Russell Targ - Banned TED Talk about Psychic Abilities

I love this video. Go figure they pulled this off of mainstream media, this is pretty high end research. Thanks for posting!

a reply to: ColdWisdom

What I haven't found was how Puthoff and Swann became involved with Hubbard and Scientology. Hubbard has always seemed like a snake oil salesman, so were they associated before the onset of Hubbard's writings?

Was most of what Hubbard wrote about actually observations of the abilities of people like Swann and Puthoff?

a reply to: Watcher777

What I haven't found was how Puthoff and Swann became involved with Hubbard and Scientology. Hubbard has always seemed like a snake oil salesman, so were they associated before the onset of Hubbard's writings?

I would refer you to the Scientology & Remote Viewing time line I linked in my third post in this thread. And also I would suggest scanning Marty Rathbun's blog.

It would appear as though Swann & Puthoff were attending Hubbard's first lectures in the early stages of Scientology. This would have been in the late 50s or early 60s. What is clearly distinguishable is the fact that they were both two of Hubbard's earliest students and possibly part of the first group of Scientology members to reach OT7. Ingo was reportedly involved with the inception of the Celebrity Center in Los Angeles.

originally posted by: ColdWisdom
a reply to: Kandinsky

I
At the end of the day, whether the mechanism for obtaining the target information is really psychic in nature is irrelevant. If the target information is obtained, it validates the (proposed) technique being used by the remote viewers. There are ways of extrapolating information from targets given the unconscious mind's ability to interpret patterns and cues. One of the things Targ mentions in the TED Talk is certain cues that happen spontaneously during a magician's performance where once the magician has observed this cue from his target, he uses it to extrapolate the information from his target almost algorithmically.

Now taking that in to consideration, it would seem that certain people like Ingo Swann and even Uri Gellar (yes team Xenu at SRI studied him as well) probably became very proficient at this method over time and would be able to systematically increase their accuracy rate simply by exploiting this hack. And again, it's a hack in a sense that it isn't inherently psychic as we define psychic empirically, but rather it is yielding results often enough that could otherwise only (seemingly) be obtained psychically. And finally, they could be hacking results and the results could be reinforcing their belief in their own genuine abilities, all while still remaining non psychical.

What tosh! You ignore the crucial fact that remote viewing trials both then and now are carried out under double blind conditions that eliminate ALL access to possible cues that could identify the target - unlike in the case of the stage magician, where the clue merely goes unseen by the audience. It was such rigorous exclusion of sensory cues that convinced Targ and Puthoff that genuine ESP was at work.

Your comment is totally uninformed and the vacuous conclusion you draw from it is worthless. So many here at ATS like to make worthless speculations based upon complete ignorance that they dress up to look like well-informed comments and evaluations.

a reply to: micpsi

What tosh! You ignore the crucial fact that remote viewing trials both then and now are carried out under double blind conditions that eliminate ALL access to possible cues that could identify the target - unlike in the case of the stage magician, where the clue merely goes unseen by the audience. It was such rigorous exclusion of sensory cues that convinced Targ and Puthoff that genuine ESP was at work.

First, thank you for contributing to my thread.

Second, the cues do not have to be revealed in the moment that the experiment was taking place. Cues can be observed before the experiment takes place, before the 'double blind' step is taken.

Third, were you there when they performed the experiment? Didn't think so.

Finally, I feel as though you scanned the thread briefly and latched onto a part of my response that you felt you could attack without consequence. I am open to discussion and critiquing viewpoints, but only if done constructively and respectfully.

Your comment is totally uninformed and the vacuous conclusion you draw from it is worthless. So many here at ATS like to make worthless speculations based upon complete ignorance that they dress up to look like well-informed comments and evaluations.

Please enlighten me, oh wise one. Dish out the facts then as you see them and we will discuss.

a reply to: muzzleflash

Sure. All of the projects I worked on were classified at varying levels but much of the things done back then have since come into public knowledge / public domain and I can discuss those in some detail. Don't forget it was 20-25 years ago.

I first have to check to make sure the information is truly public domain as my security agreements do not have an expiration date - but I am free to talk about info in the public domain. I just have to be careful that I only talk about the info that is actually out there publicly as I probably have a bit more knowledge related to these projects/topics than what is generally known.

Let me do a little research and I'll be back to post what I can once that's complete.

a reply to: Riffrafter

I eagerly anticipate your return with more info. You should probably make a thread of your own for it, I'm sure it would be a great one.

a reply to: ColdWisdom


There is a lot to this that is still Classified because it actually works.

