Pediatric nurse sues Winnebago Co Health Dept after losing job for her beliefs

a reply to: windword

The new human life begins at fertilization, already the genes are chosen naturally and the sex of the fetus is chosen naturally.

First and Second Week of Pregnancy

Congratulations! During these first two weeks, your body is preparing for possible conception.
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Pregnancy is calculated from this day because each time a woman has a period, her body is preparing for pregnancy. Counting from the LMP, most women are pregnant an average of 280 days. Calculating from the LMP also gives a standard of measurement for health care providers to follow since it is extremely difficult to know exactly when conception occurred.
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americanpregnancy.org...

At fertilization is when the new human life/entity begins. Any drug that affects the formation of the new human life and causes it to die is in fact abortion. At this stage it is an early abortion, but it is an abortion still.

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

That's a matter of opinion. I can find probably as many papers saying that it's not at fertilisation as you can to prove it is.

Anyway, this still has nothing to do with the nurse who wasn't forced to do anything.

originally posted by: TerryDon79
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Anyway, this still has nothing to do with the nurse who wasn't forced to do anything.

Don't get involved in what doesn't concern you, I wasn't responding to you, I was responding to another ATS member to his/her statements not yours...

originally posted by: ElectricUniverse

originally posted by: TerryDon79
...
Anyway, this still has nothing to do with the nurse who wasn't forced to do anything.

Don't get involved in what doesn't concern you, I wasn't responding to you, I was responding to another ATS member to his/her statements not yours...

I'm sorry, I thought this was an open forum?

BTW, you still haven't addressed the FACT that she wasn't forced to do anything.

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

The new human life begins at fertilization

Wrong. There is no "new" life. The egg was always alive. It didn't suddenly become alive, magically, when it met Mr Sperm.

There is no magic moment when life begins.

Any drug that affects the formation of the new human life and causes it to die is in fact abortion.

You have a right to your opinion, but you don't have a right to make up your own facts. Pregnancy requires implantation. No implantation, no pregnancy. No pregnancy, no abortion. PERIOD.

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

Any drug that affects the formation of the new human life and causes it to die is in fact abortion. At this stage it is an early abortion, but it is an abortion still.

show me where it is directly affecting the new human life? I don't believe it is. what it is effecting is the natural processes of the women's body. her fallopian tubes, her uterus... her body!!!

originally posted by: TerryDon79

I'm sorry, I thought this was an open forum?

BTW, you still haven't addressed the FACT that she wasn't forced to do anything.

You responded to my response to another ATS member who made his/her own claims, not yours...

You are making completely asinine arguments based on nothing but rhetoric on your part. Then when i respond to someone else and their statements, you proclaim my answers to them are not on topic.

You have no idea how to even follow a discussion and formulate a logical argument.
At this point it is a logical conclusion that you are doing nothing more than derail the thread.

originally posted by: ElectricUniverse

originally posted by: TerryDon79

I'm sorry, I thought this was an open forum?

BTW, you still haven't addressed the FACT that she wasn't forced to do anything.

You responded to my response to another ATS member who made his/her own claims, not yours...

Such is my right, and anyone else's, who signed up to this forum.

You are making completely asinine arguments based on nothing but rhetoric on your part.

Thats rich coming from a guy who can't understand the simple word "force" and how the nurse wasn't forced.

Then when i respond to someone else and their statements you proclaim my answers to them are not on topic.

See my first part of the reply. Also, you haven't been on topic since you posted the op. You used the op as a bait to push your anti abortion agenda and religious views.

You have no idea how to even follow a discussion and formulate a logical argument.

You mean like saying she wasn't forced, because she wasn't. The ONLY person saying that, is you.

heck I can even tell you when the terminology was changed....

In 1965, The American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists (ACOG) issued a bulletin to redefine the term "conception." That bulletin stated that conception should be understood to mean "the implantation of a fertilized ovum."1 Why this change? The timing of their decision makes it almost certain that it was politically rather than scientifically motivated. The FDA had recently approved the sale of hormonal birth control pills, but "the pill" didn't fit the traditional definition of "contraceptive." Why? Because it doesn't just prevent conception; it also inhibits implantation—or at least purports to. If breakthrough ovulation and fertilization occurs (which is the biological beginning of individual, human life), the embryo may find it difficult to implant because of changes the pill makes to the endometrium. This created an ethical problem for doctors who wanted to assure their patients that the pill is a contraceptive and not an abortifacient. How did they deal with the dilemma? They changed the definition of "conception." By saying "conception," but meaning "implantation," it became possible to market hormonal birth control pills as contraceptives—as something that prevents "conception."

If you look through the ACOG website today, you won't find a glossary of terms, but you will find numerous references to their altered definition of pregnancy and conception. In a pregnancy FAQ, they state that "fertilization, the union of an egg and a sperm, is the first step in a complex series of events that leads to pregnancy" (emphasis added).2 In the "Contraception" section of their Tool Kit for Teen Care, ACOG states that the IUD "can stop pregnancy" by "thin[ning] the lining of the uterus making it harder for a fertilized egg to attach."3 On their Birth Control Pills FAQ, they state that one way the pill can "prevent pregnancy" is by making the uterus lining thin, "making it less likely that a fertilized egg can attach to it."4 By redefining the recognized beginning of pregnancy, birth control methods that would have otherwise been said to end pregnancy, can now be said to prevent pregnancy. These semantic changes do nothing to alter the biology of prenatal development, but they do plenty to confuse the ethical implications. In a 2005 Guttmacher Report on Public Policy, Rachel Benson Gold argued that "according to both the scientific community and long-standing federal policy, a woman is considered pregnant only when a fertilized egg has implanted in the wall of her uterus."5 She goes on to say that though conception is "often used synonymously with fertilization… medically, (it) is equated with implantation." This is clearly an overstatement.

www.abort73.com...

