If we work together..we can change the Earth.

a reply to: richapau

No need to cull at all.

It's our system that is a mess, we could handle up to 20 billion easily.

In terms of resources we are on the breaking point of revolution or pure self-reliance if you will.

Energy will always be of the main concern, it's the reason we are so messy now. In terms of history, yesterday we needed wood and land to feed our growth, energy to feed our machines and power plants.

Tomorrow I can see a world we mustn't pollute for energy, needn't use swathes of land for food production and be more than capable of recycling our waste.

Because sooner or later our methods will hit breaking point and this Earth will become a lot less desirable to be on.

Clean electricity is the keystone to our future. Once that's tapped we could all live on a island like Japan or Britain and let the Earth do her thing.

a reply to: glend

We're on the same page. Essentially we need to turn the clock back with a couple of changes.....like a system that doesn't use currency. It is entirely possible. I can show how it can work. Just the fact that none of us actually lives on money and the fact that money itself doesn't actually make anything should be enough to tell everyone that it's possible.

a reply to: Azureblue

That's why my idea is to build a new infrastructure/system from scratch. Once we prove it works and is infinitely better. Then the rest of society will want to make their own.

Trying to fix the present system is way too complicated. The present system is flawed at it's very foundation. It was good for a period of time but it reached maturity quite a while ago. Now it is just rotting away and is poisoning everything with it.

a reply to: Bramble Iceshimmer


That's a very negative attitude about something that you don't even know about yet. Nightmare inducing ?

originally posted by: HarryJoy
a reply to: Azureblue

That's why my idea is to build a new infrastructure/system from scratch. Once we prove it works and is infinitely better. Then the rest of society will want to make their own.

Trying to fix the present system is way too complicated. The present system is flawed at it's very foundation. It was good for a period of time but it reached maturity quite a while ago. Now it is just rotting away and is poisoning everything with it.

The world is like it is today because certain super wealthty and super powerful people want it that way. Its also the way it is because to many people either dont care or dont realise their views and beliefs are not their own but are the product of those who own and control that remotely operated weapon of mass control, conditioning and deceit, commonly known as TV.

How would the world you want to create stop the elite from taking control of the world and turing things back to the way they are now using the exact same techniques?

a reply to: Azureblue

Well....I believe that most of the reason that we are in the economic crisis that we are in....is due to the natural progression of a capitalistic system. Essentially everyone that is in business is in business to make a profit. And the average business mindset is to increase profit on a year to year basis. The only ways that it can happen is....(A) Increase market share (Which consequently reduces market share for another business. ..ultimately leads to monopoly ) (B) Reduce production costs ( Which usually means more efficient processes or machines and a reduction in man hours ....or move business to cheaper labor markets ) (C) Consumer price increase ....aka. . inflation .

That's the normal path of business in our current system. Let that process continue for a 150 yrs and you get where we currently are. And the people that are running these companies are probably no different then you or I....They didn't intend to create the overall situation that we find ourselves in. ..they just played the game and now it's pretty much over unless some radical changes are made. I won't deny that there are some super rich people in the world that have had a lot of influence for a long time. But even they got there by playing the game of business. And I am sure that some of them have justified some very bad things in the name of profit and power.

As far as TV..I completely agree. I would not allow TV in the system I envision. I don't watch TV now and I see no good justification for it. ...I know it is all some people have to keep themselves company....but I don't see it being a problem in the new system. I would probably lean heavily toward no forms of mass communication . People got by for thousands of years without it....And probably had much better lives then us.

a reply to: HarryJoy

Go for it Harry Joy. Maybe a million such communities might get the world on a better track.

Welcome to Auroville, the City of Dawn

Auroville wants to be a universal town where men and women of all countries are able to live in peace and progressive harmony above all creeds, all politics and all nationalities.

The purpose of Auroville is to realise human unity.

MORE...

Auroville was born on 28 February 1968. Its founder, the Mother, created the Auroville Charter consisting of four main ideas which underpinned her vision for Auroville. When Auroville came into being, All India Radio (AIR) broadcast the Charter, live, in 16 languages. Aurovilians apply the ideas of the Auroville Charter in their daily life, in policy-development, and decisions, big and small. The Charter thus forms an omnipresent referent that silently guides the people who choose to live and work for Auroville.

The Auroville Charter

Auroville belongs to nobody in particular. Auroville belongs to humanity as a whole. But, to live in Auroville, one must be a willing servitor of the divine consciousness.
Auroville will be the place of an unending education, of constant progress, and a youth that never ages.
Auroville wants to be the bridge between the past and the future. Taking advantage of all discoveries from without and from within, Auroville will boldly spring towards future realisations.
Auroville will be a site of material and spiritual researches for a living embodiment of an actual human unity.


