc
Bitc Holdings (Us) Llc
Bredero Price Holding Bv (Netherlands)
Breswater Marine Contracting Bv (Netherlands)
Brown & Root Building Co
Cayman Holdings, Inc.
Condor Spa (Algeria)
Construction Pty Ltd. (Australia)
Environmental
FWENC
Government Services
Industrial Services
Log Jamss
Skoda s.r.o.
Caspian Transco Inc. (Cayman Islands, tax haven)
Cebar Sdn Bhd (Brunei Darussalam)
C.I. Limited (Cayman Islands, tax haven)
Cimbar Performance Mnrl Division
CNOOC-Otis Well Comp Services Ltd
Consorcio Contrina Snc (France)
Corporacion Mexicana De Mantenimiento Integral Sde Rl De Cv (Mexico)
Db Stratabit Gmbh (Germany)
Deveron Facility
Devonport Management Limited
DII Industries
Dorhold Ltd. (United Kingdom)
Downhole Motor Services
Energy Services Group
Falcon AFB Contract Mgmt Logistics Inc
Fann Instrument
G&H Management Llc (United States)
Georgetown Finance Ltd. (Caymans Islands)
Goddard SFC JOC
Granherne Limited
Granherne Pty Limited
Grove Foreign Sales Corp. (Barbados, tax haven)
Grove-Tk Ltd. (United Kingdom)
Guiberson AVA
Guiberson Oil Tools
GVA Consultants AB
Halliburton Acquisition Company
Halliburton Afrique S.N.C.
Halliburton Argentina S. A.
Halliburton Australia
Halliburton Aviation Division
Halliburton Baroid
Halliburton Baroid Singapore
Halliburton Benefits Center
Halliburton Brunei
Halliburton BV (Netherlands)
Baroid
Security DBS
Sperry Sunn
Halliburton Camp Facility
Halliburton Canada Inc.
Halliburton Canada/Guiberson
Halliburton Company Austria G.m.b.H.
Halliburton Company Germany GmbH
Halliburton Company, Saudi Arabia Branch
Halliburton Company/Tax Department
Halliburton del Peru SA
Halliburton de Venezuela SA
Halliburton Denmark A/S
Halliburton Energy Development (Kazakhstan) (Cayman Islands, tax haven)
Halliburton Energy Services
DEG
Jet Research Center
Halliburton Far East Pte Ltd
Halliburton Geophysical Services (Cayman Islands, tax haven)
Halliburton Global Account Management - ENI
Halliburton Indonesia
Halliburton Italiana S.p.A.
Halliburton Latin America SA
Base Neiva
Base Yopal
Bodega Sperry Sun
Division Landmark
Laboratorio Baroid
Halliburton Limited
Halliburton Landmark
Halliburton Logging Services
Halliburton Logging Svcs Do Brazil-Servicos
Halliburton Machine Shops
Halliburton Manufacturing & Services Limited
Halliburton Measurement Systems
Halliburton Mfg de Venezuela
Halliburton National Institutes of Health
Halliburton Nigeria Limited
Halliburton Oilfield Services India Limited
Halliburton Oil Services Vietnam Ltd
Halliburton Overseas Limited
Halliburton Papua New Guinea
Halliburton Reservoir Services
Halliburton SAS - Paris
Halliburton SAS - Pau
Halliburton SAS/PES - Pau
Halliburton Security DBS
Halliburton Shell Project
Halliburton Sperry-Sun Tunis
Halliburton Subsea
Halliburton Travel Division
Halliburton Trinidad Limited
Halliburton Jet Research Center
Halliburton West Africa Ltd. (Cayman Islands, tax haven)
Halliburton Westport Tech Ctr
Hall/William Mercer Ltd-Pension
Halson Financial Svcs. (Cayman Islands, tax haven)
Hanson Division
Harbison - Walker Rfctories Division
Hbr Energy, Inc.
Hbr Nl Holdings, Llc
Hed (Indonesia), Inc.
Hellenic Shipyards
Hes Corp.
Hes Holding, Inc.
Hes Mexico Holdings, Llc
Hes Oilfield Operations (Nigeria), Inc.
Hewitt Associates
HGS enterprises Inc. (Panama, tax haven)
HLS Asia Limited
Hobbymarkt Capelle Bv (Netherlands)
Hobbymarkt Capelle De Mexico, Sa De Cv (Mexico)
Howard Humphreys (T) Ltd
Industrial Instrument Division
International Admin. Svcs. (Cayman Islands, tax haven)
International Oil Field Engr. (Cayman Islands, tax haven)
Ipem Developments Ltd. (United Kingdom)
Kellogg, Brown and Root (KBR)
Americas (BRES)
Amoco
Atco
Balden
Bonney Island
Braun
Caldwell
Cardinal
Caledonia Ltd.
Celanese
Chatman
Ciba
Collins
Contrina
Contrina de Jose
Dunbar
DuPont
DYKES
Eastman
Edmonton
Environfuels
Exxon Chem
Exxon/Mobil
Far East Pte Ltd
Fort Benning JOC
Georgia Pac
Gonzales
Joe D Hughes
John Aylward
KBRCMSB
Optimum Group
Phenol-Maintenance
Philip Morris
QGPC Project
Shell Chem
Sincor
Sonatrach
Tampa Electric
Tanura
Technip-Q-Chem Project
TECSA
Tokyo Representative Office
Union Carbide
Wake
Weyerhaeuser
Kellogg-Chiyoda Services (Cayman Islands, tax haven)
Kellogg Joint Venture
Kinhill Kramer (Vanuatu, tax haven)
Kinhill Kramer (Solomon, tax haven)
Landmark Concurrent Solusi Indonesia
Landmark Graphics Corporation - www.lgc.com
GeoGraphix - www.geographix.com
Global Account Management - ENI
Munro-Garrett International Ltd
Paris
Petrodata
Laut OAC Sdn Bhd
LMK Resources (Halliburton’s Landmark Graphics Division acquired its majority interest in 2001)
Magic Earth, Inc.
Mashhor Well Services Sdn Bhd (Brunei Darussalam)
Masoneilan International, Llc
Measurement & Controls
Metro Fast Track II
M I Drilling Fluids
MW Kellogg Limited
MWKL Field Services (Cayman Islands, tax haven)
Monoflo Inc.
Mono Pumps (Australia) Ltd. (Australia)
Mono Pumps Ltd. (United Kingdom)
New Iberia Threading Machining
NUMAR Corporation -Sales
NUS Laboratory
Oilfield Innovations, Cv (Netherlands)
Oilfield Services Receivable Corp.
Omega Pump
Otis Marine Maintenance Division
Overseas Administration Servcs (Cayman Islands, tax haven)
Paragon Engineering Svcs Inc
Petrodata As (Norway)
Petroleum Engineering Services Norge As (Norway)
Petroleum and Industrial Maintenance Co. Ltd (Cayman Islands, tax haven)
Professional Resources Ltd. (Bermuda, tax haven)
Promzona 40, UPTOK Usinskstroi
Property and Casualty Insurance
P.T. Baroid Indonesia
P.T. Halliburton Indonesia
P.T. Indokor Sperry-Sun
Pump Division
Rockwater Holdings Ltd. (United Kingdom)
Rockwater Ltd. (United Kingdom)
Rotary Brown & Root
Saudi Halliburton Logging Llc (Saudi Arabia)
Seaforth Maritime Ltd. (United Kingdom)
Security DBS
Security DBS (MEM) E.C. (Bahrain, tax haven)
Security Rock Bits & Drlg Tls
Service Employees Int'l Inc. (Cayman Islands, tax haven)
Servicios Halliburton de Venezuela SA
Shaw International Ltd. (Barbados, tax haven)
Sperry-Sun
Sperry Sun Saudi Company Ltd. (Saudi Arabia)
Studebaker Worthington (U.K.) Ltd. (United Kingdom)
Subsahara Serivces Inc.
Sub Sea Offshore (Holdings) Ltd. (United Kingdom)
Subsea 7 - www.subsea7.com
Swaco Geolograph
Waterloo Plant & Sales Office
Waukesha Engine Division
Wayne Division
Wellstream Inc.
Wellstream Ltd. (United Kingdom)
Western Geophysical Services
Westport Technology Center Intl
Wheatley Valve Division
Vann Systems: now called Perforating Solutions
Zone Industrial Halliburton EDF

