Mandela Effect: Why Can't It Be Faulty Memory?

a reply to: SpaceGoatFart

No.
I am however open to the possibility they "pick up" a trigger (event of someone being surprised to find out sthg is different) doesn't have to happen, when they read about it on the internet and surrender to the story someone invented to live with it.
They could receive the information through tv, face-to-face in a conversation, mobile, whatever, of course also internet,
but even then it could be in an unrelated story and background.

Which would then mean, they altered the memory without paying any piece of mind towards it whatsoever. Never even thought about it, access and bamm: information comparison error.
Now that would be interesting, who did that, or what?

a reply to: SpaceGoatFart

You don't act like someone who "would gladly that debunks", you. You attack in a very sneaky passive aggressive way.
But they won't share their embarrassing personal story with someone who calls them all idiots.
You're an ass.

So you have to assume all you know is just the tip of the iceberg.

No, seriously. If anyone can challenge these explanation.

You can derail this by attacking me if you want. I'm just looking for someone who can prove me that my logical explanation about these incorrect memories doesn't add up and that I should really consider these testimonies as an indication of something strange.

All I want to find out is the truth.

Aren't we here to deny ignorance after all?

a reply to: SpaceGoatFart

It does add up. From what you know so far, that's the best fitting explanation.
And it is true for the part were they look for confirmation and the first thing they find is ME.

But there are stories you don't know and didn't experience.
Like I checked out this plant that's dangerous to horses, how does it look, where does it grow, stuff like that.
One search, one click, the first time in my life, on a computer nobody but me uses.
An hour later I wanted to see if I remember correct, same search, click violet, entirely different page, same title, but different design and different content.
I was shocked. Close it, try again and it's the first page again.
What was that? Hallucinations?
But what are hallucinations?
Doesn't it sound like it is possible someone/something "trolled" me?

Think about toxoplasma gondii, what do we really know what effects a mind altering bug has on a fragile high tech device like our brain?

Add: and no, I don't consider this part of the ME which has become a meme, Australia is were it always was, nobody died or resurrected, just this one instance.



My point is the much more interesting stories aren't the one publicly discussed.
What people tell you if you act interested and open minded and not just say and pretend you are.
One clear trend is to feel slightly paranoid, in whatever direction their taste leads to.
Who would be surprised? Death, fear, porn, not just in the internet.

We truly have become a schizophrenic society, to pretend the story told, is true, becomes more and more exhausting.
So we react each as we must, look for answers, look for something to do, distraction, live, work, buy, produce and it all kind of sucks. It always seems like it's just not as good as expected.
Everything is corrupt, terrorism, scandals, all of that takes a toll.
That's adding to the stress one way or another.
More aggression, more need for safety, some are already are so pumped, they say we are at war.
The truth is, either Einstein was wrong, or we got a lot of unaccounted mass and energy going on and about, who knows what it does, or what it is.
We live in a world of speculation.
Perception device error.
That's hardware.

I think faulty memory is an oversimplification, although still part of the reality. It's more a case of people paraphrasing rather than using an exact quote, and that paraphrase propagating, at least when it comes to famous movie lines and things of that nature.

This plays a huge role in the many bible passage Mandela Effect claims.

A little ME joke from the future:

Remember that one time we drifted through the unforgiving universe and suddenly our instruments showed a big blob of undetectable mass and energy?

And that's funny, because there might not be a future.

a reply to: SpaceGoatFart

Possibly.

But that's the problem, you can't prove your assumption.

I get what you're saying--same reason why near-death experiences and alien abductions all seem to be similar, because the idea has permeated the collective societal subconscious.

The problem lies in the fact that all of this is theory, because none of it is able to really be scientifically measured as to whether it's real or isn't real, at least as far as proving that something doesn't exist.

originally posted by: SlapMonkey
a reply to: SpaceGoatFart

Possibly.

But that's the problem, you can't prove your assumption.

I get what you're saying--same reason why near-death experiences and alien abductions all seem to be similar, because the idea has permeated the collective societal subconscious.

The problem lies in the fact that all of this is theory, because none of it is able to really be scientifically measured as to whether it's real or isn't real, at least as far as proving that something doesn't exist.

NDE and alien abductions leave clear psychological and sometimes physical traces that are actually studied by serious searchers, and have been happening for decades. They generated an abundant and serious literature.

I don't think the same can be said about the ME. Actually the ME is almost universally dismissed as purely subjective and not serious by anyone looking at it with a critical mind.

Despite what you claim, all of these things (NDE, alien abductions, ME) can be studied scientifically. ME doesn't survive this study very long, contrarily to the other two subjects.

There has been cases in both NDE and alien encounters that cannot be simply dismissed as either hallucinations or faulty memory thanks to 3rd party testimonies, material recordings and information that could only be obtained by supernatural means.

The mandela effect has never displayed any of these qualities. Everything about it can be explained by simple and logical reasoning.

a reply to: SpaceGoatFart

And what do you believe in? Alien, god, or just supernatural?

originally posted by: Peeple
a reply to: SpaceGoatFart

And what do you believe in? Alien, god, or just supernatural?

What I believe in doesn't matter. It's personal and subjective.

I believe more in aliens and god than in the mandela effect though.

It's basic psychology people.
Other theories have been used but the main theory here is "reconstructive memory". People are unable to recall the full extent of a situation so "fill in the gaps" often based on their own perception of the world and external influences. It's the main reason why eye witness testimony isn't taken as fact in the court of law.

Without proper training, we can only embed a certain amount of information, changing shorter memories into long term memories (around 7 units give or take). False memories are often the result of poorly "transferred" memories between the two. This is compounded when asked to recall information, e.g mandela in prison. The people remembered it wrong intially then try to reconstruct the fragmented memory by filling in the gaps with "plausibility and logic", often wrong to begin with.