During the Auroville inauguration in 1968, youth from 124 different nations and 23 Indian states, deposited a handful of their native soil into the Urn, a marble clad structure in the form of a symbolic lotus bud, located in the centre of the Amphitheatre (see photo). The Auroville Charter - handwritten in French by the Mother - rests along with this soil, sealed in the Urn, as a powerful message and promise.

a reply to: soficrow

I looked at that link you provided. It was interesting. It has a population of 2700+ ....it seems like a New Age type of colony...as far as I can tell. It gave me the impression of a very large commune...reminiscent of the communes of the 60-70s

The system I envision would be quite different then that....I envision something very organized and productive and yet enjoyable. I envision assembly line production for the things necessary to expand the infrastructure. ..such as the modular components for the enclosed bikeways and for the pod type homes. The components would be built in a factory type setting and then assembled on site.

I wish I was able to use a computer to illustrate what my ideas are....it would help sell it. It would be a very autonomous type system. It would take a significant amount of money to get it up and running. ..but after that it should be able to support itself and expand on it's own.

originally posted by: HarryJoy
a reply to: Azureblue

Well....I believe that most of the reason that we are in the economic crisis that we are in....is due to the natural progression of a capitalistic system. Essentially everyone that is in business is in business to make a profit. And the average business mindset is to increase profit on a year to year basis. The only ways that it can happen is....(A) Increase market share (Which consequently reduces market share for another business. ..ultimately leads to monopoly ) (B) Reduce production costs ( Which usually means more efficient processes or machines and a reduction in man hours ....or move business to cheaper labor markets ) (C) Consumer price increase ....aka. . inflation .

That's the normal path of business in our current system. Let that process continue for a 150 yrs and you get where we currently are. And the people that are running these companies are probably no different then you or I....They didn't intend to create the overall situation that we find ourselves in. ..they just played the game and now it's pretty much over unless some radical changes are made. I won't deny that there are some super rich people in the world that have had a lot of influence for a long time. But even they got there by playing the game of business. And I am sure that some of them have justified some very bad things in the name of profit and power.

As far as TV..I completely agree. I would not allow TV in the system I envision. I don't watch TV now and I see no good justification for it. ...I know it is all some people have to keep themselves company....but I don't see it being a problem in the new system. I would probably lean heavily toward no forms of mass communication . People got by for thousands of years without it....And probably had much better lives then us.

Only today I found this:

Professor Carroll Quigley who taught at Georgetown University in Washington DC, wrote a book about 50 years ago. The book was entitled Tragedy & Hope with a sub-title “A History of the World in our Time”. This book ran to a little over 1300 pages.
On page 324, Quigley wrote a page, which summarises a major theme of the book:
“the powers of financial capitalism (the Elite) had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole.
This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world’s central banks which were themselves private corporations.
Each central bank…sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence (bribe) cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards (bribes) in the business world.“

And Quigley said this.

Quigley concludes that the characteristics of weapons are the main predictor of democracy.

Democracy tends to emerge only when the best weapons available are easy for individuals to buy and use. This explains why democracy occurs so rarely in human history.

Not having a go at anyone, trying upmanship or whatever, but Quigly was regarded as an insider hence the resultant 1300 page book. This actually sadens we but we have to learn from this.

a reply to: Azureblue

I don't think there is any denying that, that is probably as much the case as it can be...and yet that book was written 50 yrs ago. I think that is the natural progression of becoming that wealthy and financially powerful.

I mean if you gained the power to have your ideas implemented in society..wouldn't you do it ? It seems that you would almost be obligated to do it....hopefully your intentions would be good one's. As far as the Elite....if their plan was to destroy us...couldn't they have done it a long time ago.

I think they fully realize that they are themselves subject to powers that are above them. Not earthly powers but universal powers that will hold them accountable.

I fully expect that they are much like ourselves....in that they may not find themselves always in agreement among themselves. And probably experience power struggles on their own level. I would like to believe that at least some of them...if not most of them desire to develop a viable system that will result in the contentment of their subjects. I fully expect that it is the disagreement among them as to what that leads to the broken systems. Not to mention the fact that the world as a whole is a huge and complex system that presents continually evolving problems.

a reply to: Azureblue

PS...please don't think that there is any animosity in my responses...there isn't. I am only trying to present alternative views. I also realize that this site was built on subjects such as the Elite ruling the world. I have no doubt that they do...I'm just not sure how sinister their intentions are. If they do mean to destroy us....they are obviously being held in check by some power. But I don't think they want to destroy us.