Wow thats alot of comapnies working for Halliburton. Wonder who runs the boards on many of these companies? I wonder if they would include ex-presidents, members of congress, ex - CIA Directors and the like? I wonder if these are the same pals that George W. owes for his failed companies back in the day and his dad's friends. Who knows.

Vincere7, I applaud your post and I am astounded at the number of Halliburton subsidiaries on that list. The facts are there clear as day for everyone to see, but one must choose to see the truth. The sheep riding the Dubya train will never get it, no matter how many companies you list and no matter how damning the evidence you provide is.

Peace

I was responing to DR. LOVe, try reading the WHOLE post before going off man.....

So, bout time, before you fly off the handle, i was not talking to you...look back through the post at who called me Mcfly. Not sure where YOUR attack came from man.

Do you suffer from the beer bong false nationalism that puts a kid on a tank & has you thumpin' yer chest for being a "real AMericun

This is uncalled for, WTF man? I am an American and that is a pic of my son from when we visited my father's grave (vietnam 65-68) at the War Memorial park in BAy Pines Florida. So, I would like an apology about that......If not, go fark yourself......

Pay attention - it was a counterpoint to a specific poster about the false logic of applying American ownership of Iraqi oil translating to cost relief for the masses. I'm done attempting to convert anybody; I'm happy to let social Darwinism take care of you.

or this, you made the same point about oil companies that I posted, don't balme Bush, balme big business, it is beyond our president....