I grew up in the 60's there were lots of families with six or more kids...
and... having that many kids that close together is a health risk for women...

originally posted by: dawnstar

show me where it is directly affecting the new human life? I don't believe it is. what it is effecting is the natural processes of the women's body. her fallopian tubes, her uterus... her body!!!

Prescription drugs like Ulipristal acetate( including Ella) block the effects of the female hormone progesterone, and progesterone is needed to maintain the pregnancy.

Ulipristal acetate works by blocking the effects of the female hormone progesterone. There are two brands of ulipristal acetate tablets available.
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Link

Progesterone is one of the hormones in our bodies that stimulates and regulates various functions. Progesterone plays a role in maintaining pregnancy. The hormone is produced in the ovaries, the placenta (when a woman gets pregnant) and the adrenal glands. It helps prepare your body for conception and pregnancy and regulates the monthly menstrual cycle. It also plays a role in sexual desire.
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www.healthywomen.org...

a reply to: TerryDon79

it isn't that rare to have your job description changed and finding yourself with duties you never signed up to do. most of us have to just bite the bullet and accept what is thrown at us at least till we find a job somewhere else. and the higher the employment numbers get, the more immigrants that flow in, the more people will have to just bite that bullet. my son finally changed jobs because they changed his job to one that was killing his back. but he had to endure the pain a couple of months before he could move to a job that was more favorable to him.

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

One of progesterone's most important functions is to cause the endometrium to secrete special proteins during the second half of the menstrual cycle, preparing it to receive and nourish an implanted fertilized egg. If implantation does not occur, estrogen and progesterone levels drop, the endometrium breaks down and menstruation occurs.

www.healthywomen.org...

like I said, effecting the women's body, not your precious little fertilized egg...

originally posted by: dawnstar
a reply to: TerryDon79

it isn't that rare to have your job description changed and finding yourself with duties you never signed up to do. most of us have to just bite the bullet and accept what is thrown at us at least till we find a job somewhere else. and the higher the employment numbers get, the more immigrants that flow in, the more people will have to just bite that bullet. my son finally changed jobs because they changed his job to one that was killing his back. but he had to endure the pain a couple of months before he could move to a job that was more favorable to him.

Thanks for replying to me. The op doesn't deem to understand where he/she is wrong.

I had it done to me, multiple times. I've also had to do it to others as I was management. It's certainly nothing new, no matter how much of a pain it is.

But the op seems to think it was out of place, never happens, was wrong to do, the nurse was forced and used a bunch of fallacies to try and prove that abortion is the reason this nurse lost her job.

The fact of the matter is, the nurse chose not to do what was in her amended work responsibilities.

a reply to: TerryDon79

special snowflake syndrome..
they're special and shouldn't be inconvenienced so because their objection is based on religious belief and not the physical pain that can be caused sometimes when your job description changes and causes physical problems...

a reply to: dawnstar

It is a bit different that your job description started being about saving lives and then it has been changed to terminate innocent life.

Progesterone isn't just needed by a woman's body, but once the woman's egg has been fertilized a different being starts it's life cycle. That new human life form also needs progesterone.

I am not saying I want to stop you or any other woman on making an abortion, it is your decision. But don't force your decisions based on your own ideologies on someone else and force them to participate on taking an innocent life.

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

She wasn't made or forced to take a life. She wasn't made or forced to do anything. You keep using it as your argument, but again, you're wrong.

originally posted by: dawnstar
a reply to: TerryDon79

special snowflake syndrome..
they're special and shouldn't be inconvenienced so because their objection is based on religious belief and not the physical pain that can be caused sometimes when your job description changes and causes physical problems...

I have never used that term outside of jest, but I'm starting to think that it might be a worthy term for some people.

She basically got butt hurt because her job role changed and she didn't like it.

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

After ovulation occurs, the ovaries start to produce progesterone needed by the uterus. Progesterone causes the uterine lining or endometrium to thicken. This helps prepare a supportive environment in your uterus for a fertilized egg.

Progesterone helps nurture the fetus.

A supply of progesterone to the endometrium continues to be important during pregnancy. Following a successful implantation, progesterone helps maintain a supportive environment for the developing fetus. After 8 to 10 weeks of pregnancy, the placenta takes over progesterone production from the ovaries and substantially increases progesterone production.

www.resolve.org...

no it needs a uterus that has been altered by the progesterone.
women's uterus, women's body....

originally posted by: TerryDon79

She wasn't made or forced to take a life. She wasn't made or forced to do anything. You keep using it as your argument, but again, you're wrong.

I was responding to Dawnstar, not to you...

And for nurses who have been working on pediatric care on helping save and improve lives to then change it to take lives there is a big difference. It certainly is not the same as your supervisor at McDonalds making you clean the toilet...

a reply to: TerryDon79

I wouldn't have used that term if it wasn't that I've been seeing it in so many thread titles on ATS lately. really ain't sure of what they are meaning by it. I am probably redefining it here... but it just seems to fit so nicely!