I think Hidden Hand made it quite clear that the purpose of their rule is to create circumstances that try and test humanity in myriad ways. If life is really about soul development. ..how can souls be developed in a 'cushy' environment that presents no challenges ? That reason in itself is the biggest deterrent to me for wanting to develop a 'Utopia'

originally posted by: HarryJoy
a reply to: Azureblue

I don't think there is any denying that, that is probably as much the case as it can be...and yet that book was written 50 yrs ago. I think that is the natural progression of becoming that wealthy and financially powerful.

I mean if you gained the power to have your ideas implemented in society..wouldn't you do it ? It seems that you would almost be obligated to do it....hopefully your intentions would be good one's. As far as the Elite....if their plan was to destroy us...couldn't they have done it a long time ago.

I think they fully realize that they are themselves subject to powers that are above them. Not earthly powers but universal powers that will hold them accountable.

I fully expect that they are much like ourselves....in that they may not find themselves always in agreement among themselves. And probably experience power struggles on their own level. I would like to believe that at least some of them...if not most of them desire to develop a viable system that will result in the contentment of their subjects. I fully expect that it is the disagreement among them as to what that leads to the broken systems. Not to mention the fact that the world as a whole is a huge and complex system that presents continually evolving problems.

Your right. Poeple who become very wealthy or come from familes wo have been very wealthy and powefull for dozens of generations do get a born to rule beleif about themselvs.

One can only get so welathy that any more is just academic and does not do much for them anymore. Man has alys sought to control their fellow man and the super welathty are no differnt.

So they are going to mould the world in their own image and rule it themselves. Same as they will not just sit indley by and watch the masses plot to change their plans have a thing called dmoracy when, to their way of thinking, running the world is all about money and they have it so they should be the rulers. Similary, they dont believe the massess are fit to rule because they cant manage money.

In the end they become fulll of their own importance and decide to take things into their own hands.

a reply to: HarryJoy

I would not allow TV in the system I envision

and that is why " your vision " is never EVER going to work

a reply to: Azureblue

You know. ...after I made my last post something struck me. The prophecy in the book of Daniel seems to make it quite clear that after the Roman empire there will not be another world empire.

That would explain why the Elite have not been able to progress past the point that they are at. There have been super wealthy people for a very long time and they have still not achieved a one world government. If that prophecy is true ( and I personally put a lot of stock in the Bible ) then Hidden Hand may have just been spinning a yarn.

a reply to: ignorant_ape

You're joking.....right? I mean. ..I really can't believe that someone that frequents a conspiracy site. .. would practically pledge allegiance to the most wide spread and powerful mind control device on the planet. I guess you are a testament to just how effective it is.

a reply to: Azureblue

I agree that the Elite may not like democracy. But it seems that even if we had a perfect democracy. ...we would still be just as divided. How can we hope to bring about any type of peace...if one half of us disagrees with the other half. I feel that personally I am usually able to see both sides of an issue...and end up being stuck in the middle.

a reply to: HarryJoy

no i am not joking

but you are taking the piss

i have in no way - " pledged allegiance to the most wide spread and powerful mind control device on the planet. "

you just made that up

if you actually bother to read my other posts - where i do actually address my opinions on TV you would know my real position

the reason i posted what i did - is because in your deluded fantasy - you appoint yourself as arbiter of what people can or cannot do

that is the reason your fantasy will fail

you could replace " TV " with ANYTHNG and the same argument holds

a reply to: ignorant_ape

Well...I'm glad you cleared that up. Because anyone that read your post would have most likely thought the same way that I did.

Now just so we are on the same page...Arbitrary means to make a decision without a reason or based on a whim....neither of which fits with the decision that I made regarding TV.

I have plenty of reasons why I would make that decision. But I am not going to waste time elaborating them to someone that apparently AGREES with it.

And while I am at it...I will make another decision about MY blueprint for a feasible utopia...I wouldn't allow people there that disagree with a rule. ....simply because they didn't get to be a part of the decision. If they have a REASON for their disagreement...then I would be glad to listen.

a reply to: HarryJoy

blinks - you dont have any idea what " arbiter " means do you ?

hint - it is NOT a synonym for arbitrary

but i digress

the complete failure of your delusion is that you are deciding what people can and cannot do - so much for free will in your fantasies

Well. ...whether it is synonymous or not doesn't matter. The point is there are good reasons for that decision and anyone that didn't agree with that decision obviously wouldn't want to be there. I made it clear at the beginning that it wouldn't be for everyone.

As far as free will goes....that in itself is a fantasy. Why would you even expect to have completely freewill ?? A society can never exist without rules or guidelines.There has never been and I suspect never will be a system on this earth that allows people to do WHATEVER they want. Do you really believe that there could be ? As I see it...you either have to cherry pick people to be there. ....or you have to limit the parameters of their freedom.