It's the recollection of the event that causes the problem and the way the questions are asked, with the reactions of the person asking playing a big part in the answer ( a look of dissapointment on the response may result in the person fishing to give a correct answer so tailor the answer to appease the person asking). People don't remember made a dying in prison, it's not something they hold dear or know to be true, it's only when they need to recall this information does the information become diluted by external forces.

Could go on for pages about BASIC psychological concepts that explain the reasons for this "phenomenon" but it would be pointless. Those that choose for this to be real will say it's real, regardless of the facts.

And as many have stated, it's often a reaction to other people experiencing the same thing, like a suggestive thought. I must stop.

originally posted by: SpaceGoatFart

originally posted by: SlapMonkey
a reply to: SpaceGoatFart

Possibly.

But that's the problem, you can't prove your assumption.

I get what you're saying--same reason why near-death experiences and alien abductions all seem to be similar, because the idea has permeated the collective societal subconscious.

The problem lies in the fact that all of this is theory, because none of it is able to really be scientifically measured as to whether it's real or isn't real, at least as far as proving that something doesn't exist.

There has been cases in both NDE and alien encounters that cannot be simply dismissed as either hallucinations or faulty memory thanks to 3rd party testimonies, material recordings and information that could only be obtained by supernatural means.

The mandela effect has never displayed any of these qualities. Everything about it can be explained by simple and logical reasoning.

Can you define "3rd party testimonies" in the context you are using for me please?

originally posted by: GemmyMcGemJew
Those that choose for this to be real will say it's real, regardless of the facts.

Exactly. Especially since our brain is guilty of trying to be consistent at all costs. So when we make a mistake, we prefer to deny it was a mistake than accept we were wrong.

It happens regularly. Just remember all the times you were arguing with someone. When was the last time you admitted you were wrong? It doesn't happen very often. And yet being wrong is something that happens more than we are ready to admit.

originally posted by: Ruiner1978
Can you define "3rd party testimonies" in the context you are using for me please?

Like one person claims to have seen a UFO going west, and someone else living 5 km west of that person also sees a UFO a few seconds later.

Those 2 people never interacted with each other, and at least the 3rd party wasn't exposed to external information about that particular UFO

originally posted by: SpaceGoatFart

originally posted by: Ruiner1978
Can you define "3rd party testimonies" in the context you are using for me please?

Like one person claims to have seen a UFO going west, and someone else living 5 km west of that person also sees a UFO a few seconds later.

Those 2 people never interacted with each other, and weren't exposed to external information about that particular UFO

Right. So why does this not apply to two people both claiming they remember South America being more westward?

a reply to: SpaceGoatFart
I thought it could be memory but then saw the tank guy in China alive after I saw him kileed by the tank live on TV . Then 3 days ago I was reading about Rod Stewart getting his Knighthood and below that it said Vera Lynne was getting an award, i said hang on a minute she died 3 years ago aged 96, she is now alive and aged 99. Now I remember this because there was me my wife and our granddaughter in the livingroom at the time and we watched how people said " We will meet again don't know where don't know when" got us through the war and all that stuff. So I played it on the laptop constantly to annoy my Granddaughter and my wife said you will raising her from the dead if you keep playing that, Vera lynne died 3 of us have that memory from 36 months ago so something is happening. I have my own thoughts on it, The bible says in the end days the dead will walk the earth with the living and I just assumed zombie like or that was the image that came into my mind.

Maybe its people we know died and now they are alive again like Vera Lynne.

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

Right. So why does this not apply to two people both claiming they remember South America being more westward?

Because both of them only started to "remember" this after seeing a thread or a youtube video about it.

originally posted by: pavmas
a reply to: SpaceGoatFart
I thought it could be memory but then saw the tank guy in China alive after I saw him kileed by the tank live on TV . Then 3 days ago I was reading about Rod Stewart getting his Knighthood and below that it said Vera Lynne was getting an award, i said hang on a minute she died 3 years ago aged 96, she is now alive and aged 99. Now I remember this because there was me my wife and our granddaughter in the livingroom at the time and we watched how people said " We will meet again don't know where don't know when" got us through the war and all that stuff. So I played it on the laptop constantly to annoy my Granddaughter and my wife said you will raising her from the dead if you keep playing that, Vera lynne died 3 of us have that memory from 36 months ago so something is happening. I have my own thoughts on it, The bible says in the end days the dead will walk the earth with the living and I just assumed zombie like or that was the image that came into my mind.

Maybe its people we know died and now they are alive again like Vera Lynne.

That testimony is much more interesting than all the usual stuff about Bearenstains and Mandela and world maps. I willingly admit it.

If I had the opportunity I would interview you and your wife to know more about this.

originally posted by: SpaceGoatFart

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

Right. So why does this not apply to two people both claiming they remember South America being more westward?

Because both of them only started to "remember" this after seeing a thread or a youtube video about it.

No, they haven't seen any youtube video or even heard of the Mandela Effect.

Again, why does this not apply to two people both claiming they remember South America being more westward?

a reply to: pavmas
OK. ..in that situation..1 of you misheard a news report/coverage that she had died or was very ill at the time. One person in your family convinced the others of this, unintentionally. When it comes to recalling it your family reconstruct the memory as though they saw it, other than they were told by you or another family member. All 3 of you will not remember SEEING that she died, only that you heard she died. It's simple when you think about things objectively.

If you to closely interrogate your family members you will see that not all "saw" it, just heard it. If you word the question in a way to suit your needs (that they did in fact watch it) they will give you the answer you desire. If a 3rd party asked you would not get the same response.