Solar Mystery — What Happened to the Sun in 5480 BC?

It's also kind of curious that the mid-5000s BCE is when many of the older agrarian civilizations seemed to pop up. Strange things happening with the sun stimulating an interest in religion and larger societies?

Since the oldest living tree is 5066 years old, where did they find a DEAD tree that is 7400+ years old that most definitely would have to be fossilized, where all of the chemicals in its rings were replaced through the process of fossilization with minerals?

originally posted by: Blue Shift
It's also kind of curious that the mid-5000s BCE is when many of the older agrarian civilizations seemed to pop up. Strange things happening with the sun stimulating an interest in religion and larger societies?

True, there seems to be an upsurge in this time frame of cultures changing from hunter gatherers to more stable agricultural pursuits. Expanding their shelters, etc. I pondered whether that had to do with environment changing, forcing the animals (food supply) migrating further away than normal.

originally posted by: Blue Shift
It's also kind of curious that the mid-5000s BCE is when many of the older agrarian civilizations seemed to pop up. Strange things happening with the sun stimulating an interest in religion and larger societies?

I wonder if IAMTAT was onto something with the idea of solar radiation altering human genes during that time. Is there a way to examine genetic history from that far back to see if any anomalies arose around that time?

Sodom and Gomorrah nuclear annihalation?

originally posted by: the2ofusr1
a reply to: djz3ro

Go to the 8 min mark of the vid

Thank you, I'm out and about just now but will check it out when I get back in...

a reply to: TinfoilTP

that most definitely would have to be fossilized,

No.
humanorigins.si.edu...

originally posted by: theantediluvian

Interesting stuff to ponder. And before I forget, here's the link to the paper.

Thing is, was this a triggered extraordinary event or something that occured over that narrow band of time. the 5480bc figure, isn't that close to the half-life of 14C? Then was there something in given history that would be a pointer as IAMTAT suggested? I am always out on dating samples, although it seem the best example for 14C dating appears to be used in the tree rings, although the ordinance of samples might also be a help. But I ain't no scientist, and there were/are reccomendations for other methods of dating, although they might not need to apply here, but again perhaps to make correlations in other parts of the world say.

originally posted by: waftist
I wonder if IAMTAT was onto something with the idea of solar radiation altering human genes during that time. Is there a way to examine genetic history from that far back to see if any anomalies arose around that time?

It has also been postulated that around that time human brains saw an increase in the size and complexity of the corpus callosum in the human brain. It supposedly strengthened the link between the two hemispheres, resulting in the "voice of God" going away in all but a few individuals, who were then seen as prophets.

40-50K years ago Humans began making art...I believe the oldest example is about 42K yrs. old...prior to that we can find no other examples.

I have always wondered if one of these radiation bursts was responsible for the genetic changes that pushed humans to begin to ponder the abstract and intangible.

originally posted by: Blue Shift

originally posted by: waftist
I wonder if IAMTAT was onto something with the idea of solar radiation altering human genes during that time. Is there a way to examine genetic history from that far back to see if any anomalies arose around that time?

It has also been postulated that around that time human brains saw an increase in the size and complexity of the corpus callosum in the human brain. It supposedly strengthened the link between the two hemispheres, resulting in the "voice of God" going away in all but a few individuals, who were then seen as prophets.

Fascinating..I will have to add this theory(solar caused gene altering) to McKenna's Stoned Ape mushroom theory on what may have altered humans to become self aware, thus more reflective and expressive of both inner and outer worlds.

Pardon the digression:

Google books: Eruptions that Shook the World
Author Clive Oppenheimer
Publisher Cambridge University Press, 2011
(url is too long!) P. 356

That date, 5480 BCE, is also one date for the Kikai-Akahoya eruption in Japan (also have seen 4500 BCE, so it is in that range. I rather trust CUP). On the eruption scale it weighed in 7.2 M.

Not saying the sun-earth is one-to-one connected (could be, not point of the post). Just saying that the time period had a couple rather large events happening at the same time.

Wonder else was going on around the globe at that time??