And where were your thoughts on Iraq 5 years ago? Riiiiiight, the beer bong thing again

With my cousin from Mineola,NY serving in the Marines

The Shia will exact bloody revenge for being suppressed by the Sunni, the Kurds will splinter off officialy bringing the Turks into war......yeah, sh***ts & giggles ahead for sure!

I thought I was expreessing this by saying 3 tribes cam toghter to form Iraq in the 40's I think it was.....

That's just plain ingnorant to offer up the proven false hype of Iraq's ability to rebuild....or are you still eating Yellow Cake!?!?

You watch to much Chappelle after the beer bong bud.....



And lastly, I did not respond to you...later....

Amazing Post vincere7. I think I'm gonna take that list and do a bit o' researching. As an Analyst who also happens to be a History buff, I'd like to see if maybe I can form a few facts hidden in the information.

Phae

very nice post vincere...very nice....

Yes it also amazes me that while all this non-damaging evidence is heartily available to any citizen to digest why is it that Americans as a whole are completely ignorant of reality? I believe we are just too busy trying to make a buck, taking our kids to school and to soccer, football, etc.. to do research on any important issue. Voter turnout at the polls suggest that Americans are simply ignorant to the facts and will believe anything. Currently we are certianly in a sad state to believe anything advertised concerning war where oil is concerned.

Now anyone could argue against the facts or that these are 'my' facts, or 'puffed up' facts similar to Rather's press release. However we cannot erase history and history always rears it's ugly head. Nor can we erase what exists today such as directors of a company on a stock exchange.

I don't know who would allow advertising of their keen interests to be projected to a population that would crash their desires or sack their missions by releasing information that would jeopardize their endeavor - for this would be foolhardy. We see as an example the murder of Thomas Barron a week after his public announcement that the space program, concerning the apollo missions, was dangerous. This of course could've resulted in further investigation of Nasa's programs if Barron and his family were not hit by that train a week later. Also why would anyone suppose that Dr. David Kelly, the Iraqi weapons inspector, was a suicidal man is beyond me. As he committed suicide shortly after testifying before the House of Commons Select Committee on Foreign Affairs about bogus intelligence on WMD's. Dr. kelly announced to a colleague that if we indeed invaded iraq he would probaly be found dead in the woods - he was several weeks later.

To conclude, we as any other nation, can only believe what we are told unless we do something about it. Unfortunately we are too busy to do anything about it and even if we did protest it is futile as Dr.Kelly and Mr. Barron would tell you as much. Besides the administration can only last eight years right? Ignorance really is bliss.

Originally posted by esdad71
WTF......

I'm sorry about that....I thought I was getting flamed again & responded in kind.

Originally posted by COOL HAND

Originally posted by Johnny Redburn

And even if no stockpiles were found, the old Iraqi regime had the knowledge to create them

Speculation.

and if sanctions against Saddam were lifted and inspections stopped, he would have reconstituted his programs and again threaten his neighbors with WMD.

Speculation.

Since you claim that those statements are speculation, perhaps you can provide some evidence to back that up? Otherwise, we can just pull the speculation card on you.

First quote: You were the one making a claim based on supposition and conjecture, I stated it was speculation, I simply wanted you to provide proven information for your claims and where you acquired it, you failed to do this and instead asked me to provide evidence for my reply of 'speculation', however seeing as I did not make put forth an argument and simply pointed out the inadequacies of yours, then your reply for my ‘evidence’ makes no logical sense.

Second quote: Once again you make a speculatory statement that you attempted to pass off as an accepted truth, instead of making it your personal opinion. Again it makes no sense to ask me to present 'backup' for my single word response, when its intent was to probe the truthful basis of yours.

Originally posted by Yeticha
there was nothing un-lawful about the invasion because we don't answer to anyone else in the world....we don't seek a permission slip to kill the enemy

As a member of the United Nations, America has agreed to live by the international laws that maintain some level of world security. In my mind the U.S violated this commitment with the invasion of Iraq by not attaining justification from the international community. Also to say that you do not 'answer' to anyone else in world would be putting yourself above any law that attempts to govern world’s security and peace, would it not?

Originally posted by COOL HAND
I have not made any claims here, so I do not need to put out any info to back up that claim.

You made two claims that are not accepted truths, to deny that you made this claims would be to deny that you wrote your initial post.

Originally posted by COOL HAND
Compare that to JR who made a claim and then did not back it up.

As I said, I was merely using the indescrepencies of your claims to reach my statement that I believe it was based on 'speculation', I was not replying with a return argument.

Have a safe and productive day.

He can't be "right all along," because he's already been more wrong than right, about practically everything. Right about what? That Iraqis want to be free? Is that why we went to war? That's not the impression I was given.

JR,
You are a very confused person. I was asking you to back up your speculation claims against djohnsto77, not me. You are on the hook to provide information to back up YOUR claim.