In consideration is the matter of Joan of Ark a woman that was to the French a General, to the British a witch and in so far as the Vatican Canonized as a Saint.

a reply to: Kashai

There is a lot to this that is still Classified because it actually works.

Please elaborate, my friend. I'd like to know of what that is classified that works and why it works and how.

originally posted by: ColdWisdom
What say you ATS?

I prefer the work of Rupert Sheldrake, who has covered most of the same territory but with greater scientific vigor and none of the taint of Scientology.

a reply to: Blue Shift

Well it would be great if you could provide some linkage to the work of Rupert Sheldrake.

a reply to: ColdWisdom


Countries as well as in this case Empires have been working with Mystics for thousands of years The Roman Catholic Church is but just one example. When Remote viewing showed up as a government program in regards to the United States and inrelation to Desert Storm? A problem occurred in that those in position of authority thought they could effectively remove the spirituality out of the equation; they were wrong.

a reply to: Kashai

If remote viewing worked the way the team describes it, then we should live in a world of complete predictability. We should know exactly where MH370 is, for example. If Hal Puthoff successfully remote viewed a document locked in a vault in the National Archives then we should know the contents of the unreleased pages of the 9/11 report. If military intelligence officials are adept at remote viewing then we should be able to read the mind of our enemy, so far as I can tell we cannot.

Personally, if I had psychic abilities I don't think I'd be going on talk shows and betting on the silver market. But that's just me.

a reply to: ColdWisdom


That is an issue with science and psi.


Some scientist do insist that if psychics exist they should be perfect at it. But if it is related to a developmental issue then a point being, Psi ability depends upon practicing in relation to a certain mind set and in relation priorities, to such an observer to his or her environment.

Like a professional athlete there is a method that allows for development that does not mean they will succeed each and every time. But it does mean they have a chance to succeed because of there efforts at development.

I don't know how to subscribe without commenting, so here it is.

This post is very interesting. I've always been fascinated by the idea of R.V.

a reply to: Riffrafter

fascinating. Thanks for the post.

Are you able to talk about what the SRI guys were working on that wasn't remote viewing?

ETA: I see muzzleflash already asked something similar, but I'm really curious about the SRI stuff. As far as public domain, I have read that the CIA had MKOFTEN which had astrologists, clairvoyants and occultists working for them, but I have had problems finding details on that, and I was curious if anything similar was going on, and some of that must be public record by now.

IMHO only ,ESP/Telepthy/More has been erased or bypssed in our geonome,we are born with it.... I am quite sure it was worked out loooong ago.

a reply to: ColdWisdom
Have you read the book "The Stargate Conspiracy"? My best friend is obsessed with it, he lent it to me for a read and it is quite fascinating. It outlines the connections of various cults to the CIA and such. Puharich and Geller in particular seemed to have "paranormal" events happen around them which were performed with exotic technologies. The CIA seems to start cults as a means of practicing mind control techniques.


a reply to: pianopraze
The same friend mentioned above believes this as well. He has a number of books and documents about the Nazis being behind MKultra and "traumatic conditioning". He believes that Mengele's still-classified files were about this. According to him it has to do with genetic trauma, hypnosis, drugs, et cetera in some bizarre conglomeration to erase and reprogram the victim's mind...

I can only get him to talk about it when he's drunk though.

originally posted by: SargonThrall
a reply to: ColdWisdom
Have you read the book "The Stargate Conspiracy"? My best friend is obsessed with it, he lent it to me for a read and it is quite fascinating. It outlines the connections of various cults to the CIA and such. Puharich and Geller in particular seemed to have "paranormal" events happen around them which were performed with exotic technologies. The CIA seems to start cults as a means of practicing mind control techniques.


a reply to: pianopraze
The same friend mentioned above believes this as well. He has a number of books and documents about the Nazis being behind MKultra and "traumatic conditioning". He believes that Mengele's still-classified files were about this. According to him it has to do with genetic trauma, hypnosis, drugs, et cetera in some bizarre conglomeration to erase and reprogram the victim's mind...

I can only get him to talk about it when he's drunk though.

I can only approach it at times.

The bread crumbs are out there and sprinkled across ATS.

What's left of the cia mk ultra files were can be found at the black vault. I combed through every single one. There are some old threads here on ATS with others that have too.

Black Vault mk ultra foia documents

The more you know the more you wish you didn't. I can understand why your friend wants to dissociate with drink before he talks about it. It is mind shattering. And the things not told are worse.

a reply to: Riffrafter

Could you please help with the decoding of the acronyms in your tale?

I am very fascinated by all of this.
Have any of you read any Chris Carter? or Rupert Sheldrake?