I have heard of a theory concerning Galactic 'Superwaves' of radiation bursts from the galactic center...striking earth every 26,000 years and causing major geologic and evolutionary change.

I believe some Mayan cosmology also parallels this idea, although some New Age ideas have pirated a lot from the theory.

originally posted by: smurfy

originally posted by: theantediluvian

Interesting stuff to ponder. And before I forget, here's the link to the paper.

Thing is, was this a triggered extraordinary event or something that occured over that narrow band of time. the 5480bc figure, isn't that close to the half-life of 14C? Then was there something in given history that would be a pointer as IAMTAT suggested? I am always out on dating samples, although it seem the best example for 14C dating appears to be used in the tree rings, although the ordinance of samples might also be a help. But I ain't no scientist, and there were/are reccomendations for other methods of dating, although they might not need to apply here, but again perhaps to make correlations in other parts of the world say.

Your question sent me down another rabbit hole and I am not scientific enough to truly understand the charts and data sets in the provided PDF on Glacial Lake Varves in Sweden. Fascinating science as well.

Abstract:Mineral magnetic, organic carbon and pollen studies of two varved Holocene lake-sediment sequences in the boreal forest of northern Sweden indicate that significant environmental changes took place between c. 6000 and 5700 bc. This interval is characterized by an increase in mineral-matter accumulation, which is a proxy for winter-snow accumulation, and a statistically significant decrease in total pollen influx (predominantly Pinus, Betula and Alnus), which may reflect lower spring and summer temperatures and increased frost frequency. Notable increases in the influx of deciduous tree species (including Quercus and Corylus) suggest a rapid change to warmer conditions between 5700 and 5600 bc. Given dating errors associa- ted with the varve chronologies and the Greenland ice-core timescales, the cold interval can be considered to reflect a regional (possibly global) climatic cooling, which is often referred to as the ‘8.2 kyr BP cooling event’. However, the younger age of the cold event in northern Sweden does not support the hypothesis of forcing by the sudden drainage of Laurentide glacial lakes into the North Atlantic, unless a minimal 300-year delay in ocean-atmospheric coupling is accepted. The data contribute to a complex picture of early-Holocene environmental change, in response to deglaciation of the Northern Hemisphere.

I am hoping someone more scientifically minded could determine whether there is any correlation with this proposed solar event that may coordinate within the 6th millennium of the glacial lake Varves data? Obviously, the solar event would be global would these other geological tests confirm it had more effect to our environment and possibly be a cyclic event that will reoccur in our future?

Drafts and dangnabbit! Forgot to add the PDF Source Link again! Source

a reply to: djz3ro

I mentioned the rain forest only as a example to compare to other forests eco-systems . Considering some trees can grow very big and tall even today it may have been quite different back then . In fact if you look at the fossil record we see that even some species were giants compared to today . Multiply the fauna and trees using similar scales and the tree canopy could have been in the thousands of feet . just something to consider . Oh and they didnt have chain saws back then either

originally posted by: Blue Shift

originally posted by: waftist
I wonder if IAMTAT was onto something with the idea of solar radiation altering human genes during that time. Is there a way to examine genetic history from that far back to see if any anomalies arose around that time?

It has also been postulated that around that time human brains saw an increase in the size and complexity of the corpus callosum in the human brain. It supposedly strengthened the link between the two hemispheres, resulting in the "voice of God" going away in all but a few individuals, who were then seen as prophets.

That sounds a bit half- brained to me!

originally posted by: TEOTWAWKIAIFF
Google books: Eruptions that Shook the World
Author Clive Oppenheimer
Publisher Cambridge University Press, 2011
(url is too long!) P. 356

That date, 5480 BCE, is also one date for the Kikai-Akahoya eruption in Japan (also have seen 4500 BCE, so it is in that range. I rather trust CUP). On the eruption scale it weighed in 7.2 M.

Not saying the sun-earth is one-to-one connected (could be, not point of the post). Just saying that the time period had a couple rather large events happening at the same time.

Wonder else was going on around the globe at that time??

In digging online I was surprised that there did seem to be a lot of volcanic global activity during the early part of the 6th millennium. I wonder if anyone can answer whether this C-14 dating is strictly based on perceived solar input or could it reflect geologic changes, this time period does seem to be experiencing an increase in climatic changes. Would solar activity effect the earth's magnetism to cause these changes?

a reply to: CynConcepts

It might also be reflecting a relatively large meteor or comet impact event.
Both can cause a period of global cooling, higher levels of radiation and lower levels of pollen in soil samples.

It's been suggested that the concept of Lucifer (the shinning one) being cast out of/from heaven into the earth (Falling from grace)...and bringing evil upon the earth...is based upon early humans witnessing a massive comet or meteor impact.

originally posted by: CynConcepts

originally posted by: smurfy

originally posted by: theantediluvian

Interesting stuff to ponder. And before I forget, here's the link to the paper.

Thing is, was this a triggered extraordinary event or something that occured over that narrow band of time. the 5480bc figure, isn't that close to the half-life of 14C? Then was there something in given history that would be a pointer as IAMTAT suggested? I am always out on dating samples, although it seem the best example for 14C dating appears to be used in the tree rings, although the ordinance of samples might also be a help. But I ain't no scientist, and there were/are reccomendations for other methods of dating, although they might not need to apply here, but again perhaps to make correlations in other parts of the world say.

Your question sent me down another rabbit hole and I am not scientific enough to truly understand the charts and data sets in the provided PDF on Glacial Lake Varves in Sweden. Fascinating science as well.

Abstract:Mineral magnetic, organic carbon and pollen studies of two varved Holocene lake-sediment sequences in the boreal forest of northern Sweden indicate that significant environmental changes took place between c. 6000 and 5700 bc. This interval is characterized by an increase in mineral-matter accumulation, which is a proxy for winter-snow accumulation, and a statistically significant decrease in total pollen influx (predominantly Pinus, Betula and Alnus), which may reflect lower spring and summer temperatures and increased frost frequency. Notable increases in the influx of deciduous tree species (including Quercus and Corylus) suggest a rapid change to warmer conditions between 5700 and 5600 bc. Given dating errors associa- ted with the varve chronologies and the Greenland ice-core timescales, the cold interval can be considered to reflect a regional (possibly global) climatic cooling, which is often referred to as the ‘8.2 kyr BP cooling event’. However, the younger age of the cold event in northern Sweden does not support the hypothesis of forcing by the sudden drainage of Laurentide glacial lakes into the North Atlantic, unless a minimal 300-year delay in ocean-atmospheric coupling is accepted. The data contribute to a complex picture of early-Holocene environmental change, in response to deglaciation of the Northern Hemisphere.

I am hoping someone more scientifically minded could determine whether there is any correlation with this proposed solar event that may coordinate within the 6th millennium of the glacial lake Varves data? Obviously, the solar event would be global would these other geological tests confirm it had more effect to our environment and possibly be a cyclic event that will reoccur in our future?

Drafts and dangnabbit! Forgot to add the PDF Source Link again! Source

Here's and old one for you well, not that old, the key being to do with correlation of dating between I suppose the land and the sea, observed differences. The key references are 14C dating and uranium-thorium dating.

"scientists have sought other indicators of age against which carbon dates can be compared. One such indicator is the uranium-thorium dating method used by the Lamont-Doherty group"
It comes from what now is deemed fake news...the NYT. How times change in some perceptions.

www.nytimes.com...

a reply to: CynConcepts

Carbon 14 is produced by collisions between air atoms and high energy particles. Those particles (cosmic rays) originate sporadically from the Sun. They do not originate from volcanoes. They also originate from the far, far reaches of space. Solar activity inversely affects the level of galactic cosmic ray "flux". The less activity there is, the higher the flux on Earth. What ever caused this, it came from "out there."


When a CME encounters Earth's magnetic field it causes it to "wiggle" for a while. That's what a geomagnetic storm is. There isn't much evidence to support a connection between geomagnetic storms and climate.